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Thread: Ebay is there any point in Auctions any more?

  1. #1

    Ebay is there any point in Auctions any more?

    My wife decided to bid on an item, She bided the highest amount yet didn't win the auction, it appears someone using software won the item because they bided earlier, yet only show at the end of the auction, if correct there really is no point.

    Her screen said that she was the highest bidder when the auction finished

    5***9(943feedback score: 943) £210.00 28 Oct 2020 at 1:23:32PM GMT
    s***7(197feedback score: 197) £210.00 28 Oct 2020 at 1:23:49PM GMT
    s***7(197feedback score: 197) £200.00 28 Oct 2020 at 1:23:30PM GMT
    2***k(1478feedback score: 1478) £190.00 28 Oct 2020 at 1:19:48PM GMT
    2***k(1478feedback score: 1478) £180.00 28 Oct 2020 at 1:15:23PM GMT
    6***0(394feedback score: 394) £176.67 25 Oct 2020 at 2:32:18PM GMT
    r***2(145feedback score: 145) £163.00 27 Oct 2020 at 6:16:18PM GMT
    6***0(394feedback score: 394) £157.67 21 Oct 2020 at 9:34:55PM BST
    a***h(27feedback score: 27) £156.00 27 Oct 2020 at 11:33:15AM GMT
    2***k(1478feedback score: 1478) £149.00 24 Oct 2020 at 4:44:49PM BST
    3***9(2feedback score: 2) £145.00 24 Oct 2020 at 4:38:31PM BST
    3***9(2feedback score: 2) £138.00 24 Oct 2020 at 4:37:29PM BST
    3***9(2feedback score: 2) £119.00 24 Oct 2020 at 4:37:01PM BST
    Starting price £99.00

  2. #2
    Master Christian's Avatar
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    Yes, I'm not sure whats going on there...I would have assumed if £210 was her limit, the sniper couldn't have got it for £210 as she would have been the first bidder at that amount. I can't work out why his later bid of the same amount wins it.

  3. #3
    Master
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    Are you saying your wife is 2***7 and 5***9 won it? If so, looks like they bid 17 seconds before your wife. Their bid may not have immediately shown up due to either a software lag at Ebay's end, or a signal lag at yours.

    Sent from my SM-A105FN using Tapatalk

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Christian View Post
    Yes, I'm not sure what's going on there...I would have assumed if £210 was her limit, the sniper couldn't have got it for £210 as she would have been the first bidder at that amount. I can't work out why his later bid of the same amount wins it.
    she is the second two on the list, the sniper could have put his bid in a week before yet the time shows as 1:23;32 but didn't show whilst the auction was in progress and she was being told that she was the highest bidder.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Ruggertech View Post
    Are you saying your wife is 2***7 and 5***9 won it? If so, looks like they bid 17 seconds before your wife. Their bid may not have immediately shown up due to either a software lag at Ebay's end, or a signal lag at yours.

    Sent from my SM-A105FN using Tapatalk
    I was watching it on my screen at work as well, it definitely wasn't there.

  6. #6
    Master Onelasttime's Avatar
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    If I want an item Iíll put in the highest price Iím prepared to pay about 10 seconds before auction ends. Sometimes I get lucky, sometimes someone has put a higher bid in before me.

    The highest bid could have been placed as soon as the auction started, but it wouldnít show until the auction ended, when it either wins or gets beaten by someone doing the same.

  7. #7
    Master
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    ebay is full of cheating sadly, it is a haven for scum bags

  8. #8
    Master RustyBin5's Avatar
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    Itís someone putting their max bid and unless you outbid them you lose. Ebay will auto bid up to their limit. Itís fair enough tbh.

