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Thread: Help: Nerdy New mesh WiFi recommendations

  1. #51
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    The roaming feature is (mainly) controlled by the wireless client not the network, unsure as to the cause of the other posters issues it could be as simple as overlapping high strength signal from the apís or a deeper issue.

    Unifi has the option to adjust the output power and set a minimum signal strength from client devices to help tune these situations


    If you havenít already ordered all your patch cables, rack etc you might like to look at kenable you can get patch cables in various lengths and colours in individuals for much less than Amazon/eBay
    https://www.kenable.co.uk/en/


    Iíve bitten the bullet and gone for a small Omada setup so it will be interesting to compare notes.


    Interesting in your choice to go with a 24 port, 8 port poe and the udm pro in the loft, even with cameras it feels you are very long on ports?

    Also interesting on the ceiling mounted apís I suspect mounting them, getting the patch cable to them and concealing the incoming wall plate / cable will be fun?

    The floor plan looked like the tv room and master bed had built in cabinetry that could have concealed the in wall apís can you get the ceiling mounted ones in there too?

  2. #52
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    The DMP and Switch came today from Ubiquiti Europe - again without a VAT demand. Virgin is being delivered later today and I'll try a basic and partial set up either Friday when we get the keys or Saturday. The Virgin is now self-install and they've given us the new hub 4 but it'll be straight into modem mode anyway.

    I have gone a bit long on ports. The price difference between the USW-16-PoE and the USW-24-PoE is 85 EUR and the difference is an additional 8 PoE ports for the money. I thought I'd rather overspend £75 and have an extra 8 PoE ports meaning we can have all PoE devices inc cameras connected directly to the switch. If we don't now buy PoE cameras it'll be a waste.

    I'm going to set up some of it partially for a week or two with wires all along the floor and APs resting on shelves so we can be 100% sure on exactly where we're drilling holes and placing APs. After this I'll factory reset and have it all drilled in and mounted properly. I do think a few of these will just be hidden in cupboards like you suggest. Much later on if 4 APs somehow don't give the coverage needed I'll think about adding one or two more Vs swapping some or all of them out with the long range U6-LRs. I'll probably add another 1-2 Flex Minis or 8 port Flex Lites once we're a bit more settled and have TVs and desks set up.

    I'm going to have help installing it physically from a guy who wired up my in-law's house and sister in-law's house with CCTV and ethernet ports. I'm happy to set up the network myself but I'm not willing to go three floors up up a ladder with a drill and after all that probably drill it in the wrong place. We need to change the ariel on the roof so will have him out anyway.

    It should be fun to compare notes. Thank you for the recommendation for cables and rack. I was watching rack set up videos last night on Youtube and think I'll end up with the rack wall mounted up near the ceiling in the loft.

  3. #53
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    I unboxed it all just now and will install it tomorrow internally with wires everywhere, see how I get on. The Virgin Superhub 4 works fine in the living room where it's installed and the bedroom directly above but not too well in the kitchen and not anywhere at all.

    Hopefully the 50m ethernet cable comes early tomorrow as the 20m cable I bought is was too short!
    Last edited by wileeeeeey; 2nd May 2021 at 19:10.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by wileeeeeey View Post
    I unboxed it all just now and will install it tomorrow internally with wires everywhere, see how I get on. The Virgin Superhub 4 works fine in the living room where it's installed and the bedroom directly above but not too well in the kitchen and not anywhere at all.

    Hopefully the 50m ethernet cable comes early tomorrow as the 20m cable I bought is was too short!
    Oooh Shiny...

    No update in three days, it’s either going swimmingly or...

    I think you’ve made the right call re unifi vs tp-link, I’ve just discovered that the Omada firewall is not stateful, meaning I can isolate the trusted lan and iot and no traffic will pass between them, I can allow traffic from the trusted lan to iot but the Omada system will not allow iot devices to respond to flow initiated from the trusted lan, this feature should be in the next major fw & sw release.

