Reply With QuoteThe one on Chrono24 has definitely been over polished.
Look at the bezel, is very soft when it should be very sharp fluted.
Firstly, please let me apologise for only enclosing the links of the two DD 1803, but I don’t have any photos that I can attach directly.
I would really appreciate some advice regarding these two.
Both have just come back having been fully serviced by Rolex.
The first one only has the box and service card, while the second is a full set.
Apart from the price difference, the only real concern that I have is the ledgibity between the two dial and their hands.
The first has a champagne dial while the other is gold.
Is the “Wide Boy” a rare piece and what is the history behind it?
Primarily whichever one I choose it will not be used as an everyday watch.
The first seller is a local jeweller who I have contacted several times and he has sent me additional photos, via EBay message, which shows the watch better. He will also get from Rolex the correct strap and pin buckle.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rolex-Gen...0/232827852148
The second piece is from a dealer in London.
https://www.chrono24.co.uk/rolex/day...-id9624770.htm
Both watches still have the service stickers on them.
As a wild card, I have also been looking at the following piece, which looks lovely. But I am unsure on whether it has been over polished.
https://www.chrono24.co.uk/rolex/dat...-id8198923.htm
Thank you for any help that you can provide.
Last edited by Topcat30093; 12th December 2018 at 11:34. Reason: Amended title
The one on Chrono24 has definitely been over polished.
Look at the bezel, is very soft when it should be very sharp fluted.
I'm wearing a Day Date at the moment; if it were my choice I'd go for the local watch, a watch guaranteed to work well for many years and it's cheaper. It looks a good price for a solid gold watch, just expensively serviced. I also prefer buying locally . Incidentally, if you only use it occasionally, you'l be constantly re-setting the day and date.
You could argue that these watches are designed for regular use .
Last edited by paskinner; 26th November 2018 at 10:52.
Agree 100% with that. Looks v nice.Originally Posted by paskinner
Neither DD, as the bracelet is missing, the leather strap even if original has been added later (bracelet probably sold on separately)
The DJ has the proper end-links, but does look over polished, way too shiny IMO.
There are plenty around, so I'd keep looking for a better example
Thanks gents for your advice.
Pleased that it wasn’t just me who thought that the DJ was over polished.
Regarding the bracelet, previously I would have agreed with you 100% that a DD should be fitted to a president bracelet. But my tastes have changed and I really like the thought of it being fitted on a strap.
The leather strap is the best decision by a mile. Rolex gold bracelets are just too loud for comfort and attract the wrong sort of attention.
Patek Philippe nearly always come with a leather strap because it just looks right.
The DD is perfect for a strap.
36mm DD have long had a strap option. And they tend to look good. The newer, bigger DDs are bracelet only. I agree it can look 'too much', which is why I went for white gold. Most people assume it is steel.
And for those who ask, what's the point....pass.
Incidentally, the DateJust can offer an equally fine visual appeal, at least to me. A decent option for those who want 'the look' without all the cost.
The two models, DayDate and Datejust, really are brothers. So, a 36mm DJ can be a rather good option if you don't fancy gold, and tend to remember what day it is.
In this case, I'd go local for the DD on a strap.Should be a good buy; or, I'd buy a new 36mm DJ with Jubilee.
Last edited by paskinner; 26th November 2018 at 20:04.
Thanks Mick and Peter for your input.
I am certainly keen on getting one on a strap.
And the fact that both have been serviced by Rolex is very reassuring
Condition wise between the two 1803’s which would you considered the best?
Would having B&P’s be a deciding factor for you?
And is the “Wide Boy” piece as the seller describes “Rare” so maybe a better option?
Thanks again for bearing with me, as I know that the vintage world of Rolex is full of pot holes!
Last edited by Topcat30093; 27th November 2018 at 00:38. Reason: Added a further paragraph or three
No one cared about boxes and papers in those days, they were slung out when the warranty ended.
If you have a good watch with a recent Rolex service receipt then you are fine. This document verifies authenticity and shows a recent service.
I wouldn't buy a DD without a bracelet, the President bracelet is a work of art. I have the 36mm platinum DD, which has the domed bezel rather than the fluted, so is perversely a lot less blingy than the yellow gold version. Domed bezel is also available in white gold.
Pateks are an entirely different kettle of fish.
Sorry it's a little grubby! I wore it for four straight months before changing to another watch. I don't know whether anyone noticed it, but zero comments.
My suggestion would be to pop along to the local jewellers; have a good look at the watch. Put it on your wrist, how does it feel? Do you like the strap? It's Rolex serviced so, if you still like it, buy it.
I wouldn't worry about 'papers'....you will have the remains of the two-year Rolex guarantee. And the advantage of not having the bracelet is that you avoid all the issues about 'stetch' and wear; Rolex won't service these old bracelets. They cost many thousands to replace.
Incidentally, I think a Rolex service will have cost around £800.
Sound advice Peter.
Very true Mick.
Holsterman, I understand 100% were you are coming from. Many years ago, before I was introduced to the higher echelons of Holorgy, my grail watch was the Y/G DD with President bracelet and concealed clasp. That was the only format, that I wanted and eventually that dream came true.
