Adult ASD Diagnosis

[markrlondon]

I wasn’t going to reply to this thread at all to be honest because the word “diagnosis” connotes something wrong with the person. For sure, many autistic people are disabled but so are many NT people. My autism isn’t a disability, nor is it an excuse for anything I haven’t achieved in life.

Well said.

[RustyBin5]

Can I ask - did any of you have late development of speech or speech disorder as children?

Yes that is very common as an early indicator- similarly a condition linked to this is verbal dyspraxia (the inability to come up with the word you need to say)

There are excellent ways to train around this including the game headbandz- For example instead of Apple if you can’t think of the word you are taught to explain in other words like green thing hangs on trees fruit keeps doctor away etc. not always associated with spectrum but often it’s an early indicator.

[draftsmann]

Can I ask - did any of you have late development of speech or speech disorder as children?

If anything I was precocious as regards speech as well as learning to read and write before starting school. I still remember the mutual frustration with primary school teachers because I wasn’t prepared to learn “their way” what I already knew.

[markrlondon]

similarly a condition linked to this is verbal dyspraxia (the inability to come up with the word you need to say)

That's interesting. I suffer from this from time to time.

[markrlondon]

If anything I was precocious as regards speech as well as learning to read and write before starting school.

I remember that I was taught to read by my mum who read the Narnia books to me as a young child. I vaguely recall now that she was worried that I couldn't read but in fact I had begun to silently read along with her. I didn't tell her that as it just didn't occur to me to say anything (and I enjoyed the being read to/reading along experience).

I guess that would have been around the time I started primary school.

I still remember the mutual frustration with primary school teachers because I wasn’t prepared to learn “their way” what I already knew.

Hehe. I had a teacher in the second year of primary school who annoyed me by insisting that H should be pronounced "haitch", i.e. with the leading "h" audible.

[GraniteQuarry]

Interesting, thanks for the feedback

[tixntox]

I spent some time teaching "special needs" children (including many ASD pupils) and the powers that be wanted to "integrate" them all the time. I fought long and hard against it as I knew that many ASD children could not cope with the noise and teaching methods in a "normal" classroom setting. Please do not attack me for the words in quotes as they are just that - quotes! By the way, integration is obviously a cheaper method!!!

[RustyBin5]

I spent some time teaching "special needs" children (including many ASD pupils) and the powers that be wanted to "integrate" them all the time. I fought long and hard against it as I knew that many ASD children could not cope with the noise and teaching methods in a "normal" classroom setting. Please do not attack me for the words in quotes as they are just that - quotes! By the way, integration is obviously a cheaper method!!!

Double sided coin this

Integration SHOULD be the desired option but only if the person can cope with it. Both routes should be available depending on severity.

[Kingstepper]

Remember when I was at school children with issues were dumped in a so-called remedial class and given up on really. Don’t think they were ever taught or learnt much but kept them out of the way.

[tixntox]

Double sided coin this

Integration SHOULD be the desired option but only if the person can cope with it. Both routes should be available depending on severity.

Absolutely. Many of the pupils who were "pushed" towards integration however even had specific notes on their statement of special needs to avoid large groups and noisy environments! One support assistant with several students in an "integrated" class, as opposed to several assistants and a special needs teacher in a small group! Funding mathematics seemed to take over rather than the pupils needs! I'm glad that I retired when I did!

[odyseus10]

100% this. Some people on the Autism Disorder Spectrum cannot speak, cannot walk because of severely undeveloped motor skills and will never be able to live independently. Comparing that with someone who has Aspergers and is a bit socially awkward as if they are both the same thing is astonishing.

That’s why there are three levels with 1 needing the least support if any.

To say someone with Aspergers is a bit socially awkward is not only very simplistic, but actually quite insulting!

[RustyBin5]

My son has Aspergers and is indeed a bit socially awkward. Not sure how it’s insulting. I don’t read it that way

[Saint-Just]

Awkward isn’t an insult. It’s a statement of fact. I am sure the fact that we came from a different culture mean people thought some of our reactions to situations were awkward, i.e. different to what would have been the norm in this country. I would never consider it insulting.

[markrlondon]

Awkward isn’t an insult. It’s a statement of fact. I am sure the fact that we came from a different culture mean people thought some of our reactions to situations were awkward, i.e. different to what would have been the norm in this country. I would never consider it insulting.

The word "awkward" can be used as an insult or belittlement (much like "cack-handed" for left handed people). That's why some people consider it to be or perceive it to be insulting or belittling.

Furthermore, "awkward" is not easily objectively measurable. It is largely a matter of subjectivity. One person's "awkward" or appearance or perception of awkwardness can be another person's "entirely comfortable". If someone who is on the spectrum feels fine in a certain situation but appears awkward to others and is described as such then this can undermine them, either in terms of their own self-image or in the minds of others.

