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Thread: Advice with a plumbed in woodburner

  1. #1
    Master hellominky's Avatar
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    Advice with a plumbed in woodburner

    I'm going to contribute another thread from a ham fisted diy-er looking for advice.

    In short, can anyone give me a clue in removing a woodburner that is plumbed into the central heating.

    The woodburner is installed in the home of my wife's grandmother, who is now in care.

    The burner is an old arrow model, but acts as central heating and hot water.

    I've checked the burner and it seems okay but the plumbing angle is beyond me. I've attached some photos that capture the burner and the best view I can obtain of the plumbing connection, which I believe connects to a normal hot water tank in the next room.


    The house has a normal cold tank in the loft that gives water pressure. The cold tank runs down to feed a hot water tank in one downstairs room. I think the plumbing runs from the hot water tank and into the burner, then running back to the hit tank when heated. The plumbing seems to run behind some skirting board and I can see one pipe connector running into the burner, I can't see another but the angle is crap.

    The connection runs into the rear of the burner but isn't accessible from inside. I presume I need to isolate the cold tank and drain it all down and then try to disconnect the plumbing from the rear of the burner.

    At some point the family will sell the house, and they won't be that impressed it it comes with additional flood damage......

    I've checked Google/you tube and can't see anything helpful

    Thanks

    Steve

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  2. #2
    Master
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    I’d say shut off the electric to the cylinder then shut the water supply to it off
    Either by tying up the ball valve in the loft of it may have a shut off ‘tap’ where it enters the cylinder
    Run the hot tap to empty the cylinder (no inlet so it won’t fill up)
    Then I’d guess all your left with is any water in the pipes between the cylinder and the back boiler?

    Edit
    Is the back boiler feeding rads?
    If so those 2 pipes coming from the back boiler I guess are are flow and return for the radiators
    Last edited by lewie; 2nd February 2025 at 22:09.

  3. #3
    Master hellominky's Avatar
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    She doesn't have any radiators! It's a very old fashioned house.

    Good advice ref the tank thanks

  4. #4
    Master
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    Then I guess the water just returns to the hot water cylinder
    Mains in ( from the loft tank) cold water out of the tank hot water in (from the back boiler ) hot water out to the taps (at the top)
    In theory if you just want to remove the burner
    Shut off the water
    Drain the tank
    Remove the burner and cap the in and out pipes
    I’d remove the whole lot
    Burner tank and associated pipe work
    Scrap the waste - that cylinders probably worth £60 plus
    And someone will buy that burner if you stick it on eBay
    This is a good guide
    https://www.evolvemyboiler.co.uk/art...er-replacement
    Last edited by lewie; 3rd February 2025 at 09:39.

  5. #5
    Master hellominky's Avatar
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    Thank you so much that's a great guide, nice one

  6. #6
    Unless you plan to modernise the house yourself can’t you just leave it there? Any buyer will surely install central heating and likely change h/w too.

  7. #7
    Grand Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    Unless you plan to modernise the house yourself can’t you just leave it there? Any buyer will surely install central heating and likely change h/w too.
    That would be my thinking of a plan. Depends on if the OP is taking it on himself, much too hands on for me to either do or project manage.

    Hardy old girl living without proper heating at that age. Fair play.

  8. #8
    Grand Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    Unless you plan to modernise the house yourself can’t you just leave it there? Any buyer will surely install central heating and likely change h/w too.
    Definitely my approach too, either totally modernise or leave exactly as it is. My DIY skills would be stretched to do all the work myself and in my view thats the only way to make it work financially. Costs have risen sharply over the last 4 years, as a project it would soak up money............my current abode was bought as a project, when the neighbour asked whether we were giving the house a name my answer was ' moneypit' !

  9. #9
    I'm no profesional but there must be an outlet for heat/pressure to escape?? Usually there will be a tank in the loft to allow for expansion/heat or pressure, a blow off tank if you like. These things normally have some safety system built in.
    The pipework will rely on gravity to get it to circlate. Hot water has a lower density than cold and this allows the circulation to start.

    This is probably of no use to you but may help you understand the system better.

    I don't use my system from April till October and never had any leaks. Maybe a small heater on a frost stat would negate the worry from leaks/bursts

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  10. #10
    Master hellominky's Avatar
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    Sorry to clarify the house will be sold in time, I'm just hoping to relocate the woodburner to my house (the family are all okay with this idea).

    And yes, she is unbelievable really. No heating at all apart from a woodburner and an open fire and hot water just via the woodburner. The house is like something from 1930, she was still fetching coal/wood daily at 95 years old!

    She's part of the different breed of people - was a land girl in WW2, volunteered for disabled people for much of her life and won an MBE for charity services about 10 years ago. She's gone into a home finally as she started to suffer with her memory, but is still physically able and fiercely independent. We tried to get her heating etc for years but she is the embodiment of the war spirit and wasn't interested at all and didn't want anyone taking pity on her.

    Incredible lady.

  11. #11
    Master gunner's Avatar
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    I'd leave it in place.

    That way the house has at least a basic option for heating and HW until someone guts it, and you get a nice new burner.

  12. #12
    Master
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    Can I ask what your plans are when relocating to your own house? Are you planning to plumb it in to your own heating system, or just fit it as a stove ?

