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Thread: Bricks and Mortar house v Holiday Lodge.

  1. #1
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    Bricks and Mortar house v Holiday Lodge.

    What with the wife recovering from a stroke and old age relentlessly creeping up, we have decided to look for a holiday property in the UK as a bit of a get away, somewhere on the coast or a penthouse type thing in a picturesque city.

    The Sunday papers seem to be bombarded with adverts for timber lodges that look something like an upmarket caravan. The good thing about these appears to be the location, the ones I have scanned are on cliff tops or the edge of a lake etc.

    The good thing about bricks and mortar is that is that it will go up in value whereas although these lodges are superbly situated, I can imagine them being a financial headache.

    Does anyone here have any experience of owning one of these ?

  2. #2
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    I haven't personally but I would check out the terms and conditions of holiday lodges especially with regard to management charges and some sites require you to replace them every X years

    Sent from my moto g(7) plus using Tapatalk

  3. #3
    Grand Master Dave+63's Avatar
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    Whilst they show the lodges on the cliff edge with stunning views, the ones you’re likely to be able to buy will be the ones by the roadside with a view of the lodge next door!

  4. #4
    Grand Master Passenger's Avatar
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    I've no direct experience but after a quckie glim at the Luxury lodges of Wicksteed Park, just the first one that popped up on tinterweb as I've no idea where you're looking, they seem to range in price from 170 k for about 800 sq ft to 240k for 990 sq ft and come with only a 10 year structural warranty, slightly worrying... Personally that seems very dear for what they are...A nice little flat, or penthouse, might be stairs though, something in a brick building in a charming little town with countryside around about would I imagine stand you better over the mid term certainly. Just my tuppence worth. All really depends what works better for you and mrs mick.


    https://www.wicksteedlodges.co.uk/the-park.php

  5. #5
    Holiday lodges check the management fees, also the terms . Some of them insist that they vet potential buyers later on- vetoing all of them forcing you to sell back to them cheaper etc. Some real horror stories.

  6. #6
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    The devil is in the detail with these lodge parks, the terms of the contracts can be quite onerous and restrictive.

    As an illustration, your lodge may only be 15 years old maximum before replacement that you must buy thru us,selling your old lodge only to us while paying us for all the moving and hook up costs,all maintainenece must be approved by us and carried out by our approved tradesmen using electric you must buy thru us. Or some similar restrictive and ultimately profitable arrangment with your park owners.

  7. #7
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    Depends on a few things Mick.

    Budget being a main one. You’ll get a great sea view / location for a hell of a lot less with a lodge.

    Also, usage. The site fees will be high and they’ll hammer you every 10 years or so for a replacement lodge. If you’re there for 6 months of the year, who cares? But twice a year for a week or so, it’ll prove costly.

    Legacy. Are you intending on leaving money / assets to kids? Because a lodge is a bad way to preserve / grow your capital.

    I’m leaning towards a hybrid method myself. I’ve a buy to let flat - bricks and mortar and an appreciating asset. Once I’m ready, I’ll use the rental from that to rent somewhere on the coast. Gives me the option of moving around with out the ball ache of selling up every time.

  8. #8
    Grand Master Chris_in_the_UK's Avatar
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    Simply a fact that the lodges go down in value and will have a finite lifespan (park dependant) and bricks & mortar will not.
    When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........

  9. #9
    Grand Master Passenger's Avatar
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    Why not find yourself a nice plot of land and buy a Huf house. They've some smashing designs and obviously are built to last, they can be tailored specifically to your needs internally and seem to start around 65 sq m's/ 700 sq ft and then upwards. Just another option.

    https://www.huf-haus.com/en-uk/art-bungalow-sample-5/

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Passenger View Post
    Why not find yourself a nice plot of land and buy a Huf house. They've some smashing designs and obviously are built to last, they can be tailored specifically to your needs internally and seem to start around 65 sq m's/ 700 sq ft and then upwards. Just another option.

    https://www.huf-haus.com/en-uk/art-bungalow-sample-5/
    I remember seeing one of those on Grand Designs, pretty nice. Is there a price list for the kits?

