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How far did you drive with steam coming out of it?
Hello all
As some of you may remember I had a bit of a fire sale recently and bought the Fiesta ecoboost that was advertised on SC as my one and only car for the time being. It was described as being mechanically good and the seller brought it down to me and I didn’t even test drive it, as it made the 100 mile trip and according to him had no issues.
I’ve been driving it locally for the last couple of weeks, and on Saturday went out with my wife and kids. Driving along I see lots of white smoke / steam in the rear view mirror and can smell antifreeze I believe, the kids were complaining and their eyes were stinging. Revs were jumping and running lumpy. Got it home and it has refused to start again.
I know that buying a 2nd hand car is a gamble, but I didn’t expect it to last 2 weeks and 500 miles. I think it’s the HG, and am concerned that the engine may be beyond economic repair. I’ve had some quotes and what was meant to be a cheap car to get me around for a few months may prove to be a money pit. I am upset and disappointed beyond words.
The thing that I’m concerned about is have I been done over, as 500 miles before catastrophic failure leads me to suspect that the car was on its last legs when sold to me, and that’s based on what I’ve been told
If anyone has any suggestions as to what would be the best / cheapest way forward I would really appreciate some constructive assistance.
The car is a 2014 Fiesta 1.0 Ecoboost 125 Zetec S with 75k. Looking around on the Fiesta owners groups, I’ve been quoted £1600 for a known good engine supplied and fitted by Ecosport I believe, who are apparently well regarded.
I’m now hiring a car as I have to have a car for work and the kids school and can’t keep that up for long as it’s just money down the drain but I have no choice at the moment.
I think I needed to vent.
How far did you drive with steam coming out of it?
I’ve no experience with these, but over the years I’ve had a few blown head gaskets and in each case I fixed the car myself as no damage had been done to the engine.
On a car that’s done some mileage I think you have to accept that this can happen, its v. unfortunate considering that you've only bought the car recently, but a head gasket problem is difficult to disguise, if the head gasket was starting to fail in this way the car would've been guzzling water and I can’t see it surviving a 100 mile trip.
I don’t think you’ve been ‘ done over’ as you term it, but I do think you’ve been unlucky. The only comment I would add concerns water leaks, if the car was losing water and in need of regular topping up that may have caused the head gasket to blow.
Between you and seller (dice) surely. Also sounds like seller did all the mechanical work himself (from his ad), which may or may not be linked to the problems.
I would like to think a seller on here wouldn’t do that, these are cracking little engines but can let go spectacularly as can any turbo engine, I would suggest a replacement engine is a good price, eco sport are reputable indeed, but if nothing is badly damaged on inspection a head gasket replacement (and skimming the head should sort it.
How far did you drive it smoking and did the car get hot, any temp warnings on the dash?
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The 1.0 eco boost is blighted with issues, to be honest I’d be looking at an engine. I know Ford simply replace the engines in most cases rather rebuilding them.
The car as probably had a hard life from new, they are great little cars and that eco boost loves a thrashing 75k miles and more than likely 50 of them hard.
If i were the seller I’d be chucking you half the purchase cost back in the spirit of goodwill and then your both out of pocket equally. Can’t be any fairer than that.
What’s the seller saying?
I read the ad, it came across pretty genuine, though I thought it was overpriced. Being objective, an unscrupulous seller could know about a water leak and nurse the car with constant top ups but it seems unlikely.
I've had 3 HG failures over the years, and fixed them all myself. I don't think you will need a new engine, new head tops, take it to an independent and get a quote.
Was only a mile and a half or so from my place, so 5 mins
No overheating on dash temp gauge, expansion bottle was below minimum when I pulled up but not empty.
Dice was a really nice guy and I’m glad to hear that it could just have happened.
I’m hoping that the head won’t have cracked, as I’ve heard that that is a fairly common issue with these when they get hot.
I know the early 1.0 ecoboost had a design fault with one of the cooling hoses most have been replaced are you sure it’s not this that’s gone rather than the head gasket
if your anti freeze container is now a messy creamy like substance then your head gasket has definitely gone. These things do happen but be it a car, a watch or a cooker even bought off here then the same respect must be given to make sure both parties are happy. Get a quote and no doubt the seller will offer to split the bill as it would of happened to him anyway.
Every car could reasonably be described as mechanically good, until the moment they aren’t. And it would be difficult to delay/cover up what sounds like a catastrophic failure. Just bad luck unfortunately.