    Well to be fair it should be in this release if tp-link wan Omada to be considered a real unifi competitor

    However I have a cunning plan keep an eye on the Techy-nerdy stuff thread for more info

    Edit: Is that an in-wall ap I spy?

  5. #55
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    My much more humble network and patented ap testing mount ;-)




  6. #56
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    You're going to put me to shame now, Captain.

    This is currently how the network is set up. This is temporary until we get it up in the loft and the the APs drilled through the walls.

    We're moving back out in about 6 weeks for a week or two while the painters come and we have some light switches and plugs moved and added.

    I've just upgraded to the 2TB Google Drive so I'm hammering the network with my MBP uploading about 200gb.the little box you can see is the Flex Mini but I'm going to wait until it's set up properly to plug that into the living room as I don't want another 30m cable going back downstairs to the front room.


    Last edited by wileeeeeey; 5th May 2021 at 12:20.

  7. #57
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    A couple of screenshots from the app as they're easier to upload. I keep getting warning messages about smart queues so I might look into it later when I have nothing else to do.

    The system is smart but the naming of clients isn't the smartest. It's named my 13 inch late 2013 MBP as a 2019 16 inch MBP which is a bit weird but doesn't impact anything - did confuse me though wondering if a a neighbour was on. Couple of other naming convention niggles but again, matters zero so not too fussed.

    One thing which is annoying me which there will be a solution for but I haven't googled yet is setting certain APs to be used by specific devices. Sometimes the WiFi score for a device will show 70% and it's not connected to the closest AP. I can go in and click reconnect and it'll move over most of the time but not always. Devices in the loft aren't all connected to the AP nearest but maybe that's traffic management. I wonder if you can force roaming (or attempt roaming) if the score goes below your specific threshold. Probably can.

    Screenshot dump below if you're interested.

  8. #58
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    Ignore the depressing WFH set up but not sure why all these aren't connected to the AP between the banisters on the left Vs the one in the middle floor below (some are, some aren't). Not a big deal as all APs will be in the walls/ceilings soon anyway but curious nevertheless.

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by wileeeeeey View Post
    One thing which is annoying me which there will be a solution for but I haven't googled yet is setting certain APs to be used by specific devices. Sometimes the WiFi score for a device will show 70% and it's not connected to the closest AP. I can go in and click reconnect and it'll move over most of the time but not always. Devices in the loft aren't all connected to the AP nearest but maybe that's traffic management. I wonder if you can force roaming (or attempt roaming) if the score goes below your specific threshold. Probably can.


    Definitely you can tune it but ultimately itís the client that controls the roaming. Assuming youíre using devices made post 2010 ;-)

    You can set a minimum client signal level in unifi so if it falls below it forces a disconnect and the client looks for another ap. The other is adjusting the ap output level.

    You might need to play with both.

    The new place looks good btw.

  10. #60
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    Had it installed properly yesterday at the same time as ripping out two old aerials and an old Sky dish. Ubiquiti did the famous "no IP address found" after we'd moved the Virgin router up the loft so had to factory reset both Virgin and every Ubiquiti product to start fresh. I kept the SSID and password the same and everything just reconnected.

    Install went relatively well and my wife is thrilled not to have ethernet cables all over the house. Only annoyance is I knew I should have taken a half day at work and supervised as by the time it was done the guy said the famous words "I've done you a favour" and installed two APs on top of eachother leaving the living room without one. CAT6A is quite fat and pretty tough to work with and I think he'd had enough. There is a line of it down the side of the house in trunking but he could only fit 4 cables in the trunking and didn't leave much flex at one of the ends at all. The slack is there but the cable is too tight in the trunking so I can't tug it.

    Not the biggest of deals but it does mean the WiFi doorbell has 74% signal in the UI portal so I've just ordered an 8 port PoE switch to sit under the TV which will give me an extra few ports which I need anyway and power one of the APs. I'm moving one he left in the middle of the house to the front of the house, doorbell should be fine then. The AP will probably just sit under the TV out of sight and I'll think about mounting and the switch after we've painted.

