Reply With QuoteNot exactly all towns and villages, but next month it will be.Originally Posted by hilly10
I got back from Dyffryn near Harlech today and already two villages on the Barmouth to Harlech road have 20mph in force, catching the last of the English holiday makers no doubt.
Last edited by hilly10; 26th August 2023 at 22:06.
Not exactly all towns and villages, but next month it will be.
London.
Thanks for the clarification, didn't think you meant Wales.
As an aside, I was just reading an article regarding bus timetables in Wales being buggered up by it as they are currently based on journeys on mainly 30mph roads. There will have to be more buses and drivers added if they want to maintain the current frequency of services on any particular route.
I don’t think all London roads are 20mph. Depends on borough and if road managed by borough, TfL or national highways. I live in a supposedly 20mph borough wide, but in reality it’s a mix of 20, 30, 40 and 50.
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I can believe this since I live about two miles away from one of the “ 20 mph pilots” that has been running 12 months now. Unlike sensible Councils who deem outside a school or by a shopping centre a collision zone and enforce a 20 mph. The trial just drew a circle around three villages and all 30’s became 20’s. This means A&B roads, in some cases for miles at a time.
Following non existent consultation ( remember in the trial areas 80% voted against 20 mph) the authorities have reneged on certain through roads eg possibly bus routes. However the buses will spend a significant time in 20’s and as Rugger believes will run later and less frequently.
During Covid bus timetables were reduced drastically and are only back to a third or half frequency, bad news for bus users.
Steve
Thanks, I will. I'll go at 15mph steady, just to pi55 off the locals and avoid any prizes or points! Heading to Borth for a spot of fishing, so will watch it through Mach.
On the subject of ULEZ cameras - here's a fun thing I learned today...
There's a long main road near me that runs into the ULEZ area by circa 2 miles before entering a town centre with a big roundabout. That entire road is however exempt from ULEZ all the way up to that roundabout, despite running 2 miles into the zone. Every turn off of that roundabout at the end of the road is ULEZ, so to stay out-of-the-zone you need to swing around the roundabout and drive straight back out for circa 2 miles again. Apparently according to the local neighbourhood site, the reason for this is so that heavy goods vehicles that turn down towards the zone but without intending to actually enter the zone, have the ability to go down into town and swing around the roundabout to turn back out of the zone.
The result? Every single side road on that stretch (dozens of roads), including my own, even including a blooming Tesco car park entrance, is signposted ULEZ and has it's own ULEZ camera. Just so that the main road can be kept ULEZ free, but god forbid a resident wanted to use that same road to drive straight out of the ULEZ, better catch them on dedicated signs/cameras on every singly street in the area. I really have to scratch my head and wonder what genius came up with that plan... let's blight a dozen side roads, including many cul-de-sacs that go nowhere, with ugly cameras and signage, rather than adding a place to turn somewhere earlier up the road... Honestly this stretch of road now looks ridiculous, I saw less warning signs on a visit to Chernobyl!
Irrelevant rant over..!
is this not a racist comment ie Colour and race/type being referred to in a disparaging way???
I wouldn't say it's racist, exactly. Moronic, yes. Unfortunately, some find crude stereotypes comforting.
Go to the Torygraph, and under complete anonymity of the comments section, around any SK article there is a clear and not isolated dislike for a man of a certain religion having the powers of the Mayor of London.
That’s as far as I will go in the G&D, and can be further discussed in the BP.
Hmm, makes more sense now, neighbouring counties not playing ball hence this mess around the start of ULEZ where main roads run into London and there's no prior opportunity to display signage before a turning point.On the subject of ULEZ cameras - here's a fun thing I learned today...
There's a long main road near me that runs into the ULEZ area by circa 2 miles before entering a town centre with a big roundabout. That entire road is however exempt from ULEZ all the way up to that roundabout, despite running 2 miles into the zone. Every turn off of that roundabout at the end of the road is ULEZ, so to stay out-of-the-zone you need to swing around the roundabout and drive straight back out for circa 2 miles again. Apparently according to the local neighbourhood site, the reason for this is so that heavy goods vehicles that turn down towards the zone but without intending to actually enter the zone, have the ability to go down into town and swing around the roundabout to turn back out of the zone.
The result? Every single side road on that stretch (dozens of roads), including my own, even including a blooming Tesco car park entrance, is signposted ULEZ and has it's own ULEZ camera. Just so that the main road can be kept ULEZ free, but god forbid a resident wanted to use that same road to drive straight out of the ULEZ, better catch them on dedicated signs/cameras on every singly street in the area. I really have to scratch my head and wonder what genius came up with that plan... let's blight a dozen side roads, including many cul-de-sacs that go nowhere, with ugly cameras and signage, rather than adding a place to turn somewhere earlier up the road... Honestly this stretch of road now looks ridiculous, I saw less warning signs on a visit to Chernobyl!