  9. #9
    Grand Master Wallasey Runner's Avatar
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    No. I list everything as buy it now and negotiate with interested buyers. Even sold a watch the other week that ended up in the new incoming section on here. It was quite funny, the buyer had no idea he had bought from someone on here. I didn't list on here as there is little appetite for buying watches on here these days. If only I had been selling an old jacket or a broken phone it would have been well worth while

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by RustyBin5 View Post
    It’s someone putting their max bid and unless you outbid them you lose. Ebay will auto bid up to their limit. It’s fair enough tbh.
    But it not Fair enough when Ebay are telling you that you are the highest bidder and you're not

    Well actually you are because you haven't been outbid.

  11. #11
    Grand Master Dave+63's Avatar
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    It looks like a last minute bid seventeen seconds before your wifeís last minute bid. It doesnít look like an early bid or it would constantly show that they were the higher bidder. It also doesnít look late enough to be a snipe.

    There certainly doesnít look to be anything amiss though, the other bidder bid £210 seventeen seconds before your wife did.

  12. #12
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    Surely if a sniper submitted a bid at the last second or two, ebay have a moral responsibility to the seller to secure the highest price and thus surely a delay of say 30 seconds should be allowed for anyone else to out bid the sniper. The rule of thumb is that the highest bidder wins.

    I would be an unhappy bunny if was the seller.

  13. #13
    Grand Master Dave+63's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    But it not Fair enough when Ebay are telling you that you are the highest bidder and you're not

    Well actually you are because you haven't been outbid.
    She was highest bidder with her £200 bid until the £210 bid came in.

  14. #14
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave+63 View Post
    It looks like a last minute bid seventeen seconds before your wifeís last minute bid. It doesnít look like an early bid or it would constantly show that they were the higher bidder. It also doesnít look late enough to be a snipe.

    There certainly doesnít look to be anything amiss though, the other bidder bid £210 seventeen seconds before your wife did.
    That's my take on it exactly.

    Sent from my SM-A105FN using Tapatalk

  15. #15
    Grand Master oldoakknives's Avatar
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    Unfortunately the other bidder made a bid for the same amount as your wife but 17 seconds earlier. Up until that time your wife was the highest bidder.

    In future try adding say 85p to your bid. People often bid in round numbers and a few pence on top often wins the day. If your wife had bid £210.01 she would have won.
    ďThe more I learn about people, the more I like my dog.Ē

  16. #16
    Master PhilipK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldoakknives View Post
    Unfortunately the other bidder made a bid for the same amount as your wife but 17 seconds earlier. Up until that time your wife was the highest bidder.

    In future try adding say 85p to your bid. People often bid in round numbers and a few pence on top often wins the day. If your wife had bid £210.01 she would have won.
    This ^^^

    It clearly says in the T's&C's that if two bidders place the same bid, then the earlier one wins. In this case somebody else (either in person or using sniping software - you'll never know which) bid £210 before your wife did.

    The notification on screen saying that your wife had won was probably just a glitch on eBay's part while it was sorting the winning notifications out.

  17. #17
    Grand Master GraniteQuarry's Avatar
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    The other bidder could've bid £300, your bid of £210 simply did not top the sitting higher bid.

    Effectively the hammer price at auction is the SECOND highest bid.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Dave+63 View Post
    It looks like a last minute bid seventeen seconds before your wifeís last minute bid. It doesnít look like an early bid or it would constantly show that they were the higher bidder. It also doesnít look late enough to be a snipe.

    There certainly doesnít look to be anything amiss though, the other bidder bid £210 seventeen seconds before your wife did.
    When you click on automated bids that one is highlighted

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by PhilipK View Post
    This ^^^

    It clearly says in the T's&C's that if two bidders place the same bid, then the earlier one wins. In this case somebody else (either in person or using sniping software - you'll never know which) bid £210 before your wife did.

    The notification on screen saying that your wife had won was probably just a glitch on eBay's part while it was sorting the winning notifications out.
    You can highlight Automated bids, that was the only one that was highlighted, it didn't say she had Won, it said that she was the highest bidder at the end of the auction, if it hadn't said this she would have put a higher bid in.

