Reply With QuoteThanks I didn't know that.
Originally Posted by MrBanks
They haven't had any meaningful control for years except with PR and watch design. Now that has been completely removed from them and the shareholders want to start making money.
Thanks I didn't know that.
I’d say controlling PR and product design is pretty significant input.
Either way, new owners new vision. Time will be the judge of that.
I can’t see why they are getting such a hard time on this thread although I’d want to know what’s inside for that price level. Website just says “automatic movement” on this page. https://www.bremont.com/products/sm40-dt-ss-bk-b
People featured in their marketing seem quite old so that would go against the suggestion of targeting younger buyers.
Out of shot I bet he’s got moc toe boots with his trousers turned up.
Looks like a TZer.
Last edited by Montello; 10th April 2024 at 16:59.
I prefer that it says automatic movement rather than a random made up number like BR04-XZ/1. They have used Sellita for years, particularly the SW300 in S300 series so I presume the new models are no different.
I didn’t know that. My point was I’d want to know what’s inside.
the TZ audience isn't anyones target market. A minority of watch enthusiasts isn't going to keep any company afloat. Just my opinion but Bremonts target audience used to be reasonably affluent middle aged men and women who didn't want to be part of the crowd and had a little national pride. Their target audience with the new releases are 20 to 50 something year old men and may be women who would usually buy a less expensive TAG and aspire toward a Tudor or Omega. High street shoppers, not watch enthusiasts.
At those prices if they aspire to a Tudor they could buy one, granted Omega is a step up in price.
In a way I agree but I'd prefer they said 'modified Sellita xx' or 'modified ETA xx' or 'modified La Joux-Perret' etc. Saying 'automatic movement' is as vague as advertising a car with 'an internal combustion engine' as were their BR references. That said, the vast majority of watch buyers really don't care or know what movement is in a watch. All they care about is the style of the watch or the brand on the dial.
I wasn't meaning to reference the middle ground, more so that Bremont might be (badly) trying to divert customers away from Tudor and may be to a lesser extent Omega.
they've used a variety of movement models and manufacturers over the years. You can find out what's inside all the watch models but it does take a little bit of research.
This is what it says under finer details on the product page.
I always felt that the English brothers had a strong whiff of the Del Boy about them and the whole Wright Flyer / in-house movement debacle did nothing to persuade me otherwise. While it was nice to hear talk of movements being made in the UK again - I'm sure we'd all happily support that - a company is only ever going to grow so big before you need external money (from VC or any other source) to really step things up. I know from personal experience that the VC guys are usually focused on the 5-year parachute, so profitability immediately becomes an issue. Challenging times ahead...
SGR
Unfortunately as it was my job, I can tell you every single movement used in every single Bremont model, as can a few others on here.
Aside from completely reinventing the brand, I like the look of the new releases. The only thing I'm not a fan of is the supermarine bezel insert (is it aluminium?) and the raised SLN indices, which they have ripped off from Vertex.
I must admit - I am a great admirer of the Bremont case design. In a world where every man and his dog has a 'std Rolexy case' Bremont produced an individual design with 'claw'-type lugs. I also like the case knurled band what you can have in a selection of colours.
The Martin Baker with white face is a particular favourite as is the Supermarine.
Not so keen on the notion of "bit of spitfire/lancaster/sopwith camel in every watch" idea, though...............
I'm simply not in the market for a £2k-£4k watch, however.
They've just trashed the brand in one release.
I quite like the MB (and would wear one) or the Supernova but I genuinely think that the terranova and that shockingly unattractive new bracelet is going to push MB etc buyers away by association.
that's what Mr Banks was alluding to, that he prefers the description 'automatic movement' to a Bremont reference code. You have to dig a bit deeper to find out the exact movement used.
Yep.
They arrived with an interesting take on case design across the board and whilst some hated he 'associations' they produced they were very different. The limited edition pieces generally retained value despite some on here hitting on them and the brand grew on the back of a broad spread of mainstream/limited pieces with decent aesthetics.
The new stuff is shite (and I say this as a previous Bremont owner).
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
Personally I thought that the S301 used an ETA movement but why should I let the facts get in the way of a disgruntled ex employees ramblings.
In the interests of perspective or clarity, you could mention all the other movements that Bremont have used over the years instead of just Sellita.
Your thoughts betray you, padawan.
Never disgruntled, I enjoyed my time there and it gave me a leg up into the industry.
The chap in the pic is Aldo Kane. He is rather more hardcore than a typical TZer.I’d say controlling PR and product design is pretty significant input.
Either way, new owners new vision. Time will be the judge of that.
I can’t see why they are getting such a hard time on this thread although I’d want to know what’s inside for that price level. Website just says “automatic movement” on this page. https://www.bremont.com/products/sm40-dt-ss-bk-b
People featured in their marketing seem quite old so that would go against the suggestion of targeting younger buyers.
Out of shot I bet he’s got moc toe boots with his trousers turned up.
Looks like a TZer.
None more hardcore than a TZer geared up with Barbour, selevage (sp?) jeans, redwings and a Rolex.
XXL and size 8 feet?
Phew glad I don’t have a Rolex (hides the Tudor)
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Stone Island will be looking at this development...closely...
Logo which is instantly recognisable. Tick
Designs which are instantly recognisable. Tick
Style, story and rough and tough designs which sell easily. Tick
Cash cow LEs which sell out immediately. Tick.
Now throw that all away and try to make a silk purse out of the sow’s ear you bludgeoned everything into. Tick
Hubris trumps all
Nah.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
I suspect the brand will just go downhill from here …
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Plus ca change. Oui.
