Lemania chronograph future spares availability

[stevet1]

I've been looking for a lemania 5100 based chronograph for a while, I love the history behind it, the acclaimed robustness of the movement and of course the second and minute chronograph hands being situated on the main dial making it superb legible in use. The only thing that concerns me though is the future availability of servicing and spares. I know the lemania movement contains a few plastic parts that would be difficult to replicate etc and may eventually become embrittled. What is the consensus on these parts becoming rare in the future making it difficult to keep it in good order over a lifetime and proving a barrier to passing it on as an heirloom piece?

[Sinnlover]

Sweets (member here) is likely to be the man in the know
I have been put off buying further examples based on my experiences of getting parts some parts are all ready almost unobtainable.
The calendar parts can be hard to get hold of as an example.
It maybe possible to 3d print parts, Bry maybe able to offer his thoughts on that.
It is a shame as it’s almost the perfect chronograph movement

[stevet1]

Thanks for the response and your honest opinion which are confirming my fears so far.
Happy to have my suspicions challenged though if anyone has more information.

[Onelasttime]

I've had a 5100 for a while and foolishly keep putting off getting it serviced, although it runs fine.

I last asked about servicing in 2019 and it was still possible, but none of the three watchmakers got back to me when I asked how they would replace parts if it needed it.

I hate to think it's on some kind of horologicial death row and will eventually end up binned.

[earlofsodbury]

Perhaps consider one of the Sinn or Damasko centre-minutes chronos based on Valjoux 7750 movements instead? Easier to service.

Hopefully in time 3D printing will be sufficiently high-resolution to make parts for the old movements...

[sweets]

The 5100 is relatively easy to service, its pillar construction is relatively easy to work with.
So in terms of normal use, and normal servicing, all you need to do is find someone who happily works on it.
Not everyone is happy to, Paul (walkerwerk) hates it and doesn't like to work on it. I have had the movement serviced perfectly well by a few different people, and most recently the Horological Underground here in Bristol has done one for me, with no issues.
It is also a movement that is currently and (as far as I know) for the foreseeable future at least, supported by 3 of its main suppliers, namely Omega, Tutima and of course Sinn.
So if you own one of them, a return to manufacture will guarantee the availability of spares.
There may be others, I know Eberhard in particular had a very close working relationship with Lemania (they produced at least 2 totally unique movements just for them).
And Fortis may do. And Schifferle and Schifferle (service agents for the Orfina Porsche Design). All may still support the movement, but I have no proof of the first two, and only an offer of work from S & S.

I am not aware of any failures due to embrittlement of the delrin parts. Yes, day and date wheels can be damaged by setting at the wrong time, and these are plastic (not delrin), but they are for many movements.
So, if you have one of the more minor-branded examples, you may struggle, as I am not aware of any independent re-manufacturer of parts for it. And the day-date discs are about as scarce as any of the parts (which you can often find for silly prices on Ebay)

Curiously, one of the most common failures is the winding mechanism, which is all metal, not plastic at all. It is one of the main reasons that regular servicing is needed, as the rotor is not spun on a proper bearing, and it needs to be lubricated to stop wear.

Whilst the V7750 alternative movement is newer and better supported by those that manufacture it (versions are made by Sinn, Damasko and Tutima) the V7750 does not have the same shock resistance as the original, so it is not quite as capable, or historied.
You would also be tied to whomever for all spares.

So if I were looking for one now, that is either a fixer upper or is to be kept for a long time, I would restrict myself to buying a Tutima, Sinn or Omega (1045 movement).

In fact I have, mostly, recently buying a black Sinn 142, to complement my EZM1 (and Tutima Commando II)

[notenoughwrists]

I sent a Fortis cosmonaut Chrono 5100 to the watch guy for full service.
No probs working on it, but needed a replacement crown/stem as it was slipping on hand-winding. They could not source and I had to just live with the defect.

Put me off any future Lem. 5100 pieces to be honest.


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[Dynam0humm]

I sent a Fortis cosmonaut Chrono 5100 to the watch guy for full service.
No probs working on it, but needed a replacement crown/stem as it was slipping on hand-winding. They could not source and I had to just live with the defect.

Put me off any future Lem. 5100 pieces to be honest.

The slipping crown has nothing to do with the movement, that's a Fortis part.

[juusom]

Thank you sweets for the great post about the lemania 5100 service situation! I was actually pondering the same things as the OP few months ago. My decision was the get the Tutima 760 (titanium version of the military chronograph). I have been delighted with it and hopefully it can be still serviced many years in future.

[sweets]

Just got back to this thread having been away for a couple of days.
No need for thanks, this place has provided me with lots of useful info, so it's only right that I chime in whenever there is something I can help with.
I think I will contact Fortis and ask them whether they still support the movement through their service network.
I will post here whatever I get in reply.
D

[sweets]

I have heard back from Fortis, very quickly (to their credit). They say

Thank you for your message and your interest in Fortis.
Unfortunately, we do not have any spare parts for Lemania movements. Therefore, if something should be wrong or a revision would have to be carried out, this would unfortunately no longer be possible.
As watches with Lemania movements are generally old models, we generally have almost no spare parts left (including parts other than the movement).
Please don’t hesitate to contact us if you have any other questions or concerns.



So there we go, the list of those able to support their older models isn't any longer than we might have thought.

D

[notenoughwrists]

The slipping crown has nothing to do with the movement, that's a Fortis part.

I think you are right. Just read back:







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[stevet1]

Thanks for those updates and for contacting the major watch manufacturers that used this movement, still following with interest.

[sweets]

No problem.
No reply from Tutima as yet.
Fortis replied to me a second time when I expressed my disappointment that they were not supporting watches that were a mere 21 yeas old. They commented

Thank you for your reply.
We completely understand your concern. Unfortunately, this is beyond our control as the movement manufacturer no longer exists and we can only guarantee spare parts up to 10 years after the end of production. This generally applies to all watch parts.
In addition, this watch was still produced by the previous company. We also have no influence on their production and models. They will not be re-produced if they are once sold out.
In 2018, the company was taken over by the current owner and all models from 2018 onwards were produced by us. We can therefore only guarantee spare parts for these watches.

Thank you for your understanding.

[Ar.parask]

I currently have:
1 sinn ezm1
2 Orfinas PD
1 lemania 5100
1 sinn 156
1 heuer carrera

6 in total and keep hunting for more. I wouldn’t let the fear of servicing put me off a nice watch


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[BillyCasper]

I’ve owned two 5100, Sinn EZM1 and a Bundeswehr chronograph. Sometimes regret moving the Sinn on, but perhaps don’t feel so bad if there could be future constraints servicing them, it’s a valuable watch. From memory this matter started cropping up in discussions quite a few years ago.


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[notenoughwrists]

That’ looks lovely ^^^


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