Reply With QuoteIf you really wanted to find out you wouldn’t ask the question on a watch forum!
What's it about? What exactly are they up to?
If you really wanted to find out you wouldn’t ask the question on a watch forum!
Shhhh
It’s a secret....
It’s different things to different people and there are very few secrets in relation to Freemasonry that can’t be found within a few seconds searching on the interweb. I’m a ‘happy clapper’ as my son calls them and can only speak as I find. I’ve not found anyone ‘on the square’ that doesn’t seem to be in it for genuine reasons. There are undoubtedly some bad Freemasons out there and as with all sections of society no doubt a few who joined in the misguided belief it would further their careers etc.
I’m sure there have been cases of favouritism but this is no different to giving a leg-up to a fellow member of your golf club, someone recommended by a good friend, old school mate, blah blah blah.
If anyone is interested in learning more then you could contact your local masonic centre, which I’d be happy to help you find. If you want to take the piss and think we’re all devil worshippers then I’m good with that to, so mote it be.
https://www.ugle.org.uk
Try this for starters
I was invited but in this country you have to be deist.
I offered to take the oath on Darwin’s “on the origin of species” or on Hawking’s “A brief history of time”.
Both were rejected
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
What are the genuine reasons, is it just a social thing?Originally Posted by hops
Mostly it is. Essentially think of it as a Brotherhood that does a lot of charity fundraising, has some ceremonies that are steeped in tradition and lore, and has social meetings (including ones to bring friends and family (especially the wife) to.
There is a lot of care for members, and a temendous support network if ever needed.
The ceremonies are actually rather fun, although they are taken seriously.
Most Lodges have rules, including no discussion of business or politics.
There is nothing remotely sinister about it.
So clever my foot fell off.
It is primarily the social side for me but there is a great deal of pride in completing the ceremonies as word perfectly as possible but preserving the fun element. The basic story encompasses the building of King Solomon’s temple and other orders expand on different aspects of that. However it is most definitely NOT a religion or a replacement for it. It teaches morals and encourages you to be an individual who considers you to be the best person you can be. I enjoy meeting a great bunch of mates on a number of occasions throughout the year, talking nonsense and having the odd creme de menthe frappé.
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I have a friend in the Masons and he describes it's as being like a mix between LinkedIn (he is a builders by trade), and social club (a sort of Club 35-80 with a snooker table) and a charity - opportunity to do good stuff.
He enjoys it. Lots of social and charity events, plus he gets quite a bit of business via it from other Masons. His only criticisms of its were.
1) it has a "certain" demographic and can get rather political.
2) it costs quite a bit - not just subs, but also to attend events.
3) it a costs even more because his wife wants new frocks, shoes, bags every time every time she attends a function.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
"There is a lot of care for members, and a temendous support network if ever needed."
Really? I was a Freemason back in the late 80's/early 90's.
My father died and my marriage broke up all in the space of three months and, when I could really have done with a bit of support not one of them showed any interest. Hence, I left.
But you were a ‘bro’...
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
You never leave, once a freemason always a freemason
Sorry that was your experience.
My sister lost her husband last year. He was only 49, leaving her and her three children.
They couldn’t have been more supportive- and continue to be so.
Perhaps things have changed significantly since you were involved. I suspect they have.
My own lodge is also hugely supportive of brethren in need.
My father was a member back in the 60/70's, his father died and his mother (my grandmother) lived at the other end of the country. He asked if anything could be done to help, simple things like checking she was OK now and then, the brotherhood didn't want to know.
I was on the square back in the 80's in an ancient and very small Lodge in Surrey. My impression was that it was a social club with arcane rituals that was dying on its feet, the average age was way past 60 and I was in my 20's. I tried introducing "new blood" to revitalise the lodge, the officers in charge didn't want to know. I felt I was metaphorically banging my head against a brick wall and eventually gave up attending.
As TFB says it surely must have changed by now otherwise there'd be no lodges left.
My own impression isn’t that it has changed, but that it depends a lot on the individuals in the lodge.
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
It sounds like your Lodge Almoner was not doing his duty.
Lunch at 'Tapton Hall' was always a very pleasant experience.
Last edited by number2; 8th July 2018 at 10:32.
"Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. The third time it's enemy action."
'Populism, the last refuge of a Tory scoundrel'.
When Rick Wakeman's mother died he got so much support it made him become a Mason. There's a you tube video about it.
Did he get the support because the Mason's knew of his financial status.
