Panic buying

[number2]

my personal view id we are all going to have to go through a reset and a bout of inflation

for too long inflation has been kept artificially low by JIT and cheap labour from overseas

Low inflation leads to low interest rates which relaxes people (it also feed the house market but that's a different story)

Driving and HGV is not a nice social life job, the pay needs to reflect that so market forces attract people into it, not steal people from overseas who'll work for very little, this will make things cost more

Picking fruit is an unpleasant task and the solution is to pay enough to get people to do it, not import cheap labour, it makes fruit more expensive but it's the real price, no one is going to invest in inventing a machine which human labour is cheaper

Being a carerm being a nurse etc etc etc

all of this needs a reset, it will hurt but we'll end up with higher interest rates, higher but real wages and a higher cost of living, but it will be the real price and sustainable

But that isn't what the people were promised is it, no more foreigner's and lower prices is my recollection.

[Ruggertech]

They triggered the events that put her there in the first place. Well spotted.

Quite.

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[459GMB]

Thought this cartoon was superb !

[mart broad]

Well in my part of semi rural Essex there are no shortages just been out to get some provisions and the shelves in Asda are full, the freezer compartments are full and the booze is there in plenty oh and on driving out people are filling their vehicles without queuing.

[redmonaco]

Regarding Adrian’s post copied from Facebook:

It is incorrect.
Yes a tanker driver needs additional qualifications compared to HGV drivers.
Yes a significant number of EU drivers have stopped coming to the UK as of last January.

They created the critical deficit, the one that long hours cannot patch up (unlike the existing deficit that existed before).

We saw the effects very quickly, first in exports that dwindled and HGVs crossing to the continent empty (drivers are not happy), then imports that did not arrive within the expected JIT model. I believe a few people here have experienced delays in construction, in new cars deliveries, and then of course in supermarkets.
The same thing WAS HAPPENING with petrol deliveries. The number of stations that had supply issues rose from 10% to 16%, without any help from the Beeb.
No one mentioned it, therefore the problem did not exist.
Except it did.
The supermarkets hired drivers with more attractive wages. Excellent.
The fuel distributors did not react so some tanker drivers heeded the call.
Then we started to have a genuine problem, but we didn’t yet know it.
Many here can testify they knew of petrol stations with sometimes a full row of pumps out of order. It was all right of course, just the waiting time was a bit longer. And as long as no one mentioned it it remained a local issue, nothing systemic.
Then things take a turn for the worse, the press starts mentioning it and suddenly it becomes the Beeb’s fault.

Talk about shooting the messenger!

I hope that all those criticising the media coverage realise that they are advocating for a press that only tells you about things when there is nothing you can do to mitigate the effects. A press under government orders, so to speak. It would of course be all for our own good.

I find it hard to believe that any hgv drivers that obtained work here would have left the UK because of Brexit.

[redmonaco]

But that isn't what the people were promised is it, no more foreigner's and lower prices is my recollection.

I didn't here either of those points mentioned during Brexit?

[Saint-Just]

I find it hard to believe that any hgv drivers that obtained work here would have left the UK because of Brexit.

Interesting. First, where did I suggest that EU drivers had left the UK in the post you quoted? I only mentioned that some of those who were coming have stopped, and that is nothing but factual. Time wasted with red tape make it highly unprofitable coming over, and many will go back empty.
Second, those who came over are by definition mobile. Remember the Polish plumbers who came to the UK in the early 2000? They came because the rates were better. Many went back when they had enough savings, and as Polish rates increased. This was not started by Brexit, it is part of the deal when you're going abroad to work.
Brexit only added to the deal the hostile environment. So I don't find it hard to believe at all that some drivers have left, but I have no figures to document this. I know it happens all the time, from one country to another. The difference Brexit makes is that those who go are not replaced because those who would have come won't, or/and can't.

[guinea]

I find it hard to believe that any hgv drivers that obtained work here would have left the UK because of Brexit.

How many HGV driver changed career or retired last year? There is always churn. In recent years we'd recruit from the UK and the EU to fill the gap, now we only have one place to source new people. People don't have to leave to create a gap.

The same issue exists in IT, but there I can absolutely point to people I know leaving the UK because of Brexit.

My wife isn't from these shores. She moved to the UK as it was famous for being sensible, risk free and a country that follows the rule of law and does the right thing. Oh how she's changed her mind. She would love to leave, but the kids are settled in good schools and the places we'd go aren't much better right now.

[Peck]

I find it hard to believe that any hgv drivers that obtained work here would have left the UK because of Brexit.

I don’t know anything about HGV drivers, but I know for damn certain some excellent European scientists are leaving the U.K. (the place they’ve called home for many years) as they no longer feel welcome here.

