New Sette 270 on the way :)
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New Sette 270 on the way :)
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Looking forward to sampling some new beans this weekend...
Absolutely right ... in Italy is by far the most used coffee pot at home breakfast - Moka Bialetti, or (like me) Moka Alessi which is in steel. In italy you have a coffee break around 10:00 am at the bar where you get a nice espresso and a croissant.
It is advised to only wash under running water (NO soaps or detergents, and every so often dry it with a microfibre cloth which will take out some accumulated fats.
And a bit of service changing the rubber ring, cleaning the fine perorations in the disk, and may be changing the valve every 5 years or so.
The "not decent cup" is nonsense.
Last edited by Franco; 3rd June 2020 at 16:55.
I spent almost one year in Italy and I can tell you this: there are very few places where you can drink an decent espresso, made from fresh roasted coffee beans. Most of them uses pre-packed coffee from different vendors (I saw in some metal recipients, like big jars). I asked some of those pub owners and the told me that is not efficient (economically) to use fresh roasted beans for 1 euro/shot. But the machines do all the thing and you can get an acceptable espresso for 1 euro. Of course, I'm talking about regular places where you can drink espresso fro about 1 euro, not about expensive restaurants.
They like it thick and strong, soupy ristrettos
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Well, I was born in Florence , I am Italian and been in most parts of Italy for the first 30 years of my life. And drunk thousands of coffees everywhere. Do not think you can seriously doubt my knowledge of Italy.
In 1570 there were 85 coffee shops in Venice, and coffee has been a national darling since then. Most espresso machines of class come from Italy, Saeco, Gaggia, Pavoni were the first available home espressos
In every town there are five or six special places, and every town have dozens of bars where you drink coffees better than “decent”” , unlike you said earlier. Of course depends what your favourite coffee is like , may be you like Starbucks.
I think a lot of ‘third wave’ coffee drinkers look down on italian coffee culture. My wife’s Italian and I love it. For a 80cents a shot it destroys any big chain coffee in the uk.
It’s like when people say UK has great foodie culture. There’s some great stuff but the average is just rubbish. You can go anywhere in Italy and get a great coffee and food.
Just received these a couple of days ago
I drink fresh roasted coffee espresso from almost 10 years... I'm using a Lelit PL41TEM and a Mazzer Super Jolly adapted for single dose. I've been experienced different way of preparing coffee (espresso, moka, french press, turkish ibrik). I also own a Kinu 47 classic and a Flair Signature PRO. I'm using not only dynamo metric tamper, but also these tools:
I imagine that you know what are used for, right?
So, you may be more familiar with Italian coffee places than me, but I know what a good coffee should be, and definitely a good coffee is made from fresh roasted coffee. Can you send me a location of 10 coffee in the same district places which are using fresh roasted coffee?
I am sorry, but have no time to waste with you, you are too cocky and argumentative.
Enjoy whatever you drink, that I have no interest to know. Just don’t piss about on Italy.
Man, I love Italy. I spent a lot of vacations there: Roma, Venice, Florence, Toscana, Catania, Milano, Torino, and it may be some more that I've forgot about. The weather is good, the food is amazing, the ice cream is fantastic. My only problem is with the coffee: I start walking into espresso world because of Italy. But after I start understanding what is it and how is made, I realize that there is no good coffee without fresh roasted beans. I don't say that you cannot drink a good coffee in Italy... I'm just saying that because the cost issues, you cannot have a good coffee for 1 euro and that is a fact. Yes, is good because they use machines that costs 2-3-4000 euro in those coffee pub, the thermal stability on these machines is huge (we are talking about very big boilers), which leads to a big improvement in the coffee taste. But I drank some amazing coffee in some places and I asked the owner why this difference... the answer was simple: where is a good coffee, the price is not 1 euro. If i need to go deeper with my explanation, it would my turn to say: I have no time to waste with you.
Regarding the cocky part (that being said by an Italian), you make me laugh...
I just wanted to write more, but I see no point discussing with such peoples... You didn't bring any argument into this, just waving your Italian nationality (and pride) here. I just explained that I love Italy, but you are stuck in your hole.
I had this unpleasant experience with peoples like you in the past (in your beloved country), and they act exactly like you: they offend first and also they scream after (just because they can, just because they are Italians). Well my dear, I don't give a damn about your nationality... what matter is something else. The good point is that I also met great peoples in Italy.
Last edited by kumm2004; 3rd June 2020 at 21:50.
You do contradict yourself a little! You were a little offensive to Italians!
Anyway, I think the thing is you need to compare like for like. High end coffee anywhere is going to taste great. But, middle of the road stuff is undoubtedly better and cheaper in Italy. 1 euro from a bar or 4 euros from a Starbucks. It’s a no brainier for me.
Also, you do need to be careful in Italy. If you take a seat the price can double or triple as they consider it table service. Just stand and drink it or take it yourself.
Italian coffee will always be the same, i.e bulk roasted robusta to a very dark roast (and then sprayed with water to make the weight back up) but even as a speciality coffee drinker who likes third wave coffee (google it) there is something enjoyable about a well pulled shot from an Italian train station vendor, even better if it’s pulled on a lever machine.
