Reply With QuoteWhat is their hourly rate?Originally Posted by adrianw
I would be amazed if anyone could beat this, I just had our Sprinter MOT'd at the Mercedes main truck dealer, the front shocks were supposedly leaking so I authorised them to change them, when I had time I checked what was involved, There are five bolts, two are optional depending on how a cable is routed, but lets say five, it works out that they charged £50 per bolt (and I assume they had rattle guns) they then charged £189 to do the tracking, which doesn't actually need doing if they marked the camber bolts. Never ever again, Have now found a local independent.
If you thing I'm exaggerating https://www.google.co.uk/search?sour...eigQaT_4fQAw37
What is their hourly rate?
I thought most dealers provide a quote before doing the work, mine certainly does.
The horse bolted right there!
Sure I have mentioned them before, but I used to use an Independent in Edinburgh (since folded) - who employed the best Mercedes/BMW/Audi mechanics from the area, because they poached them from the main dealers by paying them sig more than the MDs. They still managed to charge 50% of main dealer rates, and sourced the OEM parts from the part maker, not from the Cars’ maker.
Basically - they didn’t have to pay for grand premises, good looking women in the service department (as no man will argue over a bill with a good looking female who ‘strokes’ him).
They had all the diagnostic equipment and I never found them to inflate the work required.
Not sure why they disappeared - Perhaps the advent of PCPs?
Go to Eastern Mercedes and you got the “We’ve done this for you Mr G***, and we’ve done this for you Mr G***” (never mentioning that they have charged like a wounded buffalo, for doing it)
The main dealers might be finding it tough just now, and milking the customers they have.
I should have explained, it had to be back on the road with an MOT today, and they know it
It sort of became irrelevant, as they said it books 1.5 hours per side, and that can't be right,
I also didn't mention that i expressed my displeasure and asked how they can justify their pricing, explaining exactly what they had to do, they reduced the bill by 33%
Has to be £130+ (before VAT)?
I’d be quite comfortable accusing them of fraud, and stating my impressions online.
What you have described is the MO of quickfit outfits.
A final thought: Offer to underpay them to the same amount as they have overcharged? On the basis that they have tried it on, and if the only recourse is that they revert to the proper amount - then they lose nothing in trying, which might work for a fair percentage of customers.
Yes, that is a fine way to keep customers loyal and on board,,, NOT!!!
Our local LR dealer just quoted a (new!!) customer of ours replacement discs and pads all round on their Discovery Sport. Take away the parts and they were trying to charge them £240 per hour which to be fair did include the VAT
Sounds like they are trying to recuperate monies lost in lockdown to me... not good.
The Mrs recently took her year old Toyota for it's first service and they'd charged an extra £70 for a wheel alignment. Surely it should have been aligned when it left the dealers when new and miraculously no kerb marks on the wheels after a year.
Then one of her colleagues took her Renault for it's first service, same dealer but different franchise and she also got hit with a wheel alignment bill.
I think Rod hit the nail on the head and they're also maximising profits before the predicted recession hits.
Ah LR pricings!!
years ago after a service on the Landy they told me my pads could do with changing, cost would be £420+vat, I was renovating a property at the time and near it was a parts store, I enquiries at the cost of the pads £54 inc for all wheels!!, 2 hours later using the emergency jack I had changed the lot............never been to an AD since.
It will get worse with all the electronics, battery management etc. You'll end up having to go to the main dealer.
I had to bend over at BMW for a spark plug service on my 750i a few years ago... £269 to change 8 spark plugs and reset a service interval counter in the computer seemed a bit excessive. Must have taken them all of 15 minutes.
Christ, down my way they do the tracking for FREE if you buy a couple of tires or about £10 - £15 if you dont.
I took my Vivaro in for an interim service just before the 3 year warranty was up. I was advised my drop links were worn and would need replacing . All done under warranty so no dramas. Fast forward approx 8,000 miles at my major service and I was advised my drop links were worn and would need replacing .
The video emailed to me was by the same guy who had done the first one .
I queried it with the service manager who immediately backtracked claiming it was an honest mistake .
True, but imagine all the diagnostics running and only the main dealers able to sort out codes, resetting etc, especially when everything is electronic and computer controlled. It will get rid of dodgy brake pad changes etc, but will be so specialised that the home mechanic will be at a loss, and many so called specialist garages will be made redundant or dodgy like the street grarge type places.
Similar story, took my VW for a supplying dealer service after their service package ended, advised at the ‘health check the console bushes needed replacing, (£400 ) took it to my indie and he laughed and said they all say that, had a look and they were fine. I took it for a MOT at my local VW not long after and their ‘health check’ was clear. Robbing sods.
Also, I was quoted £250 by VW to have a ABS speed sensor replaced on it, I’ve sourced a OEM one for £30 and my indie said it will less than a hour to fit.
Last edited by JasonM; 22nd September 2020 at 15:56.
The cynic in me suspects that condition based servicing has removed the opportunity to try the brake pad/disc scam so they have to be more creative!
I would never give the go ahead without a written quote, Cart Blanche to charge a phone number figure, we always gave quotes for all jobs and where possible with oe and aftermarket part options, Kia main dealer btw.
