Speed limiters On Cars

[langdalematt]

So apparently as of July 6th all new cars will be fitted with automated speed limiters. Does anyone know if you will be able to override these?

[b-rad]

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/1...-how-they-work

"Many cars in Europe and the UK already have speed limit assistance that relies on info from GPS mapping and road sign recognition, but systems currently have to be switched on by the driver. Under the new EU regulations ISA will be active by default, although drivers will, for now, be able to turn the systems off at the start of each journey."

"For now, the ISA technology will only apply to all-new models launched after July 6. New cars already launched and in the showrooms will have until July 2024 to be ISA equipped. While the EU rules have been applied after Brexit so won’t be adopted automatically in the UK, there’s every chance we’ll get the same systems here regardless of any government action."

[Dazzler]

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/1...-how-they-work

Seems a bit of a slippery slope, accelerating is just as much of a tool as braking to get out of potential hazards.


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[aa388]

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/1...-how-they-work

Seems a bit of a slippery slope, accelerating is just as much of a tool as braking to get out of potential hazards.


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Exactly but the majority of people on the roads these days have forgotten or never knew what the loud pedal does.


On a slightly different subject, I spent my working day on the roads going from one place to another and see lots of exotics on the roads. Yesterday was the first time I’ve seen a Carerra GT out of a showroom and it looked and sounded great !! OOP 5S is on a 911 and yesterday must have been Ferrari day as there were loads out.


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[Tifa]

It's only a matter of time before your car will dob you in to the authorities for speeding, parking on double yellows, and any number of other offences.

[notnowkato]

Most modern cars seem to have some " dynamic stability control"( engaged by default) or whatnot to keep one out of trouble, easily switched off, if trouble is what one wants. I imagine the same applies with this intrusion??

[oldoakknives]

Guess I’ll be keeping my current car a while then.

[aa388]

It's only a matter of time before your car will dob you in to the authorities for speeding, parking on double yellows, and any number of other offences.

Those of us who drive wagons for a living already have the delights of the dvsa. They can’t fine us on the move but can download all the data from the wagons Tacho while driving behind us, with that data they can just stop us and then fine us as they are a self financing department now. So when you think that wagon drivers break the rules think again, we’re hounded 24 hours a day.


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[number2]

Behold the field where I grow my whatsits...

[Kingstepper]

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/1...-how-they-work

Seems a bit of a slippery slope, accelerating is just as much of a tool as braking to get out of potential hazards.


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Sure, happens all the time.

Unlike braking, far more likely used by tools to break the law and be a danger to other road users.

[higham5]

Most modern cars seem to have some " dynamic stability control"( engaged by default) or whatnot to keep one out of trouble, easily switched off, if trouble is what one wants. I imagine the same applies with this intrusion??

My understanding from reading and article last year was. You cant turn the system off, however you can defeat it by accelerating hard. The system then logs an “ exception report” Should it be required certain authorities eg Police will be able to read back on these in the event of an accident or similar.

Currently motorcycles are exempt as they realised that a bit of fwd momentum is required to keep them upright, thus slowing a bike say mid corner going into a 30 might cause the rider to crash. However this was seen as a short term setback and the plan is to push through speed control bikes too.

[adrianw]

looks like a great opportunity for defeat boxes, will be a standard protocol

[notnowkato]

My understanding from reading and article last year was. You cant turn the system off, however you can defeat it by accelerating hard. The system then logs an “ exception report” Should it be required certain authorities eg Police will be able to read back on these in the event of an accident or similar.

Currently motorcycles are exempt as they realised that a bit of fwd momentum is required to keep them upright, thus slowing a bike say mid corner going into a 30 might cause the rider to crash. However this was seen as a short term setback and the plan is to push through speed control bikes too.