Irrelevant rant over..!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-66623252
I got the G word pass from having the same complexion as blue top milk and not being able to tan.
It’s a different world in Londonistan.
It has only to be a matter of time before we give up with these signs and cameras and just put a gps tracker in every car.
That could then deal with road taxation, emissions zones, speeding, stolen vehicles and so much more.
What are we waiting for ?
How would we know if the trackers are working or being manipulated / removed? A cynic might say we first need to establish a system of cameras to verify the info reported from the in-car tracker
Is that how we want to live?
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
ANPR widespread throughout the country. We are already partially there.
Last edited by noTAGlove; 29th August 2023 at 14:18.
But is it actively used for the above and does it get meaningful results?
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
If you haven’t paid your Road tax or insurance and continue to drive you will soon know about it.
I’m sure it could be expanded for more surveillance.
How I want to live is in a safe world where death and destruction on the roads is minimised and those who pollute most pay most.
If people were sensible and drove with respect for others then there would be no such need for such measures; but unfortunately there seems to be ever larger numbers of selfish muppets who must drive at excessive speed or whilst emailing or uninsured or what ever ...
I wish for a world where we can enjoy freedoms and respect those freedoms but if there is a large proportion of selfish people who just take the p*** then I am prepared to have my driving tracked if it makes the roads safer, fairer and reduces the carbon footprint. It is a price I am willing to pay.
You'd be surprised actually; one of my cycling buddies is a police inspector and he told me the computer that is linked to the ANPR cameras pings every time it sees something wrong e.g. no insurance (he says it pings a lot ....). he also says because of limited resources most of those just get ignored, generally they only get enforced if compounded with another crime.
If 100% of ANPR cameras automatically charged all cars without insurance we wouldn't have 1,000,000 uninsured cars on the road https://forcescompare.uk/guides/how-...red-in-the-uk/
Last edited by Montello; 29th August 2023 at 16:12.
It's a road tax thing then innit ?? Use more, pay more surely ?
One of my cars is used about 5hrs per week (if the weather's decent and I can get the roof down) yet I have to stump up £ 365 per annum for that pleasure.
My neighbour has a pile of shit Corsa on an 08 plate. Out of interest I checked it and despite being 15 years old it is compliant. I bet £2K scrappage would get you one of those. Most petrol cars from 2005 onwards are. It is mainly diesel cars as they seem to need to be from around 2015/16. Given it seemed the government at the time were the one encouraging mass diesel take up for that then to be found the worse polluters it is a bit of an irony that they are the most affected. Given greater good (plus my car is unaffected) I rather go with the ULEZ. I imagine in a year or so it will be not much of an issue anyway.
Fair enough, so vehicle exhaust output x time or distance and no exemption for vehicles made before 1973. 2,750 ULEZ cameras should be able to take a good stab at how far a vehicle has travelled in London or how long on road. Or maybe something like if Euro 5 diesel £12.50 then Euro 6 £6.25 per trip.
5 hours a week sounds quite a lot ... assuming average of say 45mph that's 11,7000 miles per year ... I think you are doing OK.
But if the charge was per mile it would be much fairer as you'd pay for what you used, no more no less ...
That is just a baby.
Our year 2000, 23 year old Agila is ULEZ complaint, or will be when Vauxhall send me the letter to confirm what they have told me on the phone, that it has a Euro 4 engine.
From my perspective, it sits all week doing sweet Fanny Adams and if the weather's ok, it'll get a run out so a £1 a day is the rate for having it sat on my path.
My car has done a total of 10,000 miles in the last 5 years and I get the privilege of paying £395 Road tax this year. As with yourself it is used when the sun is out and I can put the top down. This does not happen a lot as I live in Argyll.
Last edited by alas58; 29th August 2023 at 18:57.
It is painful really. However, I don't live in a ULEZ zone (as yet).My car has done a total of 10,000 miles in the last 5 years and I get the privilege of paying £395 Road tax this year. As with yourself it is used when the sun is out and I can put the top down. This does not happen a lot as I live in Argyll.
I did once read a fable about somebody seeing some currant bun in Scotland I think
The most enjoyable part of owning the TR6 which is classed as historic I can go any where and not worry, apart from Central London.
Last edited by hilly10; 29th August 2023 at 21:42.
I saw older cars were exempt. Are the emissions less noxious? What’s the logic??
Posh, rich people like to drive classic cars perhaps?