    No matter what, Mick should not buy a lodge/glorified caravan on a site. It will be financially ruinous.
    Last edited by Justin Case; 11th April 2021 at 17:19.

  11. #11
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    Bricks and mortar will be a better investment but a lodge in that sort of location will be much cheaper although there will be management costs and service charges and they vary massively and can add up.

    Whilst not the same, but similar, we bought a new static caravan 7 years ago and it has been fantastic, Allowing for depreciation I reckon it costs us 3.5k a year inc running costs for which we can use it for 7 months a year. It wasn't a financial investment but has been great.

    I had a stroke myself, actually after an accident whilst on my bike near the caravan, but having it has definitely contributed to my rehab and been a great escape. For me life is not just about the money these days. Tomorrow we will be up there for a few nights and I can't wait.

  12. #12
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    I managed to blag a chat with a friend of a friend and he confirmed everything said here, in other word stay well away from a lodge.

    Bricks and mortar it shall be.

    Many thanks for the input, it is much appreciated.

  13. #13
    I was staggered at the costs of lodges. There were some in North Wales around Abersoch that can cost £500k + especially on the beach, you then pay £000’s in fees annually and you only get the pitch for 20 years or something...bonkers! I’d rather a proper house by the coast somewhere!

    Also the one we visited had 4x4s all over the beach towing jet skis to the water and range rovers everywhere! Cheshire Wives territory I reckon!

  14. #14
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    We considered a lodge in North Norfolk, the occupancy restriction (only 11 months of the year) killed it for me. We bought a proper house instead.

  15. #15
    Grand Master Dave+63's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Case View Post
    I remember seeing one of those on Grand Designs, pretty nice. Is there a price list for the kits?

    No matter what, Mick should not buy a lodge/glorified caravan on a site. It will be financially ruinous.
    Maybe he’d have to sell a Rolex then!

    Good decision Mick, it’s definitely the best decision longer term. And having to walk to the beach is good exercise!

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mick P View Post
    What with the wife recovering from a stroke and old age relentlessly creeping up, we have decided to look for a holiday property in the UK as a bit of a get away, somewhere on the coast or a penthouse type thing in a picturesque city.

    The Sunday papers seem to be bombarded with adverts for timber lodges that look something like an upmarket caravan. The good thing about these appears to be the location, the ones I have scanned are on cliff tops or the edge of a lake etc.

    The good thing about bricks and mortar is that is that it will go up in value whereas although these lodges are superbly situated, I can imagine them being a financial headache.

    Does anyone here have any experience of owning one of these ?
    If there is any similarity with Fixed caravan holiday homes terms then walk away now.

  17. #17
    I have stayed at a few of these cottages for long weekends and found it very nice with lakes, outdoor pools, tennis courts etc.

    Doesn’t seem a bad price to me considering the location and facilities.

    https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/84881668#/
    Last edited by boring_sandwich; 11th April 2021 at 22:37.

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    Suffolk was lovely this morning



    And bricks and mortar property relatively reasonable

    Pitch

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    Quote Originally Posted by dougair View Post
    I was staggered at the costs of lodges. There were some in North Wales around Abersoch that can cost £500k + especially on the beach, you then pay £000’s in fees annually and you only get the pitch for 20 years or something...bonkers! I’d rather a proper house by the coast somewhere!

    Also the one we visited had 4x4s all over the beach towing jet skis to the water and range rovers everywhere! Cheshire Wives territory I reckon!

    We had a caravan on Abersoch's Warren caravan site in the 50s and through to the mid 60s. There were only a handful of vans in those days, spread right out and none on the dunes. Ours was the closest to 'our' section of dune and was at least 70m back from it. There was also at least 50m to the nearest other van. Entertainment was centred around walking, dinghy sailing and trips out from Abersoch's jetty on a fishing boat, returning with more mackerel that you could possibly eat. Plus a kids club that met on the beach every Sunday. Needless to say, I have very happy memories of the place.

