Best investment potential over the next few years?

[Passenger]

Some good points Rev, especially re dabbling in what you know/ can get your head around.

AND imo wines best for drinking not investing in, that's a bit sad. missing the point really.

Question for Mick if he'll indulge me... what sort've percentage of worth are you looking to put into crypto, noticed you were seeking to pick brains on the matter a day or so ago....

[Mick P]

Almost all equities have a basic book value, i.e. the net value of assets. With commodities that's trickier. Property is, literally, bricks and mortar -- often land, too. Oil and gold are what they are. But art and antiques have very little intrinsic value. (Ever sold a gold watch for scrap? But what is a vase except for some clay and laze and maybe paint.) With these it's all down to the human element of the market. And that is purely subjective. Fashions come and go, things rise and fall in value. Who wants an huge gilt-framed Old Master oil painting these days? Not so many people. Will Banksy prints always be worth tens of thousands? I don't think so. Meanwhile, with Russian and Chinese money the old stuff from those regions is being snapped up by oligarchs.

Would I buy watches as a long term investment? No. The market is already overheated imho and the people who are dropping five and six and seven figure sum into vintage Rolex and PP can afford to take a bath on them. For them it's like a yacht or a car, another status symbol that might well depreciate. They are not investors, they are playboys. Sure you could try and get a Daytona and flip it. You could even sit on it and it might well go up in value. In fact, it probably will. But at the end of the day what have you actually got? Some steel and sapphire and a fairly unimpressive (for the money) movement.

Buy equities or property. Dabble in what you like and know. I could sell a house a buy a milsub but 1.) the house is returning me £500 pcm / £6k pa net and 2.) you can't live in a milsub. They could both tank but in the meantime the house will have earned me real money (not paper profits) and, er, it's a house. People need houses more than they need obsolete timepieces.

Thank you for you advice, I totally agree with you.

I only have 5 Rolex. so hardly an investment fortune and like you my little pile is mainly in property, 3.5 houses to be precise. Yes property and equities are by far the best investment.

[Justin Case]

Don’t you stand to lose a fortune on your Spanish apartment Mick? Hardly likely to have been a good investment that, notwithstanding enjoyment value etc.

As everything, go in with eyes open.

[Passenger]

Tough market broadly speaking over here just now, even down at the beach... front or second line the good, substantial homes are facing you might say significant headwinds...this according to my American buddy who lives right there and has dabbled in that market buying, improving, flipping and who enjoys watching the market/ talking with local agents...bit of a hobby of his really. The good stuff apparently still moves but sellers have to be sensible, most aren't, is what I'm hearing.

Obviously markets do vary a bit regionally, don't know and not commenting on Micks situation

[Mick P]

Don’t you stand to lose a fortune on your Spanish apartment Mick? Hardly likely to have been a good investment that, notwithstanding enjoyment value etc.

As everything, go in with eyes open.

I have a large Villa in Spain with sea views and a pool etc and we use that for just under 6 months a year. My 3 sons use it as and when required at no cost to them, so it's a good family investment.

The apartment which is now empty was bought in 2006 and we still own it. We are just sitting on it until the market picks up which is still strongly in favour of the buyer. I would estimate that as a minimum, we and my sons have occupied it for 240 weeks so if we sold it at a low knock price, a weeks break/occupation would average just over £200pw, so at the moment, it's still a reasonable return. If say in a few years, we get what we paid for it, it will be 240 weeks occupation for next to nothing. So I am quite happy to just keep it empty.

We own both properties outright so the running costs are low. Community tax in Spain is so low it's unbelievable.

[Mick P]

Tough market broadly speaking over here just now, even down at the beach... front or second line the good, substantial homes are facing you might say significant headwinds...this according to my American buddy who lives right there and has dabbled in that market buying, improving, flipping and who enjoys watching the market/ talking with local agents...bit of a hobby of his really. The good stuff apparently still moves but sellers have to be sensible, most aren't, is what I'm hearing.