  20. #20
    Master PhilipK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mick P View Post
    Surely if a sniper submitted a bid at the last second or two, ebay have a moral responsibility to the seller to secure the highest price and thus surely a delay of say 30 seconds should be allowed for anyone else to out bid the sniper. The rule of thumb is that the highest bidder wins.
    That might apply to a traditional "going, going, gone" auction, but not to a modified Vickrey auction like eBay.

    Think of it as "best and final sealed bids by the ending time" - with the highest (or, in the event of a tie, the earliest) bid winning.

  21. #21
    Master PhilipK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GraniteQuarry View Post
    The other bidder could've bid £300, your bid of £210 simply did not top the sitting higher bid.

    Effectively the hammer price at auction is the SECOND highest bid.
    If the other bidder had bid £300 before the OP's wife, then they would have shown as winning at £205 (as £5 is the bid increment at that level, and the previous winning amount was £200). The OP's wife would then have had her £210 bid accepted, and the other bidder would have won at £215. So their maximum bid could only have been £210.

    Also - the final price is determined by the second highest bid, but is (usually) one bid increment above it.

  22. #22
    Master PhilipK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    if it hadn't said this she would have put a higher bid in.
    That's not how to bid on eBay. You should never normally place more than one bid on an auction (bar, possibly, for BIN stomping) and that bid should be for the maximum that you would be happy paying for the item. It also should be placed as late as possible (hence most snipers use somewhere around 5 seconds before auction end) - while this potentially exposes you to a small chance of another bidder placing the exact same bid some time before you, you can try to mitigate it by bidding in odd amounts.

  23. #23
    Grand Master
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    That's what I do too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Onelasttime View Post
    If I want an item Iíll put in the highest price Iím prepared to pay about 10 seconds before auction ends. Sometimes I get lucky, sometimes someone has put a higher bid in before me.

    The highest bid could have been placed as soon as the auction started, but it wouldnít show until the auction ended, when it either wins or gets beaten by someone doing the same.

  24. #24
    Master mondie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wallasey Runner View Post
    No. I list everything as buy it now and negotiate with interested buyers. Even sold a watch the other week that ended up in the new incoming section on here. It was quite funny, the buyer had no idea he had bought from someone on here. I didn't list on here as there is little appetite for buying watches on here these days. If only I had been selling an old jacket or a broken phone it would have been well worth while
    An Eddie perchance?

  25. #25
    Craftsman
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    I hardly ever sell on ebay and the only things I might sell there are things I want to get rid of. I always list as an auction starting at 99p and any money I get is a bonus. You'd be surprised how much hassle even that is. For example, the last thing I sold was a 7 ft long kids slide - to avoid it going to the tip. Clearly marked as collection only, post code provided. The first time round, the 'winning' bidder asked me post it having clearly not even read the description. The second time, the winner said I was too far to collect. No word of apology from either.

  26. #26
    Craftsman Kevin's Avatar
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    There has only ever been one way to bid on Ebay
    (I have been typing this mantra on various forums for 20 years)

    Bid Once
    Bid Late
    Bid Your Max

    Although 20 years ago with no sniping software and dial up connections it seemed more fun!
    Last edited by Kevin; 28th October 2020 at 22:06.

  27. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
    There has only ever been one way to bid on Ebay
    (I have been typing this mantra on various forums for 20 years)

    Bid Once
    Bid Late
    Bid Your Max

    Although 20 years ago with no sniping software and dial up connections it seemed more fun!
    Did you actually read the first post?

  28. #28
    Journeyman
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    Makes no sense, blows any strategies out of the water?!

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    You can highlight Automated bids, that was the only one that was highlighted, it didn't say she had Won, it said that she was the highest bidder at the end of the auction, if it hadn't said this she would have put a higher bid in.
    I would agreed with the others here, the £210 max bid came in before your wife's. What made your wife bid £210, at £200 she would have been the highest bidder but then must have received an outbid notification, then bid £210?