Yea right
Last edited by hilly10; 29th August 2023 at 22:27.
My post was a little tongue in cheek!
Any motorist needing to travel within the ULEZ area would be wise to consider a classic car or motorcycle.
Vehicle manufactured or registered before 3rd January 1983 can be reclassified as 'historic'.
They do not require annual MOT, and are exempt from road tax from April 1st 2023.
This is a rolling programme, the same process will apply from April 2024.
I have two elderly MZ two-stroke motorcycles, both historic and therefore ULEZ exempt.
They smoke like a chimney when cold, and burn a 25:1 fuel / oil mix.
I live near Preston and have no intention of ever riding through the ULEZ, but I can do so with impunity.
Classic cars and motorcycles are not difficult to maintain, will make you and those around you smile, and offer a metaphorical two fingers up to the ULEZ.
Last edited by W124; 30th August 2023 at 09:55.
In my experience the only people in support of ULEZ are those living in central London.
I live just outside, but the children's rugby club is 1 mile inside ULEZ. Fortunately my car is compliant, but if it weren't then it becomes very expensive quickly. (Note my car is a 5.5 litre - no idea how that is considered okay under ULEZ).
Also seeing other rugby clubs asking us to play away matches only as they aren't interested in battling with ULEZ.
While I don't like the execution (namely the ugly signs that have appeared everywhere around me!), the general premise that we discourage vehicles which pollute the most is sound IMO. I was reading something on the BBC yesterday and the London ULEZ is really cheap compared to similar zones in other major cities around the world. I think a lot of the noise around ULEZ is unfounded and driven by concerns from people that just don't know what it's all about. The vast majority of vehicles will literally have to do nothing, and there's the free and easy reg checker if in doubt.
I'd suggest your kids rugby club gives a firm no to supporting that type of nonsense from other clubs. For the 1-in-10 that might have a non-compliant car, they can ride share or swallow the £12.50... seems remarkably arrogant of them to expect your entire team to travel all the time to accommodate someone's old car to be honest.
ULEZ is about NOx pollutant, not CO2 emissions.
NOx is a by product of combustion, but the high combustion pressure in a diesel engine favours NOx, hence why they are targetted. Ad-blue (as a chemical reaction with NOx) help to reduce NOx in diesel engines, and it is why only the newest diesel engines are compliant.
Older petrol cars (as long as they are Euro 4) with exhaust gas recycle (I believe) to reduce temperature and minimise formation of NOx are compliant.
Generally a compression injection engine favours NOx production over a spark type.
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As arrogant as telling people who maybe can't afford to change their car to suck it up and pay?
Fortunately I no longer commute so the inconvenience of ULEZ when it comes in Edinburgh for me will be minimal and I have no need to change, but my car is for some unfathomable reason not compliant. The same model, with exact same engine and emissions but one year younger, is compliant. The idea that all these vehicles should be effectively scrapped early and even more so that the government is subsidising scrappage seems environmentally insane.
For the one journey a week that I need to get to the other side of town for my son's Spanish classes, I will take a route which is longer and produces more emissions because the shortest, most viable route uses the ULEZ zone for 300 meters.
Is the crit'air in France a better way? You just apply for the sticker which is about a fiver. Then your vehicle is rated 1,2,3,4 or 5. When pollution levels are high then say 4 and 5 vehicle is not allowed in relevant cities. Not "oh if you give us £12.50 you can pollute all day long.
The not being allowed inside with high pollution present seems more environmentally friendly than just making money from the charging of drivers to then pollute.
If where we live ever becomes ULEZ, the whole country will have gone to shite many years before. It’s on a pretty good trajectory currently though.
You can do what you like with the scrappage money TfL gives you.
Buy a new car or spunk it on the dogs. It is up to you.
Probably more likely to become '15 minute' neighbourhoods.
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
Could I piss it up the wall also
Silly comment. His rugby team didn't put the ULEZ in place, they're not the ones telling people to pay. But yes it's clearly arrogant to expect an entire team of people to travel all the time so that a small minority don't have to deal with ULEZ, when there's multiple options; a £12 fee, ride-share, public transport, don't go etc.
Her Britannic Majesty's Secretary of State requests and requires in the name of Her Majesty all those whom it may concern to allow the bearer to pass freely without let or hindrance and to afford the bearer such assistance and protection as may be necessary.
She’s dead.
Like the thousands who served in her Army I was and will always be a soldier of the Queen.
She had our respect and loyalty without question.
We called her the Boss, a title we gave her with affection.
We served for your freedom not to have it taken away with undemocratic foolishness by our own people.
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You find it funny that someone died?
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