    Now the place is packed and even the dunes are rammed with chalets/lodges. They cost, as you say, 500K plus. Whilst some/many may love what it offers nowadays, it's no longer somewhere I would want to spend time.

    Back on topic, good decision Mick.

  20. #20
    Master draftsmann's Avatar
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    Security is an issue for a second or holiday home that you are going to lock up and leave for possibly weeks at a stretch. In that respect if you really want to go rural the park home/lodge may be a better bet than the alternative of a cottage somewhere isolated and quiet.

    To be honest I can’t think of another single thing in favour of an overpriced lodge on a site surrounded by more of the same, populated (for between 10-11 months per year) by geriatric bores, and quite possibly with no or at best extremely limited choices of shopping, pub and restaurants within walking distance, necessitating getting in the car to do anything. Plus, as others have said, they are a financial disaster.

    A lock-up flat in a picturesque city, or market town, or seaside town, with a choice of amenities on my doorstep, would be the way I’d go if I were in your shoes.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by draftsmann View Post
    .

    A lock-up flat in a picturesque city, or market town, or seaside town, with a choice of amenities on my doorstep, would be the way I’d go if I were in your shoes.
    That is what we will be looking at.

  22. #22
    Master draftsmann's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mick P View Post
    That is what we will be looking at.
    I hope you find something lovely Mick. What locations are you considering?

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by draftsmann View Post
    I hope you find something lovely Mick. What locations are you considering?
    Somewhere we can get to within a couple of hours, so South Wales, Devon (my home county) Cornwall or Dorset.

  24. #24
    Have you parted with your Spanish apartment already Mick?

    You’ll need to factor in stamp duty on second U.K. property too I guess?

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Case View Post
    Have you parted with your Spanish apartment already Mick?

    You’ll need to factor in stamp duty on second U.K. property too I guess?
    No the apartment is still up for sale

  26. #26
    Grand Master Dave+63's Avatar
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    Bricks and Mortar house v Holiday Lodge.

    What’s the market like currently Mick? It’s always been notoriously slow in my experience.

    It took us eighteen months to sell our place (and at roughly 50% of what we’ paid for it) and we thought we’ did well!

  27. #27
    Grand Master Passenger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave+63 View Post
    What’s the market like currently Mick? It’s always been notoriously slow in my experience.

    It took us eighteen months to sell our place (and at roughly 50% of what we’ paid for it) and we thought we’ did well!
    Can't speak for Mick of course. That's very much par for the course I'm afraid, and likely to remain so as far as I can tell. It's simply a different market, and still they're building more in some parts and places despite some standing unsold and empty nearby.
    Location, location, location is even more important over here. It's a buyers market right now.
    Last edited by Passenger; 12th April 2021 at 10:48.

  28. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Mick P View Post
    Somewhere we can get to within a couple of hours, so South Wales, Devon (my home county) Cornwall or Dorset.
    How about something like this by the canal in Exeter?

    https://www.whittonandlaing.com/prop...13286881/sales

    My parents own two flats for rent in the same block. It’s a lovely location.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Passenger View Post
    Can't speak for Mick of course. That's very much par for the course I'm afraid, and likely to remain so as far as I can tell. It's simply a different market, and still they're building more in some parts and places despite some standing unsold and empty nearby.
    Location, location, location is even more important over here. It's a buyers market right now.
    Could it also be because Spaniards do not have the same approach to buying a house as Brits, in as much as its primary function remains to be a home a lot more than an investment?
    'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pitch3110 View Post
    Suffolk was lovely this morning



    And bricks and mortar property relatively reasonable

    Pitch
    Shush ....Don't let the secret out !!!

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  31. #31
    Grand Master Passenger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saint-Just View Post
    Could it also be because Spaniards do not have the same approach to buying a house as Brits, in as much as its primary function remains to be a home a lot more than an investment?
    Nail head SJ.

  32. #32
    Grand Master Dave+63's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Passenger View Post
    Can't speak for Mick of course. That's very much par for the course I'm afraid, and likely to remain so as far as I can tell. It's simply a different market, and still they're building more in some parts and places despite some standing unsold and empty nearby.
    Location, location, location is even more important over here. It's a buyers market right now.
    It was 2008 when we moved back and the back end of 2009 when we finally sold!

