Reply With QuoteFrom Damasko's social media feed:
DC70:
DC72:
DC76:
The world's most minimalist mechanical chronographs just got even more minimalist!
I was hoping (not £hoping£) they might do this, and lo-and-behold, the DC70 (nd - € 2,580), DC72 (date - € 2,680) and DC76 (24hr ind - € 3,380) have arrived with next-to-no fanfare, all in the smaller 41mm case of the DC56 & seq. as opposed to 43mm for the DC80 / 86 range. Same significantly modified-7750 based movement SFAICS.
Only other change I can spot is a new crown, which looks a little bigger and a little more coarsely-fluted.
From Damasko's social media feed:
DC70:
DC72:
DC76:
I like simple watches. I'm not big on chronographs with loads of subdials, they're just too busy for my tastes. I've recently discovered a softening in my love of divers and while I maintain a few Seiko divers, everything else has gone in favour of more traditional watches with simple bezels.
Why, then, does Damasko leave me so cold? Their design language is just so stark, everything looks the same. Yeah, there's the odd little flourish, an aeroplane on the end of a hand here, and the odd little spot of red there, but by and large there's little nuance to their watches.
Am I wrong? I'm more than willing to be proven wrong, tell me what I'm missing with this brand!
I don't think it's possible to be proven wrong in a matter of taste (though most forums seem to be populated by people determined to prove otherwise!).Originally Posted by Papa Hotel
I'd even agree with you - their design language is both starkly functional, and pretty consistent - for me that is exactly what I like about it, that and the robustness of the watches themselves. But it's no reason you should strive to like it - plenty of more-nuanced fish in the sea and all that
I don't think it's possible to be proven wrong in a matter of taste (though most forums seem to be populated by people determined to prove otherwise!).
I'd even agree with you - their design language is both starkly functional, and pretty consistent - for me that is exactly what I like about it, that and the robustness of the watches themselves. But it's no reason you should strive to like it - plenty of more-nuanced fish in the sea and all that
Hear hear. They are made to measure time, not to be waved about in the air and photographed with expensive props to cries of "wowzer" and "cor blimey". ;-) The DC76 could be on my list if they were to make the 24hr subdial into something more useful than an am/pm indicator, as they have suggested they might with the DC86.
F.T.F.A.
I think Damasko should be applauded for reworking the 7750 to create a modern centre minute design.
As a recent convert to the brand with a DC56 that I regard as absolutely perfect in all regards, I do find their current design language a bit overdone. This started with the DS30 and it’s very heavy indexes and it’s runs through most of the models except the DC 86/76
I think if I wanted a centre minute chrono, I would most likely go hunting for an original 5100 engined watch from Sinn, PD, or B&R, and keep my DC56.
Damasko are doing good work
Dave
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Starting at £2260 according to CW Sellors so maybe about £2000 from Chronomaster.
I really like it.
1) I'm a fan of Damasko designs for their starkness / boldness.
2) the size of these new centre minute chronos works better for me than the older models - so does the price :-)
I notice the treatment of the case is a bit different from the other models: looks brighter / less matte. need some pics in the wild to assess how far the difference goes.
I believe this may be a slight red-herring, as Damasko has left the web pages for some of its older models unchanged for years, so those still assert the cases are "ice-hardened", which is a technique they discontinued a few years ago when the grade of steel used proved to be slightly rust-prone.
I believe all of the cases are now case-hardened throughout their range. It would be odd if it were otherwise really, especially as the cases for the DC70 series can be identical to those used for the 50 series.
Ah thanks for that - wasn't aware the ice-hardened process was abandoned. Agree it could be nothing; a real life comparison with current DC5X / DC8X models will settle it. Keeping an eye out for YT comparison videos, hope someone does one soon.
I've not heard of the ice-hardening technique being discontinued. Their website still describes the bracelet as" 100% Made in Germany – 100% Made in House" . Like the case made of ice-hardened stainless steel". , although this could be old information not updated of course. Whilst rust seems to have been a real issue I've never had a problem with my DA37 (2006) or DC56 (2009) or the DC67 I owned for a while, and they've all had their share of sweat and water.
Is the ice hardening a Damasko term for the cryo treatment seen elsewhere?
https://www.damasko-watches.com/en/t...in-the-detail/
It looks like instrument steel is new, but it is for the DC7x
D
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Last edited by helidoc; 1st May 2021 at 22:40.
The DC70 looks great - really like that. Does anyone have any experience with their “modified 7750” does it still “wobble” like a 7750 as that really annoys me and I don’t think I could have another 7750 like that.
5 years of wearing a Valjoux 7750 powered watch, and I still don't even know what this wobble is? Please let on as I too would like to be annoyed.
It’s just feeling the weight of the rotor as it winds the movement. The 7750 is unusually noticeable in this respect.