    The reason I ask is, if you plan to use it as just a stove, there’s a high probability you will be disappointed with the outcome and would be served better buying a stove designed for that job.

    We have 2 wood burners in our new house (well, 1861 isn’t new but you get the drift)… 1 of our stoves is a standalone 8.8kw fella. The other is a beast of a 30kw jobby which is also plumbed in to our heating as a top up to our oil boiler. The 8.8kw chap does a FAR better job at heating a room than the 30kw guy. Boiler stoves are generally designed to direct most of their heat in to the water system. I’d guess that we are lucky if our 30kw is pushing out more than 5kw in to the room. I’m actually thinking of replacing it with a standalone stove as we don’t need it for the radiators/hot water as the oil boiler seems to be handling that ok on its own.

  13. #13
    Master
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    Or really something you should be fitting yourself either
    They do require signing off by the local council- I’ve had 3 fitted but fortunately I have a mate that fits them

  14. #14
    Master hellominky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gorrie View Post
    Can I ask what your plans are when relocating to your own house? Are you planning to plumb it in to your own heating system, or just fit it as a stove ?

    The reason I ask is, if you plan to use it as just a stove, there’s a high probability you will be disappointed with the outcome and would be served better buying a stove designed for that job.

    We have 2 wood burners in our new house (well, 1861 isn’t new but you get the drift)… 1 of our stoves is a standalone 8.8kw fella. The other is a beast of a 30kw jobby which is also plumbed in to our heating as a top up to our oil boiler. The 8.8kw chap does a FAR better job at heating a room than the 30kw guy. Boiler stoves are generally designed to direct most of their heat in to the water system. I’d guess that we are lucky if our 30kw is pushing out more than 5kw in to the room. I’m actually thinking of replacing it with a standalone stove as we don’t need it for the radiators/hot water as the oil boiler seems to be handling that ok on its own.
    That's interesting thanks, I was going to store it until we redecorate and then get it installed to use as normal woodburner, without any plumbing. I think i can get hold of metal plugs to seal the rear holes for the plumbing so assumed it would work the same. I didn't realise it could be cooler, that's interesting.

    My father in law spoke to my wife tonight and said words to the effect of 'great idea, but get a professional to disconnect it you moron'.

    Probably sound advice........

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by hellominky View Post
    That's interesting thanks, I was going to store it until we redecorate and then get it installed to use as normal woodburner, without any plumbing. I think i can get hold of metal plugs to seal the rear holes for the plumbing so assumed it would work the same. I didn't realise it could be cooler, that's interesting.

    My father in law spoke to my wife tonight and said words to the effect of 'great idea, but get a professional to disconnect it you moron'.

    Probably sound advice........
    Ok, so generally speaking…. a boiler stove has a water jacket built in to it. Think cavity wall… but the cavity is filled with water. This means that.. when fitted to work as a boiler stove, the stove does not radiate as much heat out in to the room because of that water jacket.
    I’ve no idea what it would be like using a water jacketed stove with no water in the jacket… I still suspect it wouldn’t be anywhere near as toasty as a stove designed to be a standalone due to the cavity.

  16. #16
    Grand Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by hellominky View Post
    That's interesting thanks, I was going to store it until we redecorate and then get it installed to use as normal woodburner, without any plumbing. I think i can get hold of metal plugs to seal the rear holes for the plumbing so assumed it would work the same. I didn't realise it could be cooler, that's interesting.

    My father in law spoke to my wife tonight and said words to the effect of 'great idea, but get a professional to disconnect it you moron'.

    Probably sound advice........
    Haha sound advice indeed.

    Equally a modern stove will blow this out of the water from a heat efficiency and production potential.

    Be far better off with a modern one unless you have a similar aged house / want to ignore decades of improvements in design, or it holds personal value.

    Assuming it can meet modern sign off requirements (no idea there, just a thought).


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  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by gorrie View Post
    Ok, so generally speaking…. a boiler stove has a water jacket built in to it. Think cavity wall… but the cavity is filled with water. This means that.. when fitted to work as a boiler stove, the stove does not radiate as much heat out in to the room because of that water jacket.
    I’ve no idea what it would be like using a water jacketed stove with no water in the jacket… I still suspect it wouldn’t be anywhere near as toasty as a stove designed to be a standalone due to the cavity.
    Where will the heat go if not radiated to the room - up the chimney?

    Agree though, better off with a modern, purpose designed stove.

  18. #18
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    Where will the heat go if not radiated to the room - up the chimney?

    Agree though, better off with a modern, purpose designed stove.
    I’m guessing its sort of insulated by the water jacket ( with no water) keeping the heat in

  19. #19
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    Where will the heat go if not radiated to the room - up the chimney?

    Agree though, better off with a modern, purpose designed stove.
    Never tried but assuming this does have a water jacket… even without water the heat needs to pass 1 wall, heat the air in the cavity enough to then heat the outer wall to radiate in to the room. That doesn’t sound efficient.
    Also, while typing there.. I’m thinking you’d maybe need some sort of vent for the hot air as it expands, rather than just blanking/plugging it.

    To me, it just all sounds a bad idea. A load of hassle and expense for something that probably won’t be particularly good. If it had been getting fitted again as part of a boiler system then ‘maybe’ worth considering.. but even then, I think I’d be looking at a newer model with guarantees and fitted by someone who isn’t going to invalidate your house insurance!

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