Obviously markets do vary a bit regionally, don't know and not commenting on Micks situation

The new Brexit rules of the 180 day with a 90 day break has caused two families to put their apartments on the market. They both came out from October to April to escape the UK winter. There seems to be a lot of that going on and what with covid restrictions, the market is once again dead.

Its all down to price. When I bought the villa, I negotiated 48% off the original selling price from a vendor who had held back far too long on price and eventually lost heart and just caved in. He bought it in 2007 as a holiday home and had spent only 11 weeks in it, so he must be cursing the day he bought it.

[Danstone]

Hate these kind of posts as, unless investment is your real hobby, it sucks all the enjoyment out of this passion, but I’ll give my thoughts anyway. Of the three options I would go with the PP and hope that Patek discontinues the Aquanaut in the next few years. That’s the only chance I see of making any meaningful gain in the next few years as I see all of them as being at their limit for the near future.

I don’t buy into the ‘never sell a Rolex’ and ‘you never lose on a Rolex’ posts that get spouted on here all the time. You only have to go back ten years and literally any Rolex, even the hallowed Daytona, would have lost you money had you bought at retail and sold to a pre-owned dealer next door five minutes later. This age of instant profit is a very modern thing, it may continue but it probably won’t. Yes, Rolex will outperform other brands in terms of value retention and even profit, but you will probably have to hold on to them for many years to see anything back if you buy at current market prices.

[Devonian]

I have a large Villa in Spain with sea views and a pool etc and we use that for just under 6 months a year. My 3 sons use it as and when required at no cost to them, so it's a good family investment.

The apartment which is now empty was bought in 2006 and we still own it. We are just sitting on it until the market picks up which is still strongly in favour of the buyer. I would estimate that as a minimum, we and my sons have occupied it for 240 weeks so if we sold it at a low knock price, a weeks break/occupation would average just over £200pw, so at the moment, it's still a reasonable return. If say in a few years, we get what we paid for it, it will be 240 weeks occupation for next to nothing. So I am quite happy to just keep it empty.

We own both properties outright so the running costs are low. Community tax in Spain is so low it's unbelievable.

Have you considered selling it at a loss now and putting the money into something else to recoup your losses? Even if the running costs are low, they are still running costs. Plus you’re totally at the mercy of the Spanish housing market and it may continue to be a buyers market for a long time.

With you posting elsewhere about the stock market returns and possibly dabbling in the bitcoin malarkey, plus you’re mantra of never selling a Rolex, maybe there’s a diverse spread of options you could put your apartment sale into that will return more than playing the waiting game?

[Wallasey Runner]

Have you considered selling it at a loss now and putting the money into something else to recoup your losses? Even if the running costs are low, they are still running costs. Plus you’re totally at the mercy of the Spanish housing market and it may continue to be a buyers market for a long time.

With you posting elsewhere about the stock market returns and possibly dabbling in the bitcoin malarkey, plus you’re mantra of never selling a Rolex, maybe there’s a diverse spread of options you could put your apartment sale into that will return more than playing the waiting game?

I hope his property investments don't exceed 5% of his portfolio.

Wasn't Mick on the Rich List the other week

[Devonian]

Wasn't Mick on the Rich List the other week

No way! He’s dropped to 5th

[o u t a t i m e]

My vote goes to the aquanaut. Here’s a crazy prediction... I believe the 5167 will be worth close to 50k by the end of the year. In any case, whatever you buy, make sure you love it, wear it and enjoy it. None of that silly watch in the safe nonsense.

[Dave O'Sullivan]

Top trolling from Mick yet again
Old rascal.

To be fair, I think that’s pretty sound advice.

[Mick P]

Have you considered selling it at a loss now and putting the money into something else to recoup your losses? Even if the running costs are low, they are still running costs. Plus you’re totally at the mercy of the Spanish housing market and it may continue to be a buyers market for a long time.

With you posting elsewhere about the stock market returns and possibly dabbling in the bitcoin malarkey, plus you’re mantra of never selling a Rolex, maybe there’s a diverse spread of options you could put your apartment sale into that will return more than playing the waiting game?