I used to wear it regardless of what I was doing, which included driving a 44 Tonne artic.
It was and still is an awesome piece, with a defiance presence on your wrist.
Nowadays, though I still love to see them on a bracelet, I like them on a strap, that way I no longer have to worry about catching the bracelet.
Once after drinking waaaay too much alcohol, I played football with the family, fell over and twisted the bracelet. The damage cost £1,100 to put right, thank goodness for insurance.
Incidentally, I always admired the Platinum DD with the ice blue dial, but never understood why they never had the option of a fluted bezel?
Perhaps it was to do with cost or it was impractical to do!
I'm given to understand that it's not possible to make the fluted bezel in platinum, I can't think why, though.
Platinum has a "greyness" to it and is visually quite unlike white gold (or Rolex's version of WG). It also looks very different from steel. Perhaps a platinum fluted bezel wouldn't have the same "sparkle" you get from the gold versions? A sparkle I'm personally keen to avoid, btw, because it really attracts attention.
P.S. I'd go for the "wide boy", of the two you like.
Last edited by Holsterman; 27th November 2018 at 08:23.
Working platinum is very different to working gold (iirc the temperatures have to be much higher and it's much harder, at any rate the info is online if you want to find it) Presumably the detail of a fluted bezel is simply impractical.
I may be wrong but I though Rolex use 18k. While platinum is denser it would be softer than gold when alloyed with other metals. Platinum wouldn't hold the fluted edges as long.
Not comment on those specific watches, I have owned both: champagne on leather and gold on president. I much prefer the gold dial. It makes the watch more 'complete'. I have no problems with legibility.
With regards to the bracelet, I'd really try to source one with it fitted. It takes the watch to another level. You can always stick it on a leather strap when you fancy a change.
A friend who sent-in his 1803 for service, got it back with the bracelet removed. Rolex wouldn't refit it, because they thought it insecure. They wouldn't repair it, and quoted £8000 for a new one.
However, there are a few specialists who take this work on. The bracelets of these old models cause more issues than the watches.
Which is why new ones are now fitted with ceramic to make them resistant to stretch and general wear. About time.
I think the hidden clasp is lovely, a key feature of the Presidential bracelet. Although you lack any adjustability, and extra links are eye-wateringly costly. So if you buy the watch with bracelet, make sure it comes with enough links.
The other problem may be the sheer 'brashness' of a yellow gold model with bracelet. I wouldn't have the nerve.
Last edited by paskinner; 27th November 2018 at 10:35.
I thought that it may have been something along those lines, thanks.
Thanks Dave
Good to know about the dials and a good point about the bracelet.
Got a photo of the Wide Boy.
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So, Topcat, have you bought one yet? If not, the choice from the three is easy.
The third's a wrong 'un. Too much wear, too much polish.
The second's at London prices (and Austin Kaye tend to over-restore their watches, anyway).
The third, however, looks and sounds just right.
Buy it quick ... before I do.
Tinker, I am going to see it over the next few days.
I cannot offer too much advice on the ones you show, but I would say that they are beautiful watches. This is mine
Blowers are selling a 18038 on a strap which has also been serviced by Rolex.
The additional feature of the date quickset is definitely a plus.
On second thoughts, TC, it's not cheap for a head-only Roller, so, as much as I like Somerset, I shan't go there soon.
I am still searching for a Day Date.
This week I shall be going to look at one of the freshly serviced Rolex 1803 that I had mentioned.
However I continued to look and found this 18038 which also had just un gone a Rolex service.
My question to those in the know, is regarding the bracelet.
Is the stretch to bad for the watch to be worn?
The seller has assured me that though there is stretch, it can be worn. And there is also the option of removing a link to make a better fit.
Part of the deal, is that it would come with a new Rolex strap and pin buckle.
I would really appreciate your thoughts before I proceed either way.
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I don’t have the experience to comment on the degree of stretch on this bracelet, its significant, thats for sure, but whether its excessive is open to question. I’d be tempted to enquire with Seth at Watchdealer to get an idea of cost and feasability of restoring the bracelet and factor this into the decision. Also, if the bracelets fully tightend /restored you might need another link!
Buying a day/date is never going to be cheap, the bracelet’s the key issue in most cases.
Even though I’d rarely wear one, I’m becoming drawn to these myself at around the £8-9 K price range.......compared to paying iver the odds for a modern steel sports Rolex they’re good value!
Good luck in your quest, black, white or silve dial would be a ‘must’ for me.....that narrows the choice somewhat.
Paul
In my opinion that stretch is quite bad and could be close to terminal, or. Significance repair job
Also you cannot remove the top links near the case so even if the fit was tighter, it would still look off (like pics)
Last edited by Jlynch1984; 12th December 2018 at 14:50.
It looks totally shagged, avoid, or negotiate a price reduction sufficient to fix the bracelet.
Here are some further photos with a link taken out, to show a tighter fit on the wrists.
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Thanks for your input.
Have to admit that I am tempted.
