These days, to be able to buy a sports Rolex from an AD, you need to be a Templar, a member of the Opus Dei, a footballer and the cousin of the janitor writing at the AD (these are cumulative requirements!). Then, maybe, we might have something for you... Look, but don't touch! First you need to buy some of the other (boring) models...
So the prices on the pre-owned market go up and up and up, and lots of people are infested by the need to speculate. It's not just a watch any more, it's a status symbol, an investment, an opportunity to make some easy profit. It's so very boringly transactional.
And of course it infects other brands as well. They'll make more and more inexplicably expensive watches in limited editions, obtainable only by a very few, painfully selected special ones... You will be able to buy (insert desired brand's LE model here) if you'll send us a recording of you jumping on your left foot, at 3 am, while shouting out loud: 'My mama never loved me!'
But wait, there's more! If you can add anything military to it - jackpot! Something about some divers, or pilots, or at least some infantry men... Just add a bit of wood from the fuselage, some metal from the rocket... Or, if you're a true visionary, you will have an epiphanic dream one night in France, and you'll wake up knowing that you can create an utterly false connection with an imagined history... It will sell, by Jove!
The only ones worth collecting are rather obscure, 33-34mm watches of yesteryear. Hat off for the ones who realised this fairly early. I didn't.
Ha ha nice rant mate. I tend to agree. It’s a silly hobby....I’m just glad I don’t like modern Rolexes! Or the vast majority of modern watches, if truth be told.
We had a similar discussion whilst ‘tired’ at last night’s vGTG (where you were missed!)
A lot of that is very well said.
I would say many who think themselves WIS are really your (nicely put) VBTs....Originally Posted by Wooster
Lovely, eloquent rant. As I type, the Stockholm Syndrome brigade will be finding ways to explain why you are simple-of-wit, delusional and in all ways capital-"R"-Rong.
The price of instant brand-recognition does seem to be a very, very sore bottom nowadays...
Move onto brands you can source and afford to buy, there are plenty to choose from. Or take up a different hobby.
Hi Christian
An excellent summary of the crazy place we find ourselves.
My AD emailed me earlier with Soz, we cant ever promise to supply a GMT, but maybe there is something else you would like. I sent a very courteous reply, and will wait, if no watch comes, so be it.
In the last 3 months I have splurged barely over £1000 on a classic Seiko diver, a vintage quartz Seiko diver, an interesting microbrand, and some straps. I'm pretty delighted with the new additions, and pleased that there is still interesting stuff at the value end. There is parts of the market that are all about money, but I choose not to play there, and am happy.
Dave
Nice rant and completely agree, I’m going to have a rant of my own.
I will also never play the AD game, buying a few watches I don’t really want (or not willing to pay full retail on) and HOPING to get a desired model that I do want at retail, hence I rather pay straight up the premium over retail, which is the true market price of the watch anyway.
For some models you not going to lose money paying over rrp, of course I rather pay retail but that’s not happening because I don’t play the game.
However I don’t blame the Rolex or AD either, supply is limited, Rolex is not going to make unlimited supplies straight away, it would really devalue them and the prestige, same with any successful luxury brand when they have some hot products, controlling supply is important to maintain some exclusivity
For example, Pepsi is not actually rare or a limited edition, but its a very long run model that will be out for many years and Rolex simply cannot just flood the market (ever), people will get bored instantly and the brand will go down the toilet (Sorry omega), so they need to control the supply carefully over the next 10 years or so, I’m probably making it up but perhaps 1000 pepsi a year released over 10 years would be 10,000 pepsi, perhaps then they would update movement, change design a bit etc. 10,000 of a single model is not rare in the watch world, although maybe a bit rare for Rolex given the universal brand appeal. And the AD has to allocate these watches to loyal existing customers it’s a business so I don’t really blame them.
I understand the business but I will never play the AD game, although in my mind it’s fair and makes sense. If I want the watch I’m happy to pay up the premium knowing that I’m probably not going to lose money anyway, which is already great in this hobby.
I agree that thinking about this and getting worked up over it can take a lot of the fun out of the hobby, so I enjoy other watches. Buying and wearing what you like whether a hyped Rolex, (and let’s be honest, there is something enjoyable about owning something that many people want beyond the actual watch itself) or something completely under the radar, I’m loving my vintage longines , I don’t even know the model number or name, just an old 34mm longines automatic.
Man, that's a great line. Paints a wonderfully vivid word picture.You will be able to buy (insert desired brand's LE model here) if you'll send us a recording of you jumping on your left foot, at 3 am, while shouting out loud: 'My mama never loved me!'
I had a great experience at Harrods last year.
Whilst generally floating around I ended up in the watch department. The AD saw me searching through the available Rolex's and came over asking me: "Are you looking for anything in particular?"
I told him I was just browsing and he told me they'd just got an Explorer in and would I like to look at it?
I explained I wasn't in a position to buy, but he told me that didn't matter.