    I'm half tempted to rip it all out and do it myself when I have spare annual leave and nothing better to do but for now I'm happy it's done.

    Thank you again to the Captain for such great help and advice, it really did help a lot and I'm very grateful. Building the rack and setting up VLANs are next, but for now I've done some port forwarding to play XBox. Priorities.

  11. #61
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    Quick pic of how Mr Yeehaw left it yesterday and how I have it today. I've got it facing the wall because of how tough the cables are and because someone saw it behind me in a Teams call yesterday and it derailed the entire conversation when they asked me "what the hell is that?!" Fair question as it is a bit nuts.

  12. #62
    Lots of people moan about using Google with sky router , I have it and it works perfectly

    Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

  13. #63
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    Yikes that looks complicated. I use BT whole home WiFi dishes. Pretty simple to set up with the best part of 200mbps (which is what I’m getting wired from my router) wherever I need it. I’ve never felt the need for more speed than that, and I have to upload huge video files. The only slight wrinkle is that the Philips Hue hub doesn’t like to be connected to the dish, it has to be connected directly to the router due to something to do with IP addresses. So the solution is to connect the router to a cheap Ethernet switcher (got one from from Argos), which is connected to both the Hue hub and the BT dish, which works for some reason I don’t fully understand. That minor ball ache aside, I’ve never had to worry about it since setting it up, whereas power line adapters were always flaky.

  14. #64
    Internet nerds full of double nodding or something and open ports or whatever I've attached Google's router to my sky router/modem plus 2 points , have multiple things attached to the mesh, including 2 of us who from home on the UK gov portal and me on Citrix and 16 other devices and have no issues at all

    Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

  15. #65
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    Hey Wiley

    I had been wondering how you were getting on, I guess you didnít backup the unifi and vm configs before hand?
    No biggie I guess but it does make a fallback easier if something goes wrong in the future.

    Looks good, even with the Ďfavourí, werenít you going to install them in the loft in the original plan?

    Vlans should be easy as on unifi but moving the Sonos off to a IoT lan could be a pita, Iíve shyíd away from that at the moment but have Alexa/fire tv/printer/heating/alarm all over there and working, so most of the way there.

    Glad my rambling were some help.

  16. #66
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    Hey Captain,

    He put one near enough in the ceiling of middle Hall, just inside the room at the top of the stairs. Great position and coverage, no issues. Immediately after he put the one meant for the living room directly the upstairs AP in the room next to the kitchen as he found an existing hole where the old radiator pipes were ripped out from. I didn't think we were having one there but he "did me a favour" to "avoid more holes in the wall".

    The 8 port PoE switch came today along with a compatible PoE injector just in case. Speedy delivery from UI and again no VAT demand.

    Annoyingly the 108 EUR switch came with an EU plug but the cheap 8 EUR PoE injector came with an additional UK plug so for now the AP which was in the middle of the house downstairs has been moved to the living room via the Flex Mini with a PoE injector and Amazon same-day delivery are bringing an EU adapter later so I can set up the 8 port switch properly. This will probably make the Flex Mini redundant until we bring our other TV over once we've painted but means the doorbell now has 100% WiFi.

    In the moment I wasn't thinking and just factory reset the lot. There was a backup but it slipped my mind. Setting it back up again with the same SSID and password helped a lot, everything but the robot vacuum cleaner reconnected automatically.

  17. #67
    Quick questions regarding Google's offerings: Google Nest and Google WiFi.






    Even though the Nest WiFi product is better specced and newer, we are looking at Google WiFi, as the latter lacks the microphone/speakers the former has, and we have no desire for Google to be listening to conversations in our home.

