Reply With QuoteExpalin your concerns & ask her to make you sole executor. Don't appoint a solicitor unless you want to spend a fortune in fees.
My Mum has named myself and my brother in law as executors on the will.
Sadly my sister and I do not get on, we haven't spoke for many years, and I'm sure never will. Nor do I speak to my brother in law.
I am very concerned that when my Mum passes, I am going to be faced with a lot of added stress, having to work with my brother in law to sell my Mum's house, which she owns outright.
I understand that my Mum has left the house to both my sister & I - 50/50. I would hope to sell it and split the money and move on, - hopefully other possessions will be specified on the will.
I do not trust my brother in law, and I fear that any disagreement could drag on, possibly through courts (who knows)...
I will be going through enough at this time, grieving for my Mother, without having to fight any further battles.
Is there anything my Mum can do to negate such a situation?
Just make a neutral solicitor a sole executor instead?
State that upon any disagreement that I have the final vote?
Comments on the other ideas or any other possibly better suggestions would be greately appreciated.
Expalin your concerns & ask her to make you sole executor. Don't appoint a solicitor unless you want to spend a fortune in fees.
As above - try for sole executorship.
BUT- you are both tasked with ‘ensuring that the deceased’s wishes, as they are prescribed in the will - are executed’
Sounds like you will have to remind BIL of that, at every opportunity. Some people think it is up to them.
Based on my experience, having a solicitor as an executor is likely to be frustrating and expensive. Hideously expensive. Of course it can/should depend on the complexity of her estate, if it's primarily just the house it might not be too bad. Approach a solicitor for pricing if you still want to investigate that route.
Assuming she's capable of making rational decisions at this time, perhaps you should be having a chat with her and explaining your concerns, is there not other family or even close friends who might fulfill the role?
To be fair, you're there to carry out the will - as long as that's been drawn up as watertight as possible there's not really much room for discretion - the executor just does the nuts and bolts of getting relevant documentation contacting firms/collating finances/figures, paying the right tax etc and then distributing remaining funds as per the will. Open an account for the process and just ensure that all executors have to sign for any funds transfers.
But in the situation the OP describes having an antagonistic joint Executor can be a nightmare. The only way to force them to act correctly is to go legal & that gets expensive very quickly. Just a simple thing like a house valuation can become a battleground & there are numerous houses left unsold for long periods because one executor holds out for an unrealistic price.Originally Posted by blackal
I went through this a couple of years ago, I was named as executor and myself and sister were the sole beneficiary’s. I engaged a solicitor as Probate was involved, I appreciate you can do it yourself but personally I didn’t want to get involved. The solicitor I engaged charged a fixed fee as opposed to a percentage of the estate and from start to finish I found it relatively painless and not too expensive. Everything was handled through the solicitor, we had two brief meetings and she sorted all the financial side culminating in a cheque being sent to my sister and myself.
A simple example - the mother stipulates that her personal possesions (after any specific stipulations) are to be split equally between the son & daughter. Executor son-in-law lets the daughter clear the house - what's the Executor son going to do about it? Other than starting legal proceedings there's not much he can do. As sole Executor he has much more control.
Been here myself recently with passing of my mother, whom I shared with a half-brother 20 years older than me.
The whole thing was a living hell as he is so different to me, and has a money-grabbing wife behind the scenes trying to do everything she could to ensure they got as much out of everything as possible (think rushing me into clearing out my mother's house and taking all the 'charity' stuff for herself to sell on a car boot sale, whilst lying about it... You get the general idea).
For your own sanity and wellness during what will be a very difficult and disorientating time, you really do need to have this changed to 1 executor, not so much that someone might 'lose out', but just to save the constant contact and differing opinions. Do not underestimate how difficult the small things not mentioned in the will can be.
My father's will was co-executed by a family friend and the solicitor and did not have any of the same stresses whatsoever, and I shared him with 7 half-siblings!!
Unless your sister refuses to agree to sell, why not let bygones be bygones and agree to split the proceeds? Surely it's worth considering 'burying the hatchet' to protect and secure your share ... which must be £tens of thousands.
Executor duties are fairly straightforward and there are a number of books available to help executors and joint executors understand and dispose of a deceased's estate.
And you do not state if your mother's will was drawn up by a solicitor , or will making service or solely by your mother ... if the latter you might have problems.
You can be an executor and still employ a solicitor to advise and oversee.
And any will provisions can be 'overwritten' by e.g., 'deeds of variation' ... subject to original beneficiaries' agreements.
