What's the next dive watch on my 'flipping' journey to a Rolex Submariner?
Okay...
...I love dive watches and just for fun, I've decided to try and 'flip' my way to a Rolex Submariner Date 116613LB.
Hey, what can I say? I enjoy a challenge :)
Here's my plan...
- I buy a watch
- Take some video of it whilst I go snorkelling
- Post the video on YT
- Sell the watch
- Add some cash
- Repeat from step 1
And keep going until I get the Rolex.
I started with a Casio MDV106-1A Dura 'Marlin' and flipped it for an Invicta Pro Diver 8928OB (Bought for £65)
Then (where --> means 'flipped)
- Invicta Pro Diver (sold for £66) --> Citizen Pro Master Eco Drive BN0151-17L (Bought new for £164)
- Citizen Pro Master (Sold for £110) --> Seiko SKX007 J (Bought for £150)
- Seiko SKX007 (sold for £293!) --> ????
So...
I've got a budget of £450 for my next dive watch.
My question is, what's the most popular dive watch in this price range?
Not the best...
...The most popular.
You see, personally, I think the Citizen Pro Master is a much better watch than the Seiko but the price I sold the Seiko for proves it's the more popular watch.
It was a very easy flip.
So...
...I'm thinking my next purchase could be a second hand Longines Hydroconquest or CWC RN Quartz MK1 RN300-MQM60.
From researching eBay's sold listings I reckon I could pick either one up for £400 to £450 second hand.
My main aim is to avoid taking a hammering when I sell the watch.
So what would you get next?
Bonus Question...
How would you flip your way from a Casio Dura to a Rolex Submariner Date 116613LB?
Thanks for playing along :)
Interesting little journey. I'll look forward to following the steps along the way.
A word of caution if you opt for a Hydroconquest - Ebay is awash with fakes. Inspect all photos very carefully, especially the case back with serial number and bracelet engraving which should be nice and deep, not laser etched. The Ebay scams thread is worth a look.
Good luck!
If you're looking at most popular then your choice is going to predominantly be Seiko through a lot of the price levels.
My choice at this stage would be a Seiko Tuna, if you get lucky (and quick) you can find them for £450+ used on the forums, quite a lot more on eBay.
Thanks for the heads up, I didn't think fakes at this price point would be a thing.Originally Posted by boywithabubblegun
Oh well...
I'll check the eBay scams thread **Thumbs Up**
Interesting idea. Following
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I love the idea, good luck :)
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Interesting idea, become a novice watch dealer to ‘deal’ your way towards the watch you want........why hasn’t this been thought of before?
The skill in dealing is in the buying, unless you have the ability to add value to a watch by servicing/ restoring it you’re relying on buying below market value and selling above...........good luck, you’ll need it.
Thanks everyone for your input so far.
Tis true, I need to buy smart otherwise I'm gonna get stung.
So we'll see =)
And thanks for the heads up about the fakes on eBay.
I really hadn't considered folks would waste time making fakes of watches at this price point so I could very easily have been caught out.
I'd got my eye on a Longines Hydroconquest and armed with this warning, I asked the buyer if they had the receipt - they did and they sent me a photo of it along with the warranty card.
They just hadn't put it in any of the sales pictures **raise-eyebrows!**
And it all checks out.
The price was right too: £450 + £10 postage.
I'll post a picture of it once it arrives.
Thanks again.
Marcus =)
See you in 24 months.
No problem - glad to have been of help. Enjoy your journey!
You don’t have to ‘flip’ towards a 116613LB. They do surface from time to time, or just put your name down at a few places.
I think that its difficult to make a profit on most watches unless you are a shady character or experienced dealer - in which case I would have thought that sticking with one more reasonably priced piece and then saving until you can afford the Rolex would be a quicker route. Just not as much fun.
I think sometimes at that kind of budget end you can make a profit on certain kickstarter watches if you can predict what will take off and get in at the early bird prices. Maybe if you were starting again from scratch that would have been an option.
In my experience, Your going to come across a sort of gulf that sits from about £1500 to £4000.
Theres great fun in the game you are playing under £1000 but I reckon you'll stall just north of £1k...
I havent anything to suggest just now at £4-500 bar Seiko but I have seen used Oris 65s sell close to £1200. I like those.
Love the idea of this and followed a similar pattern myself learning and trying out watches off the forum, working towards a 114060.
I started with a SKX and moved through a Steinhart and a number of other boutique divers before buying a Sumo. This was sold for a MM300 and then my first vintage piece a 6105. After that it was a jump to an Aqua terra and then a bigger jump to the 114060. I really started to notice the difference in quality with the MM300 and the Omega.
The 114060 was lovely but something was missing and the chance to buy a 116600 came up. This was the best decision I could have made and fast forward a few years I am really happy with it! It will be a watch I won't be parting with unless I absolutely have to one day.
There is certainly a big gulf between £1500 and say £3000 where the risk can also increase on a number of fronts. I never bought a watch to make a profit but was always looking to try to break even if possible. This didn't always happen but its part of the journey and the price of enjoying different watches.
Looking back the only watch I really miss from the journey was the MM300 and one I will replace some day. I doubt though I'll be picking one up at the £850 I paid before!