Personally, I find that very distressing as they are good friends of mine who I will miss enormously. Our loss, 100%

[adrianw]

Well in my part of semi rural Essex there are no shortages just been out to get some provisions and the shelves in Asda are full, the freezer compartments are full and the booze is there in plenty oh and on driving out people are filling their vehicles without queuing.

which bit of Essex is that?

[robert75]

I used to be a window cleaner and if I was offered your rubbish coffee, I'd leave streaks all over your glass and you could kiss my arse

In France window cleaners have the highest wages, go to the front of the line in shops and are admired and respected by all…..apparently…..

[Saint-Just]

[Martylaa]

So after spending two weeks working away and seeing the news about petrol etc etc I arrived back home today thinking arghhh I didn’t too the car up before I went back to work and I’ll need the car to get the shops and have my daughter this weekend.

Absolutely dreaded going to the local petrol station expecting no fuel or huge que’s.

Well the station has 12 pumps and there was about three cars in there, a limit of £35 which is fair enough and that was it?
There were a few HGV’s there but then there generally always is.

Talk about a storm in a teacup, honestly the bloody media in this country have a lot to answer for.


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[mart broad]

which bit of Essex is that?

North had to drive into Clacton ( oh joy) but everything seemed back to normal certainly in respect of fuel.

[wileeeeeey]

So after spending two weeks working away and seeing the news about petrol etc etc I arrived back home today thinking arghhh I didn’t too the car up before I went back to work and I’ll need the car to get the shops and have my daughter this weekend.

Absolutely dreaded going to the local petrol station expecting no fuel or huge que’s.

Well the station has 12 pumps and there was about three cars in there, a limit of £35 which is fair enough and that was it?
There were a few HGV’s there but then there generally always is.

Talk about a storm in a teacup, honestly the bloody media in this country have a lot to answer for.


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If it's a storm in a teacup why has the army been deployed to drive tankers today?

[sevvy]

So after spending two weeks working away and seeing the news about petrol etc etc I arrived back home today thinking arghhh I didn’t too the car up before I went back to work and I’ll need the car to get the shops and have my daughter this weekend.

Absolutely dreaded going to the local petrol station expecting no fuel or huge que’s.

Well the station has 12 pumps and there was about three cars in there, a limit of £35 which is fair enough and that was it?
There were a few HGV’s there but then there generally always is.

Talk about a storm in a teacup, honestly the bloody media in this country have a lot to answer for.


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That may be where you live. I’m in Barnet and any road nearby that has a petrol station has been log jammed for the last couple of days. On some roads through traffic drivers are having to drive on the wrong side of the road with hazard lights on. I went out for petrol Monday night at midnight, got home 1.40am, thankfully with petrol.

[Martylaa]

That may be where you live. I’m in Barnet and any road nearby that has a petrol station has been log jammed for the last couple of days. On some roads through traffic drivers are having to drive on the wrong side of the road with hazard lights on. I went out for petrol Monday night at midnight, got home 1.40am, thankfully with petrol.

Three passed and no que’s and no signs saying no fuel.

Our local Sainsbury’s for example today, all fuel available.


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[wotsthecrack]

If it's a storm in a teacup why has the army been deployed to drive tankers today?

Relating to tanker driver numbers what is the difference today to 3 weeks ago. None. There would occasionally be empty pumps, the "Lemmings" reacted to media outlets saying there are fuel stations without fuel and the demand went up from an average spend of £25-30 to over £40 at the pumps. The selfish amongst us immediately went out and filled up. It is but a blip in demand. Storm in a teacup.

[guinea]

Post the picture from Sunday.

[Martylaa]

Post the picture from Sunday.

I was away on Sunday dreading arriving home seeing the world turning into a Mad Max type environment as I watched the sodding news.

The media should be ashamed of themselves for whipping the country into a frenzy.


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[snowman]

Passed my local petrol station on the way out and could see cars on the forecourt with no queues.

I figured sanity had resumed, so pulled in on the way home... Not a single pump was available, so, presumably, no fuel.

Not sure why they had their price still displayed on the digital sign if they have nothing to sell, but at least there was no queue!

M

[joe narvey]

Yes and not the cheapo 'ripen at home' ones so all is fine for now.

Phew, so not all bad.

[tmoris]

To change the subject completely..

hows that whole brexit thing working out in the UK. Any update?

[wileeeeeey]

Relating to tanker driver numbers what is the difference today to 3 weeks ago. None. There would occasionally be empty pumps, the "Lemmings" reacted to media outlets saying there are fuel stations without fuel and the demand went up from an average spend of £25-30 to over £40 at the pumps. The selfish amongst us immediately went out and filled up. It is but a blip in demand. Storm in a teacup.

Hope that's true. I did believe it originally but for the UK to get the Army out things must be worse than we think.