From the RAC's site "But the European Commission has made it clear that drivers will be able to override the ISA software, for instance to aid certain overtaking manoeuvres. This means that motorists will still be able to act fast if they need to get out of trouble"

[Omegamanic]

So…

any new sports car I buy after 2022 would have a speed limiter? Seems very strange. Maybe I need to cancel the Lotus order, as I’m not buying something that I can’t drive on our unrestricted roads if it’s limited to an artificial top speed!

[RobDad]

Anything with the potential to reduce death on the roads is surely a good thing? - even if it means car enthusiasts have to drive within the limits. My car is a tool to get from a to b safely, I don’t want to have to dodge idiots making sporty overtaking manoeuvres in their shiny pride and joy. Judging by other responses I’m clearly in the minority though?!?


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[Omegamanic]

Any evidence that reducing the speed will reduce the number of accidents?

I don’t see a correlation - the vast number of fatalities are from accidents well within the UK’s national speed limit. To suggest otherwise is scaremongering.

We have had calls to implement a National speed limit, but Jersey has a 40mph blanket speed limit, with a higher number of accidents and deaths, so…

[hogthrob]

Any evidence that reducing the speed will reduce the number of accidents?

Dunno, but it might reduce the severity.

[StackH]

I hope it's more reliable than the adaptive cruise control on my wife's VW, which seemed to think the speed limit had changed to 30 as I went past a junction on a dual carriageway rather than the 60 I was cruising at.

[Omegamanic]

Dunno, but it might reduce the severity.

Well clearly it isn’t going to reduce the severity of a fatality, but the standard of driving needs to be tackled, rather than cars being capable of a particular speed.

Unusually I live somewhere with no blanket speed limit, so having a restricted vehicle just doesn’t make sense to me. Plus I’d hope that any device could be deactivated for track days and other events

[Michael 38]

My Volvo's limited to 112 mph which is still plenty fast enough

[dougair]

Can’t see any problem with combining a limited with speed limit recognition. If you need to break the speed limit to over take them it wasn’t safe in the first place.

[adrianw]

Can’t see any problem with combining a limited with speed limit recognition. If you need to break the speed limit to over take them it wasn’t safe in the first place.

are you saying that speeding on a duel carriageway wouldn't be safe?

[Saint-Just]

Somehow this debate reminds me of the one American are having regarding their rights to bear arms…

[Ruggertech]

are you saying that speeding on a duel carriageway wouldn't be safe?

Why would you need to break the speed limit to overtake on a dual carriageway? If the car in the left lane is going slower than you like just cruise by in the right hand lane at the posted limit. I can see why on a single carriageway road to get by as quickly as possible, but dual carriageways no.

[Kingstepper]

Why would you need to break the speed limit to overtake on a dual carriageway? If the car in the left lane is going slower than you like just cruise by in the right hand lane at the posted limit. I can see why on a single carriageway road to get by as quickly as possible, but dual carriageways no.

He needs to push on.

[adrianw]

Somehow this debate reminds me of the one American are having regarding their rights to bear arms…

agreed, I was just being divisive, he said it wasn't safe in the first place, which is incorrect, but yes it against the law.

[dougair]

are you saying that speeding on a duel carriageway wouldn't be safe?

Err yeah, that’s why there’s a limit…

[adrianw]

Err yeah, that’s why there’s a limit…

https://www.nimblefins.co.uk/cheap-c...ar%20accidents.

[higham5]

are you saying that speeding on a duel carriageway wouldn't be safe?

I know its an unpopular opinion, but when on a Bikesafe course back in 2019, someone talked about “having the capability to accelerate out of trouble “ and the Police instructor was concise. He said you never accelerate out of trouble, his view was , you dont get into in the first place.

Hard to disagree with.
,

[Templogin]

This thread makes me think of the first time that I heard someone say "fast car, not as fast driver".

Are there any below average drivers on here?

[number2]

This thread makes me think of the first time that I heard someone say "fast car, not as fast driver".

Are there any below average drivers on here?

This thread would suggest that some just don't accept their limitations.

[33JS]

Don't worry! There's not enough material on the planet for even half of us to convert to EV's, and with IC being banned you won't need to worry about driving in future.

