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Very sorry to hear of this, I would PM Haywood and ask if he can help to put them on the stolen register?
It's a long story but two of my watches have been stolen by deception by someone I thought I could trust. It turns out the guy is a career con man and I am the tip of the ice berg with the amount of companies and people he owes money to.
The watches were stolen near Alicante in Spain where I am currently living, the person in question is dutch and although he is wanted in the Netherlands as well I have a feeling the watches may have made their way back there or my lawyer (who knows of this guy) said they will have been sold blackmarket and could pop up anywhere!
2020 SUBMARINER DATE - FULL SET
PURCHASE JUNE FROM GOLDSMITHS NEWCASTLE, UK.
SERIAL: 94PE1254
2020 GMT BLNR
PURCHASE JUNE FROM GOLDSMITHS NEWCASTLE, UK.
SERIAL: 57U3W461
Large reward for the return of the watches, I suspect I will never see them again but trying to get the numbers out there so hopefully no one buys them unknowingly.
If people could share this it would be appreciated.
Very sorry to hear of this, I would PM Haywood and ask if he can help to put them on the stolen register?
Good idea, my father actually purchased his Daytona from Haywood so fingers crossed he can help!Originally Posted by Snoodles
I have everything crossed they will appear in the future but not holding my breath.
How sad, do you mind letting us know how they were stolen? May help others getting in the same trap...
Hope you are covered by insurance or manage to recover them.
Its a very long story and I cant give all the info as of yet but this guy wont affect anyone online or the UK.
He works in person on the Costa Blanca (and probably other Spanish towns), he was actually a neighbour of mine and we became quite friendly, he's in to watches, cars etc and put on a good show driving around in his Ferrari, X6, Sl500 which is all part of the plan.
We agreed a deal and things turned sour but the watches had already gone (I was paid via transfer in person but he must have cancelled the minute he left), he kept in touch with me and came to my home again to make the payment, apologised and never once avoided me or my calls. This went on for a couple of weeks before I really started putting the pressure on and then he vanished! In the words of my lawyer 'the guy is like a magician, he gets what he can and then 'bang' he's gone'
Turns out after speaking to locals and my lawyer he is well known, he will put on this front of wealth but in reality he has nothing and almost everything is stolen whether that be cars, furniture, jewellery or anything of value. One shop is owed over 50k.
I run my own company and have done for 8 years, we often get people trying to pull a fast one but this guy was another level. In fact the criminal law firm I am using are actually owed money by him for a previous case.
If anyone is in the region just be careful of a dutch guy in his mid 50's, his real name is Abraham but he might give you a fake name. He also has a 'driver' with him 80% of the time but this guy is in fact basically a body guard.
You live and learn from your mistakes, it's a costly one and bitter pill to swallow but they might show up one day even if that is 10-20 years down the line if they go to Rolex for a service.
very sad to hear your news I hope that you either get recovery or insurance will assist...
reminds me of 'Dirty Rotten Scoundrels'....sadly these types really do exist and they have incredible skills and unbelievable neck / confidence and seemingly zero fear of capture.
fingers crossed for a positive outcome..
Spanish law isn't great hence why he seems to pop up here and there scamming people every few months.
Speaking to my lawyer as a friend he said realistically we can take it to criminal court who will start the process against him, however now he has vanished and no one knows where he is the process could take a few years to even find him (if they can) and bring him to court, the costs would be over 5k but on the upside as he has previous convictions he will end up behind bars and for fraud it could approx 5 years.
I am 99% sure they will never find him, he isn't dumb and probably has a new identity after his last run of scams. He is already known by different names in the area.
The confidence and zero sh*ts given by him though is astonishing, nothing but a rat and I am sure he will get whats coming to him as I have heard through the grapevine some people aren't going the legal route, unfortunately my fiance (who is pregnant) is worrying as this guy has been in our home and she doesn't want any backlash but he 100% deserves what he gets and I agree with anyone going down this route, its the only way to affect people like him.
Sorry to hear that. I hope this guy gets what is coming to him. Also dont blame yourself, these guys are unreal, we had a Walter Mitty at work a number of years ago who fooled everyone for over a year. We all had it figured out after the event, once he was long gone.
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Its maybe worth putting your info onto the Dutch Rolex forum if you think they might end up there.
Sorry to hear about this-sickening.
I thought once a bank transfer was done then it couldn't be reversed without your permission.
- - - Updated - - -
He was a class act and this was on going for the majority of 2020 so not a quick overnight job.
As his account was in holland and transferring to my EU account I presume there must be a window to cancel, stupidly I should have waited but he was my neighbour who I seen almost everyday after all!!
Thanks for the heads up on the dutch Rolex forum, I have just found the below if that was the one you were referring to?
https://www.rolexforum.nl/
Yeh that's the one.
This is simply wrong. Even many of the banks' own staff don't realise it, but the crooks certainly do. Most types of bank payment CAN and WILL be reversed under the right circumstances. People's faith in the system is quite misplaced, as I have warned here previously.