Regardless of engine replacement they are a pain to work on, it’s the way they are designed, just switching them out instead of repair. They love to be revved and can just go, with a turbo unit when it goes it’s never normally a slow death like naturally aspirated, they just blowOriginally Posted by BritishExpat
If I was the seller I’d offer half the cost of the repair to be honest, it’s the fairest way, I
Certainly don’t think there was any malice from what you’ve said
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I texted him yesterday explaining what had happened. I haven’t had a reply thus far.
Apparently this being the 7.5 it has the newer, redesigned pipe and I confirmed this with the seller. It seems to have lost compression as it won’t start.
Agree 100%, I’ve done my fair share of car work in the past and that’s my view on this one.
Just messaged a Ford tech and his words were throw the engine away.
Will insurance cover it, i.e. write off?
Thanks FFF, apparently they can and do warp the head and the block and can’t be repaired in a lot of cases.
I really don’t know what to do.
Never heard of insurance covering mechanical failure.
Try an additive first. Perhaps it will cure the leak. Small chance, but it's a cheap solution. If not, find another engine. This car is only 7 yrs old and all parts have only done 75K! So with a better engine, it can lead a second life.
As others have said, if you’d had a good quote from a reputable repairer than that’s the way forward.
This might be morally tough but just because you bought it via a SC post here rather than any other source doesn't help. It's always buyer beware with second hand cars from private sellers. How on earth can the seller know how/where it was driven once the deal was done. It might sound fair to be seeking 50/50 with the seller but that is above and beyond.
For those that want security when buying a car, get one from a dealer with all the facilities. Or have the one you want to buy thoroughly checked out if buying privately and don't have the knowledge. Assuming the thing was all clean and honest, it's just bad luck it fell over in your hands. In the two weeks you've owned it, have you ever checked the oil & water?
I've been working on my own cars for over 40 years. I just replaced the rear brake discs & pads on my daily driver. I absolutely can be sure that I did a better job than most garages would do. I took 3 times as long but everything was wire brushed, cleaned, lubed etc. I'm not sure why you think DIY "may or may not" be linked to problems. If the OP mentioned Kwit Fit, now you're talking.
If anyone buys a second hand car from me, the buck stops when you pull out of my driveway, that's just how it is with second hand stuff.
So sorry to hear this OP - is this problem the 'eco Pop' people in the trade refer to?
Not sure I understand all this new engine talk. Have you actually had anyone look at the car yet?
You say it didn’t appear to overheat, so there may not actually be any damage. Are you sure there isn’t a coolant hose leak/split? Did you notice before that the coolant level was ok? Any sign of oil in the coolant reservoir? (the old mayo/milky residue check). Have you tried checking for codes on a scanner (or find someone who has one) for clues? I think it’s worth doing a bit more diagnostics work before throwing money at an engine swap.
I agree with some of the other comments - if there was a known issue I’d be a little bit surprised if you could drive another 500 miles before it broke down.
Hi
No signs of hose leaks, still had some coolant in the expansion bottle. No Mayo on underside of oil filler cap or dipstick. Oil and water levels were fine.
I’ve not had the time to get a mechanic out yet due to work. I have described the symptoms to a couple of specialists and a trusted local mechanic and they have all prepared me for the worst. The fact that it won’t start but turns over leads me to suspect a compression issue.
These are small engines that run very hot apparently.
sold a lot of cars over my last 30 years in the motor trade,mostly "bought as seen" cheapies, but in the one case where something terminal happened shortly after purchase i took the car back and refunded the buyer.i didnt have to but i felt morally obliged and word soon gets around in a provincial town if you sell a bad 'un and dont want to know afterwards..hope you manage to get things sorted..
This thread reminds me why I’d never sell a car on SC.
+1, I thought exactly the same, selling cars to friends/ workmates can work out badly although I’ve done it in the past without giving it a second thought.
A car is a collection of mechanical and electrical systems that are prone to failures as the vehicle gets older, watches are far simpler although they’re (arguably) more challenging to work on.
OP has my sympathies although I think it v. unlikely the seller of the car was aware of any problems. Hopefully the engine and cylinder head haven’t incurred damage and can be fixed easily.
I’d not touch an ecoboost personally. But...
They aren’t known for head gaskets.
What they are known for is expansion bottles. If that cracked it would lead to steam and the antifreeze smell. If if continued to be driven, it’d wreck the engine.
Not saying that’s the case here but only offering a little pointer from my experience.
Hope you get it sorted.
Last edited by Dave O'Sullivan; 9th March 2021 at 22:40.
