I can’t get get my head around a full
eV just yet and good ones seem to be pretty pricey (£50k plus with waiting lists) I’ve been looking at a pre owned Macan 3.0s but used prices are crazy for these still but at £30k budget could get an Audi approved S4 Avant, which seems to be a great fit for what we want. Question is, is it mad to throw that much money at a petrol engined car right now? Will it just disappear far quicker as EV charging improves? Alternatively any thoughts on the S4 vs Macan debate?
Any input appreciated
Depends on how long you want the car for - assuming 3 years or so then just get what you want end enjoy for now. From 2025 onwards I'd say that EV would become the norm and depreciation far more of an issue for fossil-powered cars, but that's a way off.
And S4, definitely. The Macan is nice, but almost all of the SUVs seem to be reverse-Tardis devices. All big and chunky on the outside but cramped on the inside. Anyway, fast estates look cool!
I would, although I’ve no need at the moment as I’m not convinced the ban on production of petrol engined will be kept to. Also the cost of EV running will only increase and will at some point be no different to petrol. Whilst EV’s reduce local pollution the human and actual cost of mining for the battery products is pretty bad.
I would too, it will take twice as long to offset the carbon used in production for an EV compared to ICe, in other words over 400k miles!
Yes go for it. Even once ICE vehicles aren't for sale it will be many years before they get banned if ever. Im sure we will see some more low/zero emissions zones in large cities so unless you regularly drive into city centres i wouldn't worry.
My wife who is still recovering from a stroke can only drive an automatic. We popped into the local Honda main agent expecting to buy a new EV. First thing was not a single new car for sale but many 6-9month old ones for sale.
The salesman advised me to buy petrol simply because no one can predict the cost of replacing the batteries when they finally give up the ghost. Also the EVs are expensive and our mileage is only 4500 miles a year, so it's just not cost effective for us to go EV.
So we drove away in a 7 month petrol Honda HR V.
Hmm. Am going to see the Audi today and see if it fits the bill And if they’ll do a deal. No rush so I’ll keep options open. Any other experiences of the S4 Avant? The S6 seems a bit ‘Whaley’!
The vast %age of EV’s on our roads are mainly hired/rented, the average punter is never going to drop 30-40k on an EV when the petrol version is half price.Originally Posted by daveyw
The UK infrastructure will implode if everyone gets 7kw charger fitted at home, the cables in the ground cannot support it.
Talk of hydrogen, bio fuels & others in the pipeline.
An EV car will never be green!!
I went from diesel to hybrid and back to diesel. A hybrid is either a) the best or b) the worst of both worlds. If you like petrol I'd stick with petrol for now.
I wouldn't spend 30k cash on a ICE car right now, but if its hire purchase or whatever they call it now with a future guaranteed value after 3 years, all you are risking is the monthly payments you will have spent. If you can write that money off, no risk.
I recently needed a car and looked at new small ev's, but ended up buying a 7.5 year old mini cooper diesel after doing the maths. The mini cost £8k, has low mileage, averages well over 70mpg, £0 road tax, cheap as chips insurance, and does about 650 miles on a tank of diesel.
Had a similar conundrum last year and ended up with a Tesla for the sake of it.
Just went out in it and the bonnet opened 5 times. I don't know what I'd do in your shoes to be honest as the Tesla is a safe bet -- but safe with the bonnet opening it isn't. Quite a low end car really. Underwhelming.
The warranty/repairs would put me off a used Macan quicker than the depreciation. S4 is very nice but I think saloons have the steepest depreciation curve?
How about a PHEV BMW 530e or 330e? It could be a more safe middle ground and I really liked my old BMW PHEV. Other PHEV cars available too of course.
I did recently, and my logic was I intended to keep for a while, plus I suspect EV’s still haven’t hit their heavy depreciation yet. As the tech improves and the cost of EV’e comes down, my thinking was those 5 year old first wave of elec cars will take a dive in years to come. So in the medium term, I felt for me that money was better parked in a non-ev.
Btw, get the macan, they’re awesome cars.
Not a ''Jazz'', well done Mick.
"Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. The third time it's enemy action."
'Populism, the last refuge of a Tory scoundrel'.
I'd spend 5-10k on a decent second hand ICE car and have fun with the rest.
Funnily enough we're currently looking at a 2009 Mercedes-Benz ML280 CDI, one owner, 80,000 miles at £7k, some good stuff out there, might as well enjoy while we can.
"Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. The third time it's enemy action."
'Populism, the last refuge of a Tory scoundrel'.
Are secondhand prices starting to come down now? They’ve been mad for tha last couple of years.
Plus, of course, the unknown amount of pollution caused by generating the electricity...
To me its a bit like the government's 0% target. Not that we wont be producing pollution, just not in this country!!! Unbelievable really that they get away with it
I feel they’re softening at the moment rather than continuing to rise. The S4 Avant was fantastic and a great all round package. It’s all a question of money now…
S4 is really juicy coupled with a peanut sized fuel tank. If you don’t need all of the space an S3 Sportback is a much better car. Just as quick on the road in real terms and will achieve better mpg in almost every scenario
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I would say petrol will easily still be popular for the next couple of years and a fast and nice petrol car is always rewarding to drive.
I am sure the popularity of EVs will increase once the infrastructure is there but that could be some time yet.
Hydrogen powered cars could possibly be on the cards too of course
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That’s a good shout. I’ll try one out but got to be 5doors so I think you get more flexibility and car for your money with the S4 Avant The S6 is probably gonna be too big though.