  30. #30
    Master PhilipK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    Did you actually read the first post?
    Well, to be fair he said:
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
    Bid Your Max
    and you had previously said:
    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    it said that she was the highest bidder at the end of the auction, if it hadn't said this she would have put a higher bid in.
    so obviously she had not bid the maximum that she was willing to. Had your wife done so, she would have won the auction.

  31. #31
    Master
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    I always bid in the last two or three seconds precisely so as not to allow any time to react. Bidding at any other point is just forcing the price up. I always work out the maximum I'm prepared to pay and bid that, even if it is hundreds of pounds above the current price. If it goes for less great.

    I wouldn't sell on ebay but ninety percent of the watches I own have come from there. I treat it as just like going fishing and enjoy every aspect of it. Which is perhaps a bit odd.

  32. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Captaincook View Post
    I would agreed with the others here, the £210 max bid came in before your wife's. What made your wife bid £210, at £200 she would have been the highest bidder but then must have received an outbid notification, then bid £210?
    If she had done that it would have refused her bid, even I know that, she put the second bid in With 20 seconds to go, just to make sure, lots of people do that, throughout it told her she was the highest bidder.

  33. #33
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhilipK View Post
    Well, to be fair he said:

    and you had previously said:

    so obviously she had not bid the maximum that she was willing to. Had your wife done so, she would have won the auction.
    *may* have won the auction. No one ever knows what the other guy bids.

    I once bid £1000 on an item that was at £50 with a few minutes left. I expected it would reach £100-150 in the final flurry, but I was determined it would be mine. It ended at £105, but had i won it at £1000 Iíd have been happy.

  34. #34
    Master PhilipK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    If she had done that it would have refused her bid, even I know that
    No, eBay wouldn't have refused it. As the bid increment at £200 is £5, you wife's £200 bid would have been beaten - at £205 - by the bidder who won. eBay would still have accepted a £210 bid for your wife at that point, but it was beaten by the fact that the winner had placed his bid earlier.

    Quote Originally Posted by demonloop View Post
    *may* have won the auction. No one ever knows what the other guy bids.
    In this case, as the auction was won at £210 with 2 different bidders at £210, we know for certain that the winner had only bid £210, and had the OP's wife bid any higher - even £210.01 - she would have won the auction.

  35. #35
    Craftsman Kevin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    Did you actually read the first post?
    Yes, I did. It is astonishing that people still don't understand how ebay works, it has been around long enough.

    There are threads like this every few weeks.

    If you bid your max and don't win then someone wanted it more than you. I find it makes you stop and think about how much you really are prepared to pay and stops you getting in to bidding wars. As a seller I love to see people active and pushing the price up, funnily enough they rarely win
    Last edited by Kevin; 29th October 2020 at 00:50.

  36. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
    Yes, I did. It is astonishing that people still don't understand how ebay works, it has been around long enough.

    There are threads like this every few weeks.

    If you bid your max and don't win then someone wanted it more than you. I find it makes you stop and think about how much you really are prepared to pay and stops you getting in to bidding wars. As a seller I love to see people active and pushing the price up, funnily enough they rarely win
    Iíll try again for the hard of thinking, it said she was the highest bidder, the other bid was not shown at the end of the auction, itís like winning an auction in a sale room, and then afterward the auctioneer popping over and saying, well we decided to give it to another bidder.

    I am remembering why I donít use ebay, I just told her to pop into curryís and get a new one

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
    Yes, I did. It is astonishing that people still don't understand how ebay works, it has been around long enough.

    There are threads like this every few weeks.

    If you bid your max and don't win then someone wanted it more than you. I find it makes you stop and think about how much you really are prepared to pay and stops you getting in to bidding wars. As a seller I love to see people active and pushing the price up, funnily enough they rarely win
    Iíll try again for the hard of thinking, it said she was the highest bidder, the other bid was not shown at the end of the auction, itís like winning an auction in a sale room, and then afterward the auctioneer popping over and saying, well we decided to give it to another bidder.

