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Thread: 6N: Wooden Spoon Nominations

  1. #1
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    6N: Wooden Spoon Nominations

    Anyone wanna nominate any team for the wooden spoon. It could rest on the book of great excuses.

    Jim

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    Decider next week with England v Italy

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    Grand Master RustyBin5's Avatar
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    Not often 11-6 could be described as a hammering but England were destroyed today. If they dont improve they will be down there.

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    Okay, thats 2 understandable nominations for England. Anyone else??

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    England were truly woefully today, the scoreline flattered them against what I thought were a quite majestic Scottish team. That said, I would take this as an aberration from England and we almost certainly won't see another performance like that from them this six nations.
    Can't see anyone but Italy having the wooden spoon...again.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruggertech View Post
    England were truly woefully today, the scoreline flattered them against what I thought were a quite majestic Scottish team. That said, I would take this as an aberration from England and we almost certainly won't see another performance like that from them this six nations.
    Can't see anyone but Italy having the wooden spoon...again.
    Youre probably right but for 5 nations, right now feels real sweet, almost like a broken chariot.

    Jim

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmcb View Post
    Youre probably right but for 5 nations, right now feels real sweet, almost like a broken chariot.

    Jim
    No arguement from me, don't think the wheels came off, more like they were'nt fitted in the first place ;)
    Think poor Italy will feel it next weekend when England will run out aiming to soothe their hurt though.
    And I truly fear for my team (Wales) against a smooth running and rightly confident Scotland.
    Last edited by Ruggertech; 6th February 2021 at 21:00.

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    Grand Master ryanb741's Avatar
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    I suspect England may well finish above Scotland when all is said and done. Scotland were immense today and would have caused problems to a full strength England but consistency has been the Achilles heel of Scotland teams past. Let's see. England certainly won't be worse than today but this defensive rugby has been dire since autumn.

    France to win the 6 nations at a canter IMHO

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    Like I said. Rinse and repeat.
    Last edited by ryanb741; 13th February 2021 at 19:54.

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    Good to see a resurgent France. Italy at the bottom as usual.

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    The wheels on the chariot go........... ah, fell off.
    Poor Owen needs a wee hug fae his maw.
    Unfortunately I still see Italy as favourites for the spoon.

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    England were truly awful. Sadly the spoon will go to Italy again.

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    On a serious note all of the 5 nations are capable of beating each other now so I can't see a grand slam for anyone.
    England looked ring rusty today and will face big tests against the other 3.
    Scotland's problem will be lack of strength in depth so weekly games really stretch our meagre resources.
    Cameron Redpath looks a real find though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hood View Post
    On a serious note all of the 5 nations are capable of beating each other now so I can't see a grand slam for anyone.
    England looked ring rusty today and will face big tests against the other 3.
    Scotland's problem will be lack of strength in depth so weekly games really stretch our meagre resources.
    Cameron Redpath looks a real find though.
    Pssssttt. There are 6 nations 😜😜

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    Enjoyed the game and result tremendously, but guys theres only 1 thing worse than a bad looser.

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    6N: Wooden Spoon Nominations

    Quote Originally Posted by numberjack View Post
    Enjoyed the game and result tremendously, but guys theres only 1 thing worse than a bad looser.
    A nation full of them?

    Joking aside is there a general 6 nations thread for this year? Couldnt see one.
    Last edited by RustyBin5; 6th February 2021 at 22:46.

  16. #16
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    Scotland were very good yesterday, the back row were fantastic. Red path looks to be a real find, his running style is kind of reminds of Guscott, effortless, Russell is still either brilliant or a liability.
    England looked like a team who had not played rugby in a while, very rusty and lack lustre. I have been saying big Billy should be dropped for a year now. He just does not look like an international 8. His work rate is too low, he is lazy (I would not say that to his face though). Compared to Fagerson in that game, it was night and day. Fagerson was all over the park and making hard yards, what did Billy do?
    I have played rugby all my life and I just don’t get the current box kicking game. I have always been coached that you keep hold of the pill, this means the opposition can’t score. If the backs can’t make ground get the big fat lads like me to rumble it up the park with pick and drive, working phases tires the defence. England used to be very good at 10 man game I have no idea what has happened.