[adrianw]

North had to drive into Clacton ( oh joy) but everything seemed back to normal certainly in respect of fuel.

Too far the other way, oh well. I used to live in Great Bentley.

[mart broad]

Too far the other way, oh well. I used to live in Great Bentley.

Round the corner i am in Weeley Heath as i say seems to be back to normal but on Friday and Saturday last it was i believe like something out of Mad Max.
However it might be worth a power cut now just to shut those smug “ people” in their EV ‘s up

[adrianw]

So after spending two weeks working away and seeing the news about petrol etc etc I arrived back home today thinking arghhh I didn’t too the car up before I went back to work and I’ll need the car to get the shops and have my daughter this weekend.

Absolutely dreaded going to the local petrol station expecting no fuel or huge que’s.

Well the station has 12 pumps and there was about three cars in there, a limit of £35 which is fair enough and that was it?
There were a few HGV’s there but then there generally always is.

Talk about a storm in a teacup, honestly the bloody media in this country have a lot to answer for.


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Where in the country are you?

[adrianw]

Round the corner i am in Weeley Heath as i say seems to be back to normal but on Friday and Saturday last it was i believe like something out of Mad Max.
However it might be worth a power cut now just to shut those smug “ people” in their EV ‘s up

I've stolen the wife's electicery car today, If it is still chaos in Witham and on the A12 I have to go to Colchester tomorrow so might take a diversion

[docd]

No problem getting Diesel at Tescos in Glossop midday today, drove straight in and on to a vacant pump. Busy but no crazy queues. No idea what Sunday was like.

[Andyg]

I lot of people I know tend to fill up on Friday evening (for the weekend) or Saturday as part of the “big shop” therefore the MSM running the story Thursday night and all day Saturday was always going to create havoc.

As for the Army being called in. Why not? If it means that the great unwashed are placated and normal service is resumed faster, then happy days. Plus it demonstrates that the government reacted.

Plus I don’t remember anyone complaining when the army were bussed in to help during the pandemic, the fire fighter strike or the last petrol tankers strike (which was much worse that this shortage).

Not sure I totally buy the Brexit excuse myself, given that Brexit occurred 18 months ago, so I would have expected that all these EU lorry drivers might have departed quite some time ago.

[barneygumble]

Not sure I totally buy the Brexit excuse myself, given that Brexit occurred 18 months ago, so I would have expected that all these EU lorry drivers might have departed quite some time ago.

Brexit occurred 9 months ago, didn't it? As in, the transition period meant that it was still in the Single Market, EU laws applied etc. etc., and that ended only this year.

[blackal]

Brexit occurred 9 months ago, didn't it?

Yes it did - the end of the ‘transition year’

[Martylaa]

Where in the country are you?

North East.


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[oldoakknives]

To change the subject completely..

hows that whole brexit thing working out in the UK. Any update?

All good here, where in paradise are you?

[Kingstepper]

I lot of people I know tend to fill up on Friday evening (for the weekend) or Saturday as part of the “big shop” therefore the MSM running the story Thursday night and all day Saturday was always going to create havoc.

As for the Army being called in. Why not? If it means that the great unwashed are placated and normal service is resumed faster, then happy days. Plus it demonstrates that the government reacted.

Plus I don’t remember anyone complaining when the army were bussed in to help during the pandemic, the fire fighter strike or the last petrol tankers strike (which was much worse that this shortage).

Not sure I totally buy the Brexit excuse myself, given that Brexit occurred 18 months ago, so I would have expected that all these EU lorry drivers might have departed quite some time ago.

Why not bring the army in?

Well, we are being told daily by the Government that the crisis is easing so should be over before we see troops on the ground.

[learningtofly]

Anyone in the north Kent coast area, perchance? Reason I'm asking is that I'm meant to be taking a break over 8th-10th October, staying in a Whitstable Air BnB and riding round the coast on the new motorbike for a couple of days. If I'm going to cancel I have until the 3rd to do so, so I'm interested to know what the fuel situation has been like over the last week (on the basis that it will have been the worst case scenario).

TIA!

[tmoris]

All good here, where in paradise are you?

Prague, Cz. Wish Uk didnt leave, but hey, maybe your kids / grandkids will opt in in 20yrs or so. Or maybe Eu will fall apart. Who knows :)

[ryanb741]

Phew, so not all bad.

Hold your horses. Waitrose out of Brioche Buns. Having to serve burgers in a sesame seed bun like a filthy American

[IAmATeaf]

This made me laugh

https://youtu.be/hthhAvG6O1k

[IAmATeaf]

Went for an evening walk with my son and the queues are back, walked past a Tescos express and it was complete mayhem.