    I am remembering why I donít use ebay, I just told her to pop into curryís and get a new one

  37. #37
    Master PhilipK's Avatar
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    Sigh. Let's go through this slowly for you. I've put the last 3 bids (the only ones that matter) in chronological order. Your wife's bids in green; the winner's bid in red.

    s***7(197feedback score: 197) £200.00 28 Oct 2020 at 1:23:30PM GMT
    At this point, your wife is the highest bidder at £200.

    5***9(943feedback score: 943) £210.00 28 Oct 2020 at 1:23:32PM GMT
    A new bidder has now bid £210. They are showing as highest bidder at £205 (£200 + one bid increment of £5)

    s***7(197feedback score: 197) £210.00 28 Oct 2020 at 1:23:49PM GMT
    Your wife bids £210, which eBay accepts (as it is higher than the currently showing highest bid). She is joint "highest bidder"; however, eBay's rules say that in this situation the earlier bid wins, so the auction winner is the other bidder.

    eBay is operating exactly as it is meant to. The problem is that you/your wife don't appear to understand this and made the error of not only placing multiple bids on the item, but also not bidding the maximum that you were prepared to pay.

  38. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by PhilipK View Post
    Sigh. Let's go through this slowly for you. I've put the last 3 bids (the only ones that matter) in chronological order. Your wife's bids in green; the winner's bid in red.

    s***7(197feedback score: 197) £200.00 28 Oct 2020 at 1:23:30PM GMT
    At this point, your wife is the highest bidder at £200.

    5***9(943feedback score: 943) £210.00 28 Oct 2020 at 1:23:32PM GMT
    A new bidder has now bid £210. They are showing as highest bidder at £205 (£200 + one bid increment of £5)

    s***7(197feedback score: 197) £210.00 28 Oct 2020 at 1:23:49PM GMT
    Your wife bids £210, which eBay accepts (as it is higher than the currently showing highest bid). She is joint "highest bidder"; however, eBay's rules say that in this situation the earlier bid wins, so the auction winner is the other bidder.

    eBay is operating exactly as it is meant to. The problem is that you/your wife don't appear to understand this and made the error of not only placing multiple bids on the item, but also not bidding the maximum that you were prepared to pay.
    Sorry, where are they showing a bid of £205?

  39. #39
    Grand Master Dave+63's Avatar
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    Ebay is there any point in Auctions any more?

    She probably wonít have noticed the £205 bid price as sheíll have been in the screen to increase her bid. The £205 will have been viewable from two seconds after she placed her £200 bid, for 17 seconds until the £210 bid was showing.

    The £210 would then show until the auction end, however long that may have been.

    Are you saying that the listing was showing her £210 bid with her as the highest bidder? If so, that would indicate a software glitch.
    Last edited by Dave+63; 29th October 2020 at 12:30.

  40. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Dave+63 View Post
    She probably wonít have noticed the £205 bid price as sheíll have been in the screen to increase her bid. The £205 will have been viewable from two seconds after she placed her £200 bid, for 17 seconds until the £210 bid was showing.

    The £210 would then show until the auction end, however long that may have been.

    Are you saying that the listing was showing her £210 bid with her as the highest bidder? If so, that would indicate a software glitch.
    Exactly

  41. #41
    Master RLE's Avatar
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    I donít think the increments are limited to £5.00. I was bidding on a old RC car the other day and the revision of the outbid notice was current bid £180, bid £190.

  42. #42
    Master PhilipK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RLE View Post
    I donít think the increments are limited to £5.00. I was bidding on a old RC car the other day and the revision of the outbid notice was current bid £180, bid £190.
    According to https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/buying/b...idding?id=4014 bid increments in the range £150.00 to £299.99 are £5. It's only at £300 and above that they go to £10.

    (Note that - as well as being the amount that the proxy bidding systems uses to determine how much to bid - one bid increment is the minimum amount above the currently showing highest bid that you can place your bid. eBay will often try to encourage you to place a higher bid, which I guess is what happened in your case).

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