In the meantime, the adenoidal fun-police can just doddle around until their hearts are content. Can you imagine dual carriageways when 2 cars are in different lanes, beside each other, on the limiters and approaching the end of the DC? ...with cars stacked up behind them like with HGV's... The A9, endless miles of 45mph drivers with little to no opportunity to overtake until the short, sporadic DC sections where people can finally get clear.

The world is full of people who want to restrict everyone else. Can't you just focus on your own sad, unfulfilling lives?

[watchcollector1]

Any evidence that reducing the speed will reduce the number of accidents?

I don’t see a correlation - the vast number of fatalities are from accidents well within the UK’s national speed limit. To suggest otherwise is scaremongering.

We have had calls to implement a National speed limit, but Jersey has a 40mph blanket speed limit, with a higher number of accidents and deaths, so…

Jersey's roads are hardly representative of the rest of the UK.
Road safety isn't just about speed but clearly in like for like conditions the higher the speed the less time to react (for the driver and other road users), the longer the braking distances and the more severe the outcome.

Having a fast car isn't a licence to treat public roads like a race track. Significant speeding above the limit is anti social.

[Tooks]

Don't worry! There's not enough material on the planet for even half of us to convert to EV's, and with IC being banned you won't need to worry about driving in future.

Global car ownership is at around 17-18% apparently, so it’s very much a first world problem we’re lucky to have.

But ‘if even half of us did convert to EV’ the other 80+% would probably appreciate it.

But hey, I’m sure that’s been ‘debated’ enough on here already.

Our EVs nag about speed limits, but can be overridden with a flex of the right foot if necessary.

It’s always doom and gloom where changes to cars are concerned isn’t it.

[Montello]

I know its an unpopular opinion, but when on a Bikesafe course back in 2019, someone talked about “having the capability to accelerate out of trouble “ and the Police instructor was concise. He said you never accelerate out of trouble, his view was , you dont get into in the first place.

Hard to disagree with.
,

Exactly this.

Controlling excessive speed is obviously going to reduce issues.

[mrushton]

Expect this to change at some point to a limiter that will automatically slow your car down on eg motorways when there is a new speed limit in say roadworks. Some electronics that tell you you will be slowing in 3 miles, 2 miles, 1 mile. Then it will only cancel when the limit is lifted. Same box will prob be used for road pricing and for speed monitoring and they'll be sealed and illegal to tamper with.

[adrianw]

Expect this to change at some point to a limiter that will automatically slow your car down on eg motorways when there is a new speed limit in say roadworks. Some electronics that tell you you will be slowing in 3 miles, 2 miles, 1 mile. Then it will only cancel when the limit is lifted. Same box will prob be used for road pricing and for speed monitoring and they'll be sealed and illegal to tamper with.

speeding PR and speeding enforcement is about revenue, not safety, for this reason alone they will never do that.

If it were about safety they wouldn't hide cameras and they would make an effort to tackle the main causes of accidents.

[notenoughwrists]

I am fine with it - although only if there is an option to enter your IAM or ROSPA advanced driver membership number and override the limiter.
Sorted.
Makes all the nobbers slow down, or actually learn to drive a bit.
Win/Win

I think the most valid comment here was about it being the start of tamper-proof monitoring, for road charges of all sorts and so on.
The government(s) are going to see an inevitable steady decline in fuel tax revenues from 2030, and need to compensate.
Same for the smoking bans, but offset with a proliferation of approved gambling formats and advertising (maybe).


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[Liner33]

Exactly this.

Controlling excessive speed is obviously going to reduce issues.

"Excessive speed" has no relation to speed limits

You'll never control "stupid" and you cant even legislate against it

[Saint-Just]

You'll never control "stupid" and you cant even legislate against it

In a French movie a few years ago, A dialogue between a police inspector and his friend, a psychiatrist heading a psychiatric hospital
The police was asking his friend to section a suspect that was potentially a criminal but whom he couldn't arrest
The reply goes as such:
I cannot section him. He is deeply stupid (he uses an expletive but we're not in the BP), not insane so I cannot section him.
(then , very dead pan): This is an asylum for the insane, not for the (same expletive). We should built asylum for the (expletive), but we can't: Imagine how big the wards would need to be.