    I do think England will improve they have too, they can’t get an worse, Italy for the Wooden Spoon but I would not be shocked if England are towards the bottom of the table after that performance.

    Well played Scotland!

  17. #17
    Master jukeboxs's Avatar
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    England, cos they're crap.

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    This is really funny doing rounds on social media

    Police in London have launched a major investigation after 15 young and inexperienced men were subject to a terrifying ordeal whilst out for a gentle kick about in the park . One shocked victim said 'It started in the 1st minute when they took the ball from us and wouldn't give us it back.". Police said the culprits were all Scottish, dressed in blue and showed no regard to the emotional impact on their victims who were subjected to 80 minutes of physical and mental abuse. Witnesses are requested to phone Crimestoppers anonymously at the earliest opportunity.
    🏉🏉🏉🏉🏉🏉🏉

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    As a Irishman I'm worried Ireland will finish pretty close to Italy, can't see where the wins will come from

    Farrel has made us steadily worse every year, a team full of 30 year olds past their sell by date

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    That was too close for comfort, well done to Ireland for taking it so close with 14 men, but their own fault for being a man down. I'll happily take the win.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmcb View Post
    Police in London have launched a major investigation after 15 young and inexperienced men were subject to a terrifying ordeal whilst out for a gentle kick about in the park . One shocked victim said 'It started in the 1st minute when they took the ball from us and wouldn't give us it back.". Police said the culprits were all Scottish, dressed in blue and showed no regard to the emotional impact on their victims who were subjected to 80 minutes of physical and mental abuse. Witnesses are requested to phone Crimestoppers anonymously at the earliest opportunity.
    🏉🏉🏉🏉🏉🏉🏉
    Apparently England thought they'd be breaking covid restrictions travelling to the Scottish half ;)

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chewitt13 View Post

    Farrel has made us steadily worse every year, a team full of 30 year olds past their sell by date
    Agreed, time for a change, from the perspective of someone who also wears green.

    I also think there should be a relegation system. Italy are barely competitive. Maybe give Georgia a chance.
    Last edited by gerrudd; 7th February 2021 at 19:53.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gerrudd View Post
    Agreed, time for a change, from the perspective of someone who also wears green.

    I also think there should be a relegation system. Italy are barely competitive. Maybe give Georgia a chance.
    I fear Georgia would be even worse. The Georgians play in 2nd division french rugby, at least the Italians play in the top level competition. I think a playoff between the top of the tier 2 championship and the Wooden spoon winners may be the way to go rather than straight relegation promotion. Something needs to be done to develop wider European rugby though. A combined North America Europe competition would be a good way to develop the sport.

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    Probably way wide of the mark but I see it as England were woeful and Scotland didn't take advantage proven by the score. England have the talent (though an aging team), just idiots for giving penalties away waaay too easily.

    To me it's france, irelend, then a toss up between England and Wales though I expect England to start turning up even with their injuries, Wales failed to dominate today. Scotland will start start strong but their general lack of stamina will tell, then its Italy obviously

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    Quote Originally Posted by subseastu View Post
    Probably way wide of the mark but I see it as England were woeful and Scotland didn't take advantage proven by the score. England have the talent (though an aging team), just idiots for giving penalties away waaay too easily.

    To me it's france, irelend, then a toss up between England and Wales though I expect England to start turning up even with their injuries, Wales failed to dominate today. Scotland will start start strong but their general lack of stamina will tell, then its Italy obviously

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    Lack of strength in depth of squad rather than lack of stamina I think. Scotlands fitness not in question recently.