Here’s why I toy with the idea of trying to join:
I believe one of the biggest problems we have is the absence of community spirit and a sense of belonging.
I think it’s behind a great deal of social breakdown as well as the depression that comes with feelings of displacement and lack of purpose.
We don’t tend to know much about our neighbours or the local greengrocer. Many of us only open our front doors to get into our cars, often work in other towns where people we never meet get rich from our toil, and then we don’t spend our money in our own community as more shopping is done online.
I’m not saying the Freemasons are the answer to everything,of course. But I do think that clubs and societies are a step towards the benefits of old-fashioned community living that’s becoming so rare.
The secrecy of freemasons adds to the skepticism and fuels some of the hopefully outrageous rituals that you hear down the pub. Maybe a bit more transparency would attract more members. Ive been intrigued by it as a friends dad is a member and to this day he's refused to say anything about what goes on.
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Things are slowly changed for the better, regarding the secrecy element the only things in general that aren’t openly discussed are the ceremonies, as this would detract from the experience of the candidate, or the methods by which we are known to each other. As I alluded to earlier however most of this is on the web if you really must know. I’m really disappointed to hear the lack of support a couple brothers had at their times of need. That’s not been my experience and hopefully the exception, not the rule.
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I was the recipient of a secret handshake once, presumably the guy was checking if I was "in"
I wasn't but was able to tell him I knew the score about the handshakes. He didn't seem to mind. As you say, most of this info is online if you want it.
I agree with you, but you can do so much yourself to further community spirit. When we built our house in the country I called to all the other houses on the road to say Hi.
We're not friends with them but we're not strangers.
And within my own group of friends, we get together a lot. We had friends here earlier, we're just back from another friends house and we've another friend calling here later with a birthday gift for our wee girl.
When everyone makes an effort, everyone feels included imo
I suppose similarly to most things in life you get out of it what you're prepared to put back in.
In a nutshell my journey in Freemasonary has been very pleasurable and i have met many and various people on that journey the myths,stories still abound and i am still after 36 yrs in the Craft awaiting my first Goat or blood sacrifice.Cost is always mentioned but what one gives to charity is personal and hopefully within ones means Religion and politics are no no’s and are left outside our meetings and of course like all “ clubs” members do deal with each other in business bit like the SF on here😉
Anybody that has an interest can approach their local Provence or go to the United Grand Lodge of England website and no it is not for everybody but we are a lot more open these days.
Sorry it was when Rick's Father died. It was nothing to do with his financial status..... here is his reasons...
And, Manchester City was founded by Freemasons (hence the clubs colours) including the rules of football.
Every Freemason has to be elected and go through background checks, go through the degrees, there is no favouritism, you can be of any religion, I suppose really that it is the only organisation of all men (and women) of different religions, going forward together for the good of people.
London based Lodges have completely paid for a helicopter for the air ambulance. To join Freemasonary is a very worthwhile thing to do, you will get so much out of it.
Last edited by Rod; 8th July 2018 at 18:35.
How does one get started? And does a modest income really not matter?
Contact your local Provincial lodge, they usually have a website or find your local Masonic centre and pop in. As long as you can afford the fees, which vary from Province to Province, there’s no need to give exorbitant amounts to charity. As a rough guide our yearly subs are about £160 and we meet 4 times a year. If you wish to dine after the meeting our meals are £30 which covers a good 3 course meal with wine.
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https://www.ugle.org.uk/
Or google your local Provence as has been said the financials are not huge and Charity is what you make it
Once you have commited yourself to become a fully fledge Freemason you do not have to attend any lodge meetings again and leave at any time. Once a Freemason, always a .......
It can also be as expensive as you want it to be. My late father was a Mason for years, infact he was like a walking advertisement. Every piece of jewellery that he owned carried the Masonic emblem on it.
This is what I mean. He was very dedicated.
Last edited by MADDOG; 8th July 2018 at 19:17.
I think our yearly subs are £250, but that includes the really excellent meals and wine. You give as much or as little as you wish or can afford to charities - there is no expectation of amount.
We meet formally four times a year and I usually put an extra ten or twenty in the gift aid envelope. Some do more, some less. Our lodge is in the process of building a brand new scout hut for the local community.
There are also other events such as Ladies Night - a huge ball that is held behind our house in marquees covering an acre, and weekends away etc. All are entirely optional.
Some members go to everything, some to very little. It doesn’t matter. Depends on how much free time and other commitments someone has.
I was advised when I joined that Family cones first, career/job second, and Freemasonry very much third.