It’s their coffee, their tradition. Is it the best coffee in the world? No, it’s not even the best coffee in Europe.
It’s not going to change as it’s so ingrained in the daily routine, other countries even those with a coffee bar tradition are more receptive to the ‘modern’ third wave way of roasting and brewing coffee.
No point in trying to change it if they are happy drinking it.
They make some of the best coffee machines though.
(The irony of this post is the fact that some of the best speciality coffee is roasted by an Italian called Rubens Gardelli who won the world roasting championship a few years ago!?)
Last edited by MrSmith; 4th June 2020 at 09:53.
Just to set things right.
"Coperta" means blanket. Perhaps you meant "coperto" which means something different: https://mycornerofitaly.com/coperto-italian/
Several restaurants however are like in the UK, and do not charge it, in those however you are supposed to leave a tip.
In service stations usually there is a row of pumps with "servito" which means "with the attendant" , and costs more that the normal, which is self-service. The attendant time costs money, hence the charge.
Equally, in many bars you do not pay to sit, unless you ask the waiter to serve you. In others, particularly in the central areas of towns, the costs of space is prohibitive. And if you sit and occupy it for one hour or so, it costs money, hence the charge.
It is the same in France, Germany and Spain, nothing specific of Italy, and nothing in the whole of Italy.
I've certainly experience of similar in French cities.
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Timely thread for me - my Jura S9 (bought second-hand 11 years ago) is having problems, and I'm not enjoying using my Zyliss cafetiere mugs (although they are ideal for travelling - so good that they have stopped me from trying an Aeropress!)
so I've just ordered a Jura E8 to tide me over
I'm a big fan of bean-to-cup machines. I've played around with Sage-type machines in the past, but it always felt to me that they were designed so that the whole theatre of making the coffee was more important than drinking the actual coffee itself. (A bit like audiophiles spending more time listening to the equipment than the music).
I've experimented with lots of beans, and the ones that consistently suit my palate (I only drink strong black coffee) are Whittard's Café Français (https://www.whittard.co.uk/coffee/di...ee-111070.html). Probably looked down on by the enthusiasts, but they work for me.
Plastic... too much plastic.
you can read a good review about these automatic machines here.
Thanks for the link, but I fear that the reviewer had too many prejudices for it to be an objective review. It's also 12 years old, and the technology within B2C machines has moved on quite a bit since then.
There's a lot of snobbery attached to coffee making, as well as a lot of people who seem to enjoy playing barista more than drinking the coffee. Plus there's always the attraction of a big shiny machine with lots of knobs and dials and gauges, no matter how difficult it may be to actually persuade it to dispense a decent tasting coffee.
I've no problem with plastic, it its place. It has lots of advantages over other materials - hence its wide-spread use in all sorts of products. I can't imagine you could find a car, a TV, a computer or all manner of other object which don't have a high proportion of plastic in them.
My only problem with plastic is the direct contact with the coffee. To be honest, I don't know how is this Jura E8, but I saw some automated machines and there was direct contact between plastic and liquid. Regarding the snobbery, I agree with you and i assure you I'm not one of them... I'm using the same machine since 2012 and the same grinder since 2014.
I don't know about the E8 (it hasn't even arrived yet) but I've had my Jura S9 apart and there's some - but minimal - contact between the liquid and the plastic. The beans go into a plastic hopper and then are ground by metal blades. The brewing unit is metal, and then the resulting hot liquid travels along a rubber (from memory) hose to the dispensing nozzles, which I think are plastic. The water reservoir is plastic and the cold water travels through clear plastic (from memory) hoses to get to the brewing unit or (when hot) to the steam outlets.
What is the objection to liquid/plastic contact? I would hope that any plastics which come into contact with the liquid would be food grade, chemically inert, and designed not to taint the coffee?
Set up , budget end of decent set ups , this has cost me about 1k
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Yeah I've upgraded to am IMS screen, and competition baskets ( I believe they are made to a much higher level of engineering )
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Have you considered that you could fit a PID to that Classic?
Sorry, I wasn't looking to that picture in details... I just saw the front of the machine and the grinder. My fault!
Then you have all you need for drinking a good coffee.
I am enjoying this thread. I do enjoy drinking coffee but happy with supermarket purchased ground coffee and Aeropress.
Strange to think that something so basic as coffee can be so complicated and so variable.
What is the PID?
First crema using the Sette....
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Heat transfer , quality of engineering for metal screens, probably loads other reasons
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I don’t quite understand the issue with plastic, bpa? But even with an a high end machines water is normally kept in a plastic tank. I try to only drink from glass, I’d been using a britta kettle for years which was plastic. I can’t believe I hadn’t thought about it. I now have a glass kettle.
However I do remember reading the Judas machines can’t be opened and cleaned. Apparently they can get quite horrible inside! Not sure if it’s an issue anymore.
Last edited by Rodder; 4th June 2020 at 20:45.