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    If Scotland can stay injury free they should be challenging around the top, game being overshadowed in some places by a row over taking a knee ffs. Politics, religion etc have no place in sport, dont remember seeing any displays in the Pro14 this season.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chewitt13 View Post
    As a Irishman I'm worried Ireland will finish pretty close to Italy, can't see where the wins will come from

    Farrel has made us steadily worse every year, a team full of 30 year olds past their sell by date

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    I think that England actually have the youngest team (average age) in the 6 Nations??

  28. #28
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    Italy. But like many I want to talk about England! Theyve put in one performance of note in the last two years and the rest of the time theyve been absolutely turgid. I said two years ago at this stage of the 6N that they needed to get rid of Jones to free up the potential shown in the Premiership every week. I dont want to see England play to what Jones idea of an English team should play like. Theyve been doing that for years and moved not one inch forward.


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  29. #29
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    Eddie's cult of Sarries squad failed in every department against Scotland.
    They were rung-rusty and lethargic.
    We kicked all our possession to the best fullback in the world, then watched it sail back over our heads when he returned it with interest. Several times.
    No ball, no score.
    And England gave it back.
    From memory, we managed over 5 phases 3 or 4 times only. We did nothing to pull them out of shape before trying the kick, and the kick and chase never matched each other.
    We had one set of phases where the intensity rose in the first half, then Youngs flung a pss through everyone and the Scottish flyhack that resulted cost us another 60m. Bubble burst.
    Scotland played well, and have re-found their mojo against England, out-thinking them most of the time.
    And we let it happen.
    It was a very frustrating watch.
    WS will definitely be Italy (again), but I fear for England.

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    Scotland played England off the park tactically.

    England’s tactics in most recent years has been to bludgeon teams right from the start, and at speed. Score as many points as possible and break teams. Some end up disillusioned and reeling from the battering.

    Scotland ran away from them on Saturday and didn’t engage in the battle of size and bulk as they’d never win that and therefore run the risk of on-field, in-match injuries and so highlighting a shortness in depth or quality from the bench.

    When the Scots tactic was apparent Farrell showed, again, a real naivety and inexperience as a leader and captain who knows how to change a game mid flow. Scotland ate that up and worked it fully. Look at Farrell’s face in post match interview. I’m sure the wasp he swallowed will come out with a sting in his tail.

    England were out fought tactically and also in terms of savvy rugby playing style by a team determined to put one over them. And how!

    Jim
    Last edited by Jimmcb; 8th February 2021 at 22:56.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lughugger View Post
    Italy. But like many I want to talk about England! Theyve put in one performance of note in the last two years and the rest of the time theyve been absolutely turgid. I said two years ago at this stage of the 6N that they needed to get rid of Jones to free up the potential shown in the Premiership every week. I dont want to see England play to what Jones idea of an English team should play like. Theyve been doing that for years and moved not one inch forward.


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    I thought England were very Impressive against Ireland in last yrs 6 nations.
    Brutal defence and physicality-let Ireland have territory and possession so they could dominate them in the tackle.
    Maybe not box office but I thought England would do the same to us on Saturday.

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    Anyone want to talk about todays games and that it looks like Italy will get the wooden spoon.

    Jim

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmcb View Post
    Anyone want to talk about todays games and that it looks like Italy will get the wooden spoon.

    Jim
    England were dire.
    Italy were worse.

    Congratulations Wales on a triple crown.

    I think that covers it.

  34. #34
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    I thought England played well in parts. Discipline was poor. Wales deserved the win.

    The referee though - Sweet Jesus.

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    England were improved from previous weeks but dear god they need to keep the penalty count down, giving away so many shows how rusty the players are, you cant have the core of your team not currently playing domestic rugby.
    Wales were worthy winners, fans could debate the 2 tries to the end of time, but Wales won by more than14 so its a moot point.

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    I dont think you can underestimate the damage those first two tries did and how they heaped the pressure on the England players leading to the penalties.