    With Google WiFi :

    1) Does it create a unified WiFi across the home? [If not.....see 2) and 3) below] or does it behave like those powerline adapters where, some devices, keep hold of their existing connection to one access point even if there is a closer one nearby?

    2) Can you all access points share the same SSID? (hoping that by definition of a 'mesh' its a yes!)

    3) Can you roam the house whilst streaming a video, and the video does not pause/buffer as you move out of range from one point and into range of another point? i.e. a seamless connection

    4) Has anyone used it with Sky Q hub without issues? (SkyQ is known for not playing nice with non-Sky hardware!)

  18. #68
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    cman, yes, all fine. My mum has the single point Nest and my aunt has the Google WiFi 3 pack mesh (used as a wireless mesh).

    Aunt has Sky so right now I have the two running side by side but the next time I go over I'm going to disable the WiFi on the Sky and see how I get on.

    Here's a screenshot from just now of my aunt's setup taken in the Google home app (I'm a part of her Google home for when she calls with problems). It says Nest but it's not, it's the Google WiFi 3 pack.

    Seeing them on facetime is 100x better and we can actually see a moving picture when she's in the garden now.

  19. #69
    Agree with all the above, I've had Google WiFi for years and recently changed to Nest routers (x3, all routers, no points). Google (and Nest) WiFi works fine with Sky, with one slight exception - I couldn't for love nor money get the Sky Q Minibox to work consistently. Sometimes it did fine, but it wouldn't remain connected to the main Q box. Instead I've run a cable from the WiFi AP (Google WiFi and Nest Routers have an Ethernet port), reset networking on the Sky Q Mini box, chose the wired ethernet option, and it has remained mostly* stable ever since.

    *They're still shit boxes, but that's nothing to do with WiFi.

  20. #70
    Many thanks wileeeeeey and RobM for the super quick and very informative replies. Much appreciated (TZ is great!). It seems then, that they tick all boxes!

    wileeeeeey - isn't it strange how your aunt has Google WiFi but it shows as Google Nest in your app? Lazy app coding or slow decommission of Google WiFi?

    RobM - interested to know what prompted you to change from Google WiFi to Google Nest..? also, can you turn off the mic/'smart speakeer' feature on Google Nest?
    Last edited by cman; 24th August 2021 at 17:06.

  21. #71
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    The Google Home and Nest apps are a bit of a mess right now. I'm about to buy two more Nest thermostats and the new 4th gen (America only ATM) doesn't even work in the Nest App - Google Home only. Bit of an identity crisis. Google WiFi being discontinued and then relaunched probably didn't help things.

    If you're a Google One customer you get 3% or 10% cashback depending on tier.

  22. #72
    I had to go for a.mesh and Google Mesh has given us strong signals across the house and now 2 of is working from home have no issue with work zooms, works brilliantly and we have better speakers now

    Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

  23. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by cman View Post
    Many thanks wileeeeeey and RobM for the super quick and very informative replies. Much appreciated (TZ is great!). It seems then, that they tick all boxes!

    wileeeeeey - isn't it strange how your aunt has Google WiFi but it shows as Google Nest in your app? Lazy app coding or slow decommission of Google WiFi?

    RobM - interested to know what prompted you to change from Google WiFi to Google Nest..? also, can you turn off the mic/'smart speakeer' feature on Google Nest?
    Coverage, mainly. There's one room in my house, a garage conversion with what was an external wall between it and the hallway, which the Google WiFi sometimes struggled with. The Nest Routers solved it and it has been solid ever since.

    I bought Routers not Points though, so there is no mic and smart speaker inside them, and they have an Ethernet port on each. Two big selling points for me, I don't need yet another series of microphones in the house, or yet another 'assistant'. But the main benefit is the Ethernet port so I can hard-wire the SkyQ Minibox and avoid WiFi niggles with it.

