It's obvious, watch is a return!! Kick up a stink!
I have a frustrating situation with an AD in Leeds White Rose and wanted to check something...
Just before xmas I bought my wife one of the new 38mm Speedmasters. She tried on all the different colour options and settled on the lighter colour. She tells me now that all of the other colours not chosen had huge bracelets. However the one she chose fitted straight off (if she'd have said at the time I would have queried it)
Cue the obvious, when we get home in the warm her arms swells a little and it's too tight. I check the box for links and there are none. Now I'd not noticed this in the shop as quite frankly it was a little chaotic with so many watches out (for her and me). So I'm just assuming at this point that they took the links out there and then in the furore. I check the box, there are none.
Not a problem, I'm now thinking they removed the links and just forget to put them in the box. So we head over there again the following morning and ask. No - there are no links that have been left out, that is all the links that come with the watch. Now I know that the 38mm speedy bracelet is big as I'd initially put one on in the shop and it was way too big for me.
The shop say they'll order in 2 spare links for free, it'll be about a week. I honestly thought at this stage they'd just taken the links off and just lost them, hence the offer of two spare links. Annoying but OK.
We get home and now we've noticed that the warranty card is dated two months prior - right date but October not December.
I'm now getting annoyed: as well as the two spare links they'd also agreed to chuck in a new Omega strap for my speedy as part of the deal (including a great discount I have to say). I've not yet brought up the subject of the warranty card, but I've called 5 times now for an update on the strap and links. Every time they faff about and don't really know what's going on, take all the details and promise to call me back. Funnily enough they never call, wich is guaranteed to wind me up to fever pitch.
I'm starting to think that something is really fishy with this now. I think the reason the bracelet was short is that they sold the watch two months before and it's been returned. I'd like to check before I go nuclear about the failed callbacks, crap service and where the hell are the accessories you promised me.
Really kicking myself for not going onto Leeds to visit the boutique where I have a great history/relationship - this was just a spur of the moment thing.
Any ideas if Omega do the same as Rolex and ping the mothership as soon as they sell an item? That would confirm whether or not they've ripped me off or are just utter dunces, don't know dates and can't do customer service.
It's obvious, watch is a return!! Kick up a stink!
I would need no more evidence than that you have already stated. Sized bracelet and old warranty card. What more do you need?
You're both right I think. I'll not waste my time chasing them any more and start the process of a complaint to head office - and hoping they will ignore me I'll do a chargeback.
It would help my rejection if I knew how many links there should be on the 38mm bracelet just so I can state that, otherwise my rejection hinges on the fact that the date is wrong (where they will say they simply made a mistake).
I can understand the frustrations, and it does sound like this watch has been sized for someone, sold, then returned for whatever reason. However, if your wife likes the watch and is happy with it I would look to keep it provided the retailer ( I can guess who it is) will be honest and admit what’s gone on, then give you sufficient sweetners to keep you happy.
Focus on getting the best outcome; I’d want the bracelet to be full-length with the correct extra links as a minimum, plus a few goodies. You may be able to turn this to your advantage proided they’re willing to make amends.
I would try to resolve this face to face with the branch manager, I wouldn’t escalate this to head office at this stage. If the manager isn’t willing to put things right that’s the time to take it further.
Paul
Suggest they at least include a ‘free’ service - whenever that is due. I got that on a watch bought from an Omega Boutique - so I reckon the store manager could authorise it.
But it’s bad form selling a returned watch “as new”. Get some goodies out of it to your satisfaction, or return the watch for a full refund.
The registration would be on their omega systems - so they can’t just say they dated it wrongly. The serial number on the warranty match the watch right?
Last edited by MartynJC (UK); 16th January 2019 at 22:11.
A bad law causes this situation. Customers online can return anything with no consequence, and no responsibility. There doesn’t need to be any fault. Of course some retailers will repackage them as new....what sort of economic hit do you expect them to endure? Sold as pre-worn, the retailer of luxury watches stands to lose thousands.