In short, "awkward" can be not merely a supposed observation of fact but potentially (and too often) an insult, a weapon, or a divisive 'outsider-identifier'.

[hogthrob]

I spent some time teaching "special needs" children (including many ASD pupils) and the powers that be wanted to "integrate" them all the time. I fought long and hard against it as I knew that many ASD children could not cope with the noise and teaching methods in a "normal" classroom setting. Please do not attack me for the words in quotes as they are just that - quotes! By the way, integration is obviously a cheaper method!!!

Using "normal" can feel a bit like saying the other N word. "Neurotypical" seems to be an acceptable alternative.


I had to fight tooth and nail to get my son into a special school, and thankfully there has been no attempt to move him back to mainstream education.

[Saint-Just]

The word "awkward" can be used as an insult or belittlement (much like "cack-handed" for left handed people). That's why some people consider it to be or perceive it to be insulting or belittling.

Furthermore, "awakward" is not easily objectively measurable. It is largely a matter of subjectivity. One person's "awkward" or appearance or perception of awkwardness can be another person's "entirely comfortable". If someone who is on the spectrum feels fine in a certain situation but appears awkward to others and is described as such then this can undermine them, either in terms of their own self-image or in the minds of others.

In short, "awkward" can be not merely a supposed observation of fact but potentially (and too often) an insult, a weapon, or a divisive 'outsider-identifier'.

Everything can be an insult if you want it to be so.
So stop being so normal* and embrace the rich thesaurus the language allows you to use.

(* in this case, you can take "normal" as an insult if you choose to).

[markrlondon]

Everything can be an insult if you want it to be so.

This is true but it doesn't change the reality that some words can and do become more of an insult than others.

It is perhaps unfortunate when a word that is not intended by an individual to be an insult/attack/derogatory is perceived as such, but such is life. The perceptions of words change over time.

(* in this case, you can take "normal" as an insult if you choose to).

:-)

I do recognise that being too precise and mechanistic over the interpretation of words can result in the kind of asinine political correctness that we see too often nowadays. And yet I feel that words like "awkward" really can have negative real world connotations (even where not consciously intended) since the trait of awkwardness is very commonly perceived as negative or abnormal.

[markrlondon]

Using "normal" can feel a bit like saying the other N word. "Neurotypical" seems to be an acceptable alternative.

"Typical" is certainly a less potentially derogatory word.

I quite like "socially common". ;-)

[Saint-Just]

This is true but it doesn't change the reality that some words can and do become more of an insult than others.

It is perhaps unfortunate when a word that is not intended by an individual to be an insult/attack/derogatory is perceived as such, but such is life. The perceptions of words change over time.



:-)

I do recognise that being too precise and mechanistic over the interpretation of words can result in the kind of asinine political correctness that we see too often nowadays. And yet I feel that words like "awkward" really can have negative real world connotations (even where not consciously intended) since the trait of awkwardness is very commonly perceived as negative or abnormal.

I do not disagree. But even "abnormal" should not be tainted like it is. To differ, to be outside the norm, is something most people should be rather proud of. And amusingly, if they were they would also redefine what the norm is by expanding it to include them...

[odyseus10]

Everything can be an insult if you want it to be so.
So stop being so normal* and embrace the rich thesaurus the language allows you to use.

(* in this case, you can take "normal" as an insult if you choose to).

I think you missed the point as to say having Asperger’s is just being a bit socially awkward is insulting as that sounds like a minor inconvenience, when there is no mention of sensitivities eg pain, sight, smells, rigid routines, obsessive behaviour, problems finding friends and retaining them, seeing things in black and white terms, rigidly following rules and problems in the workplace

[markrlondon]

I think you missed the point as to say having Asperger’s is just being a bit socially awkward is insulting as that sounds like a minor inconvenience, when there is no mention of sensitivities eg pain, sight, smells, rigid routines, obsessive behaviour, problems finding friends and retaining them, seeing things in black and white terms, rigidly following rules and problems in the workplace

To be clear, this wasn't the point I was aiming to make but what you say here is certainly another aspect. I agree, living an untypical life can be way more than a minor inconvenience.

[odyseus10]

To be clear, this wasn't the point I was aiming to make but what you say here is certainly another aspect. I agree, living an untypical life can be way more than a minor inconvenience.

And to be clear :) is wasn’t you who latched onto “awkward” as being an insult - I am not sure why this got twisted this way??

[odyseus10]

Using "normal" can feel a bit like saying the other N word. "Neurotypical" seems to be an acceptable alternative.


I had to fight tooth and nail to get my son into a special school, and thankfully there has been no attempt to move him back to mainstream education.

In fact the term ASD is now obsolete because of the stigma assigned to the term “disorder”. This is now a termed a “condition” ie ASC - Autism Spectrum Condition