I’m actually disappointed in the lack of wobble from my DC56, I was quite looking forward to it
D
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They've made the same mistake with the 72 that Sinn made with the EZM1 - an illegible date between 3 and 4. Completely useless and superfluous. The 70 is absolutely perfect, great size, functional, minimalist. Want.
The 7750 rotor actually free spins in one direction, so no movement winding. This results in the rotor wobble. The rotor winds in the other direction so no wobble.
I do like a 7750.
I like the new Damasko chronograph but sadly not the retail.
Last edited by j111dja; 1st May 2021 at 22:23.
Each to their own. I would probably go for the 72 because it has the date. I like that the background matches the dial so it is discreet, and only a small angle so easily readable
It also seems like the DC7x no longer have the soft iron core and the antimagnetic rating of the earlier watches. Of course ice-hardened steel could potentially be magnetised.
D
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Probably. Most stainless heat treatment involving low temperatures requires 'dry ice' kind of temperatures.
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
My DC56 wobbles like a drunk and I love it :)
Been trying to get my head around the various properties that Damasko do - and don't - claim for their watches:
- Currently none of the individual model descriptions mention antimagnetic properties, however Damasko's technologies page claims "effective protection against magnetic fields with a clever design: the shielding cage, which all DAMASKO models without a glass bottom have".
- None of the current models mention Damasko's much-vaunted silicon balance spring. Not sure if oversight, cost, or the unreliability some early-adopters claimed. Interestingly (!) the blurb that Damasko sent out to journalists mentions the use of "silicium" components in their new in-house movements, so presumably those include hairsprings and other magnetism-critical parts.
- The DC7n series mentions "tool steel" and "surface hardening". Tool steel is a slight red herring - it's a catch-all term for a LOT of stainless steel alloys, and also because you would typically start with a blank machined from it to produce a surface-hardened final product. And of course all their "tool steel" watches are indeed also surface-hardened.
- All the other chronos mention "ice hardened" steel. No ice was harmed in the making of this, liquid nitrogen at ~-200C is used. The ice hardened stuff also appears under the banner of "Mertensitic steel", presumably what anglophones call Martensite - a bit circular, since ice-hardening aims to transform the Austenitic component of steel into the harder Martensitic allotrope.
- The 3-handers mention surface-hardened submarine steel. Sub steel's main distinguishing feature is its ductility - great for a submarine that must flex and deform in critical situations, but a bit irrelevant in watches! Why they used this I don't know, probably because Sinn do, and it's a good marketing tool. This steel is also vaunted in Damasko's blurb for its Austenitic properties! Of course some of that (and attendant ductility) will be lost when the surface hardening treatment is undertaken!
- All of the implied or claimed surface-hardening technologies will achieve much the same end result, and FWIW, there are LOTS of different ways to achieve a hardened surface on steel - shot-peening (needs over-dimensioned blank), gas carburising/nitro-carburising*/cyaniding (*prob. 6Steel, Dekla, Dievas, Askania & most others), liquid carburizing/nitriding/cyaniding, boriding (needs an under-dimensioned blank), flame/laser/induction heating, and cryogenic hardening. All of those processes have slightly different costs, benefits, and potential problems, and those factors can all vary with the specific steel alloy you start with. It's quite a rabbit hole when you start googling
Whereas Sinn watches are tegimented ie. surface hardened, the so called "egg shell" effect, I've always understood that Damasko cases are hardened all the way through, hence their durability. Damasko and Sinn did work together quite a while ago and the first 756 models had the Damasko ice hardened cases, about 1,000 were produced. I almost got a 756 back in the day, but went for Damasko instead.
Been trying to get my head around the various properties that Damasko do - and don't - claim for their watches:
......It's quite a rabbit hole when you start googling
As I fell down the rabbit hole, I think....
Ice Hardened. All DC except 7x, old DA. Hard all the way through but potentially magnetisable, so needs a movement shield. Proper antimagnetic rating. Not that corrosion resistant, so not for a dive watch, and I’d caution a bracelet judging by some rare corrosion examples
Submarine Steel with surface hardening. Like Tegimented Sinn. Divers and DS/DK. Hard and corrosion resistant. Might egg-shell if you really smash it. Basic level of antimagnetic protection
Instrument Steel
Surface hardened. Maybe like Sinn 856, and Bremont cases. DC 7x only. Doesn’t need a magnetic shield, but basic magnetic protection only. Probably not as hard as Sub steel beneath the surface.
Dave
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Damasko probably harden their submarine steel in the same way as Sinn, likely gas-nitriding, since it's one of few processes that work with Austenitic stainless steels, a process notable in this context for sometimes reducing corrosion-resistance...
As for the rest, most of the "hot" hardening techniques just harden the outer layers, so only the cryogenically-treated cases will be hardened all through the entire thickness of the case. From a consumer's POV it's not important which hardening technique is used, really, as only the outside needs to be scratch-resistant.