There have been people on TZ boasting of how they order several expensive watches at a time, knowing they will send some, or all, back. Do you think they will then be offered as ‘used’ ? I don’t.
Last edited by paskinner; 16th January 2019 at 22:30.
Also quite a few high-street retailers have 30day returns policy - but with certain T&C.
I know I have returned a watch under those circumstances - I had not worn it or adjusted it. It was inspected and accepted for return. I asked what happened about the warranty- and was told they had to write back to HQ for a new cert for completion if/when it sells. That’s what I’d suppose a retailer should do.
Martyn.
Agree 100%, this culture of buying online then sending stuff back has dveloped in recent years and it’s a bad situation. Retailers are taking a big hit, they have to pass these costs on to someone......guess who?
People now see it as their right , buy stuff on approval, get the thrill if buying, knowing deep down they’ll send the item back.......it’s wrong!
The tooth fairy doesn’t deliver this stuff to your door.....and take it back. It’s all adding to traffic on the roads and the resulting congestion/pollution issues.
The distance selling laws need to change. Folks need to get off their lazy arses, visit shops, and make a genuine comittment to buy! We managed nicely without online sales for many years, it has it’s place but the balance has swung too far.
^^^^
Paul. What do you think of high-street chains that also offer a returns policy? Maybe we (punters) expect it with everything now.
It still seems the original seller was a bit conservative with the truth about it being a new watch (which is why you go to an AD isn’t it?)
OP: There was a little question at the bottom of your post. I believe when a watch is sold it is registered centrally - at least I have sen that happen when I bought Omega’s from an Omega Boutique. As Paul has said - if you can try going in personally to speak to the store manager to seek an amicable solution. Also they should be able to categorically answer that question.
Best of luck.
Martyn.
Last edited by MartynJC (UK); 16th January 2019 at 22:49.
Hopefully I'll get some kind of conversation going. I'm more frustrated at the lack of callbacks and dishonesty which isn't helping my mood. I'm also pretty surprised that they recognised us and know full well how much stuff we've had off them this last year. We had a good chat about it. One resolved, they will never see me again.
Yes the serial matches, right boxes, cards e.t.c. Good to know they shouldn't be able to lie their way out of it.
Thanks all.
It's not a failure of law, it's a failure of the dealer to know its arse from its elbow. If a watch is returned, they should check the watch, looking for damage and details such as the number of links included with the bracelet.
And customers can't just return anything with no consequence. If I returned a watch that I'd damaged, e.g. not in the condition it was sent out to me, I would fully expect to be either charged for a repair, or have the watch sent straight back to me with a note to tell me, "Tough luck, you've damaged the watch – it's your problem now." And I believe they would be within their rights to do this.
Blame the companies paying the monkeys peanuts so no one takes any responsibility or cares.
That is the new reality and it is not likely to change.
https://www.theguardian.com/money/20...ng-millennials
You have grounds for rejection purely on the incorrect card date since that is part of your warranty they have taken from you. Admittedly only 2 months out of 5 years though. It could have been a store demo rather than returned sale but the card date does smell fishy rather. No wonder they were quick to discount it.
There’s nothing I’d like better than going to a retail shop, feeling the goods, paying a fair price and walking out with them but it’s normally the fault of the retailers that that doesn’t happen. There’s sod all in the shops and all they want to do is take your money and order one in! I can do that from the comfort of my armchair, not drive 10 miles, find and pay for a parking place, walk to the store and have some teenager order it for me.
At Christmas, my wife tried to buy a coat she’s seen online from Hobbs. We go over there, no stock. Ordered online, didn’t like the fit so it went back. I wanted to buy a pair of North face lined hiking trousers. I went to two different stores and between them, they had just one pair in stock and that pair wasn’t my size. Had to go home and order two pairs (different sizes). I paid out £270, tried them on and then send the pair back that didn’t fit and wait for a £135 refund.
Another example. I wanted a watch for my wife. £1,760 in store. Online on the same stores website it was £1,320. Further searching online gave me a voucher code for £200 off of anything over £1,000 at that store so I ended up paying £1,120 online. Funnily enough, the £200 discount voucher code was withdrawn the day before Black Friday - good job I didn’t wait for that day before purchasing!