    I agree about the Google Apps to a point, but they are clearly trying to consolidate everything into Home. Google have a terrible history for software and app development so I'm somewhat numb to it, but if you forget everything else exists and just use the Home app you'll be fine. It does everything you need to get WiFi working, and they're adding more to it all the time so if you buy more Nest devices it should become the only App you need... but if you're coming from an existing Google WiFi and Nest setup, it's going to feel disjointed.

  24. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by RobM View Post
    Coverage, mainly. There's one room in my house, a garage conversion with what was an external wall between it and the hallway, which the Google WiFi sometimes struggled with. The Nest Routers solved it and it has been solid ever since.

    I bought Routers not Points though, so there is no mic and smart speaker inside them, and they have an Ethernet port on each. Two big selling points for me, I don't need yet another series of microphones in the house, or yet another 'assistant'. But the main benefit is the Ethernet port so I can hard-wire the SkyQ Minibox and avoid WiFi niggles with it.
    Thanks again for the info. It wasn't clear (at all!) that you can create a mesh using Google Nest Routers only, as its implied you need to get a router devicee as the 'hub' to which your modem is connected to, and its the 'point' devices that creates/extends your mesh.

    As you've created a mesh with routers only, that's also a big selling point for me.... no 'smart speaker' or Google microphone listening to conversations!

    Plus it seems cheaper that way? i.e. an individual point device is £129 and a router device is £119 (down from £149).

  25. #75
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    Works out more expensive but more flexible to buy multiple routers as Google do package deals for Nest and Google WiFi. Totally up to you.

  26. #76
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    Captain, now that it looks like we're rewiring in three weeks would it be worthwhile looking into CAT8 or would you be pretty happy with CAT6?

    The CAT6A cable I've already used is really tough and doesn't bend easily but if it's the best thing to use then we'll probably stick with it.

  27. #77
    BT have a half price offer for today only on whole home units for their BT customers if that helps anyone.


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  28. #78

    Hello

    What are the BT offerings like?

    Best,

    Ben

  29. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by burnside View Post
    What are the BT offerings like?

    Best,

    Ben
    Iíve got half a dozen of the black ones, they work well.

  30. #80

    Hello

    Thanks JB!

  31. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by wileeeeeey View Post
    Captain, now that it looks like we're rewiring in three weeks would it be worthwhile looking into CAT8 or would you be pretty happy with CAT6?

    The CAT6A cable I've already used is really tough and doesn't bend easily but if it's the best thing to use then we'll probably stick with it.
    Bare in mind these are the thoughts of someone whoís only just googled cat8 for specs and is happy to mount his ap in a paper bag ;-)

    Just for reference a 4K stream today is ~20mb/s, 8k ~40, so with good old cat5 you could run 40-50 (closer to 50 I suspect) concurrent 4K streams. Cat5 can now be used for the new 2.5gb/s standard.

    Cat8 is certified for 40gb/s at 30m including patch cables etc, I have no idea when we will need that speed domestically or when 40gb home devices will be remotely affordable.

    If I were installing today and wanted to make it as future proof as possible, Iíd look at cat6 but I would look to have a local concentration point on each floor where all the devices on that floor ran back to, I would have the connections between the switches and network core in some kind of conduit or tubing so the switch interconnects (backbone) could easily be upgraded to cat8/fibre/magic dust if the backbone ever became a choke point.

    Iíd try to put these points where itís likely the majority of high volume users/hardware would be, the tv/av/gaming space, the main home office etc. So that if for some unknown reason we find ourselves in a world where we do need 40gb/s to the desktop or games console itís easier to manage.

    Iíd also put a conduit run where my internet is presented back to the core.

    If I couldnít do that and didnít want to pay the gazillions that a av firm would want for fitting and testing the cat8 id be fine with cat6 or 6a but Iíd want it tested.

  32. #82
    Master ed335d's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Morgan View Post
    Bare in mind these are the thoughts of someone who’s only just googled cat8 for specs and is happy to mount his ap in a paper bag ;-)

    Just for reference a 4K stream today is ~20mb/s, 8k ~40, so with good old cat5 you could run 40-50 (closer to 50 I suspect) concurrent 4K streams. Cat5 can now be used for the new 2.5gb/s standard.