[Montello]

"Excessive speed" has no relation to speed limits

You'll never control "stupid" and you cant even legislate against it

I didn’t say it has anything to do with speed limits.

Removing idiots ability to be stupid has my vote.

[yumma]

I am pretty much all for it. Our EV is limited to 99mph which is plenty and theoretically saves your license on a national speed limit dual carriageway. I am not sure if Japan still have their 112 limit, but it is more than enough really. Maybe if you are on an Autobahn then why not go faster if its safe to do so, but vmax in this day and age is unobtainable mostly. Plus a good hot hatch today is about as fast as an 80’s supercar. I haven’t maxed out a car or bike in decades now.

[Omegamanic]

Jersey's roads are hardly representative of the rest of the UK.
Road safety isn't just about speed but clearly in like for like conditions the higher the speed the less time to react (for the driver and other road users), the longer the braking distances and the more severe the outcome.

Having a fast car isn't a licence to treat public roads like a race track. Significant speeding above the limit is anti social.

I don’t live in Jersey. But… there roads are similar to lots of small towns in the uk that experience high rates of accidents at slow speed.

I live somewhere with no blanket speed limit, so there is no significant, or indeed any, speeding above the limit on those roads. There is however regular driving at significantly higher speeds than allowed in the uk most days of the week, and thankfully very rarely with any serious accidents.

It’s just my opinion, but personally, I’m against the whole idea of it, or anything similar - Ymmv

It’s just another step towards a nanny state

[MartynJC (UK)]

I don’t live in Jersey. But… there roads are similar to lots of small towns in the uk that experience high rates of accidents at slow speed.

I live somewhere with no blanket speed limit, so there is no significant, or indeed any, speeding above the limit on those roads. There is however regular driving at significantly higher speeds than allowed in the uk most days of the week, and thankfully very rarely with any serious accidents.

It’s just my opinion, but personally, I’m against the whole idea of it, or anything similar - Ymmv

It’s just another step towards a nanny state

I don’t think you would like living in outer London. 20mph limits on minor roads, 30mph on trunk. (Not that anyone takes any notice - our pet cats were killed by traffic wizzing past our house and I’ve had near misses with cars when walking as some parts of the roads have no pavements).

[pugster]

imo they would stop a high proportion of accidents by re testing everyone over the age of 65 every 18 /24 months.

[aa388]

imo they would stop a high proportion of accidents by re testing everyone over the age of 65 every 18 /24 months.

Take the age out of that and you are correct but What makes you think age is a problem, when most of the idiots I see on a day to day basis aren’t old they just either don’t look or have no spacial awareness of what’s around them. I drive over 2000 miles a week in my job so I see the worst of drivers. Personally I’ve refused to work Fridays because that’s the day most of the people that should be retested are out on the roads and turn a 10 1/2 hour 430 mile round trip into 14 hours and that’s every Friday.




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[Saint-Just]

imo they would stop a high proportion of accidents by re testing everyone over the age of 65 every 18 /24 months.

...and stopped young ones from driving, why don't you
Older drivers may be an inconvenience at times but they are rarely the ones hitting others, and even more rarely at speed.

[Kingstepper]

It’s just another step towards a nanny state

Hardly this, it’s helping prevent people break the law.

Maybe you don’t agree with the speeding laws, then that is the nannying.

[JasonM]

I would rather see more intrusive 'driving too close' aids, from my observations, this issue looks more dangerous than speeding, and also more lane discipline awareness.

[adrianw]

Hardly this, it’s helping prevent people break the law.

Maybe you don’t agree with the speeding laws, then that is the nannying.

Maybe they should concentrate on people who commit real crimes, but theirs no money in that