Yes without a doubt...just bought a Golf R at just under 30k...tried a few electric cars and apart from the BIK i can't see the benifit and don't get me started on Tesla.
The wife needs a car that is "high up" in order to get in and out of it easily but the Jazz and Civic are about 4" lower. The petrol HR V was the perfect choice due to its height.Not a ''Jazz'', well done Mick.
I’m thinking of changing our petrol to a PHEV, seems best of both worlds for us.
Plug in is fine for lots of short journeys but over long distance when the petrol engine does most of the work they are less economical than a standard petrol due to the extra weight of the onboard batteries.
A compromise maybe worth making for the occasional long journey - holidays for example.
No idea on how the step up to an S4 is but I had an A4 40TFSi Back edition for a 2 yr lease
Garbage machine.
Terrible handling by today's standards
Macan is a much better prospect than an A4
I just have.
2017 Mercedes E400 4matic coupe.
Well specced up, 17k miles. £31k
It drives like a dream, v6 biturbo petrol.
It’s luxurious, quick and clever.
Full digital dash, designo hysasanth red paint. (red/wine/orange depending on the light)
£520 tax, £165 from next year.
I doubt very much that I’ll regret it.
Yes, I definitely would. For various reasons, including it might be the last chance (if I’m buying to keep for 5+ years).
We’ll done
I’ve read the EV thread with interest but right now I can’t see the point in paying £10k more for the PHEV version of the same car and full electric is too expensive as a private purchase with added concerns (no chargers at work etc).
It’s been a while since I’ve driven a ‘good’ car but the Avant felt solid enough with plenty of oomph. A Similar specced Macan is about another £10k more so the S4 is winning at the moment.
The Nissan Leaf has already been out for 11 years and the Tesla Model S has been sold in the UK since 2014. We are already well past the 5 year old EV mark.
What age/plate S4 Avant are you looking at please Dave?We’ll done
I’ve read the EV thread with interest but right now I can’t see the point in paying £10k more for the PHEV version of the same car and full electric is too expensive as a private purchase with added concerns (no chargers at work etc).
It’s been a while since I’ve driven a ‘good’ car but the Avant felt solid enough with plenty of oomph. A Similar specced Macan is about another £10k more so the S4 is winning at the moment.
If it’s the 2.9 354ps model (2016 to, about 2020) it’s a brilliant all rounder. I had that engine in a S5 Coupe from 2017 to 2019 and it’s a great power plant- plenty powerful in kick down and great mpg too.
It actually went into the Porsche Macan S (and Cayenne V6 from the 2018 facelift) from 2019 as well.
Wouldn't call it less economical, over a longer journey. Nearly 48 mpg isn't bad with 400hp on tap.
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
Yup!
That’s the one. Good to know. The newer diesels are out of my price range and with my mileage and use I’d prefer petrol anyway. Interesting that that’s the same engine in the later Macan, cheers.
99% of my journeys are less than 3 miles and I only do about 6k a year. Family are in North Wales (about 140 miles for us) which we do 3 or 4 times a year.
I get the impression that they're softening.
"Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. The third time it's enemy action."
'Populism, the last refuge of a Tory scoundrel'.
I had a 2017 S5 Coupe and it had the 3.0 V6 whereas the later RS5 had the 2.9 V6 found in Porsches as well.
Hi W
Auto Express had an article in Feb about this and a recall by Tesla to sort........
L-K
Saw qute a few Tesla´s on the road whilst in the US last 2 weeks, man they´re really not very good, refined looking, just an observation. I see Ford are bringing out an F150 all electric Pick up truck, starting at 40k dollar.
You should have no problem with buying a petrol car now with residuals, onward sales etc. The new sale ban does not come in until 2030, and second hand petrol car will have strong demand for the next 20 years.
However, have a close look at the economics. For me, and EV is much cheaper overall, although the upfront cost is more, I make huge savings in car tax and fuel which more than offset the upfront cost differential. And they are fun to drive
Thanks will look into it.
I ran a Macan S, 345 bhp, for 18 months before opting for an XC90, space for the kids being the main factor. The Volvo put my feet to sleep, and was luckily able to offload for little depreciation after 20 months. Now there is less need for high back boosters, new Macan GTS slated for August build, so should have it mid September. The S was awesome, the GTS hopefully going to be more so.
I have often looked at Audi alternatives, but they never seemed to click with me.
YOLO
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As a private purchase absolutely no savings tax wise
I would buy it. As others have said, the infrastructure and power generation aren’t anywhere near where they need to be to make the EV dream a reality for a long time.
Until I can afford an Audi E-Tron Rs I won’t be looking for one.
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If people want to 'go green' by foregoing fossil fuels (the holier than thou EV brigade), then they need to give up fossil fuels completely...not just use fossil fuel elsewhere to cover for not using it here....
My Golf estate is on a 59 plate, I thought about changing it this month, but then decided having had it for 13 years and as I am getting well over 60mpg overall and over 80mpg on a long run... i am better off putting money into keeping it going, in dribs and drabs, than spunking a dollop in one go that then depreciates and some careless trolley driver in a car park can cause upset.
S3 Sportback is 5 doors David.
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Just for info, I think Scotland was producing 100% of its energy from renewables a few months ago? Ireland was approaching those numbers too. So depending on what market you're in, the electricity may be very, very low pollution.
It might have changed but whilst Scotland does produce a lot of renewable energy, it exports a lot of it, so in fact only about half of what's consumed in Scot. comes from renewables, the other half from trad sources.
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Last edited by xxnick1975; 31st July 2022 at 07:59.
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