H
Sometimes what looks like a bank transfer is really a standing order which can be cancelled/reversed. I've been told by my bank when confirming receipt of funds BACS payments can be reversed but CHAPS and Faster Payments can't unless the account holder claims fraud. Depends on the method of transfer.
I always call the bank and ask if the money is in and cleared, and if there are any circumstances where the money could be claimed back.
Really sorry to hear about the situation OP. Must be a nightmare.
I regret that I now leave my tz-uk inbox full, as it was increasingly being filled each day with supererogatory demands for help with the most mundane or silly things, such as "what are your current views on the GMT as an investment vs the Submariner," "I'd like a full explanation of LV bezels please, immediately, because I cannot be 4rsed to post in open forum and expect you to give me your time at once," or "from these 57 pictures, will you just check over this £100,000 vintage piece for me, that I'm buying from another dealer?"
If you make contact through the miltonaires website and mention me by name, they can filter out what needs to reach me.
A very irritating loss, but there is more chance of your watches surfacing than you seem to fear, albeit that it may indeed be in years to come. Getting the numbers out there and on the main registers is vital. Will be happy to help.
H
Last edited by Haywood_Milton; 7th September 2020 at 12:06.
......and there you go. BACS, CHAPS and Faster Payments or Bill Payments can all be reversed and you're left with no more than a burning bum.
Banks are cr4p.
[QUOTE=Haywood_Milton;5525319]This is simply wrong. Even many of the banks' own staff don't realise it, but the crooks certainly do. Most types of bank payment CAN and WILL be reversed under the right circumstances. People's faith in the system is quite misplaced, as I have warned here previousl
So is there no foolproof method?
Or is there a time period where it cant be reversed?
Last edited by Hood; 7th September 2020 at 12:26.
Just to say that forum has a lost and stolen section also.
[QUOTE=Hood;5525337]It seems that way nowadays! Sad world we live in. I actually don’t know how to sell high value items anymore. I have sold bikes and cars in the past via banks transfer and never really thought about reversals.
Does anyone have the safe answer? Cash payment within the bank I suppose?
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Thanks everyone, appreciate the help and advice given.
I might have your email from a couple of years ago Haywood (my dad purchased his 116520 from your Chester shop) but if not I will send an email via your site.
Really hoping they appear one day, I guess its just a waiting game to see if they do pop up somewhere!
Message received and I will try to respond when not in office. H
Ugh, I hate reading this. Really sorry it happened to you.
I always value my watches when I want to move on at trade value and drive to Davidsw or another top grey knowing I can accept 85% of market value better than a 100% loss.
Not even sure there is a safe way to sell privately anymore. In your case, I would have definitely felt comfortable selling it to a neighbor and would have been scammed just as you were. One day, he will be caught as it sounds like the ground is sinking beneath him based on his international reputation.
I do hope you get your watches back, or at a minimum, this guy gets the justice he deserves.
Do keep us posted.
It does make you think twice selling privately, there is that many scammers and 'watch traders' popping up in that sector it's crazy.
I have a few people spreading the word now so fingers crossed no one buys them unknowingly and loses out in the future.
Absolutely disgusting.
I am glad nothing serious happened and I really hope you'll get your watches back at some point...
Unfortunately, someone buying your watches unknowingly is probably the only way that you will get them back.
The only other option is the police catching up with this guy and him still having them which is far less likely it seems.
Both these watches need to go back to a national Rolex service centre for things like a new glass, bezel pip etc. That is where many stolen watches come to light.Unfortunately, someone buying your watches unknowingly is probably the only way that you will get them back.
The only other option is the police catching up with this guy and him still having them which is far less likely it seems.
I presume if that day comes (fingers crossed) Rolex will simply take control of the watches and contact my self to verify address etc and then return them?
Does it also cover international, so if the watch was sent to Rolex in Spain would it still flag up?
It must also be terrible for people on the other end who have purchased stolen watches unknowingly, sending them for a service and them never coming back!
If I remember correctly, believe the law is different in Holland and they can become the property of an unknowing buyer.
And this character does have a Dutch connection...
That was the point I was making H. An unknowing buyer would be more likely to send it back to Rolex for a service or other work (and therefore be discovered/recovered) than the guy who stole them.
Quick bump up on this.
The watches are still missing and I was contacted by a third party last year (another scam but not watch related) via this post so its good to keep it active in case someone comes across either of the watches in the future, I am actively looking on Chrono24, eBay etc and the watches are reported stolen with Rolex, ALR and a few more so if anyone has/is offered the watches they are very hot to handle.
The guy who stolen them is now in jail for other scams, including scamming a guy in Belgium for a Daytona and selling him fake watches. He was the last guy to see my watches in October 2020, in fact I am told this guy purchased the BLNR as part of the deal but he is playing dumb and no one will help (he is a retired hobbyist/watch trader, if any traders in Belgium see this and can help PM me).
https://www.abc.es/espana/comunidad-...mNt6R0q5MiKJUE
Since this post I have spoken to about 10-15 other victims throughout Europe so the above is the very very tip of the iceberg, the scams range from high value property, cars (mercedes, Ferraris, Bentleys.) , jewellery, cash and other items (even a brand new jet ski was confiscated, he had no use for it and never use it but scammed/stole it!).