Might be worth consulting a solicitor for advice now ... would likely cost just a few £hundred and could be ££ well spent.
dunk
PS ... On the death of your mother you will have to obtain a fair valuation of the house for probate purposes ... joint executors have a duty to obtain same ... so you and your BIL will have to GTG and liase and agree to e.g. approach several estate agents. You need to get used to the prospect and plan accordingly ... and hopefully amicably.
You are also allowed to renounce your executorship by signing a deed of renunciation and thus let your BIL deal with everything ... this would not alter the other terms of the will.
If an executor or joint executor has actually 'done something wrong' is his / her executorship, then subject to proof of same, they can be 'removed (as executor) from the will' . But suspecting that an executor might do something wrong does not constitute grounds for his/her removal.
Last edited by sundial; 3rd August 2020 at 17:11.
"Well they would say that ... wouldn't they!"
Thank you so far the for the amazing response so far.
I have spoken to her once about this, - at first she said "I won't be here so I don't care!"
To add; my Mum is trying to be fair to both my sister and I by making both myself and BIL executors. If she makes me sole executor, it would probably upset my sister, so I suspect she will be reluctant to do that...
It’s a delicate subject to discuss, the danger though is that by trying not to upset one person, it might end up upsetting everyone. Having 2 executors is just inefficient unless there is a practical reason for it.
Cheers..
Jase
I’m glad you make this point. Why should your mother be forced to choose who gets to control the process of dealing with the estate. Maybe it pains her you don’t get on and thinks it is a way you will come together. And if you push her maybe she will choose your sister !
The fact that you are anticipating trouble may not be a fair judgment of your sister and BIL, but am entrenched viewpoint that will somewhat guarantee friction.
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At the very least it should be changed to your sister not her husband in order to avoid that possible line of argument/disagreement. If she insists on this course then I would also impress on her to make the will as specific as possible down to naming the major possessions that are to go to either party and that all remaining unspecified possessions should be sold and added to the estate if no equitable agreement can be reached. Bear in mind that any items of significant value must by law be accounted for in probate. Solicitors usually advise against making things too specific, but if you're defintiely expecting issues then it may be needs-must.
For my late father I was joint executor, but the family basically left it all to me - I'm pretty sure my sisters will do similar when it comes to my mother. Fortunately we're fair minded as a bunch and get on well.
Last edited by Scepticalist; 3rd August 2020 at 17:14.
My mum is in the process of changing her executors from my uncle and aunt to me as my aunt died 8 years ago and my uncle lives 150 miles away can’t really see and doesn’t go out of the house anymore good job I got her to check the will after she nearly died a couple of months ago it’s expensive though a will review and giving me power of attorney and the solicitor is charging her the best part of £800
No way it should cost that imo. PoA is relatively cheap to do - it's a standard form for them unless you need weird variations.
I disagree. You only die once - do it properly. Plenty of cheaper / corners cut / self filled out forms lead to a greater chance of problems and litigation.
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I'm not denying that - I'm just saying that's ridiculous cost for it. It cost half of that from my mother's solicitor.
Let a solicitor handle the matter.A bereavement brings out the worst in people.It may cost more but it will save Your sanity. You will then be spared the ordeal of conversing with relatives You clearly don’t want to and if the outcome is not what they want it has nothing to do with You.
Agree with this. I will probably be executor for my mother eventually and aren't going to go through the hassle of doing it myself. Seems expensive but I look on it as being split 4 ways so cost to me not too bad.
Either have you as sole executor or a solicitor. Both options will be less painful than arguing with BIL and sister. And the will should be checked to ensure it is specific about anything you wish to keep. Unfortunately these situations can bring out the worst (or best) in people.
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
That will be the first thing the co-executor will block.
Same. £350 for 2x POAs for myself over my parents.
I was a joint executor once for a friend.
Never again.
My parents have me down as sole executor - I told them I was not interested in being joint, with anyone.
Rob.
Yes they will because they won’t want to lose control. Which is why having two executors is a bad idea.
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
On my mum's wishes I have just done both the Health and Financial LPAs. Easy to do online and cost £82 each. My brother did it online 3 years ago for my dad before he passed away too. My brother and I were his executors, but his will was pretty simple to execute with mum still being around as the main beneficiary.
Any work on a will and I would get a solicitor involved to ensure it was done right.
To the OP, as mentioned above, if your mum is set on the joint executorship, then work with her to ensure the will is detailed enough to avoid ambiguity when it comes to executing it.
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Easy enough to do it yourself. Same form whoever does it.
Yes this. Don’t leave any wriggle room. If you do you will regret it.
