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Thread: Face Masks

  1. #1
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    Face Masks

    Now it is likely that the wearing of face masks will become more common. Any suggestions on where best to get some. The reviews on Amazon for the "medical" style are patchy to say the least. I was thinking dust mask from Screwfix / Toolstation or am I way off course

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  2. #2
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    We have to wear them at work ( I’m an electrician ) I’ve been buying the Surgical ones from electrical wholesalers most near me seem to have preempted the need and got in there quick

  3. #3
    Grand Master GraniteQuarry's Avatar
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    Highly recommend Wolford, proper gear from a proper manufacturer. Less than £20.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by toastie View Post
    We have to wear them at work ( I’m an electrician ) I’ve been buying the Surgical ones from electrical wholesalers most near me seem to have preempted the need and got in there quick
    Thanks for that I had a look at CEF £80 for 50 wow !

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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by GraniteQuarry View Post
    Highly recommend Wolford, proper gear from a proper manufacturer. Less than £20.
    This keeping us safe isn't going to be cheap is it

    Sent from my SM-T800 using Tapatalk

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Taxboy View Post
    Thanks for that I had a look at CEF £80 for 50 wow !

    Sent from my SM-T800 using Tapatalk
    As it happens city is the last place I purchased them from, I’m sure I didn’t pay that much for them but then I bought them on account so probably get a discount.

    I’ve also seen them on groupon but no idea on cost etc

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by GraniteQuarry View Post
    Highly recommend Wolford, proper gear from a proper manufacturer. Less than £20.
    Can you expand on what you mean by 'proper gear from a proper manufacturer'?
    I've not heard of them before, and they appear to be a normal clothing manufacturer rather than a mask/respirator/medical/any sort of PPE manufacturer, so any info would be great.

  8. #8
    Grand Master GraniteQuarry's Avatar
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    They’re a clothing company, my missus buys leggings and suchlike from them! Made in Austria so not a sweatshop in Shenzhen is what I meant.

    Obviously a simple mask rather than PPE but having been through FFP2/FFP3 from 3M and suchlike I find these perfect for daily use but perhaps not the most suitable for an hour a day on the tube.

    Quote Originally Posted by hughtrimble View Post
    Can you expand on what you mean by 'proper gear from a proper manufacturer'?
    I've not heard of them before, and they appear to be a normal clothing manufacturer rather than a mask/respirator/medical/any sort of PPE manufacturer, so any info would be great.

  9. #9
    Grand Master Saint-Just's Avatar
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    I don’t think you should buy a mask built to any standard as it is not designed to protect you and in most cases wouldn’t. For example those with a valve are completely defeating the purpose: you wear a mask to avoid spitting your viruses out. What protects you is that every one around you does the same. If one of those has a valve, he’ll share the virus if he is infected.
    'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.

  10. #10
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    In the unlikely event I find myself on public transport I will cover my face with a motorbike tube.

    I have a box of masks in the boot but in all honesty, the evidence is sketchy at best in terms of offering limited protection to others rather than to yourself. If the psychological encouragement helps, then I am all for that.

    I can see this helping in cities, in particular London, but again it is a one size fits all policy. Rural bus routes are not the same as the Tube in rush hour.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by GraniteQuarry View Post
    They’re a clothing company, my missus buys leggings and suchlike from them! Made in Austria so not a sweatshop in Shenzhen is what I meant.

    Obviously a simple mask rather than PPE but having been through FFP2/FFP3 from 3M and suchlike I find these perfect for daily use but perhaps not the most suitable for an hour a day on the tube.
    The OH wears Wolford too and I've just bought a couple of their masks but the 15% discount code they sent to me unsurprisingly didn't work on them. They do look like they're comfortable to wear, unlike proper PPE, would you say that they are in your experience? Thanks.

  12. #12
    Grand Master GraniteQuarry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mactrack View Post
    The OH wears Wolford too and I've just bought a couple of their masks but the 15% discount code they sent to me unsurprisingly didn't work on them. They do look like they're comfortable to wear, unlike proper PPE, would you say that they are in your experience? Thanks.
    Definitely more comfy! I found the industrial PPE ones get moist very quickly (heaver breather...) but this doesn't as it's proper thick cotton/polyester. Throw it in the wash after the shopping trip or whatever, job done.

    Wifey got the 'Silk' version which looks like fancy lace panties, apparently very comfy but I wouldn't wear outside for fear of being wolf whistled!