Yes that would be a very kind gesture but easier said than done! I sold an 11 year old van a few years ago. I owned it about 2 years and made sure it was serviced and well looked after. I sold it privately with 125,000 miles on it. About three weeks later the new owner got in touch with me and said the head gasket had gone. He was understandably peeved off and asked for a partial refund to help with the repair. I had to decline as I had already spent the money on my new (also secondhand, privately purchased) car. I felt bad for the lad, and I would love to have been able to help but I couldn't afford it and where do you drawer the line with a second hand car sold in good faith with a clear conscience?
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If you were selling "in the motor trade" then presumably you were legally as well as morally obliged to refund the buyer for a terminal failure?
I wouldn't assume the seller knew. I was selling a diesel focus a few years ago, it had been faultless throughout my ownership. Buyer paid, came to collect the next evening and it wouldn't start.
Gave him his cash back, and the bloody thing never started again, ended up scrapping it. No warning, no previous issues. High pressure fuel pump from memory.
Is the turbo water cooled on this model ? If so turbo failure may show white smoke and coolant smell ?
Cheers
Simon
Ralph Waldo Emerson: We ask for long life, but 'tis deep life, or noble moments that signify. Let the measure of time be spiritual, not mechanical.
Sorry to hear that. Sadly sounds like the usual reason this engine is known as the Ecoboom.
Yes it is and although unlikely to be the issue it’s not impossible that it’s feeding the engine coolant via the inlet
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Why not just get a leak down test done, then you can stop guessing what’s wrong with it or how bad it is
Not exactly something the average owner would know how to do.
He needs to find a local repairer who will work systematically to diagnose the fault, my money is still on a blown head gasket but I don’t understand the complexities of this engine so there may be other faults that fit the symptoms.
Difficult one for sure, if it was a cheap £500 use for the remainder of MOT type car then it’s to be be expected, but nigh on £3k it’s a lot of money to chuck away.
Let’s hope the seller responds to your text and you can work something out, thing is you’ve done over 500 miles and anything can happen in that timeframe.
Whenever I sell privately I always explain any faults and print off two sold as seen receipts for both myself and buyer to sign-date-time, it’s not about a concrete contract but it just puts it in writing that that once you leave my property the car is yours and all responsibility after that date and time is yours.
Hope you resolve it, I did fancy your X5 when you had that up for sale..
The legal side.
Private purchase:
For private purchases the phrase 'buyer beware' applies. Unless the private seller untruthfully answers any questions you've got about the car, they're not under any legal obligation to declare the condition of the car to you when buying and you won't be able to claim for repairs.
Sorry, but If the car had worked for me, I had had no problems with it, even if I had serviced it myself I would not refund on it.
Remember, the seller may have sold it because he/she needed the money.
I cant think of anything that would last 500 miles and then let go, it is unlikely that the failure has anything to do with the previous owner.
just sounds like bad luck to me, its one of the caveats of buying used mechanical items - its up to you to get an AA check or whatever done before you part with any cash.
I can understand how you must feel aggrieved, but a lot can happen after 530 miles, it’s not like it was immediately after purchase, if you didn’t notice anything wrong after 500 miles it’s unlikely the seller knew anything was going to happen, if someone had asked you after you had done 400 miles in it how it was going, you would probably said it’s great, no issues. I can’t see that the seller has any responsibility to be honest, it’s just very unlucky timing for you.
Cheers..
Jase
For those that are suggesting the seller should contribute as it was a forum what time period/milage should this warranty be offered for?
Unless evidence of what failed can be found coupled with maybe the fact it was an advisory on an mot that was said to have been addressed but wasn’t - then it’s just bad luck. Worth checking previous mot’s to see if any symptoms were evident that should have been mentioned
Good luck
Sorry to hear about this. I hope you can get it repaired soon but, as others have said, I don't think the seller has an obligation here. I bought a car once without test driving it and that didn't end either. I can feel your pain.
TBH, not many engine failure related faults will ever show up on an MOT which is essentially a safety not a condition check. I often read of people putting a car through an MOT as some sort of pre purchase inspection which is complete nonsense. Worth having 12 months (the tail end of a car's life most of the value in the vehicle is the MOT rather than a car) but there are loads of things that could be wrong which won't even be of interest to the Ministry's inspector.
nowadays yes but back then no.now i am retired i still sell the odd one if i know its history.i wouldnt sell an ecoboost.its been known to be a bad engine almost from the word go.its a shame because the engine it replaced the 4 cylinder 1.25 zetec.was a superb engine.i know of a couple of ex driving school cars running around happily with over 200k on the clock still on the original engine..
Last edited by greasemonkey; 10th March 2021 at 10:54. Reason: spelin
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