    Cat8 is certified for 40gb/s at 30m including patch cables etc, I have no idea when we will need that speed domestically or when 40gb home devices will be remotely affordable.

    If I were installing today and wanted to make it as future proof as possible, I’d look at cat6 but I would look to have a local concentration point on each floor where all the devices on that floor ran back to, I would have the connections between the switches and network core in some kind of conduit or tubing so the switch interconnects (backbone) could easily be upgraded to cat8/fibre/magic dust if the backbone ever became a choke point.

    I’d try to put these points where it’s likely the majority of high volume users/hardware would be, the tv/av/gaming space, the main home office etc. So that if for some unknown reason we find ourselves in a world where we do need 40gb/s to the desktop or games console it’s easier to manage.

    I’d also put a conduit run where my internet is presented back to the core.

    If I couldn’t do that and didn’t want to pay the gazillions that a av firm would want for fitting and testing the cat8 id be fine with cat6 or 6a but I’d want it tested.
    Cat 8 is pointless for a domestic environment. Cat 5e and 6 will both support gigabit ethernet up to 100m, cat 6 should even support 10G over 55m as long as the surrounding EMI environment isn't too hostile. 55m is a long way in most houses!

    But you already know this, I've just read the 1st page!!
    Last edited by ed335d; 26th August 2021 at 14:58.

  33. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by wileeeeeey View Post
    Captain, now that it looks like we're rewiring in three weeks would it be worthwhile looking into CAT8 or would you be pretty happy with CAT6?

    The CAT6A cable I've already used is really tough and doesn't bend easily but if it's the best thing to use then we'll probably stick with it.
    See above. Is the cable you're using black by any chance?

  34. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Morgan View Post
    Bare in mind these are the thoughts of someone whoís only just googled cat8 for specs and is happy to mount his ap in a paper bag ;-)

    Just for reference a 4K stream today is ~20mb/s, 8k ~40, so with good old cat5 you could run 40-50 (closer to 50 I suspect) concurrent 4K streams. Cat5 can now be used for the new 2.5gb/s standard.

    Cat8 is certified for 40gb/s at 30m including patch cables etc, I have no idea when we will need that speed domestically or when 40gb home devices will be remotely affordable.

    If I were installing today and wanted to make it as future proof as possible, Iíd look at cat6 but I would look to have a local concentration point on each floor where all the devices on that floor ran back to, I would have the connections between the switches and network core in some kind of conduit or tubing so the switch interconnects (backbone) could easily be upgraded to cat8/fibre/magic dust if the backbone ever became a choke point.

    Iíd try to put these points where itís likely the majority of high volume users/hardware would be, the tv/av/gaming space, the main home office etc. So that if for some unknown reason we find ourselves in a world where we do need 40gb/s to the desktop or games console itís easier to manage.

    Iíd also put a conduit run where my internet is presented back to the core.

    If I couldnít do that and didnít want to pay the gazillions that a av firm would want for fitting and testing the cat8 id be fine with cat6 or 6a but Iíd want it tested.
    Good points. I was going to try and run two cables per single socket and only put one into a keystone so if there were any issues I could change keystone/cable later on but conduit would be better - depends on how much channelling the guys will do which I'm guessing will be as little as possible.

    I'll probably have more luck with APs in ceiling than I will with an ethernet socket in each room.

    A few POE flex minis dotted about acting as hubs could be good so long as they don't need to power anything running off them. Will have a look at the floorplan again and see where I'd want APs placing as we're in the kitchen 10x more than the dining room and relying on the signal to go through what is realistically an exterior wall. I can't see us using the dining room for a few years at least and the only thing that AP does really is cover the garden.