    They were still building through the crash of 2008.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mick P View Post
    Somewhere we can get to within a couple of hours, so South Wales, Devon (my home county) Cornwall or Dorset.
    Just remember local communities in these places aren’t always welcoming to second home owners. They can be closed communities and it’s very obvious when a property is used as a second home.

    I can imagine it’s particularly hard to see your children having to live away to live when there are properties sitting empty for a large part of the year.

  34. #34
    Grand Master Passenger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave+63 View Post
    It was 2008 when we moved back and the back end of 2009 when we finally sold!

    They were still building through the crash of 2008.
    Still at it even now, though there was a pause during covid wave 1.

    We got really lucky when we sold our first one about 3 years ago. IN 2 weeks if you can believe it...though the legal side/ completion took a wee bit longer, got out about what we'd put into it and had lived in it for free 5/6 years plus all the holidays before we moved out to try it permanently...Enormous good luck and good timing too as I bought the new one, before the sale was completed...The key I think was we gave it a complete lick of paint, decluttered it and presented it to its best advantage, plus the reason we bought it in the frst place was the great views all the way to Le Manga on a clear day and the magnificent Sierra around us also we'd added a little swimming pool, picked our timing for Spring when we thought folks would be actively looking and got a bite...asking price wasn't greedy/ inflated either, we knew it'd be a waste of time expecting to sell it for double or 50 percent more than we'd spent on it, which is often the British mindset, then they languish for years, their exteriors fading in the hot sun, gardens getting overgrown...so you have to spend more money, or worse yet vandals or squatters move in, seen this as well.
    Last edited by Passenger; 12th April 2021 at 11:48.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodder View Post
    Just remember local communities in these places aren’t always welcoming to second home owners. They can be closed communities and it’s very obvious when a property is used as a second home.

    I can imagine it’s particularly hard to see your children having to live away to live when there are properties sitting empty for a large part of the year.
    That’s why a flat- ideally not ground floor- is a better bet than the dream cottage.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mick P View Post
    Somewhere we can get to within a couple of hours, so South Wales, Devon (my home county) Cornwall or Dorset.
    Property in Devon is selling so quickly right now. I'd imagine Cornwall and Dorset is similar. A lot of buyers from away.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Taxboy View Post
    Shush ....Don't let the secret out !!!

    Sent from my moto g(7) plus using Tapatalk
    Okay buddy, soz, mums the word...

    Pitch

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devonian View Post
    Property in Devon is selling so quickly right now. I'd imagine Cornwall and Dorset is similar. A lot of buyers from away.
    Noting Mick’s mention of Dorset, I’ve always loved the Dorset coast but it’s always been expensive, I always assumed because it was just-about commutable to London if you were a masochist.

    I guess with WFH being reality for many of the demographic who can afford to live in that part of the world, going even further west is now a viable proposition.

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mick P View Post
    What with the wife recovering from a stroke and old age relentlessly creeping up, we have decided to look for a holiday property in the UK as a bit of a get away, somewhere on the coast or a penthouse type thing in a picturesque city.

    The Sunday papers seem to be bombarded with adverts for timber lodges that look something like an upmarket caravan. The good thing about these appears to be the location, the ones I have scanned are on cliff tops or the edge of a lake etc.

    The good thing about bricks and mortar is that is that it will go up in value whereas although these lodges are superbly situated, I can imagine them being a financial headache.

    Does anyone here have any experience of owning one of these ?

    Yes, we have one.

    It's horses for courses Mick.

    We decided we wanted a lovely quiet place right on the North Somerset coast overlooking the sea, with amenities on a very well managed site.

    We didn't do it as an investment, because it isn't. It is a cost.

    We considered buying a flat in a nearby village, but then the emphasis is on us to run it and maintain it etc. Our park fees cover pretty much everything, so it is as close to hassle and headache free as possible. We can go whenever we like or are able to.