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Is it totally shagged? Unless you’ve seen one stripped down, how do you know?
I haven’t seen one on pieces so I can’t equate what I’m seing with the degree of wear, I don’t know how thick the pins are so I can’t estimate whether the bracelet is in danger if failing. For that reason I qualified my advice in an attempt to not mislead the OP.
Some input from someone with an informed opinion is what he really needs. The seller will claim the bracelet is servicable, it could be argued that its condition is comensurate with the age of the watch. I don’t see the seller dropping the price significantly, I think its worth finding out how much a full refurbishment will cost before committing because at some point I think you’ll end up doing that.
It’s a tricky decision, if I was looking to buy I’d be struggling. Cost of refurbishing the bracelet is a key piece of info in my opinion unless someone can say categorically that the bracelet has plenty of wear left in it......and the best person to give that advice is probably the guy who refurbs them.
Thanks Paul, for your usual honest and straight forward reply.
To be fair to the seller, they have never tried to hide the fact that there is stretch in the bracelet.
And even stated that Rolex would not touch it, due to the age of the bracelet.
They had the foresight to purchase a genuine Rolex and pin buckle, which is something that I would likely use.
Though, the addition of the bracelet, even if it's only worn occasionally, as Mick said earlier would be an advantage.
Everything is price dependent, and the bracelet could be refinished.
It's just a matter of time...
Hi Tony
In the first pictures it does look bad and I’d walk away (unless price was excellent), however the second pictures it doesn’t look too bad. I’m cautious so would probably keep on searching myself.
Looking forward to see whatever you get :-)
Let's just say I wouldn't be rushing to buy that watch. Worth paying more for a pristine example, rather than trying to fix an arguably shagged-looking one.
How much is it up for? I bought - and sold - my 18238 on bracelet with B&P, in better condition, for less than 8k, so if it's more than that I would hold out.
I wish that I could find one like yours and at that price :)
Just tried the one on that is on EBay.
Lovely watch and nice people
Trying them with different straps.
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Bezel peaks look sharper on this one too.
At the risk of enraging the purists, how much would an 18ct gold 'replica' bracelet cost for a Day Date cost? I`m sure these were available at one time and I think they were produced in Italy. Buying a watch without bracelet (priced accordingly) then getting a replica replacement might be a way forward. I`m not looking to get into the 'replica' debate, but provided the watch was genuine and the bracelet was good quality I wouldn't be worried that it wasn`t the real McCoy. I'm talking about good quality bracelets that weren't cheap, not some plated tat!
The problem with day-dates is the sheer cost/value of the bracelet, this tends to turn the logic on its head a bit when trying to buy.
Edit: a quick look on the internet hasn`t found anything, maybe the gold aftermarket replacements aren`t available now?
Last edited by walkerwek1958; 13th December 2018 at 13:26.
Is that the one in Wellington Topcat?
To me it’s the president bracelet that makes it, there is just not the same impact on a leather strap.
Yes Ben that's the one.
He also had a freshly serviced Rolex GMT Master 16770 for around £7,000
Well, I have bitten the bullet and made an agreement with the owner, to buy the other one on the bracelet, with the understanding that should I not like it, then it can be returned for a full refund, it should arrive tomorrow.
Incidentally, I did email Seth at The Watch Dealer and he replied very quickly, saying that without seeing the bracelet it would be difficult to quote, which is fair enough, but he did say somewhere between £500 - £1,000.
I thing £500-£1K is fair for refurb considering the value a good bracelet adds to the watch, far better than my suggestion to buy an aftermarket bracelet.
The Day Date is a watch I`ve never even considered, can`t imagine I`d wear one very often, but I`m getting drawn to them. A friend of mine bought a new one as his retirement present to himself, couldn't understand it at the time but now I can.
Buying a second-hand example for the 'right' money makes far more sense to me than paying a few grand over list price for a Daytona or even a BLNR, I know it's like comparing apples and carrots but to me it makes far more sense.
I far prefer the bracelet so I think you’ve made a good choice Tony, especially as you can return it if you’re not happy with it. I can always give you my view for a fee - latte or cappuccino:-)
If Seth can’t do it, isn’t there a guy in Hong Kong called Michael Young whose supposed to do fantastic work with bracelets - though I think you’re talking a long wait as he’s extremely busy.
Definately right choice with the bracelet.
Mine is absolutely knackered and I wear it with no problems. Once it's on the wrist, the stretch isn't really an issue.
I saw a badly stretched GMT bracelet that Seth had tightened up and it was incredible what he had done, I would have thought a President bracelet wouldn’t present more of a challenge it’s just the components that are more expensive hence the higher cost.
Thanks Stephen will keep you posted.
i have heard good things about Michael Young.
Cheers Dave that’s encouraging to hear.
Thanks Bob and Paul for the reassurance.
My 16753 Rootbeer has loads of stretch but once it’s on the wrist it isn’t a problem (to me)... I think you have made the right choice, I love those day dates
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^^^^^^^
Thank you for that, it makes me feel better :)
Will keep you posted.
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