And retailers wonder why the High Street is failing.
Last edited by Motman; 17th January 2019 at 09:25.
I agree this happens because of return policies / distance selling regulations. But it's important to remember that the retailers have chosen to sell via the web or to include such a generous policy in their GTC. So that is no excuse not to be honest to the buyer about it. If the watch was sold to another customer two months earlier, it's not new and not telling a customer about it (including the consequence of a shortened warranty term) is outright dishonest / fraudulent.
Why do you think that Haywood doesn't sell via the interwebs? For exactly this reason, if you want a sale to be final, it is no option. Better price that into your business model if you want to be part of the online game or best Amazon's returns policy. They cannot have the cake and eat it.
You are absolutely correct to kick a stink. And do the community a favour and name and shame the business.
Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.
I'm sure Omega et al have a process in place to deal with returns and warranty resets so the issue now is about the dealer being too incompetent to follow this procedure and check returned goods for completeness. While in general I'm ok with being sold mint and complete returned stock as 'new', in this case what was bought as new was neither mint or complete so the OP should either demand his money back or screw the dealer out of whatever he can, straps, servicing, bump up the rolex list, store credit, the works. In a capitalist society the only true punishment for businesses is financial.
Sounds like you've got the watch at an excellent price, throw in a few sweetners and you end up in a good position. Provided the watch is OK (no cosmetic damage etc) I'd take this approach.........principle's sweet but cash is sweeter.
Years ago I bought a new Omega Constellation for my wife, that came from a grey dealer. The watch had been sold and returned, bbut the price was great so I was happy. In my case all the links were present, can't remember if the bracelet had been sized or not.
Keep your eye on the prize, it's OK for folks on here to say what they'd do (reject, customer rights, yada yada) but at the end of the day you're still left trying to source that watch in the best overall deal. Forget e-0mails and phone calls etc, sort out out face to face with the manager, be calm and use the word 'disappointed' several times. Accept it's been a 'misunderstanding', leave him a way out of the corner to make amends, and you'll probably end up with a good result. The manager doesn`t want this to escalate further and you can give him every chance to avoid that by keeping you happy.
My wife told me she's wanted to buy something online but postage is close to £10 but free over a certain amount (say £100 or whatever) so she's ordered enough to get free shipping and returned the stuff she didn't want using the free returns bag. Saved her a tenner.
"A man of little significance"
Voice of reason, especially if your wife loves the watch and it's been at a bargain price. The extra links and a wee sweetener seems satisfactory if those conditions are true.
Many would get a reality check if they ever ran a shop. The overheads compared to web only trading would make your nose bleed. That said all it took was the briefest reference to the watch being a return and I suspect the buyer would've been more understanding, esp at point of sale when the euphoria of the purchase is highest. The sense of deception in the cold light of day rankles but don't cut off your nose to spite your face.
Sounds reasonable, let's see how it goes when I pop in. Have to say we both love the watch, and it is mint. I't just the retailer experience that sucks.
I wish. It's been sold from the same shop as the 'jeweller' section of the card has their exact address and details in. Makes me think it was sold in person at that store versus shipped from the group's central distribution centre. Probably sold by the same salesperson who sold it to us two months later as well. Cheeky bastards.
Last edited by NickGaters; 17th January 2019 at 22:26.
All concluded now. Went in to discuss and they were extremely apologetic about ignoring me, but tellingly didn't bat an eyelid when I stated we strongly suspected it was a customer returned watch sold again as new to us. Also tellingly they rolled over immediately with no fuss and started talking options to make it right.
To give them their due, they did offer to source a brand new watch with more discount than already offered and honour the free strap for my Speedy. We did consider this briefly but then they brought out a strap that they *thought* could have been the one ordered for me...and it was the wrong one (wrong colour).
We'd both had enough of the messing about by this time and politely but firmly requested a refund - which was granted with no issue. I think we'd have both been annoyed if we'd have taken up the new watch offer as this had taken the shine off the whole thing.