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I heard from a prominent watch collector interview on YouTube that collectors should buy with much more feeling and a lot less thinking. I think this person is right and it’s something I’m trying to move towards in order to increase my enjoyment in this hobby. So my advice is to buy what you like when you want it (whilst trying not to lose too much money in the process)
Someones already doing something similar on YouTube. Here's a link to the first video in their series, may help for some inspiration!
https://youtu.be/SyDAj8ozRAE
Just wanted to echo that this is a great concept for a video series and to see someone work their way up the cost ladder.
It’s interesting that though I’m not working towards a particular model, it’s roughly how I do my watch flipping (and others I suspect): essentially throwing a little more money in each time I flip. Though I usually lose a bit every time, rather than turn a profit.
Sounds like you have your hydroconquest bought. I would suggest an MM200 for your next flip!
Jon
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Thanks Jon, that's a really good idea. I like the Seiko's but find all the numbers and models make my head spin LOL."I would suggest an MM200 for your next flip!" - Idontgram
Thanks M1011, I'll check that out. I've also got a YT channel: UnderWater Watches Underwater - check it out =)"Someone's already doing something similar on YouTube."
Sage advice my friend. I figure if I buy second hand - video the watch - then sell it again, I won't take too much of a hit."...buy what you like when you want it (whilst trying not to lose too much money in the process." - ac11111
"There is certainly a big gulf between £1500 and say £3000 where the risk can also increase on a number of fronts. I never bought a watch to make a profit but was always looking to try to break even if possible. This didn't always happen but its part of the journey and the price of enjoying different watches." - diver527Thanks for the heads up on the gulf between £1500 and £3/4000. I'm planning on buying second hand, so that will hopefully increase my options..."In my experience, Your going to come across a sort of gulf that sits from about £1500 to £4000. Theres great fun in the game you are playing under £1000 but I reckon you'll stall just north of £1k..." - TimeThoughts
...And exponentially increase the risk =)
I considered getting in on the ground floor for a Second Hour Gin Clear Diver, but trying to work out what might take off and what might flop..."I think sometimes at that kind of budget end you can make a profit on certain kickstarter watches if you can predict what will take off and get in at the early bird prices." - Lusty
...Well, I wouldn't know where to start =)
I'm rubbish at saving that kind of cash, it always seems to get 'invested' in something else, but if it's tied up in a watch, that's a different matter."I would have thought that sticking with one more reasonably priced piece and then saving until you can afford the Rolex would be a quicker route. Just not as much fun. " - Velorum
There are a number of watches on my 'hit list' I'd love to check out on the way to the 116613LB."You don’t have to ‘flip’ towards a 116613LB. They do surface from time to time, or just put your name down at a few places." - Cheesycake7
____
Thanks everyone for your input, some good ideas =)
This arrived today:
Longines HydroConquest £460 off eBay.
Of course with my goal being the blue faced gold and steel Rolex Submariner, when this one came up at the right price, I had to go for it =)
Now to get it filmed and flipped =)
Now that's flipping!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pcM3fhMiBpw
When you finally get the sub it would be amazing to have a timeline of the whole journey!
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I’d be looking at Seiko or maybe you can snag a half decent Tag
Tag feels no love in this forum - but the general public seem to like them
An Oris may get your a profit
Love the idea - great if you can utilise £1 listing days to sell via eBay etc
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Love this as a concept.. used to really enjoy my hydro conquest too! Perhaps an aqua racer or similar next
Nice idea this, will be interesting to see the progress.
How long are you going to be holding onto the watches before flipping?
Really cool idea. You can get Vintage Tag divers for around 500 pounds on Ebay with tritium dials and seem to be quite popular so you should be able to sell for a profit. Best of luck!
The Seiko was a fluke, you found a mug to pay near 300 for a used 007.
Please tell me who they are, maybe they want my Steinhart ocean one for 400
Hamilton Frogman, awesomedive watch
You could buy the latest Timex special edition - they seem to be cheap and (for a short while at least) sell for a premium. Good luck on your journey- now lets see those snorkeling videos!!
Thanks for all the feedback, much appreciated.
Apologies for taking so long to reply, but I've trapped a nerve in my neck and can only sit upright for short periods of time :)
Anyway...
...moving on:
You can find them on my YT channel here
Looks good. Thanks for the recommendation. Possible contender for the next watch =)
Thank you. A vintage Tag with Tritium is a great idea for the next watch
The plan is to keep them for as short a time as possible. My snorkelling window is closing soon for this year. I'd like to get the Longines videos and possibly the 'next' watch too. Then I can save up between October and May for the next part of the journey =)
Gotta say, I like the Hydro Conquest, especially the two tone, bears a 'similar' look to my Grail at the finishing line.
Thanks for your input, There's certainly a lot to choose from the Seiko range, you could possibly even do this journey only focusing on Seikos LOL. But the problem I find with Seiko's is getting up to speed with all the various reference numbers and models. Makes my head spin.
Yeah... Don't think it's gonna be quick LOL.
Certainly is. Wow!
The longines legend diver is quite stable price wise and I think a really fun watch to try out on your way up!