Realistically the scumbag will walk free mid 2023 I am told by the police in Belgium and Holland his term was 30months (not 10y) and he has served part of it while awaiting trial, he is serving time in jail in Belgium now and then he has 12 months to do in Holland where he apparently over over 1million euros from scams/thefts. This is likely where my watches are, his family are gypsies and apparently he does the leg work and most things get fed back to his family!
Spain are useless and its very likely nothing will happen here, we had him on video call in court but he wormed his way out of it and it was meant to be rearranged. Since then he has been moved to Belgium, soon to NL and it adds to the paper chase which Spain dont seem to want to do.
If anyone can help PM me on here, I am always active and will be long term. There is a large reward for the return of them and no questions asked!
Just wondering what the time limit on funds being recalled
24hours?
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This is really shocking sorry to hear you've had to go through this! Like others, I always thought bank transfers were irreversible.....this in itself is very worrying!
Thanks guys. Almost 2 years later and its still a kick in the b*lls!
As his payment was from a dutch bank to my UK bank I would expect it to be different from a normal transfer and probably has a bigger window to reverse it. Like many people I didn't know you could do this.
I have my fingers crossed they show up one day and they are reported on just about every platform possible, its just if the thief has sold them on already or if there sat somewhere with many other luxury items he's stolen.
I was told his sister in Holland is sat on a fortune, piles of luxury clothing, jewellery and much more so they might pop up in NL at some point, I check Chrono24 a few times a week in case they come up on there.
The guy is due to be released from the jail in Belgium this month (might have already happened) and then he will be moved to Holland for other scams but should be out later this year and I will put my life on the matter that he will be back to it.
This is his and his families career, doing the odd year or two in jail is just part of the job and its never stopped him before.
The only upside is that I have been told he scammed a few 'not so friendly' Russians and some similar Dutch people before he went down so his release from jail might not go as easy as he planned and I think its been tough when he's been in there... but thats another story!
Just a quick bump up on this to keep the advert fresh incase anyone offered the watches comes across it.
The BLNR popped up on Chrono24 last year but due to terrible handling by C24 and the police it was gone but it was still in Holland.
So both still missing... If anyone comes across this post when researching the watch/es send me a message.
They are reported with multiple police forces, Rolex and across all stolen watch platforms.
Another update to keep this thread alive incase a potential buyer/owner of the watches comes across it. Both watches are still missing however...
I was recently contacted by a lawyer in the Hague who needed some information from me to help his case against the person who stolen these from me (he has a mountain of other victims in Holland and my info was going to help). After sending what he needed we got on to my case and how I had been let down by C24 and the dutch police last year, he immediately didn't think this sounded right and after meeting with some colleagues agreed to help me based on civil actions.
The plan was to contact the person who was selling the watch on C24 and by law he had to provide us with the info of the seller within 14 days of receiving a strongly written letter from the lawyers firm, if he did not comply or was lying we could then step forward and try to claim money/or the watch, as we would have grounds that he did not act in good faith when buying (his argument was he paid approx market value and was not aware).. Fast forward 10 days, we received a reply from him stating he had returned the watch to the 'dealer' for a refund when he found out it was stolen and if we wanted any other info we were to contact the police, which we did and were able to get the 'dealer'/sellers name and info. He was not helpful really and I think he purchased this below market value which is why he did not want to proceed with anything as it would come light he paid less.
We repeated the above, sent a letter to the dealer demanding info or the watch, if they were not to comply we would proceed with legal proceedings. We waited the 14 days and nothing (we have proof it was delivered and signed for), so the next step was for my lawyer to call him on the off chance and see what was going on. The dealer, after doing some digging is a home based seller in Eindhoven, with a company which was stricken off due to being inactive, he has no website, phone number, profile or nothing at all online. We mentioned his name to some Rolex networks/grey dealers in Holland and none of the main guys knew him so we figured something was off from the start. This is his legit name though, not a fake one as it was verified legally by my lawyer, he is just completely off the radar.
This 'dealer' told us he can not remember taking the watch, where it went, what he paid or anything. He point blank refused to help and told my lawyer he's not scared of the police and if we want to sue him then go for it. He apparently has a wife who is worth a fortune, he deals in watches worth 200k+ and has a close clientele of buyers so he does not need to advertise any of his stock online or work with any other dealers. All the usual BS you hear from these type of people.
We did some more digging after that and some Rolex grey dealers we know passed his name around their network and it turns out he's well known for this type of thing..
There is no point in going after this guy legally, fees would mount up and he wont care if he's found guilty and a judge might not even take on the case as its on the border or legal/civil matters (advised by my lawyer too). So chances are the guy who stole them passed them to this guy, he's sold them and had one returned which has likely been re-sold again.. If this dealer had been legit then we were so close to getting the GMT back.
*** His details are: Marcel Preiss and he lives and works in Eindhoven. If anyone comes across this and can help then send me a message on here, you can also see info on the Rolexforums.NL among other sites when searching for the serial numbers**
The search continues but I will always keep putting pressure on these as I am confident they will pop up at one point.
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