No good words for main dealers here either.
2008 V70 with FMDSH, pollen filter invoiced 3 times, i changed it and it was minging, dated 07
Fiat Doblo Van first service at Barnsley Main dealer,air filter £27 on the invoice, i changed it last week, was changed but for a Crosland item same as i put in, 5 quid and an ECP exclusive.
2014 XJL 5.0 air filters invoiced twice and still original.
BMW are no better,
The only thing they are good at is invoicing and everybody is fully trained on the card machine.
Do they do it by sight with a hammer?
Dumb comment
Honda wanted £190 to change 4 plugs in my son’s 2005 Civic Type R. Did it himself.
I had a Volvo XC60 which had its first few services done by a dealer local to my work under a service pack scheme.
Once the pack had run out I had the next service done elsewhere as the price the original dealer quoted was ridiculous. The second dealer called me and told me they would need to do the cam-belt (I think it was) as it was due to be done at the previous service and hadn't been. I went fairly mental and in the end Volvo UK paid for it as a "goodwill gesture". Someone somewhere was lying and I'm reasonably confident it wasn't the second dealer...I remember the attitude of the service manager at the first dealer wound me up and in hindsight I should have trusted my instincts...
Just had a “ b” service on my MB GLC it’s a lease so main dealer £530.00for what was essentially oil,filters,brake fluid and a check over oh sorry forgot battery in the key.
However in the video i was sent one of the tyres had had a puncture in its centre and the service manager said it’s not something to worrry about keep your money in your pocket no need to replace it.
I am waiting for the day i go to a MD service and am asked what’s your preference regular KY or baby oil, sir
Last edited by mart broad; 22nd September 2020 at 18:04.
I FEEL LIKE I'M DIAGONALLY PARKED IN A PARALLEL UNIVERSE
They did mine free.Our local LR dealer just quoted a (new!!) customer of ours replacement discs and pads all round on their Discovery Sport. Take away the parts and they were trying to charge them £240 per hour which to be fair did include the VAT
When I had my old Honda Accord, 3 years on the trot they said the front brake pads need changing, 3rd year I queried this and the story I got back was there was a mixup between percentage worn and left. After arguing they gave me a refund for the previous years change of pads but I had to argue as they considered it a genuine mistake.
Hi Adrian, might want to double check if they do commercial vehicles but PMW Chelmsford are a fantastic Mercedes, BMW, VAG, Porsche (German car) specialist without the main dealer prices. Worth a look, or even CARS Chelmsford who are superb. All the best. Darren
As a main dealer of 32 years ....retired last year....i saw this charging stuff occurring more and more very shortsighted approach...
Its essentially driven by several factors/ pressures..
Manufacturers are loading dealers with demand for new kit and training on a weekly basis to a stupid extent the training bill for an average sized dealership can run upto £ 1’000 a week when you factor in cost of course (run by manufacturer)..hotel costs and fuel and thats before you lose a tech for 3 days = 24 hours non chargable.....(dont book the course mandated get charged anyway or terminated)...
You all need a new engine hoist £4500 each x 500 dealers “but we have a hoist and the one you want to autoship is £2750 from xyz”.....” its on its way the debit hits Monday”....
You need 3 x 65 inch flat screen TV’s in the showroom ....”eh”.....to show 24/7 videos of our product driving through a desert ...you need them and the new accompanying furniture within 60 days “its only £ 35’000 from our in-house supplier”....don’t order it get terminated.....
And thats before you factor in dealerships are selling new product at losses driven by manufacturers insane ever increasing targets and the Carwow effect as they charge the dealerships £350 per sale ....essentially sell the right number each quarter and you get a per unit bonus to back fill the losses miss it your screwed and thats before the interest bill on 1m of stock and a 10k-20k write down on demos and courtesy cars each month..
Soooo..whats a dealership to do ?....well sadly there are 3 remaining areas they can still make money to try to break even or make a profit...
Finance .....Buisiness managers will sell you finance / GAP / tyre protection / paint protection / etc etc....until your both exhausted..
Used car dept ....yes still a profit source but increasingly burried under pre-reg cars taxed to hit the previous quarters target!
Service ....ah service (aftersales) ....it carries the can / burden ...we used to look for 70% absorption of overheads by aftersales now its close to 100% ...the maths is done by the grown ups they look at what the service dept needs to deliver to achieve the ‘number’ then backwards divide it to work out a ‘charge out rate’.....then go and tell the Service Manager his new rate is £ 200 per hour!! Or circa £ 350’000 per tech per year or double that of a brain surgeon...utter insanity...
And as the service dept slowly gets quieter as customers look and find cheaper alternatives....the grown ups fix the 10% hole in the budget by you guessed it putting the rates up 10% “ our new rate is £ 220 effective October 1st...oh ffs.....
“Maybe we reduces the rates and attract more lost customers back”? “Don’t be ridiculous we would lose money”...
“You can sheer a sheep every year - you can only skin it once”.....
Last edited by TKH; 23rd September 2020 at 09:38.
An interesting breakdown - thanks.
I hasten to add just like every industry there are huge variations in approach taken but needless to say some of the behaviour of the big PLC's is eye watering...