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
Very hard to entirely eliminate. Friction easily arises over possessions - some that aren't valuable so not specifically named but couple of people would like them.
Yes I’ve had experience of this. My grandfather’s war medals were ‘grabbed’ on the day of my mother’s funeral by my uncle. My father didn’t feel he could refuse, and I was conveniently sidelined while it happened. It still bothers me to this day.
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
My brother and his wife cleared out the valuables from my parents house after they died, we were joint executors but I never saw anything of the stuff again, they even tried to clear the bank accounts on the day my dad died but the bank knew about it as he lived in a small village. The court case to sort the rest out because I lost it at that point cost well over £20,000 it was a waste of money but it gave me great satisfaction knowing the thieving gits had to pay half. I treated myself to a blue bi metallic sub when it was over.
So either make friends with your sister and BIL or get your mum to get someone independent to sort her estate out. It will save a lot of hassle and life’s to short to get stressed at a time of sadness.
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If you had to take them to court because of their actions then why did they not end up paying your solicitor fees? Did the court not question what happened to your parents valuables, or was it impossible to prove what they pilfered from the house?
Get a solicitor to be the executor IMO.
My Mum died last week and one of my sisters who is usually sweetness and light has turned into a beast and we've had a few rows since my Mum's passing.
Money brings out the worst in people.
Fortunately we have a solicitor working for us or it would be awful.
Cheers,
Neil.
Be VERY careful if there's risk of dispute in the family.
What is most important is that your Mothers will is very specific about what has to be done as well as the 'who gets what' bit that most wills cover. There is a house not far from us which was left to two brothers - the usual all my wordly goods to be split between my two sons bit. One brother wanted to put it on the market and sell it, the other refused; and you can't sell half a house so the house has been empty and boarded up for the last 10 years!
What the will should have said was that the house MUST be sold and the proceeds divided equally - if that's what she really meant. The same should go for specific jewellery items etc. Your Mother's will should be very clear what she wants to happen to what.
I'm currently the sole executor to my late cousins will. First thing I did when she died was to appoint a solicitor. Yes, it costs, but it saves an awful lot of hassle and aggravation, (I was executor to both my parents wills and did the whole lot myself; believe me, it's a lot of hard work - I still have the spreadsheet to prove it!). The second thing I did was to have all the locks changed on her flat with keys left only with the solicitor - no one can take anything without his knowledge and consent, not even me.
Last edited by Griswold; 4th August 2020 at 14:51.
Best Regards - Peter
I'd hate to be with you when you're on your own.
It went to the Sherriff court in Scotland because of the problems they were causing over the assets and all the costs were put down to the estate. My brothers solicitor who was his wife’s employer, stood up in court and even tried the “well he lives in England “ approach talking about me, the Sherriff just looked up and replied “ you know the do have telephones in England as well” which caused a lot of laughter, which was probably the only funny part of the whole process.
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Sound advice - even if one party wants to buy the property you can accept their offer on an open sale as long as it's not disadvantaging the estate.
Last edited by Scepticalist; 5th August 2020 at 09:48.
I'm really sorry to hear about your Mum.
Thank you again to everyone. I may even show my Mum this thread, - I think the best course of action is to appoint a solicitor... - I'll see what she says. It's not a conversation I'll look forward to, - it's uncomfortable, as I don't like to imagine such a time, - I will be devasted. I wouldn't want my Mum to get the wrong idea, that I am somehow looking forward to recieving an inheritance, when it's purely down to pinciple.
Naturally it's entirely your (her) choice how to proceed but if the choice does indeed come to appointing a solicitor please please do plenty of research whilst gathering as much info as possible on the scope of their involvement, charging structure etc. Naturally, money is far from the most important consideration when the time comes but the potential for additional stress at a difficult time can be significant, and the potential for money disappearing like water from a hose pipe left on all year is real.
I'll give you some limited info from one case I dealt with, where the sols were the "top firm in the country" (and had awards to "prove" it)
Basic (trainee should have spotted it) mistake which WILL lead to an IHT liability in future, damage approx £36k..not possible to correct after the fact.
Failure to advise another simple course of action, again trainee stuff. I managed to step in and sort this one. Cost to implement ~£1k. IHT saving £102k and growing.
Their client ended up doing significant amounts of the work that the sols were being paid to do.
Sure this was probably a more complex estate than it sounds like will be the case for you, but it wasn't that difficult or that large (well under £1m)
Charges for this shit show. A bit over £50k. There several aspects of the case that were worthy of, and should have led to a formal complaint but as you can imagine at a time like this it's often the last sort of thing someone wants to take on.
Best of luck, however you proceed.
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