Reply With QuoteThat's a beauty dunk. Excellent pics and info too. I did a fair bit of reading up on American Railroad Watches several years ago, some of the examples have the most excellent movements. This thread may have re-ignited my desire to own one!
Following on from Rev-O ’s Coventry Watch Museum post, hereunder some pics of my
"Coventry Co-operative Watch Manufacturing Society" 18ct gold cased
pocket watch.
The watch was discovered in a damaged state in a Peterborough
pawnbroker’s window 13 years ago. Mark Wiles F.B.H.I. (Antique and Modern, East Barnet, N London)
restored the watch in 2009; Mark initially thought it was a Georgian timepiece.
In the early to mid 19th C., Coventry watchmaking / clock making was a thriving industry but gradually
went downhill following imports of cheaper Swiss and American clocks and watches. In an effort to compete with
cheaper imports and to maintain production of quality timepieces, the Coventry Co-operative Watch Manufacturing Society was formed
in 1876. This 1893/4 fusee pocket watch is a very fine example of a CCWMS timepiece … and one of the few to have been engraved on the
balance cock with CCWMS.
The Assay Office hall mark is indistinct but is likely Chester … the style / font of the K date mark
does match the1893/4 Chester date mark. I am planning to take an infra red photograph of the
Assay Office mark to see if IR will reveal some more distinct ’stamp’ detail.
In 2010 Paul Shufflebotham, Chairman, Coventry Watch Museum advised on another forum regarding CCWMS:
"Coventry Co-operative Watch Manufacturing Society
was set up in 1876 when they register their trade mark.
They were working at 35 Mount Street Chaplefield Coventry until 1900
Then at Stanley Terrace until 1918 when ceased trading.
The CCWMS was one of the founding members of the Co-operative Union which is still
going today.”
Cheaper late 19th C. American and Swiss imports coincided with the growth of the Coventry bicycle and motorcycle industry which evolved into the Coventry motor industry.
Watchmakers' and clock makers’ skills transferred easily to some of the requirements of the bicycle / motor engineering industry … e.g. fusee chains and bicycle chains are similar apart from ’scale’ .
BW
dunk
"Well they would say that ... wouldn't they!"
That's a beauty dunk. Excellent pics and info too. I did a fair bit of reading up on American Railroad Watches several years ago, some of the examples have the most excellent movements. This thread may have re-ignited my desire to own one!
F.T.F.A.
Thank you Bob ... I am not so happy with the pics and plan to photograph the watch again ... and since posting the foregoing have discovered more about CCWMS and the '19th C and prior' English watchmaking industries: https://www.vintagewatchstraps.com/e...atchmaking.php. ... all interesting reading ... especially regarding how e.g. Coventry watchmakers 'bought in' their 'frames' (ebauche 'rough' movements) from e.g., Prescot manufacturers. And the article documents the fact that Coventry watchmaker Rotherhams eventually imported American watchmaking 'machinery' to mass produce watch parts.Originally Posted by magirus
American railroad watches are very collectible ... as are English railway company watches.
BW
dunk
Last edited by sundial; 22nd October 2021 at 00:40.
"Well they would say that ... wouldn't they!"
Nice post, great pics. Thanks for sharing.👍
Lovely watch dunk.
Some great info here:
https://www.vintagewatchstraps.com/e...atchmaking.php
That's beautiful Dunk.
A nice piece of history.
Cheers,
Neil.
Super article & well worth a read if interested in history of English watchmaking ...
dunk
"Well they would say that ... wouldn't they!"
Following further research and additional advice received:
The basic ebauche frame for the movement was bought in by CCWMS Coventry from the John Wicherley Watch Co. in Prescot, Lancs. UK (who supplied hundreds of UK watchmakers with ebauche frames); CCWMS then finished / refinished the movement using either additional parts made themselves' or outsourced from other Coventry watchmaking specialists .... those parts including the escapement, enamel dial, hands and case ... in this example an 18ct gold case made by Edwin James Walker (E.J.W.) in Coventry. The case was sent to the London Assay office for hallmarking .. hence its K 1885 hallmark date. The whole watch was assembled / finished over a period of several weeks or months.
BW, dunk
"Well they would say that ... wouldn't they!"
That’s lovely, wonderfully clear uncluttered dial.
Now that is a beautiful thing. Mark Wiles deserves much credit for the restoration. Interesting history, too. Thanks for posting. Presumably an owner could very easily regulate the timekeeping. One thing that's always puzzled me is the reasoning behind the spacing for the weights on balance wheels (not just this watch), but I suspect it's not a simple answer!
Easier to poise if screw spacings are asymmetrical? Maybe a forum watchmaker can answer?
"Well they would say that ... wouldn't they!"
Lovely. But that date letter K is not London 1885, I think.
The shape of the outline is wrong
That K in a square stamp with chamfered corners is (for London, and that is surely London'd outline of a Leopard's head) is 1805. 1885 would be a shield-shaped stamp.
Maybe I am reading it wrong, but it certainly looks like that.
Something is 'not quite right' with the hallmarks. I'm planning to try and reveal more original detail by taking an infrared photo.
BW, dunk
"Well they would say that ... wouldn't they!"
Now that will be interesting Dunk, look forward to your results.
Hallmark anomaly now solved thanks to advice received from MWR members. Transpired that higher carat gold hallmarks have different shaped background to those stamped on silver and lower carat gold. So the CCWMS 18 carat gold case hallmark conforms to 1885.
https://www.vintagewatchstraps.com/c...s.php#cautions ... See 'Date Letters Cautions'
BW, dunk
"Well they would say that ... wouldn't they!"
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