  35. #85
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ed335d View Post
    See above. Is the cable you're using black by any chance?
    Half way through changing what are realistically patch cables (some black) but all the CAT6A is blue. Old pic from earlier in the thread here.


  36. #86
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    Don't judge me on this picture alone!

    We've had to take up the carpet but now can't lay the flooring until we've rewired. All cables here are CAT6A - the blue were cut and made, the red and black bought in.

  37. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by wileeeeeey View Post
    Don't judge me on this picture alone!

    We've had to take up the carpet but now can't lay the flooring until we've rewired. All cables here are CAT6A - the blue were cut and made, the red and black bought in.
    Ah, yes, unshielded Cat 6A is indeed very thick (I thought you might have been using an external grade cable). Counter intuitively, shielded 6A is typically thinner.

    6A is really not very good for domestic use (as you've already found), as it is pretty inflexible with a large minimum bend radius.

  38. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by wileeeeeey View Post
    Good points. I was going to try and run two cables per single socket and only put one into a keystone so if there were any issues I could change keystone/cable later on but conduit would be better - depends on how much channelling the guys will do which I'm guessing will be as little as possible.

    I'll probably have more luck with APs in ceiling than I will with an ethernet socket in each room.

    A few POE flex minis dotted about acting as hubs could be good so long as they don't need to power anything running off them. Will have a look at the floorplan again and see where I'd want APs placing as we're in the kitchen 10x more than the dining room and relying on the signal to go through what is realistically an exterior wall. I can't see us using the dining room for a few years at least and the only thing that AP does really is cover the garden.
    I would take a step back and look at where you have the most concentrated wired devices as thatís where Iíd put the conduit runs.

    As I said the obvious ones are the tv/consoles/Apple TV/firetv in the lounge, any/main office spaces. Kitchen perhaps but is that background watching or 4K low latency gaming???
    All youíre doing is putting in a Ďhedgeí that if 10gb/s some how becomes a choke point you Ave a easy route to upgrade

    Donít forget as you are installing cabling it might pay use some of the in wall apís for areas like the kitchen.


    Putting conduit everywhere would be massive overkill.

    Donít bother putting leaving any runs unterminated, the cost of presenting them is nothing and you want to know theyíve all been tested, it also gets confusing at the node zero/patch panel end when you have unpresented drops.

  39. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by ed335d View Post
    Cat 8 is pointless for a domestic environment. Cat 5e and 6 will both support gigabit ethernet up to 100m, cat 6 should even support 10G over 55m as long as the surrounding EMI environment isn't too hostile. 55m is a long way in most houses!

    But you already know this, I've just read the 1st page!!
    Itís the old moon on a stick problem, you want to make something as future proof as possible but without over complicating things or blowing the budget.

    To my mind it will be a long time until 1gb/s is a constriction to most home networks, and long before then 2.5gb/s will be the new norm which happily runs on cat5e. Iíve read a few cases of people getting 10gb/s to work at home distances too.

    IMHO Cat6 will easily last 10-15 years in a domestic setting if not longer, and if I couldnít get a couple of conduit runs in I wouldnít lose much sleep.

  40. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Morgan View Post
    Itís the old moon on a stick problem, you want to make something as future proof as possible but without over complicating things or blowing the budget.

    To my mind it will be a long time until 1gb/s is a constriction to most home networks, and long before then 2.5gb/s will be the new norm which happily runs on cat5e. Iíve read a few cases of people getting 10gb/s to work at home distances too.

    IMHO Cat6 will easily last 10-15 years in a domestic setting if not longer, and if I couldnít get a couple of conduit runs in I wouldnít lose much sleep.
    Agreed. If the majority of traffic is internet based, then having super-speed internally isn't going to advantageous unless your connection to the outside world is massive.

  41. #91
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    Hey Captain,

    Rewire is halfway done. So far we have about 17 or 18 cat6 cables going up to the loft which go directly into the dream machine pro, no need for hubs between floors.