  13. #13
    Grand Master AlphaOmega's Avatar
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    Just want to reassure you about the likelihood of being wolf-whistled GQ.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by GraniteQuarry View Post

    Wifey got the 'Silk' version which looks like fancy lace panties, apparently very comfy but I wouldn't wear outside for fear of being wolf whistled!
    Agreed, looking like you’ve got your wife’s panties on your head isn’t a good look.

    What puzzles me is why our leaders didn’t make it mandatory to wear masks on public transport earlier. Same applies to supermarkets. I don’t like wearing a bloody mask but I think its the right thing to do.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saint-Just View Post
    I don’t think you should buy a mask built to any standard as it is not designed to protect you and in most cases wouldn’t. For example those with a valve are completely defeating the purpose: you wear a mask to avoid spitting your viruses out. What protects you is that every one around you does the same. If one of those has a valve, he’ll share the virus if he is infected.
    Those wearing a valves mask really annoy me. Totally ‘I’m alright jack’ mentality.

  16. #16
    Master jukeboxs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GraniteQuarry View Post
    ... I find these perfect for daily use ...
    Given past antics with Alex, I'm guessing you went for the (admittedly-still-rather-dull-but-racier-than-the-standard-black) Lace option.

  17. #17
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    Odds are most people will use any old cheap thing anyway just to avoid a fine. There are loads on Etsy that satisfy the "home produced" criteria that has been shown previously

  18. #18
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    Staples, delivered in 3 days, bought 100 pack last week for my return to work.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by walkerwek1958 View Post
    Agreed, looking like you’ve got your wife’s panties on your head isn’t a good look.

    What puzzles me is why our leaders didn’t make it mandatory to wear masks on public transport earlier. Same applies to supermarkets. I don’t like wearing a bloody mask but I think its the right thing to do.
    The data suggest there is very little point in wearing masks, especially of the quality available to the general public. I think the reason it’s being mandated now is more to reassure people (and it won’t hurt!).

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt8500 View Post
    The data suggest there is very little point in wearing masks, especially of the quality available to the general public. I think the reason it’s being mandated now is more to reassure people (and it won’t hurt!).
    It works in the sense that it protects others from you spreading the virus.

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Mj2k View Post
    Those wearing a valves mask really annoy me. Totally ‘I’m alright jack’ mentality.
    Many seem to wear surgical masks very loose (not air-tight) so not much better TBH.

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Ares View Post
    It works in the sense that it protects others from you spreading the virus.
    The data for that is sparse at best, but it doesn’t hurt to wear one. Unfortunately people tend to play with them and then touch other surfaces which isn’t ideal. Best advice I’ve had (from a medic) is avoid public transport, and walk around with your hands in your pockets so you don’t inadvertently touch anything if you do need to.

  23. #23
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    Obviously boris has bought shares in 3M ;)
    Some commentaotrs on the news have said it could be worse for the wearer as they transfer the virus from their hands to the mask by adjusting it when its on their face.

    Does anybody use the cycling masks with carbon filters?

    Another person looking for suggestions

  24. #24
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    You don't need to throw them way, the viral particles can stay alive for 48 hours at most outside a host. In sun, it's more like a few hours; I take mine off outdoors and hang on the line.

  25. #25
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    Seems far easier not to bother :)

  26. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Saint-Just View Post
    I don’t think you should buy a mask built to any standard as it is not designed to protect you and in most cases wouldn’t. For example those with a valve are completely defeating the purpose: you wear a mask to avoid spitting your viruses out. What protects you is that every one around you does the same. If one of those has a valve, he’ll share the virus if he is infected.
    The mask I have with a valve has 3-4 layers of fabric behind it, not sure what exactly the valve does but it’s not allowing direct air in or out.

  27. #27
    Thomas Reid
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    I bought some washable linen (4 ply) ones from a swanky woman's clothing store (Plumo) for both me and my wife. A variety of colours, in order to coordinate with my the rest of my outfit. :)

    Best wishes,
    Bob

  28. #28
    Grand Master Saint-Just's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrSmith View Post
    The mask I have with a valve has 3-4 layers of fabric behind it, not sure what exactly the valve does but it’s not allowing direct air in or out.
    Usually the valve is there to facilitate expirations and closes when you inspire, to force the air through the filter and stop dust particles. My (uneducated) guess would be that those layers are there to stop dust getting in as you expire due to turbulent air flow.
    'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.

  29. #29
    Anyone with facial hair should be made to shave so they fit properly.

