Reply With QuoteWhat a measured response from Seth. Good on him. Dealing with muppets like the OP must be utterly draining.
The list just gets longer and longer.
+2Originally Posted by Chris_in_the_UK
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What a measured response from Seth. Good on him. Dealing with muppets like the OP must be utterly draining.
The list just gets longer and longer.
Haha you guys are amusing...
Well as unbelievable as it may be, I don't live on TZ and have been driving the all afternoon along with family time and now introducing a springer and a cat though I don't have to justify myself on here. But some of you get twitchy if no reply from the OP is within 10minutes.
Ok lets address some issues.
Yes its always good to have 2 sides of an argument
Yes ive seen seths responce and what i can say to that is well, he has something to protect and preserve... his business. I have nothing but im honest and i have my integrity.
Some of those points from.seth are in fact incorrect and funnily enough i have proof in a long chain of emails.
Here are a couple of points from me.
At the time seth offered 2 single links for the jubilee, we were in fact talking about the president thus out of context.
To which i did not accept or decline as i just wanted my bracelets back and not have to deal with or wait any longer with increasing frustrations.
I sent him my jubilee with 2 single links as i remember screwing them together. Basically the simple mistake seth did with the jubilee was to attatch a removable link to a fixed link thus now creating a double.
His reasoning was whats the problem? It fits right? You can adjust it on the clasp
That's not really the point though and a shoddy excuse.
Ref the VAT issue.
Seth emailed me a price of £130 for the jubilee and £300 for the president was his quote on the phone. At no point did i give a budget of price to stick to. Those were his prices , not my suggestions.
Once the invoice was recieved there was near £100 extra for VAT on which wasnt factored in in seths quote.
Normally quotes that do not say 'excluding VAT' are including VAT.
No shame for questioning why this was not mentioned and not wanting to pay if this was not part of my factored costs.
This was seths mistake which eventually he admitted and we came to meet in the middle.
Its not difficult to see the pictures of before and after that clearly there is damage to the bark links
My camera isnt great at macro on my phone but it seems, now that i have the bracelet not to accuse but seth may have polished the 2 links on the bark president to cover up the damage marks slightly but they can still be seen with the naked eye and looking at the side it does look over polished as the curve to the links is well... less curved.
Regards to the chap commenting on one of my posts from another thread...
Haha thats worse than my mrs bringing up stuff from 4 years ago!
Its a completely different situation.
Paying for specialist services vs paying a decent price for a well looked after vintage watch
If im paying a 'specialist' with over 20 years of experience, thats what i expected... not for someone to make careless mistakes and have an attitude for asking questions or sending emails...
Forgive me for making that assumption haha
Anymore points to address?
Liam
70 emails?!
I find it hard to believe after dealing with Seth for 7 years on plenty occasions that you sent him to 2 separate links and he replaced with a double jubilee link which funny enough comes on the bracelet for your GMT lol
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Im not sure of how many but I know aprox 5 emails were from me asking for a tracking number! To which evenually had a reply with an incorrect number... reinforces my points of customer service and attention to detail
Wether its 30 emails in total, 70 emails in total or 1000 emails in total.
If i have questions to ask or clarify. Whats the issue?
The amount of emails would be reduced significantly if seth actually had responded in good time with relevant info, not emails like '£130' regards seth.
That in itself created a number of emails and hassle over the added VAT issue.
A simple addition of 'plus VAT' would eliveiate that.
Other email chain was regarding the links... again could be solved fairly simply.
Plus more...
If you had read and understood, he didnt replace anything. The links are all there, just in the wrong orientation.
1 of the 2 seperate links is fixed now via a pinned link thus creating a double link.
So now rather than having 2 seperate links, i have 1 seperate link and 1 double link which would be a mistake from repinning a fixed link not designed to be removed to a removable link.
talking rubbish you making it all up that bracelet has double links and one screw end of wont reply to this thread again
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The issue is 70 emails, it's absolutely nuts. If you don't see that then you're absolutely nuts too. Your entire rant stinks and has "champagne taste with beer money" written all over it.
I've read all I need to read. I would happily deal with Seth, definitely not with the OP.