Shame really as we loved the watch, but the experience of buying the watch would have been a reminder. We went straiight into town and spent the money on other stuff!
Not sure what wound me up the most, getting second hand goods sold as new or being ignored. Either way, it's a retailer I'll never deal with again. So thanks for all and your input. I really appreciated the voice(s) of reason.
Your watch, your choice.
I would have probably taken their offer, but you should do what feels right for you.
Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.
So.......you didn't really want the watch?
Turning down the offer of an identical new model, with an even greater discount.....
We did want the watch, very much so. However on this occasion, faced with continued questionable customer service we decided to ‘buy the seller’.
I’d rather buy from a retailer that hasn’t tried to stiff us with used goods, can order accessories correctly and does bother to call me back when requested. Even it it costs me a little bit more.
Yup, I’m with you. This is a luxury item (would be for me at least) and the buying experience is important. If it doesn’t leave you with a warm fluffy feeling then walk away.
It does sound as if this particular AD was trying to rectify the situation (once rumbled) but too late. I’d be interested to know if they now advertise it as a customer return.
In my opinion the "buying experience" lasts until you walk out of the store.
It's only a watch and a piece of temporary jewellery.
Having repetitively bought very expensive cars, at the end of the day it is about the deal. The euphoria surrounding the dealership experience soon evaporates into insignificance.
I would go so far as to say that the effectiveness/efficiency/knowledge of the sales outlet is less critical with a reliable watch purchase than other goods. As long as you know what you're buying.
Watches relatively rarely fail (prepared to be shot down), requiring a good ongoing relationship. Unless you are an old customer, or intend to return frequently and make repeated purchase from them why worry about about cultivating such an understanding. Personally I've never bought a watch from the same outlet twice.
Just my personal slant on it.
I can understand and respect that. I guess people are different.
I’m more about the relationship and the whole experience. I’m lucky that my wife loves watches also and encourages most of my purchases. We'll get dressed up and head into town, have a nice drink somewhere and negotiate on big purchases and celebrate with a nice meal out somewhere. Makes for a great day for us both and a shared experience.
This was a last minute/random Xmas present for her after I saw it caught her eye in the window - and it had taken the shine off the whole thing now. We’ll no doubt get the same watch again from my preferred AD - and it gives me an excuse to get the SM 300 I’ve started to get a hankering for at the same time ;-)
Now is the time you should tell us which retailer we are talking about to make sure they don't pull the same stunt on another member.
Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.
Well I guess it’s either Ernest Jones or Goldsmiths then. Both are often a haven for failed Carphone Warehouse or Curry’s sales people to end up.
And I'm pretty certain one of those two doesn't sell omega any more at the white rose. They used to but the last time I walked right up to the end of the mall they had nothing in the window.
Happy to confirm by PM who it was so any members can make their own decision if they were thinking of shopping there.
Last edited by NickGaters; 20th January 2019 at 10:05.
I have had similar experience with buying a so called 'new' watch from this retailer not in Leeds but from another branch.
This happened to me twice. It was obvious that the watches were either a returned item or a shop soiled model. Insisted on a new piece directly from Omega and not an item already in stock within their group of retail chains.
I agreed with the OP - not a great experience would do the same: Buy the seller.
The experience of buying it elsewhere for considerably more money than I could have would sour that later purchase for me, lol.
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I don’t see a problem with a returned watch provided it’s in 100% mint condition, but there’s a likelihood it’ll have picked up marks and scratches from handling or cack- handed efforts to size the bracelet. However, shop-soiled stock that’s never been sold can be just as bad. I once travelled 60 miles to buy a discontinued Omega, a watch that was v. difficult to find new or used, only to be confronted by a scratched watch with farly deep dings in the edges of the case. Needless to say I walked away disappointed.
It’s all too easy to get carried away by the buying experience and the warm feeling, but it pays to inspect a new watch with the same care as you’d inspect a used one. If your eyes aren’t great close-up use a magnifier.