Also watched an argument between van drivers, one had parked his van at the pump but the store workers were refusing to enable the pump, no idea why but apparently he had been there for ages arguing with the staff. The guy behind got sick of waiting and asked him firmly to move his van as he wasn’t going to get any fuel but he refused. Much shouting later the guy behind grabbed him and marched him to his van to move it and eventually he moved it out of the way but then got out to continue arguing with the staff who flat refused to serve him.

[MattH]

Anyone in the north Kent coast area, perchance? Reason I'm asking is that I'm meant to be taking a break over 8th-10th October, staying in a Whitstable Air BnB and riding round the coast on the new motorbike for a couple of days. If I'm going to cancel I have until the 3rd to do so, so I'm interested to know what the fuel situation has been like over the last week (on the basis that it will have been the worst case scenario).

TIA!

Tony I am in Maidstone - my little local petrol station has had deliveries throughout - we had queuing but it was worse at the supermarkets… but nothing like was shown in London.

Whitstable is lovely - think you should be ok - i am doing a round trip to Bristol that weekend so I will also need to fill up.

Good place for food if you can get a booking !

https://jojosrestaurant.co.uk/booking/

[learningtofly]

Tony I am in Maidstone - my little local petrol station has had deliveries throughout - we had queuing but it was worse at the supermarkets… but nothing like was shown in London.

Whitstable is lovely - think you should be ok - i am doing a round trip to Bristol that weekend so I will also need to fill up.

Good place for food if you can get a booking !

https://jojosrestaurant.co.uk/booking/

Thanks Matt - that sounds hopeful (and good luck with your trip to Bristol).

i looked at Jo Jo’s but they only seemed to do sharing platters, and I’ll be on my own.

[tmoris]

Stolen from twitter. Guess this appeared somewhere here already

[thegoat]

We have a small EG station near me in an urban stretch that isn’t on any main routes. They sell fuel at roughly 3 or 4 pence per litre more than the BP garage which sits just off the motorway approx half a mile away . Probably about 8 or 9 p more than the Tescos which is less than a mile away. They were the first one in the area to put up the ‘No Fuel ‘ signs.
This morning , I filled up in Trafford Park ( No queue) and, on my travels drove past three Morrisons and an Asda petrol station in Eccles, Warrington, Trafford Centre and Cheadle which all had working pumps and no queues.
I came back past my local EG garage which had a tanker on the forecourt delivering fuel. Not an hour later I walked past the same garage and the road was gridlocked in all directions as it sits on a roundabout. It was obvious the local jungle drums had been beating and folk had come out to play .
It’s obvious that some folk can’t think for themselves and need to follow the masses. Baffling.

[Stanford]

Thanks Matt - that sounds hopeful (and good luck with your trip to Bristol).

i looked at Jo Jo’s but they only seemed to do sharing platters, and I’ll be on my own.

In case you didn't know, there is space for motorbike parking (free) at ///cattle.innovator.retail (using what3words) and also just a few yards away around ///neatly.drops.straw (this one may not be spot on as the what3words isn't as detailed as Google Maps).

[ralphy]

Interesting. First, where did I suggest that EU drivers had left the UK in the post you quoted? I only mentioned that some of those who were coming have stopped, and that is nothing but factual. Time wasted with red tape make it highly unprofitable coming over, and many will go back empty.
Second, those who came over are by definition mobile. Remember the Polish plumbers who came to the UK in the early 2000? They came because the rates were better. Many went back when they had enough savings, and as Polish rates increased. This was not started by Brexit, it is part of the deal when you're going abroad to work.
Brexit only added to the deal the hostile environment. So I don't find it hard to believe at all that some drivers have left, but I have no figures to document this. I know it happens all the time, from one country to another. The difference Brexit makes is that those who go are not replaced because those who would have come won't, or/and can't.

"Taking back control of our borders"?

R

[Onelasttime]

That may be where you live. I’m in Barnet and any road nearby that has a petrol station has been log jammed for the last couple of days. On some roads through traffic drivers are having to drive on the wrong side of the road with hazard lights on. I went out for petrol Monday night at midnight, got home 1.40am, thankfully with petrol.

Why did you need petrol so badly? Barnet’s pretty well connected with public transport.

[oldoakknives]

In France window cleaners have the highest wages, go to the front of the line in shops and are admired and respected by all…..apparently…..

Thought it was the hop farmers ........ (don't tell Saint-Just!)

[sevvy]

Why did you need petrol so badly? Barnet’s pretty well connected with public transport.

To get to my golf club. Hard to carry clubs, trolley and battery on the bus.

[learningtofly]

In case you didn't know, there is space for motorbike parking (free) at ///cattle.innovator.retail (using what3words) and also just a few yards away around ///neatly.drops.straw (this one may not be spot on as the what3words isn't as detailed as Google Maps).

Ah, good to know, thanks!