    A potential epic game ruined by a ref who loved the sound of his own whistle.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinnlover View Post
    England were improved from previous weeks but dear god they need to keep the penalty count down, giving away so many shows how rusty the players are, you cant have the core of your team not currently playing domestic rugby.
    Wales were worthy winners, fans could debate the 2 tries to the end of time, but Wales won by more than14 so its a moot point.
    Indeed, England certainly turned up this week, but the penalty count, 5 from Itoje alone! England were very fortunate he didn't see yellow. You cannot win international matches with that sort of discipline.
    Adams' first try was definitely good, that exact scenario has definitely worked the other way in the past. The 'knock on' try was dubious at best, but yes, would only have made a difference to the scoreline not the result if disallowed.
    England did incredibly well to reach parity at 24-24 playing some lovely attacking rugby we struggled to contain, and indeed didn't, but then threw it all away with a series of silly kickable penalties and conceding a try, nearly two. And that is where it was lost for them, not the first two tries. It was a thoroughly deserved win for the team that was smarter, more streetwise, disciplined (only just disciplined, but enough), and hungry.
    Last edited by Ruggertech; 28th February 2021 at 11:59.

  38. #38
    Grand Master RustyBin5's Avatar
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    Its a sad day when an England team losing 40 points to Wales and conceding 41 yes 41 penalties in their first 3 games, are still being described as playing well and turning up.

    Frankly this is the worst England team I can remember seeing. For me it stems from one thing, lack of discipline. The penalty count is making rugby impossible for them. They hand the ball to the opposition over and over again, adding pressure to themselves, gifting points and territory and just shooting the selves in the foot. As a Scotland fan it looks very familiar to many Scottish teams Ive watched.

  39. #39
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    Theyve had this indiscipline for a number of years now.

    They dont seem to have a leader on the field who can reign it in.

    Is anyone else getting tired of the game being over-referreed?

    It seems like each year we are getting more stoppages and the game is morphing into the NFL!

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    All these rules really spoil rugby. It badly needs to be simplified if it's going to gain more popularity. Made the game yesterday unwatchable to the casual spectator.

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  41. #41
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    A game appears over refereed when England is on the receiving end.
    I agree with lack of leadership. Farrell is great when it comes to kicking the ball over the post but is no captain material. Where is a Johnno when you need one?
    'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.

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    I agree with a lack of leadership from England
    There is no stand out person that can read the game and ref and grab the team buy the neck to change things when they are not going to plan. I would actually welcome some of the shoe in players being rested for a game or two, Big billy looked a bit more dynamic but his fitness is nowhere near good enough and he still goes missing, he is running too high and teams have worked him out, the back row looked much more balanced during his absence in the World Cup.
    Daley is far from the best fullback in England and his defence is woeful, The team has really relied on Manu as well. There is no direct option without him so you have to use guile and make the ball do the work, Farrell is not the 12 to make that happen.
    The game has changed an awful lot since I first started playing and not for the better in some incidences. The man in the middle is under orders to keep the game flowing and crack down hard on infringements which is fine, the problem is the break down is only enforced by the the ref and there is little consistency in the interpretation of the laws. back in my day when I first played the ruck was a ruck, if you did not roll away someone used you to clean their boots. This resulted in few infringements and quicker ball (I am old with too many blows to the head so I am likely wrong on that count)
    Whilst my playing is limited to vets rugby now I find the new laws have taken some to the fun from playing the game and the laws have not really improved player safety which is the main aim. Concussion is still an issue at every level and the techniques to remove the jackal have resulted in some horrid injuries as we have seen lately and as I can attest to, it’s how I did my knee a couple of years ago.
    Last edited by Sinnlover; 28th February 2021 at 12:50.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinnlover View Post
    I agree with a lack of leadership from England
    There is no stand out person that can read the game and ref and grab the team buy the neck to change things when they are not going to plan. I would actually welcome some of the shoe in players being rested for a game or two, Big billy looked a bit more dynamic but his fitness is nowhere near good enough and he still goes missing, he is running too high and teams have worked him out, the back row looked much more balanced during his absence in the World Cup.
    Daley is far from the best fullback in England and his defence is woeful, The team has really relied on Manu as well. There is no direct option without him so you have to use guile and make the ball do the work, Farrell is not the 12 to make that happen.
    The game has changed an awful lot since I first started playing and not for the better in some incidences. The man in the middle is under orders to keep the game flowing and crack down hard on infringements which is fine, the problem is the break down is only enforced by the the ref and there is little consistency in the interpretation of the laws. back in my day when I first played the ruck was a ruck, if you did not roll away someone used you to clean their boots. This resulted in few infringements and quicker ball (I am old with too many blows to the head so I am likely wrong on that count)
    Whilst my playing is limited to vets rugby now I find the new laws have taken some to the fun from playing the game and the laws have not really improved player safety which is the main aim. Concussion is still an issue at every level and the techniques to remove the jackal have resulted in some horrid injuries as we have seen lately and as I can attest to, it’s how I did my knee a couple of years ago.
    I've got a mate who now lives in Oz. He played in the late 90s at a high level. England 18s etc. He is telling us he has issues from concussions etc. Leaving his car somewhere and having no recollection etc. Scary