Andso passed a very pleasant half hour fondling that watch, putting my fingerprints all over it and talking about the state of the market with the dealer.
It was lovely.
I tell ya...
...If I'm ever in a position to purchase, I'm going back to Harrods.
Just wish I could remember the dudes name!
It's not just watches either. I know a guy who bought a brand new boxster and immediately sold it back to the dealer for eleven grand less without physically taking delivery of it in order so buy a 718 GT4. He subsequently sold the GT4 for fifteen grand over what he paid so may be I'm the mug
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Sales Corner would be a quiet place if it wasn't for AD bundle deals.
Welcome to phase 8
Yes, all true. But you don't have to play the fashionable game - collect and wear what you like!
Buy a different brand, i have not experienced a single thing you said ever.
There is quite a lot of that that I disagree with too. I've been able to buy a few hard to fine stainless steel sports Rolex watches from my local Rolex dealer over the years (small town, sole dealer), together with some of the harder to get Omega limited editions. Yes, I can't buy everything I would like exactly when I want it, but it certainly is not the case that I've had to buy loads of stuff I don't want just to get a look in. And I'm not a footballer or related to the janitor either.
Even if you are not after a Rolex I do think they have changed a larger part of the market with some other brands also creeping up in prices faster than normally (at least I think so based on the watches and brands I track).
Luckily this also creates room for new brands, last purchase was a micro brand and my most worn watch in a long time.
Its also clear as the OP said Rolex is an investment opportunity. Looking at all the discussions in Rolex topics focusing on value and models coming for sale unworn.
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... and then there is the Seiko Marine Master 300 or better Prospex diver you can easily buy in black, green or blue. And black...
But “understatement” is a different story. You are right.
Have a great weekend
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This is all too serious. Buy a Rolex or any other make for that matter or if you have got the hump with the watch industry, buy a camera or a car or whatever. It's no big deal is it and certainly nothing to get wound up about.
Agreed - lots of interesting watches, new and used, that's why the hobby is so interesting.
'Getting and spending we lay waste our Powers'
It's a terrible shame, but a game I no longer have any interest in playing. I like the modern SD, GMT BLRO, and Daytona, but if Lord Sugar is struggling to find one, what chance have I.
Vintage is a solution, plenty out there at different price points, but as people always state it's a minefield. It's not a case of being a smart arse or a so called expert, but more a case of doing a lot of homework and making sure all the ducks line up on a watch that you are considering. Whatever watch and whatever model number etc there will be someone who has produced a document on the various dials, inserts and other things to fully check out before buying. Hard work yes, but satisfying and fun at the same time.
I think also people tend to cherish a nice vintage over a modern watch bought at list. Clearly the temptation to cash in is too much as can be seen by the regular fights in SC.
I do believe that anyone should be able to put their name down for a series production/non-limited edition watch from any brand, and expect to get a call when their name eventually comes up - but the smoke and mirrors of some AD practices don’t help.
I would love to be able to order a particular watch for a milestone birthday in a couple of years, but I can’t see any of the brands ADs even taking my details!
Thankfully I have more than enough watches already to get my daily fix.
It's just a matter of time...
Those who sell and those who want to buy just quietly get on with it. The squabbling is done by those who don't even want to buy the thing.
Magical journey indeed!
https://forum.tz-uk.com/showthread.p...hlight=Journey
It gets worse. I was in an AD two days ago to return something bought online and enquired about a D-Blue.
They tested me and said "if we had one would you really buy it now?" I said yes, I'll buy it right now and you can keep the stickers and the warranty card, I just really want the watch. They then said sorry, even if they had the watch they wouldn't be able to sell it to me. Any hard to get watch must be sold through allocation, never a walk in, and must be allocated through your home/default store.
So if they did have one they would have to unlink me on their computer from my usual store and set them as my default moving forward. This might get me the D-Blue but has no guarantee of getting me anything else and would wreck my relationship with the current AD who has been good to me. I declined as I want to keep my same store but this shows you how it's evolving with the big chains.
I suppose it depends which ‘angle’ you come at the hobby from. Personally I have very little interest in modern watches, so I get to skip all the AD/LE nonsense. On the other hand, buying vintage ushers in a whole new set of issues - scammers, duffers, servicing and repair costs, etc., etc.
Over the years I’ve learned to understand the nature of my own stop/start collecting habits, and what kind of watches I am likely to keep - and the upshot is that I very rarely sell a watch these days, and haven’t bought for years either.
Well, except this last week - I’ve bought two!!They will be keepers though. When they’ve been fixed
Last edited by Neil.Ldn; 15th August 2020 at 09:47.