  30. #30
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    I'm a childrens Community Nurse.

    Im supplied with cheap as chips ones by the NHS that are OK from the perspective of slightly reducing the likelihood of spreading it to patients if I have contracted it myself and am in the early stages.

    They do not form a good seal but seem to provide some measure of reassurance when I see people in their own homes or in clinics.

    As mentioned above I pay greater attention to what I am doing with my hands including keeping them clean.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    Many seem to wear surgical masks very loose (not air-tight) so not much better TBH.
    Surgical masks aren’t designed to be tight, they just help prevent the forward projection of respiratory droplets.

  32. #32
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    I bought some “Fluid Resistant Surgical Face Masks - Type IIR Certified” masks from Medisave website.

    I hoped that being a medical supplies site they would meet some measurable standard. Whether they are and whether they are effective, who knows?

    Not cheap - £1.20 a piece for something quite flimsy!

  33. #33
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    I'm buying Type IIR masks for work and lots of them but then we have to. About 65-75p each.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrSmith View Post
    The mask I have with a valve has 3-4 layers of fabric behind it, not sure what exactly the valve does but it’s not allowing direct air in or out.
    The valve lets filtered air out, valved masks are typically less sweaty and stuffy, which can make them more breathable and comfortable to wear

    Ignore the post from sj , current NHS guidelines stipulate FFP3 face masks for virus and bacterial infection control when the contagion is spread through coughing and sneezing (such as with the coronavirus).

    They are also often used by healthcare professionals when handling hazardous pharmaceutical chemicals, and certainly are my choice.

  35. #35
    I’m currently furloughed from one of the three major dental supply company’s,

    There are three types of masks dentists will use.
    1, IIR, surgical masks. These are 3 layer basic, all they do is stop you sneezing on people. Cost 12 weeks ago, £1 for 50, now £40 a box
    2, FFP2, these offer the wearer protection and a little less to others if you sneeze. Cost was £2 each now £5-10
    3, FFP3, N95, KN95 pretty much as above but higher filtration rate. Was £ 3 each now ???

    Options 2&3 WILL ONLY WORK IF FIT TESTED BY A QUALIFIED PERSON.

    If not Fitted then you might as well be wearing an IIR type mask. I am seeing a lot and I mean a lot! Of fake masks, all stamped up but with no certificate of authenticity.

    What the government is asking is that you wear a “face covering” this just stops you sneezing and coughing into the air.

    My advice is, if you just want to comply and be a responsible human, then buy the cheapest mask you can or wrap a neck scarf around your face.

    If you are a Vulnerable individual who wants to get protection then again as above and stay as far away from other people as possible.

    Dental professionals receive a lot of cross-infection training, including how to put gloves on and how to take them off, it sounds simple but there is a right and wrong way.

    I stood in a supermarket queue the other day behind an old boy in gloves and a mask, in the time I watched him I saw him answer his mobile, hold his car keys and lift his mask, all while pushing a trolley from the car park. None of the stuff he spent money on helped protect him in any way.
    Last edited by justin44; 4th June 2020 at 22:52.

  36. #36
    Master pacifichrono's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidL View Post
    I'm buying Type IIR masks for work and lots of them but then we have to. About 65-75p each.
    I wonder if these are Type IIR...


  37. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Maris View Post
    Surgical masks aren’t designed to be tight, they just help prevent the forward projection of respiratory droplets.
    Fair enough, but valved masks being criticised on here will also do this.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by J J Carter View Post
    You don't need to throw them way, the viral particles can stay alive for 48 hours at most outside a host. In sun, it's more like a few hours; I take mine off outdoors and hang on the line.
    It works with underpants.

  39. #39
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    Worth a look if you wear bog standard surgical masks. I have tried it and it makes a vast difference.

    https://youtu.be/2TTg53aAP8Q

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    Anyone with facial hair should be made to shave so they fit properly.
    +1.....but how do you enforce it? Years ago I was trained and certified for using fresh air breathing kits at work, one of the conditions was that you didn`t have a beard. Slightly different scenario but the principle's the same.

  41. #41
    Master Kirk280's Avatar
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    Please be very careful with any claims regarding facemasks. Do your research.

    If it sounds too good to be true....
    Last edited by Kirk280; 5th June 2020 at 09:04.

