Yes, but you might not know of the second.Originally Posted by Maysie
Yes, agreed. My use of the word barrier was misleading and was used int the context of rolling a ball across the road. Even a small grass verge would constitute a barrier.
The main point however, is that two lanes each way doesn’t necessarily constitute a dual carriageway.
I suppose the simplest way to define it is some sort of physical separation between the traffic travelling in opposite directions.
It does still seem rather odd to allow traffic in opposite directions to travel 10mph faster than it otherwise could, just because it is separated by a foot of weeds!
Isn't there always a 'Dual Carriageway' sign too?
Funny isn't it - People here don't seem that clear on the difference either!
On my second SAC, this was bought up and most people thought it was a road with two lanes each way (or even two lanes one way - One of those weird 3 lane roads), but when it was explained and then some photos shown, most people still didn't recognize a dual carriageway unless it had two lanes on each side!
Some refused to accept that a dual carriageway with a crash barrier in the centre, but no grass reservation, was a dual carriageway.
It's hardly surprising that people sometimes feel aggrieved for getting nicked for speeding when the rules are somewhat esoteric.
43 in a 30, though? No, you knew what you were doing - The only argument could be that the 30MPH sign was obscured and you hadn't yet passed two street lights (I actually got stopped in this scenario back in the very early 1990s and let off, they were obviously more interested in drink drivers that night and breathalysed me, but I hadn't been drinking at all).
M
Breitling Cosmonaute 809 - What's not to like?
Yes - that is what the instructor was trying to point out. In some cases on our roads there are 4 lane carriageways but with no barrier between (probably white solid lines) which are classed as (technically still) Single carriageways - but are confused with Dual Carriageways as they have 4 lanes. On these carriageways without barriers central reservations and 2 lanes on each side the speed limit for single carriageway still applies (60mph for cars, light vans etc)
Starter for 10 - what is the speed limit here>
Last edited by MartynJC (UK); 2nd March 2021 at 18:30.
Sorry Martyn, I could blame auto spell but instead I’ll blame the idiot operating the keyboard!
In the picture, I’d say 30mph as I would assume that the limit is defined by the street lights as there is no other signage.
30mph.
Starter for 10 - what is the speed limit here>
R
Ignorance breeds Fear. Fear breeds Hatred. Hatred breeds Ignorance. Break the chain.
The criteria (as I understand it) for 30 mph limits is streetlighting, if streetlights are present the limit is 30mph by default unless signs displaying otherwise are present at intervals not exceeding a distance that I can’t remember. A 30 mph limit won’t have signs except at points where the speed limit changes. This catches people out, especially when driving in a strange area; you can be travelling on a 40mph road that changes to 30, if you miss the sign informing you of the change you continue at 40 till you realise you haven’t seen a 40mph repeater sign for a while.
With the best will in the world its not difficult to end up doing 40 in a 30 limit by mistake if you’re in a strange place, particularly when the speed limit changes from 30 to 40 then back again. There is a case for better signage in some areas to positively remind drivers of the 30 limit but it doesn’t work that way.
Unlike coppers, speed cameras can’t use discretion. As a young driver in the 70s I benefitted from a robust roadside discussion with two officers of the law who stopped me for driving too fast in the early hours of the morning, I’ve never forgotten it. They had me stood freezing at the side of the car in shirtsleeves, the driver of the patrol car administered a bollocking but decided to me off, then the other guy ( who was older) started; he informed me in no uncertain terms that if it was his decision I would've been done! Maybe it was a classic good cop/ bad cop performance but I certainly got the message and I mended my ways.
Speed cameras punish genuine errors, discretion is out if the equation, it could be argued that better signage should be displayed in some cases. That’s where the authorities fail in my view.
As for speed awareness courses, surely the folks who are well over the limit would benefit most? The logic seems flawed to me.
So obvious. It's 28mph!
43mph; there are no traffic lights to slow you down!Starter for 10 - what is the speed limit here>
There is discretion already 'built in'. Whilst it is Police Force dependant, West Yorkshire as an example enforce at the given limit plus 10% plus 3mph - for a 30 that is 36mph.
For those well over the limit the automatic use of points and fines has been removed and an attendance in court is required.
A guy I used to work with got done doing 66 in a 30mph - he went to court and was awarded 6 points and £1500 fine AND he was required to attend a speed awareness course.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
all to be understood whilst driving and looking for cameras,other road users etc,etc.I think everyone should do a refresher theory course any way,every 5/10 yrs because we do forget stuff
You are still not getting it ... you don’t have to look for cameras if you respect the speed limits.
And refresher course in :
the use of indicators and;
the use of a vehicle horn and;
the use of fog lamps and;
the use of lights at night in built up areas and;
the safe distance between vehicles and;
the stopping distances in differing road conditions
.
and the list could go on
oh yes - 30mph as it was a built up area - which means 43mph of course as no traffic
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
When I went on my speed awareness course. The instructor said that NSL doesn’t stand for national speed limit. It stands for No Street Lights.
He said as a rule of thumb No street lights means the speed limit is above 30, unless otherwise posted.
He also said that the only insurance company to ask about speed awareness courses, is Admiral, and they do load your premium. I was with Admiral at the time, and yes at renewal time it was on the form. I switched to another provider.
(tongue in cheek comment - but not for some drivers around Croydon area unfortunately)
Whilst there are street lights visible on the slope, if they continue to be above the cutting as the road progresses they will be difficult to spot for drivers on the road.
Starter for 10 - what is the speed limit here>
Lol 😉like it but you all missed the speed van on the left , if you were coming out of the tunnel and couldn’t yet see the street lights could have you think 40
- - - Updated - - -
You have 1 second to decide before your caught ... not easy is it if we are honest
You have 1 second to decide before your caught ... not easy is it if we are honest
3 minutes and 1 second?
M
Breitling Cosmonaute 809 - What's not to like?
The road lights illuminate both the approach and the departure of the underpass plus there's road lights inside it as well.
Of course if someone's concentrating on watching out for speed cameras they might not notice all that...
R
Ignorance breeds Fear. Fear breeds Hatred. Hatred breeds Ignorance. Break the chain.
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