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  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by rdesouza View Post
    I've got a mate who now lives in Oz. He played in the late 90s at a high level. England 18s etc. He is telling us he has issues from concussions etc. Leaving his car somewhere and having no recollection etc. Scary

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    My best mate suffers a bit, he played Prop he gave up around 30 because he was getting knocked out every other game
    I have always played back row or lock, luckily I am thick so there has not been much of an appreciable change...

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinnlover View Post
    My best mate suffers a bit, he played Prop he gave up around 30 because he was getting knocked out every other game
    I have always played back row or lock, luckily I am thick so there has not been much of an appreciable change...
    He tells me when they played if you got a knock it was see as weakness as not carrying on and playing and thus affected your chances of selection. He played with the ex player taking the authorities to court.

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  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by rdesouza View Post
    All these rules really spoil rugby. It badly needs to be simplified if it's going to gain more popularity. Made the game yesterday unwatchable to the casual spectator.

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    Agree on this. Referees are taking a lot of the enjoyment from the game.

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by rdesouza View Post
    He tells me when they played if you got a knock it was see as weakness as not carrying on and playing and thus affected your chances of selection. He played with the ex player taking the authorities to court.

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    That is true. If you got a knock you (I) used to hide from the Ref because he would force you off the field if he felt you were concussed
    Pour some water over your head and get on with it. I fractured my skull at about 17/18. Went to bed that night and didn’t wake up, woke up in A&E
    The doctor told me to take 6 weeks off and monitor my symptoms. I played in the final 2 weeks later. I did buy a scrum cap though.
    Anyhoo back to how bad England are...

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saint-Just View Post
    A game appears over refereed when England is on the receiving end...


    Yesterday, England found themselves on the wrong side of the decisions; as did Italy in their match. I suspect that the Italians won't be happy with the ref's performance either.

    Breakdown, lineout & offside penalties now appear arbitrary.

    (I'm a Scotland supporter, so well used to the vagaries of referees!)
    ______

    ​Jim.

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saint-Just View Post
    A game appears over refereed when England is on the receiving end.
    I agree with lack of leadership. Farrell is great when it comes to kicking the ball over the post but is no captain material. Where is a Johnno when you need one?
    I don't mean when England play; I mean the game in general.

  50. #50
    Grand Master Saint-Just's Avatar
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    I wasnt aiming my quip at you although I agree it appears that way. But there was a time when people accepted that ref make mistakes, and are also instructed to referee a certain way. And every time England falls on the wrong side of the ref, he comes under fire.
    The game is what it is. A lot of changes are made to improve safety of the players and flow of the game; they do not always work, and will be changed... eventually.
    'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.

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