This
I’ve had countless dealings with Seth over the years op if he’s as bad as what you say he is how on earth is he still in business?I’m not sure vintage is for you?perhaps you need to buy new?unfortunately any vat registered business has to charge vat not sure which planet you are on good luck finding someone to sort your woes.
Why would i need to make it up?
Clearly you know more about my bracelet than i do :)
Its not 70 emails.
Even if it was, look at my previous and understand most emails were follow ups due to serths poor communication/ lack of information provided.
It was like trying to get blood out of a stone
Price has a lot to do with it, along with convenience in the UK.
Ahh ok so tell me you'd be all cool when you get a quote of £2000 to fully overhaul your president and then when the bill comes, heres another £400 that you weren't expecting...
Yeah i dont think anyone would be happy.
Last edited by Liam1288; 28th August 2020 at 09:06.
This thread is a perfect example of why most of us don’t air any disputes in public.
I don’t know what the OP hoped to gain from doing so but, I think its fair to say, it has done him no favours at all.
This alone tells me all I need to know about the OP.
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I hope you do....
I know exactly why you're all taking side of seth, because he has something to offer and when the time comes we want to save money and send work to him.
Which is fair enough.
Just know what to expect
I don't blow smoke up peoples arses. If someone has done something incorrect, i let them know.
Its the only way to move forward and learn.
People make mistakes.
Its only got this far due to his attitude on emails and on the phone in an un- professional manner.
No matter what happens, you don't loose your cool.
Yes he may have lots of custom but nobody really know if its private based from people who care about the outcome/ condition of their items or from the trade wanting to tart up a bracelet and sell on with a watch
If thats the case, the trader won't be so bothered and sell it on regardless.
Most private people wont know there is such thing as a bracelet repairer or dismiss the idea due to speculative price.
The bracelets are better yes. Though attentionn to detail is a fundamental and he just doesn't have it in my opinion.
I certainly would't want to send in a watch for service there
I was hoping for advice what to do/where to go...
Doesn't bother me favours or no favours.
Things like this shouldnt be kept in the dark, people need to know realtime reviews and experiences.
I think you have made your point but most people on the forum disagree with your opinion.
The way I see it you have a couple of options. Accept its an old bracelet that is now better than before, send it to someone else who 'may' do a better job or purchase a new bracelet.
Yes seems thay way.
Though i think its possibly my lack of decorum or my diplomacy they dont agree with.
I still stand by my points and will always feel the same way about paying someone... 'a specialist' be it watch repairs or vehicle painter, you want specialist outcome.
Price has nothing to do with it as its the price that was quoted though if someone said 'its £300 (where others are quoting £600) but ill do a naff job' id walk away.
Im sure most would.
I disagree , your vendetta hasn’t worked now you look foolish . End of
Hmm I must remember that when I take my car to the garage is all I have to say I didn’t realise you charge vat do you think they would leave it off if I complained?perhaps you should try Tesco’s if you are after convenience and an all inclusive price as I’m sure you’ve got as much chance as them helping you as you would if you went back to Seth
Out of context and not the same comparrison.
If tescos, a garage or anyone else tells you a price, thats what you expect to pay with the price inclusive of VAT so your point is flawed
Unless someone gives you a price saying excluding VAT...
Its principal to be informed
Im not a mind reader.
Last edited by Liam1288; 28th August 2020 at 11:00.
More than welcome to disagree.
Foolish or not, its my experience of the service provided.
I don't wish to copy and paste all the emails as proof, i dont need to justify anything.
I know i'm being honest in myself, I wouldn't have gone this far if I was not confident there were issues and mistakes in the finished product.
To be fair to the OP I would expect an estimate to be inclusive of VAT but wouldn’t give anything else much credence.
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Nope, you misunderstood my comment. I have no intention of sending stuff to Seth because I have no need for his services. I just think you sound like a complete and utter nightmare to deal with...the kind of person that has totally unreasonable expectations.
I always smile when I read about people saying how a small business didn't spend enough time replying to their constant e-mails. These people are often working very hard and time is precious to try to get things done, especially when they are working on restoration and repair. More and more people these days seem a bit too needy and self important when it comes to complaining. Probably a result of years of 'the customer is always right' bullshine.
Given the amount of good feedback I think I would be happy to use the business in question.
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
Agree. It's now law to quote consumers the total end price inc VAT so all businesses should be doing that. You can only quote "+ VAT" or the pre tax amount to businesses.