    I have 6x Ubiquiti G4 bullet cameras coming tomorrow. I only need 5 but they're sold out most places and I can only find them in packs of 3. This should work out as ethernet in every room in a wall socket with a couple in ceilings for the APs.

    I wanted to get the Google cameras but the new release was disappointing. I'll see how I get on with the UDM. If it chugs I'll look at the dedicated NVR but would really rather not.

  42. #92
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    Good progress there Wiley.

    Never played with the cams so itíll be interesting how you go, Iíd guess youíll be okay but storage capacity might be the issue depending how long a retention period youíre looking for.

  43. #93
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    Retention period and redundancy may dictate the NVR purchase. I've gone for 1x 4tb WD purple HDD for now.

    The G4 bullets are 1440p I think. The G4 Pro is 4k but was about £400 per camera, couldn't stomach that.

    This tool on the UI website is quite handy but is HD or 4K only, no 1440p option. I think I should be able to get 2 weeks with 5x cameras but I'll see how it goes.

    We should be back in by the end of Oct but hopefully the rewire will be done by the end of next week and I can play with it before then.

  44. #94
    Can any WiFi experts help with client roaming ?

    I have a 4 Draytek APs running as APs - all hard wired back to the switch & router. Each AP is on a different floor of the house (concrete floors).

    I have set the client roaming as both Strictly Minimum RSI and a speed rate of 6 MBps to hand over - is there anything else I should be doing to ensure the clients pick up the stronger APs rather than remain on the previous AP when Roaming ?

    ISP is Sky and we only get about 30 MBps (I am used to VM but that is not available here) hence the 6 MBps threshold.

  45. #95
    Grand Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    Captain is the expert but is it a mesh network?

    Depending on how new and how expensive I'd be tempted to switch it out to a mesh network, particularly if you have the ability to hardwire each AP.

    A 3 pack of the old Google WiFi which has recently been re-released with a single unit on top perhaps?

  46. #96
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    Logitech Orbi. I have the triple pack in my place in India and it does 6000sqft with minimal dead spots


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  47. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jlynch1984 View Post
    Logitech Orbi. I have the triple pack in my place in India and it does 6000sqft with minimal dead spots


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Orbi is Netgear, not Logitech

  48. #98
    Quote Originally Posted by wileeeeeey View Post
    Captain is the expert but is it a mesh network?

    Depending on how new and how expensive I'd be tempted to switch it out to a mesh network, particularly if you have the ability to hardwire each AP.

    A 3 pack of the old Google WiFi which has recently been re-released with a single unit on top perhaps?
    Thanks - they are new enough to Mesh but as each is on a different floor and they all hardwire to the switch I set them up as APs as didnt see the point in them meshing or that they even could - although given they are not handing over always maybe they could.

    They are Draytek 912s & 903s - the 912s only have one ethernet port but the 903s have 4.

  49. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by MB2 View Post
    Can any WiFi experts help with client roaming ?

    I have a 4 Draytek APs running as APs - all hard wired back to the switch & router. Each AP is on a different floor of the house (concrete floors).

    I have set the client roaming as both Strictly Minimum RSI and a speed rate of 6 MBps to hand over - is there anything else I should be doing to ensure the clients pick up the stronger APs rather than remain on the previous AP when Roaming ?

    ISP is Sky and we only get about 30 MBps (I am used to VM but that is not available here) hence the 6 MBps threshold.

    Sorry I donít think I can be much help not had any experience with draytek networking, it sounds like youíve configured them correctly a lot of the wifi roaming is handled by the client devices.

    Are all devices hanging onto the weak apís? Or are some more modern devices behaving as expected?

  50. #100
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    Either it isn't mesh or the clients are old and don't work with "handoff" as Captain says. You could look further at the RSI limits. Seems like it's just acting as a couple of separate networks which all happen to have the same SSID/password.

    They should just automatically pop from one to the other but are instead clinging onto an AP with bad signal rather than moving over to the closet AP with great signal.

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