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Thread: Rolex

  1. #1
    Grand Master Raffe's Avatar
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    Rolex

    About Rolex prices:

    Crypto Meltdown Claims Rolex and Patek Philippe as Victims
    Prices for the most popular secondhand luxury watches have peaked. It’s the latest sign that the bling boom might not last.

    The crypto meltdown has claimed its first luxury victim: the Rolex Daytona.

    After reaching record highs earlier this year, prices for the most desirable watches on the secondary market, including the coveted Rolex, have now fallen.

    The bubble in secondhand timepieces was fueled by a combination of crypto and stock-market gains, stimulus cash and speculation. That is now unravelling. So far, demand for both new watches and other types of luxury goods is holding up. But what’s happening in the secondary watch market is a stark reminder that the bling boom, particularly in the US, might not last.

    In 2021, a combination of roaring stock markets and cryptocurrencies bolstered wealth and ignited a broader interest in investing in alternative assets, whether non-fungible tokens or timepieces. And when markets began to whipsaw earlier this year, against the backdrop of rising inflation and geopolitical tensions, some investors were keen to put their money into more tangible stores of value, such as a Rolex. Consequently, a new breed of young timepiece traders joined long-time collectors. Lockdowns in China and fewer Russian buyers may also have increased supply.

    Whether they were novices or old hands, buyers all chased the same models. By February or March, the holy trinity of the most hyped watches — the Rolex Daytona, the Patek Philippe Nautilus and the Audemars Piguet Royal Oak — was trading for many multiples of their retail prices. The skeletal pieces produced by Richard Mille were also highly sought after.

    With the S&P 500 flirting with a bear market, and Bitcoin losing about 70% of its value since November, that demand is now evaporating. Buyers are becoming more cautious. Higher interest rates, the absence of stimulus payments and soaring inflation are also playing a part.

    The biggest reversals have been in the Daytona, Nautilus and Royal Oak — models that experienced the most spectacular gains. Prices are estimated to be about 25% below their peaks. This includes private transactions, though, and may not be reflected in available market data.

    Some brands are faring better, including Cie Financiere Richemont SA’s Vacheron Constantin and A. Lange & Sohne, as some collectors diversified beyond or were priced out of the most obvious names. Some cheaper models, such as Rolex sister brand Tudor, did not see the same spikes as pricier marques. And there continues to be appetite for genuinely rare pieces, as opposed to those perceived as being simply scarce.

    While the correction in the secondary market may make it a little cheaper to buy a Rolex, it might not necessarily make it easier to get hold of one.

    Waiting lists for many new models are at least two years long, because not all of the gains in the secondary market have been erased. Buying a Rolex in a store still feels like a bargain. Watches of Switzerland Group Plc, which operates boutiques in Britain and the US, is also seeing supply outstrip demand for some Cartier, Omega and Tudor models.

    Full article including interesting graphs: Bloomberg
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  2. #2
    Master
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    The tide has certainly changed...

  3. #3
    Absurd. I know from doing my own research from primary sources like YouTube and Instagram that the price rises are because Rolex is cunningly restricting supply, Chinese are buying them for bribes (and coming to the UK to get them duty free, rather than say, Hong Kong where there is no sales tax) and that the only direction prices are going is “one way”.

    Next some fool in the MSM will suggest house prices don’t always go up.

  4. #4
    Grand Master ryanb741's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raffe View Post
    About Rolex prices:

    Crypto Meltdown Claims Rolex and Patek Philippe as Victims


    Waiting lists for many new models are at least two years long, because not all of the gains in the secondary market have been erased. Buying a Rolex in a store still feels like a bargain. Watches of Switzerland Group Plc, which operates boutiques in Britain and the US, is also seeing supply outstrip demand for some Cartier, Omega and Tudor models.

    Full article including interesting graphs: Bloomberg
    Surely they mean demand outstrip supply for some Cartier, Omega and Tudor and not the other way round as they published?

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by ryanb741 View Post
    Surely they mean demand outstrip supply for some Cartier, Omega and Tudor and not the other way round as they published?
    Is there really much demand for these brands?

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by ryanb741 View Post
    Surely they mean demand outstrip supply for some Cartier, Omega and Tudor and not the other way round as they published?
    I thought that - but I also constantly see those brands easily available in shops in the UK and abroad, and in airports, and almost all models.
    Maybe the Tudor panda chrono is the only slightly awkward one to buy immediately


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

  7. #7
    Master
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    25% down from absurd peaks, still high in the grand scheme of things.

  8. #8
    Master Toshk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berty234 View Post
    25% down from absurd peaks, still high in the grand scheme of things.
    More soon

  9. #9
    Grand Master
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    Really the only people likely to be experiencing twitchy bum are the gamblers who bought to invest and not to enjoy.
    Some of mine may and indeed WILL drop, but if that sort of thing erases pleasure and introduces worry, stop collecting watches.