Some people do sell at a loss and then put the money into another "venture" and I fully respect that.

Some of us are just sitting on the property and waiting to see what happens. The property market in Spain was taking off quite well until the effects of covid kicked in and it is expected to recover fairly quickly. So hanging on is also a respected strategy.

I have decided to stay well away from Bitcoin.

I have also decided no more watches either and it must be a few years since I last bought one.

I think equities is now the place to be and trackers, although boring, are currently a reasonable bet.

[wileeeeeey]

I hang my head in shame - I bought an Omega a few weeks ago.

I have also decided no more watches either and it must be a few years since I last bought one.

Rascal

[Mick P]

Rascal

It was a pocket watch, not a wrist watch but you are right, it is a watch. Pocket watches are lousy investments, so I did this for love.

[893bet]

I have also decided no more watches either and it must be a few years since I last bought one.

I think equities is now the place to be and trackers, although boring, are currently a reasonable bet.

What about the omega you said you bought a few weeks ago

I hang my head in shame - I bought an Omega a few weeks ago.

[893bet]

Rascal

Teach me to open a thread and not read it for 10 minutes and then post without seeing the new posts that may have been made 😅

[Mr Curta]

https://www.cancerresearchuk.org

[dkpw]

FFS - let's suck out all the enjoyment, pleasure and emotional attachment from the hobby by considering the minutiae of the slightest market price fluctuations.

Jesus.

If you have to ask advice on a watch forum, let's face it, you haven't a bloody clue to start with.

AND let's hope this is still the wrong forum on which to speculate.

[rahilb]

I’m sure the Rolex sports watches will increase in value forever, just ask the bubbleback owners :)

Interestingly Bubbleback production actually did stop too; in my opinion Rolex dive/chrono watch production will never stop.

[Tiny]

Let's face it, the more Rolexes the speculators buy, the more they will increase in value. In the end they just become money laundering chips for drug dealers and criminals. A couple of years ago myself and a friend drove up a narrow country lane and got surrounded by pikies. I noticed they were all wearing subs. In the end I made a lot of revving noises and floored it.

[ryanb741]

Just buy Mings at RRP as part of the lottery system. Instant Lambo

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[Daveya.]

5% in fine wines? What's this?

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[gerrudd]

5% in fine wines? What's this?

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My portfolio is index linked to Blue Nun and Black Tower. I’m also short on Mateus Rose.

[Daveya.]

My portfolio is index linked to Blue Nun and Black Tower. I’m also short on Mateus Rose.

Excellent news, I've just sealed my beer fridge, I'm hoping they might be worth loads in 10 years

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[ryanb741]

I've just found a 4 pack of Carling. I was going to drink it but I'm thinking if I kept it in the safe with the original packaging I'd be able to retire 3 years early?

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[Sinnlover]

A couple of years ago myself and a friend drove up a narrow country lane and got surrounded by pikies. I noticed they were all wearing subs. In the end I made a lot of revving noises and floored it.

I know it’s early in the morning but this post poses more questions than answers...

1. Why
2. How
3. Was the engine turned on or did you go brum brum before running....

[wileeeeeey]

I bet they were all bimetal blue subs

[Sinnlover]

I've just found a 4 pack of Carling. I was going to drink it but I'm thinking if I kept it in the safe with the original packaging I'd be able to retire 3 years early?

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Carlsberg Special Brew is where my portfolio is heading, the gold can is more refined and it’s becoming hard to find at RRP. The tramps have tried to corner the market.

[paskinner]

Haven’t people noticed the greatly increased interest on this forum in less expensive watches? Lots of them, available at reasonable prices. Some delighting guys usually well-known for more exotic models.
Changes are happening. And the good thing is a flood of interesting watches at low cost.

I shall watch with interest. The long-term may be quite bumpy for higher priced goods.

[Daveya.]

