closing tag is in template navbar
Time Factors Watches



TZ-UK Fundraiser
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 50 of 127

Thread: Work - how old is 'too old'.

  1. #1
    Grand Master ryanb741's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    London
    Posts
    12,144

    Work - how old is 'too old'.

    With the UK working population more likely to work into their late 60s and even 70s, at what stage do we feel someone is too old and gets implicitly discriminated against. For example someone who gets a director level role in their 40s, it is fairly normal for that to continue until mid fifties but (and an example) you don't see so many HR or IT directors in their 60s.

    This will no doubt change as people having longer careers becomes the norm - issue is of course who makes room for the youngsters coming through.

    Would be interested to get some thoughts.

    Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

  2. #2
    Master
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    West Sussex, United Kingdom.
    Posts
    7,067
    Quote Originally Posted by ryanb741 View Post
    With the UK working population more likely to work into their late 60s and even 70s, at what stage do we feel someone is too old and gets implicitly discriminated against. For example someone who gets a director level role in their 40s, it is fairly normal for that to continue until mid fifties but (and an example) you don't see so many HR or IT directors in their 60s.

    This will no doubt change as people having longer careers becomes the norm - issue is of course who makes room for the youngsters coming through.

    Would be interested to get some thoughts.

    Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk
    Well, age discrimination is illegal so that shouldn't occur. Work as long as you are able and want to I guess. As to making room for youngsters, just make more businesses which is what has happened to date

  3. #3

    IMO

    Best to retire early, before it ever becomes a concern.

  4. #4
    What I've noticed in the HRD space is that they typically either move into a more consultative role, or a boutique consultancy, or diversify more towards L&D and the CLO roles. In this way they're either seen as new thinkers or oracles.

    So perhaps diversification is the answer.

  5. #5
    Grand Master
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Wakefield, West Yorkshire
    Posts
    20,042
    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Case View Post
    Best to retire early, before it ever becomes a concern.
    +1, one of the rare occasions when I agree with Ally, I started at 16 and finished at 52, who wants to work into their 60s even if they are a director?

    On a more serious note, ageism in the workplace is a concern despite legislation to prevent it, it happens implicitly and that's the aspect that causes most problems.
    Last edited by walkerwek1958; 10th June 2021 at 21:50.

  6. #6
    Master
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Location
    Isle of Ynys Mon, Wales
    Posts
    1,619
    Hi Ryan, in my opinion senior managers/directors are routinely culled by their mid 50s. Youngsters are champing at the bit with higher energy levels and fresh ideas - they are also more accepting/malleable and cost less generally. CEO level is probably different in that they oversee and direct others utilising their experience and contact network. I would say people are safer either on the middle levels operationally or at the very top (seems to me that the most vulnerable are managers at regional level who in effect act as CEOs for their region but forget that the are still higher middle management from a national perspective- the national hierarchy are more brutal to their 'own'' than they are with staff at the coal face.
    Last edited by Suds; 10th June 2021 at 21:57.

  7. #7
    Master Chewitt13's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Aberdeen
    Posts
    1,000
    I've been thinking about this lately, I've got a member of my team who is 72 and I'm worried about him, hes really good, really professional but at what age is the risk of him being in the office, working full time too great

    We cannot treat him unfairly but equally it can't go on forever.



    Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

  8. #8
    Master unclealec's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Manchester
    Posts
    5,039
    Quote Originally Posted by walkerwek1958 View Post
    who wants to work into their 60s

    I do.

    I lasted less than a year of retirement. A combination of requests from former customers and a love for my work had me building a small workshop and taking on work again at the age of 70.
    Having cultivated a frugal lifestyle I certainly don't need more money.

  9. #9
    Craftsman
    Join Date
    Oct 2020
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    307
    I am 58 this month so retirement is getting more and more appealing. I donít think I will be working much beyond 60. Although I work in a young personsí industry, programming, I think us oldsters can still give the young Ďuns a run for their money, and I still enjoy the actual coding side of it.

  10. #10
    Master sish101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Location
    County Durham
    Posts
    2,826
    Nobody wants to be rescued from a blazing building by a 60 year old fireman

    Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk

  11. #11
    Master unclealec's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Manchester
    Posts
    5,039
    Quote Originally Posted by sish101 View Post
    Nobody wants to be rescued from a blazing building by a 60 year old fireman

    Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk
    I can just hear that conversation.