    We don't rent it out, but do let friends and family use it for free. It is well put together, very comfortable, spacious and well appointed. Ours has a nice garden with it, decking dining area - all with sea views from a clifftop site. It also has a virtually private and spectacular beach.

    It all really comes down to what is going to suit your lifestyle, how much you are prepared to pay, and whether you are looking for an investment or not.
    Last edited by TheFlyingBanana; 12th April 2021 at 13:16.
    So clever my foot fell off.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by draftsmann View Post
    Noting Mick’s mention of Dorset, I’ve always loved the Dorset coast but it’s always been expensive, I always assumed because it was just-about commutable to London if you were a masochist.

    I guess with WFH being reality for many of the demographic who can afford to live in that part of the world, going even further west is now a viable proposition.
    Growing up in North Devon, we really were out on a limb and miles and hours from anywhere. That said it was a lovely place to live.

    Last few years and with a link road built in the 90's we're 45 minutes from Tiverton train station and maybe just over 2 hours into Paddington. A 6 hour round trip would be too much to do it daily but I did it last year to pick up a watch and it wasn't too bad. If you could work from home most of the week and maybe spend a couple of days in London, with an overnight, easily doable nowadays.

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodder View Post
    Just remember local communities in these places aren’t always welcoming to second home owners. They can be closed communities and it’s very obvious when a property is used as a second home.

    I can imagine it’s particularly hard to see your children having to live away to live when there are properties sitting empty for a large part of the year.
    It's hard, but do locals want to sell to locals, or sell to get as much as the market will bear?. There are a number of Norfolk properties for sale with a "buyer must have lived locally for X years" clause.

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by thenikjones View Post
    It's hard, but do locals want to sell to locals, or sell to get as much as the market will bear?. There are a number of Norfolk properties for sale with a "buyer must have lived locally for X years" clause.
    I be Devon born and bred and I do tell you that I have a west country accent as do the old trout. I am not a grockle.

    I will fit in perfect.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mick P View Post
    I be Devon born and bred and I do tell you that I have a west country accent as do the old trout. I am not a grockle.

    I will fit in perfect.
    Whereabouts you from Mick? Janner?

  44. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Mick P View Post
    I be Devon born and bred and I do tell you that I have a west country accent as do the old trout. I am not a grockle.

    I will fit in perfect.
    I don't have much of an Exeter accent anymore.

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by thenikjones View Post
    It's hard, but do locals want to sell to locals, or sell to get as much as the market will bear?. There are a number of Norfolk properties for sale with a "buyer must have lived locally for X years" clause.
    I agree, I don’t have a strong view on it. It saddens me to think that some communities are not going to exist but everything changes. If it’s going to be used frequently so be it.

    It is a consideration though, even if you’re from the area originally I can imagine it would irk some locals if there’s a property in their block that’s not being used much. For some it’s not a big deal. Gordon Ramsey doesn’t seem welcome there but he makes it apparent he doesn’t care! For others it could sour the experience.

  46. #46
    If you are in an apartment with others above and/or below you then you should be grateful for minimal occupancy.

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devonian View Post
    Whereabouts you from Mick? Janner?
    Born in Plymouth and raised in Newton Abbot.

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Case View Post
    If you are in an apartment with others above and/or below you then you should be grateful for minimal occupancy.
    You’re right, i’m sure they’d be absolutely made up.

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Case View Post
    If you are in an apartment with others above and/or below you then you should be grateful for minimal occupancy.
    My experience is that people get used to neighbours not being at home and then resent little things like the loo being flushed in the small hours or the dulcet tones of Sarah Ward on Jazz FM wafting out of the wireless of an evening.

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Passenger View Post
    Why not find yourself a nice plot of land and buy a Huf house. They've some smashing designs and obviously are built to last, they can be tailored specifically to your needs internally and seem to start around 65 sq m's/ 700 sq ft and then upwards. Just another option.

    https://www.huf-haus.com/en-uk/art-bungalow-sample-5/
    Unlike Spain, there would be the minor technicality of gaining planning permission

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