  10. #10
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by verv View Post
    Really the only people likely to be experiencing twitchy bum are the gamblers who bought to invest and not to enjoy.
    Some of mine may and indeed WILL drop, but if that sort of thing erases pleasure and introduces worry, stop collecting watches.
    This is largely true but there's also a few people who very much like watches who were probably spurred on by the residual value. Not to make money, just the value gave the confidence to buy a bit more than you otherwise would.

    If it does get brutal I might even get a call or two.

  11. #11
    Master Toshk's Avatar
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    Never bought a watch to invest. Feel pleased most overhyped stuff is nothing I actually like.

  12. #12
    Master
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    It is very useful as well as interesting to see reasonably accurate information indicating which way prices are moving. If we are honest with ourselves we like to see prices creeping up because not only does it give you a bit of confidence to make a purchase, the wife is more likely to give her approval if she can see a decent audit trail of escalating prices.

    However if you are the kind of person who has to panic sell a Rolex for whatever reason, your best bet is too stay well away from them.

  13. #13
    Master
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    Can't wait as it will soon be like 2014 all over again...discounts in AD and fire sale on SC.

    Although i would like to point out i only buy the watches i like and don't give a to55 if they go up or down in value.


  14. #14
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by mjc1216 View Post
    Can't wait as it will soon be like 2014 all over again...discounts in AD and fire sale on SC.

    Although i would like to point out i only buy the watches i like and don't give a to55 if they go up or down in value.

    There is no advantage to either Rolex or their customers if ADs have to start discounting again. Brand image is all important to both parties.

  15. #15
    Grand Master Passenger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berty234 View Post
    25% down from absurd peaks, still high in the grand scheme of things.
    Give it time, it's still early doors yet.

  16. #16
    Master earlofsodbury's Avatar
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    Just imagine a world where used prices drop significantly - so significantly, in fact, that Rolex's absurd retail prices are unavoidably spotlit given the rather unimaginative mass-produced watches for which they are being demanded...

    Wouldn't just be the speculators with twitchy sphincters, then - Rolex's marketing people will have their work cut, too...*







    * Can't possibly happen, best watches in the world mate, your [sic] only jealous, wear in good wealth, &c ad naus. ...

  17. #17
    Grand Master Neil.C's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by verv View Post
    Really the only people likely to be experiencing twitchy bum are the gamblers who bought to invest and not to enjoy.
    Some of mine may and indeed WILL drop, but if that sort of thing erases pleasure and introduces worry, stop collecting watches.
    Wise words.

    Once the talk is of residuals etc I think a lot of the simple joy of watch collecting goes out of the window.
    Cheers,
    Neil.

    My Speedmaster website:

    http://www.freewebs.com/neil271052

  18. #18
    Master M1011's Avatar
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    Let me know when I can buy a 5167A in an AD. Until then, I hate it all

  19. #19
    Grand Master MartynJC (UK)'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by M1011 View Post
    Let me know when I can buy a 5167A in an AD. Until then, I hate it all
    should not of let this one go …

    "Time is an illusion, lunchtime doubly so”. HHGTTG

  20. #20

  21. #21
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryanb741 View Post
    How much??!!

  22. #22
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryanb741 View Post
    Subdial have one I've been eyeing but I've never tried one on before. I think either that or an SLA039 is inevitable at some point.

  23. #23
    Grand Master ryanb741's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wileeeeeey View Post
    Subdial have one I've been eyeing but I've never tried one on before. I think either that or an SLA039 is inevitable at some point.
    I'm enquiring on the Subdial one also lol. I've had 2 before, both bought at around the £2.5k mark and IMHO that's the correct price for them. The SLA039 and SLA037 are better watches than the SLA017 - better quality steel, better indice finishing, Hi beat movement although the SLA017 is the direct reproduction of the original hence its increased popularity.

    Subdial also have a BNIB Ulysse Nardin Diver at £3950 where RRP is £7800 - that's a lot of watch for the money as they are superbly built

  24. #24
    Master
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    I always wonder if anyone ever actually pays some of the prices that you see on chrono - nearly £50,000 for a white dial Daytona a couple of months back, for example.

    I recall on Rolex forums someone buying the first Pepsi from DavidSW nearly double RRP back in 2018 and posting about it saying he didn’t care about the price, just wanted the watch. He’s about the only one I can recall paying those type of premiums. I’ve seen people on here say they’ve paid 20% or 30% over RRP but never any of the chrono prices. I’m sure there’s a few out there but it’s hard to tell if watch prices are rising and falling that much if people aren’t really paying those prices in the first place.

  25. #25
    Master jukeboxs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MartynJC (UK) View Post
    should not of let this one go …
    You certainly should not have! Reminds me, I need to dig mine out the sock drawer ...

  26. #26
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryanb741 View Post
    Lol
    Just sold mine back to Michael(MFB)for 3K
    Ill get it back again in 6 months for 3K

  27. #27
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hood View Post
    Lol
    Just sold mine back to Michael(MFB)for 3K
    Ill get it back again in 6 months for 3K
    How's the reflection on it?

  28. #28
    Master
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    Prices have certainly dropped in the last 4 months, but still way higher than they have been last year. What happens next will be interesting, they could drop much further, or stay where they are now. Let's see.