    " Oi! You with the breathing apparatus; how old are you?"
    "60. Why?"
    "Because I don't want to be rescued by a 60-yr-old fireman. Leave me here"

  12. #12
    Master
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Location
    Isle of Ynys Mon, Wales
    Posts
    1,619
    Quote Originally Posted by Chewitt13 View Post
    I've been thinking about this lately, I've got a member of my team who is 72 and I'm worried about him, hes really good, really professional but at what age is the risk of him being in the office, working full time too great

    We cannot treat him unfairly but equally it can't go on forever.



    Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk
    Don't understand, he's really good and really professional - what risk are you worried about? (Serious question btw)

  13. #13
    Master sish101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Location
    County Durham
    Posts
    2,826
    Quote Originally Posted by unclealec View Post
    I can just hear that conversation.

    " Oi! You with the breathing apparatus; how old are you?"
    "60. Why?"
    "Because I don't want to be rescued by a 60-yr-old fireman. Leave me here"
    You'd be hard pushed at 60 to wear full BA and climb up the ladder, let alone sling anyone over your shoulder and carry them to safety.

    Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk

  14. #14
    Grand Master TheFlyingBanana's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Bedfordshire and your back garden
    Posts
    19,155
    There is a frightening (and apparently accurate) statistic for my profession - male headteachers who work until 65 have a life expectancy of 67.5 years.

    That is why most of us look to retire around 60 and either do something else, or some consultancy etc. Those who retire between 60 and 62 have an average life expectancy.

    I've just turned fifty, and do not intend to go beyond 60.
    So clever my foot fell off.

  15. #15
    Grand Master
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Wakefield, West Yorkshire
    Posts
    20,042
    Quote Originally Posted by unclealec View Post
    I do.

    I lasted less than a year of retirement. A combination of requests from former customers and a love for my work had me building a small workshop and taking on work again at the age of 70.
    Having cultivated a frugal lifestyle I certainly don't need more money.
    Alec, youíre an expert (allegedly) in your field and youíre doing something you enjoy, I fully understand your decision to carry on buddy.

  16. #16
    Master unclealec's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Manchester
    Posts
    5,039
    Quote Originally Posted by sish101 View Post
    You'd be hard pushed at 60 to wear full BA and climb up the ladder, let alone sling anyone over your shoulder and carry them to safety.

    Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk
    I can't argue with that, but firefighters are not the definintive job to determine age-related retirement. There are many trades that require a degree of fitness; fitness tends (as I know to my cost) to lessen with age. However, many occupations are more amenable to the older person.
    If only I were in one. After a hard day at the workshop, I am having to dose myself with Hecks Anti-Ache medicine. But some days I come home as fresh as when I went.
    I try when possible to sit or lie when working. It makes the day more enjoyable.

  17. #17
    Undertakers. A job for life.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by sish101 View Post
    You'd be hard pushed at 60 to wear full BA and climb up the ladder, let alone sling anyone over your shoulder and carry them to safety.

    Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk
    This is a good point because it illustrates the futility of the question. There is no one-size-fits-all answer. I know many 60 year olds who would be capable of this...and of course, many more who wouldn't. I'd imagine it's the same across all professions. An inability to do the job at the right level will come at different times for different people.

  19. #19
    Grand Master GraniteQuarry's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Aberdeen, UK
    Posts
    27,372
    Iím 50 and currently dealing with two very wealthy business associates who are hands-on fully in charge of their respective companies... ages 73 and 77.

  20. #20
    Master Chewitt13's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Aberdeen
    Posts
    1,000
    Quote Originally Posted by Suds View Post
    Don't understand, he's really good and really professional - what risk are you worried about? (Serious question btw)
    Because the stark reality is that a 72 year old is more of a health risk than a 40 year old.

    He is energised and can teach the younger lot a few things.

    But having a friend found dead at his desk a few weeks ago aged 53, unfortunately we are all time constrained

    Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Suds View Post
    Hi Ryan, in my opinion senior managers/directors are routinely culled by their mid 50s. Youngsters are champing at the bit with higher energy levels and fresh ideas - they are also more accepting/malleable and cost less generally. CEO level is probably different in that they oversee and direct others utilising their experience and contact network. I would say people are safer either on the middle levels operationally or at the very top (seems to me that the most vulnerable are managers at regional level who in effect act as CEOs for their region but forget that the are still higher middle management from a national perspective- the national hierarchy are more brutal to their 'own'' than they are with staff at the coal face.
    I agree, I saw blokes in their 50s lose their energy and desire and chomped at the bit to get their jobs and swore it wouldn't happen to me, but it . Its job specific , high pressure not particularly enjoyable far easier to have enough than if you are an artist in your own studio at home .



    Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

  22. #22
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    N/A
    Posts
    11,076
    Quote Originally Posted by Chewitt13 View Post
    Because the stark reality is that a 72 year old is more of a health risk than a 40 year old.

    He is energised and can teach the younger lot a few things.

    But having a friend found dead at his desk a few weeks ago aged 53, unfortunately we are all time constrained

    Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk
    Sorry to hear that. Must have been terrible.

  23. #23
    I think that they should reconsider the retirement age, this would increase the opportunities for the young.

    Iím 63 there is no way Iím doing this for another four years, this is becoming a regular conversation at home,

  24. #24
    Grand Master AlphaOmega's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Trinovantum
    Posts
    10,892
    Quote Originally Posted by TheFlyingBanana View Post
    There is a frightening (and apparently accurate) statistic for my profession - male headteachers who work until 65 have a life expectancy of 67.5 years.
    Have you considered that it's the two and half years of retirement that is the problem?

    I'm only half joking.

    I have a theory that some people give up on life when they retire - it's as if they've finished with it.

    I can see the attraction though.

  25. #25
    Grand Master Chris_in_the_UK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Norf Yorks
    Posts
    38,917
    In no particular order:-

    1. Job/role dependant.

    2. Lifestyle and expected lifestyle beyond.

    3. Pension arrangements.

    4. Attention span/hobbies/boredom threshold.

    5. 'Old bloke syndrome' plays its part (like it or not).

    6. Retirement form one thing can lead to another and ongoing fulfilment.

    7. How conscious you are about getting older and the closing window/bucket list equation.
    When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........

  26. #26
    Craftsman
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Plymouth Devon
    Posts
    516

    Work - how old is 'too old'.

    I finally retired at 67 as a senior manager in the engineering sector.
    I would have left a couple of years earlier but the business was going through a major change process and I was persuaded (mostly by increasing financial inducements) to stay on and guide the company through that.

    To be perfectly honest , for the last year or so I was aware that I was not fully enthused and was to some extent just going through the motions.

  27. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by TheFlyingBanana View Post
    There is a frightening (and apparently accurate) statistic for my profession - male headteachers who work until 65 have a life expectancy of 67.5 years.

    That is why most of us look to retire around 60 and either do something else, or some consultancy etc. Those who retire between 60 and 62 have an average life expectancy.

    I've just turned fifty, and do not intend to go beyond 60.

    The implication of this would be that working between the ages of 60 and 65 reduces life expectancy by about 15 years. Do you have the source for this? If true, it's incredibly frightening? I suspect it might be one of those tales based on a sample of two though!

  28. #28
    Master sish101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Location
    County Durham
    Posts
    2,826
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/pensions...rement-crisis/

    Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk

  29. #29
    I am 52. Up until the age of 50 I was keen and still chomping at the bit to excel in my field.

    How things change. I am now 52 and with a big company reorganisation I have lost the energy to perform.

    I donít think it is about the reorganisation either. Just the evolution of time and my outlook is now more around how I enjoy my hopefully 20+ years of good health I may have, where I can travel the world and be free to do what I want without being chained to the company laptop.

    I have to admire those in their 50s who still have the drive and desire at work. But, there is more to life than squirrelling away more money than you can ever spend, and at the next round of redundancy, which seem to come thick and fast these days, both my hands are going up.

  30. #30
    Master
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Location
    Isle of Ynys Mon, Wales
    Posts
    1,619
    Sorry to digress, but is unclealec a farmer?

  31. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by ryanb741 View Post
    With the UK working population more likely to work into their late 60s and even 70s, at what stage do we feel someone is too old and gets implicitly discriminated against. For example someone who gets a director level role in their 40s, it is fairly normal for that to continue until mid fifties but (and an example) you don't see so many HR or IT directors in their 60s.

    This will no doubt change as people having longer careers becomes the norm - issue is of course who makes room for the youngsters coming through.

    Would be interested to get some thoughts.

    Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk
    I suppose work as long as you are happy enough to work and retire when you have the pension to enjoy it. I have seen far too many people retire early in their 50s and even 60s only to return to work a year or two later because they are either bored out of their minds or need something to focus on in life. Also plenty of people pass away not long after they retire be it in their 50s or 60s Its frightening to see people who have retired and a few years later have turned to drink or feel themselves isolated because presumably what drove them in life is no longer there and I am not just talking about older people but people who retire in their 50s too.

    As a side issue what do all these directors that you speak of do post retirement in their 50s?

  32. #32
    Grand Master magirus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Up North hinny
    Posts
    36,772
    Quote Originally Posted by sish101 View Post
    Nobody wants to be rescued from a blazing building by a 60 year old fireman
    There was talk of extending our retirement age to 60. I was a lot fitter than most, club runner 53/54 min 10 miler, mountain biking, knock about on a road bike at 20+mph blah blah... Left at 50 after 32yrs, I was starting to feel the strain, as fit as you are for your age it's a heavy physical job at the pointy end. However I'm sure there are many occupations that can be done well into the 60s, 70s and even beyond. Much better being retired though! Magirus, aged 63 & 25/26ths yrs.

  33. #33
    Master
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Location
    Deepest darkest South Wales.
    Posts
    2,867
    Quote Originally Posted by Jdh1 View Post
    The implication of this would be that working between the ages of 60 and 65 reduces life expectancy by about 15 years. Do you have the source for this? If true, it's incredibly frightening? I suspect it might be one of those tales based on a sample of two though!
    I dont know about just the five years, but back in about 1990 I was told by a pension expert that the average life expectancy for a male retiring at 65 was 67, and for a male retiring at 50 it was 80. He said that for many occupations after 50 you were in a downward health cycle due to either stress, physical exertion, or shift patterns (or any combination of these) depending on the job you did. So yes, TFB's figures sound very plausible.

  34. #34
    Craftsman
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Yorkshire
    Posts
    657
    Iím 60 next month and work harder than most in my job half my age, Iím far from retirement. My partners step father is 76 and he bikes 40 mins to and from work every day. Age is just a number and retirement isnít an option for a lot of people. Personally I donít want to give up, I run about like a 40 year old and if I retire Iíd become lazy and die through boredom.


    Sent from my iPhone using TZ-UK mobile app

  35. #35
    Journeyman
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Location
    midlands uk
    Posts
    182
    As others have mentioned (I've been thinking long and hard about my own retirements plans lately) there are too many variables. Mainly he individual person, type of work and that particular persons interest in still going it. Sorry that is probably not very helpful. I'm also unable to decide when I want to retire or how much I want as a retirement pot and/or income.

  36. #36
    Master murkeywaters's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Near the sea
    Posts
    5,493
    I kind of retired at 36, sounds strange but thats how its feels.

    I left full time employment to work for myself, since stepping away from being employed and all the things that come with it like having a boss, being told how much holiday a year you can take, when to start and finish etc, they were the parts that made it feel like work, the earning money bit is fine, you can take that into any age you wish as long as you enjoy how you make that money.

    With that, I have learnt and done quite well in completely different fields of business, some have been successful but started to drag like a job after a while, once that feeling starts I know its not long before I'm moving onto something else that peaks my interest.

    It all comes down to freedom for me, If I popped off this planet at 76 I hope to say I enjoyed those 40 years rather than the 6 years I probably would have had if I stayed employed to 70.

    Remember, you can always earn a few quid but you can never get time back.
    Last edited by murkeywaters; 11th June 2021 at 00:30.

  37. #37
    Grand Master hogthrob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Essex, UK
    Posts
    13,920
    Is a fit and healthy 70yo at much greater health risk than an overweight, inactive 50yo smoker or drinker? It depends a lot on the individual. Not everyone stays fit, active, healthy and mentally alert into their 70s, but many do.

  38. #38
    Master vRSG60's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Barrowford - Lancashire
    Posts
    2,960
    We should be retiring at 60.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  39. #39
    Master
    Join Date
    Aug 2017
    Location
    London
    Posts
    1,206
    Age discrimination does occur and Iím guilty of it in the past when I thought I had a good handle on my role. Deep down I guess I didnít want somebody with more experience to manage and now Iíve become the person Iíd discriminate against.

    So, 60 it is. Out, done and picking g up the hobbies I planned for but never had time.