Anecdotally, I own watches from both brands which cover the spectrum of techniques used - and all of them have withstood years of hard use and abuse by myself and others (I garden, do building work, fell trees, DIY, etc. in mine) with no trace of damage of any kind.
Yep, I think that's the gist of it. Issues like corrosion and eggshelling never seem to have been common - only seen one instance of the former and none of the latter. Not heard of a new problem in a while - there are processes and treatments available to prevent them, and I'd guess Sinn and Damasko have learned their lessons.
It is quite hard to pick the bones out of this topic, I guess Damasko don't want to give too much of their own research away to potential competitors. I do find it a tiny bit baffling that they are using 3 main base materials and 3 different hardening processes, when picking the right one and sticking with it could improve the economy of scale equation, but no doubt they have their reasons!
I was just browsing their website last night and these really stood out.
I’d have been straight in, other than I don’t like a watch without a date, and I can’t stand the date at 4 o’clock.
I’m wrestling with trying the date version, but I know others have not lasted due to the same thing.
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UK prices - at least according to Sellors - are DC70 - £2,260, DC72 - £2,348, and DC76 - £2,961.
No sign of an update to Chronomaster's website yet, but his prices are usually a mite keener.
^^^^^^^^^^yes, as i posted a few days ago :-)
You've been here 13 years and you still expect us to actually read threads as well as bang-on in them!
That made me nearly drench my laptop with tea :-)
Seem to be on there now - £2,175 for the DC70 for example. Quite thick though - 14.6mm which I think is too much for me, but will measure some of my existing watches for comparison.
Yeah, the thickness is the price you pay for using a 7750 movement plus additional complications for the centre-minutes. That said, I have a DC80 which - counterintuitively - is less obviously "tall" than the smaller-diameter DC57 I have. Neither is any sort of an issue in daily wear.
The DC70 is the only one of the three without a date so would be the only one I would have any interest in. I find the DC70 a starkly handsome watch but I don't think I could get along with it - without a rotating bezel it can only track up to 60 minutes. Even more a problem (perhaps only for me) is that there is no running seconds unless the chrono is actually running. Not seeing any perceptible movement at a glance would bother me.
I thought there is a running seconds hand. You can see it in the pics at the start of the thread.
DC80 is also without date.
Of the centre-minutes chronos, only DC76 and DC86 have a running-seconds hand.
My mistake then! I assumed the straight white hand (at 21 in the image below) was a running-seconds and the one with the aircraft/arrowhead was for the chrono seconds. Have you got an easy source for me to read up on what's what with these as my assumption appears to be completely wrong!
That's a cumulative minutes hand for the chrono whereas the other hand is the chrono second handMy mistake then! I assumed the straight white hand (at 21 in the image below) was a running-seconds and the one with the aircraft/arrowhead was for the chrono seconds. Have you got an easy source for me to read up on what's what with these as my assumption appears to be completely wrong!
Ahhhhhh ok! Makes much more sense now then :)
Think of it as the most minimalist possible chronograph, just chrono seconds and minutes; if you want to track hours get the DC80 and use the bezel, or DC86 which has an elapsed hours subdial.
I'm ashamed to think of how long it took me to get my head around Damasko's range - chiefly because they do a lousy job of explaining it!
They really do, mind you they don't make it easy on themselves with the different steels used!
Now I understand why, apart from the simple & plain aesthetic, people like this type of chrono!
Anyone know of a discount code for Chronomaster?
I’ve really enjoyed this thread, and the rabbit-hole of hardened steel etc., and I have been looking for a simple chrono for a while - so I am having a punt on one (which one exactly, is the next question!)
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Chronomaster's a bit too old-school for that. Just get in touch with Neil (he even answers emails - call yourself a dealer!) and see if you can work something out - I'm part-ex'ing a watch that would have sold for a chunk less on here (or more ballache on thiefbay/C24...) + small discount + free P&P. Never hurts to just politely ask...
Free P&P is achievable but his prices are pretty keen anyway (imo).
Neil is certainly a gent to deal with and is normally at least as reasonably priced as anyone. However, he doesn't always offer the most for p/ex or straight purchase so shop around if you're doing that. I offered him my recently serviced one-owner Planet Ocean 8500 46mm and he came back with £1,700 - Watchfinder paid me £2,800 with a free courier and insurance.
Thanks. As it happens I anticipated a low offer (he's a dealer and needs some meat-on-the-bone to make a profit), and so was surprised when he offered more than I would have got selling here (preferred option usually). Given it was an Oris which seem to be more in supply than demand, I was happy to move it on for the same as it cost me two years ago.
As for your Omega - if I could find a PO for £1700 I'd be all over it! British people will do anything to avoid saying "no", I guess insulting offers are just one more way....!
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