Haven’t people noticed the greatly increased interest on this forum in less expensive watches? Lots of them, available at reasonable prices.
Changes are happening. And the good thing is a flood of interesting watches at low cost. Excellent. Not everyone is now obsessed with over-priced ‘famous’ models.

I shall watch with interest. The long-term may be quite bumpy for higher priced goods.

Low cost is relative , and meaningless really, low cost in the forum here will range from 40 quid to 1k

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[ryanb741]

Haven’t people noticed the greatly increased interest on this forum in less expensive watches? Lots of them, available at reasonable prices. Some delighting guys usually well-known for more exotic models.
Changes are happening. And the good thing is a flood of interesting watches at low cost.

I shall watch with interest. The long-term may be quite bumpy for higher priced goods.

Not really TBH. Some give away prices on SC currently (especially that Halios and that Anonimo) yet they remain unsold.

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[Tiny]

It may not be long before Rolexes for investment are sold and kept in a vault on behalf of the buyer, just like with gold. You never see them, let alone wear them. You have a certificate of ownership you can take pictures of and post on forums.

[Tiny]

I know it’s early in the morning but this post poses more questions than answers...

1. Why
2. How
3. Was the engine turned on or did you go brum brum before running....

It's a long story. Too long for here.

[893bet]

Yet the opposite is what is happening in reality. The dog on the street is buying a 2k watch at this point. And lads that only had one watch are now looking to have 2-3.

A couple of lads on a forum buying a few “cheaper” watches doesn’t make a trend.

Where it will end. Who knows. But there is very little “value” in watches at the moment in the 5-25k segment of the market, especially from the “desirable” brands. That’s one of the reasons I ordered a Dornbluth this year.

Haven’t people noticed the greatly increased interest on this forum in less expensive watches? Lots of them, available at reasonable prices. Some delighting guys usually well-known for more exotic models.
Changes are happening. And the good thing is a flood of interesting watches at low cost.

I shall watch with interest. The long-term may be quite bumpy for higher priced goods.

[Devonian]

Haven’t people noticed the greatly increased interest on this forum in less expensive watches? Lots of them, available at reasonable prices. Some delighting guys usually well-known for more exotic models.
Changes are happening. And the good thing is a flood of interesting watches at low cost.

I shall watch with interest. The long-term may be quite bumpy for higher priced goods.

Doesn’t look that way at all. Demand is way above supply with certain watches and brands and as long as those companies keep making less than people want, it’s not likely to change for some time.

[Mick P]

Doesn’t look that way at all. Demand is way above supply with certain watches and brands and as long as those companies keep making less than people want, it’s not likely to change for some time.

Totally agree, the main thing is to keep supply down and waiting lists up, that is how to enhance the brand image and maintain residuals.

I suspect that this situation is here to stay.

[jpjsavage]

I also think the move towards precious metals is driven by the scarcity in supply of steel watches from some brands. I think Rolex are following the lead of Patek in that respect.

[murkeywaters]

It's a long story. Too long for here.

I guess they were gathering for a bare knuckle?

A mate and his missus parked in a remote lay-by, went for a walk, came back to see loads of cars and vans around there car, they had to get through some feisty lads in white vests with caravan mullets to get to their car!

[kultschar]

Purchased my 116500 for 15 grand from David SW (famous US grey dealer) when on honeymoon in Florida a few years ago. I got quite a bit of crap for not paying rrp on a certain forum and how the bubble would pop but 3 years later I notice it is now getting close to 30K - crazy since not remotely vintage.

On the other hand I sold my Hulk on here for a measly 5 grand (I think) before things went nuts so swings and roundabouts - then again the proceeds of that went towards my 5711 from Boodles!!

Ive chucked a fair bit of cash into my collection - nice to see the “potential” value keep going higher but I cant say I see it as a proper investment like my properties, I prefer the dream of being able to keep trading up without putting any more cash in and ending up with something very special.

[ataripower]

You're all wrong. Forget watches, cars, wine, art and gold. Invest all your money into Cryptocurrency. I know someone who knows someone who think they know someone who got rich by doing it. You can't go wrong :-)



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