  40. #40
    Master pacifichrono's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    San Diego
    Posts
    6,490
    Age takes its toll very differently from person to person. My CEO boss from 42 years ago is still working effectively as a C-suite consultant at 96! I retired at 62 with still a lot left in the tank. Conversely, I've worked with colleagues who were obviously "finished" in their 50s.

    Age discrimination is completely different: it really depends on the company culture, the industry, the profession and its dependence on technological change, and the particular people and situation within your 'department.'

  41. #41
    Master
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    south of the river..
    Posts
    1,538
    Quote Originally Posted by AlphaOmega View Post
    Have you considered that it's the two and half years of retirement that is the problem?

    I'm only half joking.

    I have a theory that some people give up on life when they retire - it's as if they've finished with it.

    I can see the attraction though.

    I have seen stats (in a Wealth at Work seminar), that showed the earlier you retired, the earlier you passed away..

    sorry no link or source for these 'stats'..

  42. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by hogthrob View Post
    Is a fit and healthy 70yo at much greater health risk than an overweight, inactive 50yo smoker or drinker? It depends a lot on the individual. Not everyone stays fit, active, healthy and mentally alert into their 70s, but many do.
    That's not in question, but what is up for debate is employers think differently, and it's not just about health. They don't want someone who 'has seen it all before ' and questions things, they just want youthful energy

    Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

  43. #43
    Final salary scheme, George Osborne changing the rules , companies literally doubling your pension so you remove it

    That's golden ticket land, and I benefitted from it, able to retire at 55. Very very lucky, now kids will work until 70 to get a state pension and be lucky I'd they have 100 a month top up from private pension. We've been very very fortunate to benefit form final salary schemes

    Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

  44. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by TheFlyingBanana View Post
    There is a frightening (and apparently accurate) statistic for my profession - male headteachers who work until 65 have a life expectancy of 67.5 years.

    That is why most of us look to retire around 60 and either do something else, or some consultancy etc. Those who retire between 60 and 62 have an average life expectancy.

    I've just turned fifty, and do not intend to go beyond 60.
    Think that's an urban myth.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-18952037

  45. #45
    Grand Master TheFlyingBanana's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Bedfordshire and your back garden
    Posts
    19,155
    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    Thanks for that, really quite reassuring. Itís interesting how these myths take hold. I was first told about it years ago by a friend who is an experienced Headteacher- and I do recall he showed me some supporting data that certainly appeared credible.

    That said, I still donít plan to do my role much beyond 60 at the max - teaching and education is increasingly a young persons game, and I canít think of many, or barely any heads who are still doing the job at 65.
    So clever my foot fell off.

  46. #46
    Master Lampoc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Lincs. The bit with hills.
    Posts
    5,841
    I'm looking forward to the day when we base our society on "Logan's Run".

  47. #47
    Journeyman Hattori Hanzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Location
    Leeds, UK
    Posts
    172
    As has been mentioned I think a lot depends on the job and the person.

    I work front line for the Ambulance service with all that that entails. My state pension age is I believe 68, since 2015 NHS pensions are now linked to state pension so i can take neither before 68 without penalty. If state pension goes up so does my work pension. By the time I reach state pension age I'll have nearly 50 years service on the Ambulances. I'm mid 30s now and can feel the toll years of long shifts, nights, shift turn arounds and physically demanding work have taken on my body. Do I think I'll make it to 68 in this job? Nope. Do I have the option to retire earlier? Yes at huge financial penalty.

    Some jobs you can do well into your 60s, some you can't. Not sure retirement age should be a blanket age for everyone.

  48. #48
    Master Lammylee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Manchester
    Posts
    2,493

    Work - how old is 'too old'.

    My job is physically demanding (commercial gardening for 31 years) I have made plans to be part time at 60 and finish completely at 65. I am currently 48 and wonít be as strong as now forever!

  49. #49
    If our governments were a private company, I'm sure they would end up in court, we put money in on the basis that we will be able to start taking it out at a certain age, then they change it. I read somewhere that for every year they raise the State pension age they save billions, as so many don't live to claim it or just die. I think we should be able to opt out, but have to show that we have made other arrangements, but I have ssas so would say that.

  50. #50
    Grand Master JasonM's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Cambridgeshire
    Posts
    14,838
    i think the biggest decision affecting retirement age is financial circumstances , not necessarily age related. The vast majority of people have to keep working as long as they can.
    Cheers..
    Jase

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Do Not Sell My Personal Information