My tribute to M. Bremont, the original French farmer that inspired the whole STORY.
Last edited by dkpw; 10th April 2024 at 22:44.
I’ve made it clear I’m pretty horrified at the new designs.
It’s a new company now , new owners, new management, Nick & Giles are no longer in charge, and the brand no longer represents their ethos.
I’m solidly Generation X, I’ve watched the brand grow, loved their early designs, and got close to getting one, but didn’t quite get over that line.
The brands future isn’t with me, or even my generation. It’s now Millennials who have grown up with smart watches and smart devices. They are probably earning good money now, but have large mortgages, young families, and are in a place where £3-4K is a lot, but feasible for a discretionary luxury purchase to reward career / life progress. I’m quite certain there has been work done on figuring out their target market, how to hook them now, and hold them for the next two decades.
I think they are on the wrong path, but what do I know? No one should take business development advice from me!
Dave
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I was a Bremont fan in the early years and even recall their launch at Goodwood Festival of Speed where I was very close to buying an Alt-1 Zulu.
Dabbled in a few of their watches over the years and even did the Wing tour which was very interesting. Wouldn’t say I’m a mega fan, but liked the brand and products. Case shape and customisation were fairly unique features.
The new releases are certainly not for me.
Has a whiff of Breitling’s rebranding. Fresh investment, departure from their iconic models, new movements, etc. Time will tell I guess.
I see from the beginnings section of their current site, that M Bremont, his farmhouse and his welcoming Gallic hospitality have been erased from history, much like a retouched, inconvenient photograph from Stalinist Russia.
In the FT interview with the new CEO posted in this thread earlier he confirmed it is a Sellita inside them.
I can only access the article once so can’t remember if he specified which one.
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to me, your comments never seem very balanced, always negative toward Bremont, past and present which by your own admission, as an ex employee made redundant, certainly gives the impression that you're bias, even if you're not. Contrary, I've never been an employee of Bremont, been an enthusiast for some years but always tried to give a balanced view of both the models and the brand.
I can imagine that Bremont have moved to Sellita for the new models to cut costs. I can also imagine that Bremont used Sellita when the supply of ETA movements started being restricted around 2020. However, prior to that, as I'm sure that you know, Bremont used ETA widely as well as several other movements depending on the model.
regardless, they certainly don't seem to have done themselves any favours with these new releases.
True, Breitling did rebrand in about 2012(?)with the cartoonish marketing, but they didn’t change the core of their range too much…the Navitimer B01, with the new movement, was a definite improvement on the old generation navitimer and they didn’t change the aerospace much. They continued to improve the 2022 Navitimer and look to be making improvements with the aerospace. Bremont, however, have made significant changes to branding and design that seem universally panned here. Part of the problem might be the lack of historic design which keeps other brands from straying too much.
I wasn't made redundant!? Where did you get that from? It was a great business when I first joined (otherwise I wouldn't have joined), with the focus on doing more in the UK, but the shareholder takeover in 2019 was one of the reasons why I left. It's also difficult to be balanced when you know that the public perception of the business is very different to the actual running.
Bremont was using Sellita widely from 2017 (and earlier than that) because that's when ETA supply started drying up. 7753 and 7754's were sourced for ALT1-P's and ALT1-ZT's only. The early S300's used 2982's and 2893's but the switch to Sellita was circa 2018.
Last edited by MrBanks; 11th April 2024 at 10:46.
Saw this picture on a FB group. They look quite good to me:
They might look good, but they do not look like Bremonts, even though the only thing from previous models in the new range is the Supermarine hand shape.Saw this picture on a FB group. They look quite good to me:
Bremont tried (and succeeded) in doing something different, with very high production values on what they produced.
These new models are quite silent on the specification, and it seems clear from the absence of fill on the crowns and the single piece cases that this new range has been specifically developed to cut costs, rather than build up to a specification.
I see it as a disaster for the brand.
The models they introduced are totally anonymous. They could be from any kickstarter brand. So the effort put into building a brand so far is being junked. And there are so many new models (including ones that use an existing range name) that it is clear that this new direction will replace the previous.
It’s been bugging me for days but I’ve remembered what they remind me of….
[IMG][/IMG]
They look like they've been 3d printed. It's a nope from me.
Last edited by jimmbob; 11th April 2024 at 11:26.
I guess you’d have to handle the new ones to see what they’re all about but I’ve just been in the website where the old appear alongside the new and it’s easy to see that what’s happening is a tragedy.
Those are not the release models though - they're either 3D-printed prototypes, or entirely new ceramic-cased or (hoik! spit!), PVD models.
Notwitstanding, agree with an earlier poster - the similarity to Montblanc's painfully dull, me-too, and slightly-silly "Iced Sea" range is all-too evident...
Maybe it’s the chunky proportions but that Mont Blanc reminds me of Breitling’s SuperOcean.
Thought that had to be made up but on checking the Bremont website, it appears to be true!
I doubt they're 3D printed models, most likely prototypes, but either way I like the look of them and am a big fan of ceramic cased watches.
Nice to see a watch journalist not hold back either https://www.ablogtowatch.com/new-rel...-nova-watches/
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I actually prefer the Montblanc.
Those are not the release models though - they're either 3D-printed prototypes, or entirely new ceramic-cased or (hoik! spit!), PVD models.
Notwitstanding, agree with an earlier poster - the similarity to Montblanc's painfully dull, me-too, and slightly-silly "Iced Sea" range is all-too evident...
Ha ha ha!
Fantastic design decision!
There's certainly a similar generic-ness to the overall designs!
Yep, agree, ditto the Breitling.
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