Just set aside a few £s for some extra straps because it looks amazing on almost anything
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I know you've already bought, but my suggestion would of been a Helm watch. They seem to sell for more than there RRP if you can get one.
Yeah... If you can get one =)
Thanks for that. I was starting to have colly-wobbles that I'd got the wrong watch, just need to get in the sea, get it videoed and then get it flipped =)The longines legend diver is quite stable price wise and I think a really fun watch to try out on your way up!
Just set aside a few £s for some extra straps because it looks amazing on almost anything
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The Longines HydroConquest...
And the Zelos Swordfish (I couldn't resist it!) are now up on the bay.
I estimate I'll get about £700 for the two.
Which means I'm now in the market for a £700 to £1000 dive watch.
I don't want to buy new, because as soon as I flip it, there's a massive chance I'll lose a stack of cash.
So...
What second-hand dive watch would you go for if you had £700 to £1000 to spend?
Preferably one that's popular enough so I'll get most of my money back once I video it underwater and flip it...
Many thanks =)
I’d say Ginault or Oris Aquis at that price point
Beware of a lot of fake Oris Aquis on eBay.
If you see anything that won't show the back of the watch including serial number or at least the mechanism which should be marked 733 26 Jewel and probably only showing 2 booklets and no booklet holder without a warranty card it's most likely fake.
There are a few more indicators like the cushion if you get a full side on view where it says Oris. The S will most likely look like the one show here where as it should be exactly the same font as the other bit's marked Oris with a curved over S.
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Last edited by sickie; 29th September 2020 at 12:15.
Oris sixty-five?
Thanks for the heads up...
...Seems to be a lot of fakes on eBay, getting the Longines HydroConquest was a minefield of fakes too.
Good call...
- - - Updated - - -
If you had £700 to £1000 to spend on a second Seiko Diver...
...What would you choose?
You could get a Sinn diver for £1000.
A 104 would be a doddle to get for that price, but you might also be able to get a U1 or a UX.
D
Since you’ve asked specifically about seiko, I’d say the new 62MAS reimagining. SPB143/147. This would be my choice.
There are also quite a few of the new Seiko Willards at that price range on eBay right now.
Given that you’re planning on flipping the watches and buying with you head, rather than your heart, I’d say those two suggestions or the aforementioned Aquis should have enough of a market to be flipped relatively easily.
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Thank you for that =)
Good advice. Flipping may be fun but is usually expensive which has the double whammy of delaying the time it takes to save up for the Sub which makes it more expensive as well as losing all the money in the flips.
Just knuckle down, save up and get the grail watch quicker and cheaper.
Like the concept, as I understand it you're essentially using the sequence of watches up to the Sub as a savings vehicle, all be it with a likely negative interest rate?
As other posters have pointed out the likelihood is that you'll lose more often than you win in terms of value as you flip but you'll have the pleasure of a series of interesting watches rather than simply looking at a savings account slowly increasing in value (as Sub values outpace it!).
You'd therefore be looking at watches that offer the best combination of fun/interest and value retention - there's also a slight element of jeopardy here as, a bit like "Who wants to be a Millionaire", if you make a wrong choice along the way you could really set yourself back!
I was on a similar path, flipped my way to a Todor Pelagos after a Seiko Shogun but flipped the Pelagos for another Shogun.
Hope you find some nice surprises along the way.
OP - have you actually made any money on the watches you have bought and sold? Just looking at the numbers in your posts it looks like you're trading at a loss, especially when you factor in eBay and PayPal costs (unless the aim is not to flip and make money, just to enjoy the journey).
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In this journey that you are doing to get the Rolex. You can stop here:
https://www.magrette.com
I have to said that you can find one within the budget and is something special
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Definitely one of these SPB143/147 as previously stated.
MM200 and keep it for six months could be worth a punt. I doubt it'll be worth any less by then if bought s/h and there's a new one on the horizon which may (or may not) firm up the prices on the old model...
Ever heard of that experiment they did where they told a kid they could have one sweet now, but if they waited a period of time they could have two? Something to do with delayed gratification. Well, I'm the kinda kid that would take that first sweet before they finished the sentence LOL.
You're spot on: "looking at watches that offer the best combination of fun/interest and value retention". Couldn't have put it better. As for the risk... We'll see =)
Thanks buddy, I had a look at the Pelagos in the jewellers shop in Exeter yesterday... Love it. Interesting that you preferred the Shogun. What is it about the Shogun you like so much?
Yeah, I don't expect to make any money on this adventure. It's more something to do and have some fun along the way.
I like the Moana Pacific. But the trouble is, buying new is a great way to get hit by depreciation and resell loses.
Thanks for that. I'll take a look. What's the model number for the MM200, just to make sure I'm looking at the right one. I find the Seiko dive watch catalogue very confusing =)
Just from that one pic I can tell your watch is genuineThis arrived today:
Longines HydroConquest £460 off eBay.
Of course with my goal being the blue faced gold and steel Rolex Submariner, when this one came up at the right price, I had to go for it =)
Now to get it filmed and flipped =).
The fake quartz Hydroconquests are usually 39mm for some reason
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