Interesting read, if you had a bill for £600 and the dealer said it was X parts and 2 hours labour you might well question it, but if they said its £600 with the same X parts but 5 hours labour you would probabley see the sense in the cost of hours.
Now I dont know if dealers can "adjust" the hours but I dont see any difference in that to saying your tracking needs doing when it doesn't, its fraud and not much different to charging an elderly person £600 to cut their grass.
Im not certain, but don't dealer jobs have 'book' hours? A camshaft change is 8 hours, brakes 2 hours, that sort of thing? The trick then is to get the techs to beat the book to start something else and get ahead of the billable hours.
Cheers..
Jase
Hi Jase
yes your absolutely right each job (98%) have a set allocated time or ICME time, many times a Tech will take 6.5 hours to do a 8 hour job if he or she has done same job previously and hence quicker many times a tech will take 10 hours to do the same job if they hit (rusty nuts) but customer will be charged at the 8 hours .....one of the techs was efficient the other not ...swings and roundabouts ...this is where a good workshop controller allocates the right job to the right tech (another long subject) FFF knows what i mean.
The issue is really the charge out rates 'Charge per hour' which varies wildly....and is in many cases extortionate ...it's worth shopping around every time work is required...
Thanks, makes sense.
Cheers..
Jase
“
You need 3 x 65 inch flat screen TV’s in the showroom ....”eh”.....to show 24/7 videos of our product driving through a desert ...you need them and the new accompanying furniture within 60 days “its only £ 35’000 from our in-house supplier”....don’t order it get terminated.....”
A major Citroen dealership near me when i visited had just had their main customer waiting area refurbished and the service managers comment was “ we did not have a choice it is Citroen policy all we do i pay for this overpriced junk” or you the customer does.
I FEEL LIKE I'M DIAGONALLY PARKED IN A PARALLEL UNIVERSE
MOT booked for today, main VW dealer, I had a call to say the ‘health check’ picked up a cut on the inside of a tyre so he wouldn’t be putting it to MOT and he didn’t have one in stock, I asked if he could put the spare on for the MOT, he said he could but it would depend on it being a full size ( of course) , I told him it was a full size , are you sure? says he. “Yes” I said, he sounded surprised I knew. Then the upselling, whilst the health check was all clear, he couldn’t find a record of the brake fluid being changed, also the service is due in 3k so shall we do it now, the cambelt is due for a change due to age, not miles etc etc. I declined all work and just asked for the MOT to happen please, he sounded a bit miffed. The next time I will decline their ‘complimentary’ health check. Pain in the arse, just do the fekking job it’s booked in for please.
Cheers..
Jase
They’ve got a duty of care, well that’s what they’ll tell you on the guise of flogging rubbish.
My local Nissan dealer mentioned a 'grumble' from one hub on my X-Trail - on the 'health check' Nothing critical yet.
Got two new tyres fitted at a tyrefitters 3m later, and they also mentioned the grumble and quoted around the same to change the bearing.
Got it changed at the Nissan Dealer, where they advised that the price was 'if it all goes to plan, but these have been known to be problematic'
They have now done 2 of the bearings, and despite the caveat they gave before the first one - they have gone to plan and they have not 'created' additional costs.
I have every confidence in them.
I just picked up my car, I sort of felt a bit sorry for them in the end, again the guy who was doing my paperwork was pushing for the work to be booked, I didn’t bite, he then offered me 0% finance on a service package and the work, I still declined and he gave up, on the walk to the car I asked how business was going and he said it was pretty dire, there is huge pressure to get work booked in as there is hardly any, the staff have been pared to the bare minimum and the financials are looked at daily.
Cheers..
Jase
Is a functional/safe spare wheel or repair kit not part of the MOT? I might be imagining that it used to be?
Last year my local Jaguar dealer insisted my car was due a cambelt change , I questioned it but they insisted that it was needed and could be a very expensive repair on my car if it was to fail , they even had the cheek to argue the point when I pointed out it had a cam chain rather than belt and they only need doing every 100k
My mum took her VW Polo into the local dealer for a service , she has a plan but they pointed out she needed to pay for an air con regas and they lose pressure over time , fair point but this is a 1 year old car with 4000 miles on it !
I do feel for genuine business' who serve the public and look after their customers, but pre-covid any business that takes the P and dont really care about their customer, i don't have any sympathy for the business (obviously its a shame for the staff who will ultimately lose out).
This should be a wake up call for some business owners.
I don’t know if the dealers are that quiet at the moment, I tried to book my e-tron in for service today as I got a warning message about a faulty rear light and number plate light and they said the earliest they could look at it was 7th January!
Sent from my iPhone using TZ-UK mobile app
Apparently not, that was a question I asked on the phone call but he said it was ok. I was surprised too.
Cheers..
Jase
If there is a spare wheel present, it gets tested. If there isn’t one, it can’t be tested.
In the OP’s case, the spare was being used as a normal wheel.
https://www.gov.uk/government/public...cked-at-an-mot
Spare wheels and tyres are not inspected.
Last edited by Kingstepper; 5th November 2020 at 23:51.
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