I’ve been ‘over’ watches - in comparison to my Rolex and Panerai flipping days - for a long time now. I like to read about watches but having owned most of the ‘halo’ watches and sold them when I got bored etc, I realise I can’t have really liked them all that much. And I’m not sure buying and amassing expensive stuff is a ‘hobby’. Does your wife call buying handbags a hobby? - it’s mostly just shopping for man jewellery on this site nowadays, with a fair bit of willy waving about cars etc. I’m still here as I find it quite fun but with the daft prices and lack of availability watches stopped being fun (for me) years ago
Good question. Is buying expensive, or cheap, watches really a ‘hobby.’ ? Or just conspicuous consumption?
What does the “hobby’ bit entail beyond buying and selling....there’s very little chat about technical quality or design. Far more about price and availability.
Yes that's a good question and if we are honest with ourselves most of us hanker for top end watches. Thus availability, price and future value will become obvious topics of interest.
Yes, buying loads of shoes or handbags isn’t usually called a hobby.
It’s undeniable that for some, watches have just become a vehicle of conspicuous consumption. However for others, much the same pleasure can be got from a £20 fixer upper with a nice movement or interesting history. There’s plenty on eBay alone to satisfy all tastes and all wallets. If I went on eBay right now I know I’d be able to find something interesting within a few minutes. Meanwhile, between the Rolex conversations, there’s still discussions of history, movements and so on. It’s not so bad.
The early days of eBay were fun and you could pick up some really interesting and hard to find pieces for reasonable amounts. That was before the dealers took over. Some of them are in here hoovering things up - which is what happened to me second Pogue about 6 years ago, sold on eBay with a week of me posting it with an instant profit of something like 200 quid. I digress however.
I agree with the earlier comments re older dress watches- still lots of low cost fun to be had there. I also think that things like Amphibia collecting and nodding can be an interesting and cheap as chips pursuit.
Fortunately I've never been that interested in more expensive pieces and my forays into Rolex and Omega territory have been brief.
Every now and then I have something like a 6 month 'holiday' from watches. I just wear one piece that I don't take much notice of and focus on one of my other interests for a while. Works for me.
.
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Imelda Marcos may well have disagreed with you.
I have no interest in playing the AD game and no real interest in Rolex watches any more.
I lost my mojo a long time ago but hold onto them in the hope that I’ll get the spark back again.
Casio G shock for me next. No need to worry about insurance or someone wanting to mug you for it.
All getting a bit silly, there’s plenty of better watches out there that are easily accessible.
I just wear a Garmin.
I tend to agree with the OP but I still enjoy the hobby a lot and have a few watches from different brands, second hand and affordable, that I really enjoy. Recently acquired a GS quartz and I love it! There is is still a lot of joy to be had, it just depends on your perspective and what you want out of it at the end of the day.
And by way of demonstrating my point:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Alpina-Wa...rdt=true&rt=nc
I wouldn't have looked if I hadn't claimed that you can pick up a bargain and then pottered on to ebay. I've got a wartime DH Alpina somewhere, which is absolutely first rate, but It'll be interesting to see how a modern one stacks up.
Corrupted hobby indeed.
Just talked to an acquaintance here in Lux and he bought a bi-metal Speedy this week in a package deal with a steel sports Rolex. Wants to flip the Speedy immediately for a EUR 4,200 loss, unworn.
Might as well have just paid the premium unless that 4200 Euros includes a discount which he should have gotten. I doubt that Speedy is bought by anyone at list.Just talked to an acquaintance here in Lux and he bought a bi-metal Speedy this week in a package deal with a steel sports Rolex. Wants to flip the Speedy immediately for a EUR 4,200 loss, unworn.
I hope Rolex don’t become freely available.
Then we would miss all the fun of watching adult men behaving like jilted girls- ‘that Rolex is such a bad boy, playing hard to get. I will never sleep with him again. I will start sleeping with other boys. Or may be I will give up sleeping with boys altogether. I will just cuddle up with old men. That is where fun is at at’:-)
Last edited by RAJEN; 15th August 2020 at 13:13.
Raffe, I hope the Rolex was a Daytona. Do you know what it was?
That speedy is a beautiful watch.
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Nope, I didn't ask because there is nothing on this planet which interests me less than ceramic Rolex models. Maybe it was more than one as well, he has a stable already and is always buying and selling.
Hublot?
Christopher Ward?
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Illuminati - it's brill.
"Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. The third time it's enemy action."
'Populism, the last refuge of a Tory scoundrel'.
If stamp collecting can be a hobby, so can watch collecting. Or maybe ‘a pastime’ or ‘an interest’ fits better. But what fits best of all is that it’s a fetish:
fetish
/ˈfɛtɪʃ/
noun
noun: fetish; plural noun: fetishes
1.
a form of sexual desire in which gratification is linked to an abnormal degree to a particular object, item of clothing, part of the body, etc.
2.
an inanimate object worshipped for its supposed magical powers or because it is considered to be inhabited by a spirit.
Okay.Hublot?
Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.
Cool. That's my vvatch you are talking aboot.
THIN is the new BLACK
You've clearly not visited any shoe or handbag forums...
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