Wasn't for me.
The history and some of the the formalities are facinating and generally everyone is welcoming but equally, I found some of the bar "banter" a bit "life on mars" and in the end I didn't appreciate the humour.
I should add that I'm no prude, but after years as a manager in the civil service I was uncomfortable with some of the older members views
Went to a historic vehicle show today and I was surprised to see a Freemasons stand, I know a few people who are in, but I have never discussed it with them. I’m not sure what I think about it really.
Have been issues with recruitment and retention for years now and I think a big part of this stems from a reluctance to bring the craft into the 21st century in some respects. As with all clubs or forums etc. the members have a huge part to play in how successful it is and how appealing it appears to those looking to join. We are quite lucky in that we have a broad spread of ages and backgrounds making it a pleasure to meet and ‘chew the cud’ but I know some lodges do struggle and eventually have to hand their warrants back in. Grand Lodge is making a concerted effort to make things more open and stem the flow of younger members leaving so soon after joining and to increase the awareness on social media platforms as well as fairs and the like as you discovered today.
My old man was a mason.
My mother used to take great delight in saying "Dib dib dib, dob dob dob!" when he left for his monthly lodge meeting.
Reading this thread with interest.
It seems like the Masons are a bit like the Rotary Club/Lions International, but with a few historical rituals thrown in?
From an outsiders perspective, it does appear to be at risk of being perceived as rather archaic and irrelevant in modern terms. Probably not helped by the historic levels of 'secrecy' surrounding the whole thing.
My father in law was a Freemason for many years, yet there was absolutely no assistance given, emotionally, financially or otherwise, when he had a massive heart attack, which caused his business to fail and his wife/young daughters were left homeless. I am sure this varies between individual personalities within the different Lodges, but I was under the impression it was one of the fundamental underlying principles of the whole organisation.
I have just applied to join my local lodge after some discussions with a chap I know from my local. He's in his twenties, and so was my co-signatory, so I they they have succeeded in attracting some young blood. Certainly, the impression I get (before I've even been there) is of a quite vibrant organisaition, keen to expand and do the charitable work they seek to. Doesn't look like it will cost too much, and the meals sound great value! And for me it's a chance to do some good for the community.
If only they recognised Pastafarianism as a religion.
Have you been touched by his noodly appendage?
Do you remember when Del Boy tried to join?
Indeed it was; we used to go most Saturdays. Sadly I've not been there for a few years now. That's where I met my initial proposer into Freemasonry.
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Those are good reasons for finding out more about joining. Have you tried contacting your Provincial Grand Lodge (www.pglwilts.org.uk) to find out more?
It's not very secretive these days and you certainly don't need to be invited.
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Up until WW2 the Freemasons were far more high profile. After the Second World War it turned in on itself and became very insular - which is self defeating as new members have to ask to join not be invited to join contrary to urban myth!
Starting in the 1990's the current Grand Master, HRH The Duke of Kent, has worked to make Freemasonry more outward looking - as well as actively contesting some of the more outlandish rumours circulated about the Craft in the media.
Today many Masonic Centres hold Open Days, operate websites and the United Grand Lodge of England offers tours of the site - which you may recognise in many TV dramas which have been shot in its Art Deco interior.
Similarly the secret ritual you mention is quite readily available today on t'interweb if you want to read any of it; prior to that it has long been available in print since the publication of Darkness Visible back in the 1950's.
If you do join I'd advise against reading the ritual first as it would diminish your enjoyment of the experience. I was advised the same and was glad I didn't.
Hopefully some help?
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Last edited by adg31; 10th July 2018 at 16:46.
When I worked in the CPS, a DI I was working on a case with, asked if I wanted to join something called the "Big Buffaloes."
I politely declined, as belonging to one ludicrous organisation at a time was my limit.
He might have been referring to The Ancient Order Of Water Buffaloes.
They used to exist, no idea if they still do.
ETA according to Wikipedia they still do, but doesn’t look like the organisation is in great shape:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Antediluvian_Order_of_Buffaloes
Last edited by TheFlyingBanana; 11th July 2018 at 06:44.
With a secure place to live and a managed breeding program they'll make a comeback.
"Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. The third time it's enemy action."
'Populism, the last refuge of a Tory scoundrel'.
One of my friends is a mason. He has asked me a few times to consider it.
I actually quite like the idea of it and getting involved in helping local charity projects. My biggest issue is the commitment of time to it.
You can help local charities without the need to wear an apron.
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