That's exactly where I stand on this one.
Last week I phoned to book my car in for a service and was advised what it would cost me. The invoice showed a complete breakdown of parts, labour and VAT, and the amount I paid was exactly what they quoted me over the phone.
As to everything else the OP has posted....
Best Regards - Peter
I'd hate to be with you when you're on your own.
Haha 😄That's exactly where I stand on this one.
Last week I phoned to book my car in for a service and was advised what it would cost me. The invoice showed a complete breakdown of parts, labour and VAT, and the amount I paid was exactly what they quoted me over the phone.
As to everything else the OP has posted....
I think i need my own tub of popcorn
For me, it was just one thing after another ...
There were actually more things to the previous points that i felt were unnecesarry to mention though still added to the culmination which ultimately led to the straw to break the camels back.
I was more bothered about the president links being damaged. That was my only gripe on here as seth is not interested in rectifying.
Lesson learnt not to always go for the most cost effective route.
Just realised OP is the same guy who was trying to sell a completely battered SD4K ceramic which was in real need of laser welding and a new crystal as "Has some light scratches pretty much all over the metal but never been polished so still sharp edges."
Makes total sense now.
If he was happy to walk around in a battered SD why did he kick up such a fuss about a few very minor scratches on a 40 year old bracelet. Wasn't it him who advocated that these things need to be worn and enjoyed.
Exactly, what a wally. Complete chancer.
Yes it should have done and is UK law. B2C pricing must be the "end price" so inclusive of vat and anything else that is a mandatory cost. This is why broadband charges now include line rental for a landline as you can't get the broadband without it (not virgin).
Trouble is, we are reliant on the OPs account of all this; do you trust him? Do we really know the accurate details about what was or wasn’t said about charges? Personally, I don’t trust a single word this guy says. From the start he has been slippery and hostile , trying to inflame views on this businessman. Trustpilot has removed his review.
What he failed to understand is that people here are generally quite experienced and will make their own judgements. Vendettas are quickly exposed.
yupp how ironic is that
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I don't think he is dishonest, I just think he is living in cloud cuckoo land on his expectations. He genuinely felt he was in the right and almost certainly still does. I was a Purchasing Manager for over 35 years and dealing with bad suppliers was part of the job. What I would say was if a Buyer walked into my office with a tale such as this, he would have been fired for time wasting. There is no need to send 70 emails over a bracelet, that just speaks for itself. He must have spent more time composing emails than what the watchmaker spent on renovating the bracelet.
The saddest thing is that he just cannot see this.
However he did have a valid point on the VAT.
Good spot. Does indeed make sense. Wasn't there also an offer of £200 more than he wanted but somehow chose not to sell but still advertised it on SC?
Indeed there allegedly was.
And this in the same response. Could easily be his view on condition when it suits him Vs when it doesn't.
Overall not someone I'd buy from or sell to. I'd rather buy an orient off Sweepinghoover.
Now that is just an exaggeration !
Haha so immature... non of you keyboard warriors 'get it'
Ok so you go and pay a 'speacialist' £500 to give you a bracelet with incorrect links and 2 damaged gold links... not to mention attitude and unprofessionalism.
Makes me laugh how childish some of you are
🤣
God grant us the gift, to see ourselves as others see us.
David
Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations
Yep. A chap wanted to buy it on another platform i advertised it on for 9.8k who just wanted to wear it as it was.
Doesn't need laser welding or anything of that sort. Just a service and glass which is what was describled or are you all now part time watch repairers now?
Decided to keep it so after a service you can all complain when its listed for near 13k 🤣🤣
Can't win with you lot and some of you make me resent this place... just not as friendly or open minded as it once was
Haha 😄
Love it... another dude who can't read the whole story of events
Agreed too many idiots .
Other than adding to my sweet post count now.
No vendetta was set out.
Simply asking for advice from some of the more intelligent guys on here about what to do next ref the damage to the bracelet caused by another person whilst in for repair work.
Its really that simple, other details are just the backstory aa to why seth is not interested and why i feel this way.
Just reviving this thread to thank Seth for a superb job on my GMT oyster bracelet- just delivered.
I was kept fully informed of progress during the job and I'm really impressed with the finished product.
Thoroughly recommended!!
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