    They increased so quickly, this drop now was inevitable.

  29. #29
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryanb741 View Post
    I'm enquiring on the Subdial one also lol. I've had 2 before, both bought at around the £2.5k mark and IMHO that's the correct price for them. The SLA039 and SLA037 are better watches than the SLA017 - better quality steel, better indice finishing, Hi beat movement although the SLA017 is the direct reproduction of the original hence its increased popularity.

    Subdial also have a BNIB Ulysse Nardin Diver at £3950 where RRP is £7800 - that's a lot of watch for the money as they are superbly built
    The problem with dealers and Subdial too is spamming out this on their Instagram while at the same time refusing to quote on watches.

    I get a quote on most of my watches every 6 months or so and last week, at the same time as this screenshot, asked for a quote on my YM42 and they said no, didn't even offer.

    Clearly want their stock out the door at yesterday's prices while buying in at tomorrow's prices.

  30. #30
    Grand Master Raffe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryanb741 View Post
    Won't ship to Luxembourg...
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  31. #31
    Master M1011's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MartynJC (UK) View Post
    should not of let this one go …
    Nope, two keepers right there!

  32. #32
    Craftsman
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devonian View Post
    I always wonder if anyone ever actually pays some of the prices that you see on chrono - nearly £50,000 for a white dial Daytona a couple of months back, for example.

    I recall on Rolex forums someone buying the first Pepsi from DavidSW nearly double RRP back in 2018 and posting about it saying he didn’t care about the price, just wanted the watch. He’s about the only one I can recall paying those type of premiums. I’ve seen people on here say they’ve paid 20% or 30% over RRP but never any of the chrono prices. I’m sure there’s a few out there but it’s hard to tell if watch prices are rising and falling that much if people aren’t really paying those prices in the first place.

    I remember getting my Pepsi from the AD the day after a price rise , so I had to pay about £300 more and I wasn’t happy knowing what they’d done .

  33. #33
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by wileeeeeey View Post
    How's the reflection on it?
    Never found it any issue Willy
    A brilliant watch and one without any issues you here others talking about.
    MFB sold his and regrets it so we just transfer 3K to each other every now and again and get the watch for a bit.
    Not sure it would wear big enough for you though.

  34. #34
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    Rolex

    Quote Originally Posted by Hood View Post
    Never found it any issue Willy
    A brilliant watch and one without any issues you here others talking about.
    MFB sold his and regrets it so we just transfer 3K to each other every now and again and get the watch for a bit.
    Not sure it would wear big enough for you though.
    The one thing that puts me off it is that you love it. Means it must fit your wrist perfectly which is game over for me.
    Last edited by wileeeeeey; 2nd July 2022 at 13:16.

  35. #35
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by wileeeeeey View Post
    The one thing that puts me off it is that you love it. Means it must fit your wrist perfectly which is came over for me.
    Yeh it's not one of the big Seiko's for sure .Sits fairly high on wrist though.

  36. #36
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    Thankfully I bailed out of my modern Rolex earlier this year albeit the GMT Master Pepsi still seems to be holding up well. I have a couple of rarer Tudors in my collection that I’m happy with plus a couple of older discontinued Rolex sports models and these seem to be holding up well in the secondary market.

  37. #37
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    I had a call from my local Rolex AD (laings) to confirm the new rules in place, no more than 2 Rolexs per person per year and they HAVE to come into the store to collect. Does anyone think this will help the ridiculous grey market prices and give people a half decent chance of getting the watch they want RRP?

  38. #38
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hartyuk View Post
    I had a call from my local Rolex AD (laings) to confirm the new rules in place, no more than 2 Rolexs per person per year and they HAVE to come into the store to collect. Does anyone think this will help the ridiculous grey market prices and give people a half decent chance of getting the watch they want RRP?
    No and presumably largely academic. Who’s getting one never mind two? Anyway, whose rules? Laings or Rolex? I assume it’s a rule that the protective stickers are removed at the point of sale but you’d not know that looking at many of the brand new models listed on eBay.

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by David_D View Post
    No and presumably largely academic. Who’s getting one never mind two? Anyway, whose rules? Laings or Rolex? I assume it’s a rule that the protective stickers are removed at the point of sale but you’d not know that looking at many of the brand new models listed on eBay.
    Apparently this has come from Rolex. Paul Thorpe did mention it on a recent Youtube video. But I'm always sceptical about these changes! They certainly need (needed) to do something.

  40. #40
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hartyuk View Post
    Apparently this has come from Rolex. Paul Thorpe did mention it on a recent Youtube video. But I'm always sceptical about these changes! They certainly need (needed) to do something.
    It will achieve absolutely nothing. If you’re sufficiently well in with an AD who wants to sell you 3 Rolex watches, you’ll get them. One can go in the name of your other half and another in the cat’s name.

    If Rolex were bothered, they’d be looking at eBay and WF, etc., and working out which ADs are feeding the grey market.
    Last edited by David_D; 4th July 2022 at 15:09.

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