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by justin44 View Post

    There are three types of masks dentists will use.
    1, IIR, surgical masks. These are 3 layer basic, all they do is stop you sneezing on people. Cost 12 weeks ago, £1 for 50, now £40 a box
    2, FFP2, these offer the wearer protection and a little less to others if you sneeze. Cost was £2 each now £5-10
    3, FFP3, N95, KN95 pretty much as above but higher filtration rate. Was £ 3 each now ???
    Is this correct? I thought N95/KN95 is equivalent to FFP2 and FFP3 is equivalent to N99

  43. #43
    Justin - which company do you work for? We're always looking for good suppliers for our practice.

    We're currently using reusable P3s for our dental treatment - you change the filters on them, so works out cheaper for us. As Justin said, you need to be fitted for them.


    Quote Originally Posted by justin44 View Post
    I’m currently furloughed from one of the three major dental supply company’s,

    There are three types of masks dentists will use.
    1, IIR, surgical masks. These are 3 layer basic, all they do is stop you sneezing on people. Cost 12 weeks ago, £1 for 50, now £40 a box
    2, FFP2, these offer the wearer protection and a little less to others if you sneeze. Cost was £2 each now £5-10
    3, FFP3, N95, KN95 pretty much as above but higher filtration rate. Was £ 3 each now ???

    Options 2&3 WILL ONLY WORK IF FIT TESTED BY A QUALIFIED PERSON.

    If not Fitted then you might as well be wearing an IIR type mask. I am seeing a lot and I mean a lot! Of fake masks, all stamped up but with no certificate of authenticity.

    What the government is asking is that you wear a “face covering” this just stops you sneezing and coughing into the air.

    My advice is, if you just want to comply and be a responsible human, then buy the cheapest mask you can or wrap a neck scarf around your face.

    If you are a Vulnerable individual who wants to get protection then again as above and stay as far away from other people as possible.

    Dental professionals receive a lot of cross-infection training, including how to put gloves on and how to take them off, it sounds simple but there is a right and wrong way.

    I stood in a supermarket queue the other day behind an old boy in gloves and a mask, in the time I watched him I saw him answer his mobile, hold his car keys and lift his mask, all while pushing a trolley from the car park. None of the stuff he spent money on helped protect him in any way.

  44. #44
    I bought 10000 from Belgium 4 weeks ago, obviously originated in China, just disposable not medical, cost £0.29 each delivered.

  45. #45
    Grand Master Saint-Just's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by genesos View Post
    Ignore the post from sj , current NHS guidelines stipulate FFP3 face masks for virus and bacterial infection control when the contagion is spread through coughing and sneezing (such as with the coronavirus).

    They are also often used by healthcare professionals when handling hazardous pharmaceutical chemicals, and certainly are my choice.
    You can't stop yourself, can you?

    Healthcare professionals know what to get, and more importantly how to use them. As said already, if not properly fitted they are more dangerous than no PPE as you believe you are protected when you're not.
    So people asking about face mask here are asking about face covering for future use in public transport, for example.
    In this respect, FFP3 is not only not warranted but detrimental for 2 reasons
    1) it takes a reasonable experience to endure breathing through a FF2 or 3 mask. It's an effort, and the discomfort will lead to people handling the mask to readjust.
    2) the idea about having everyone wearing a mask is a collective protection: no face covering is perfect and protects the wearer, but all considerably reduce the droplets emitted during breathing, speaking or coughing; combined with social distancing and enhanced hand hygiene, they offer a very valid collective protection. If your mask has an exhaust valve, you exhaling unfiltered air, thus while you are increasing your own protection (with the caveats above) you are denying people around you the protection that they are giving you.
    'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.

  46. #46
    Grand Master Rod's Avatar
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    A mask, even a home made one, will help reduce droplet infection.

  47. #47
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    All of the discussion about the varying degrees of protection offered by the different grade of masks is all well and good, but there will be people on public transport who will just use whatever they have, some will have the mask on top of their heads, others will be taking them on and off to make phone calls, this is just how it is when you mix with the general public.

    You only have to look at the recent images of Bournmouth beach (or similar) to see the stupidity and selfishness of the people you will likely be standing next to on the tube. As always, it comes down to the lowest denominator.

    Just do whatever you can reasonably do to be safe yourselves and protect the potential spread of the virus to others, and that is about as good as it is going to get in reality.
    Last edited by Maysie; 5th June 2020 at 13:37. Reason: typo

  48. #48
    Master sweets's Avatar
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    To be fair to most valved masks, they valve used is usually a captive flap valve. Meaning that it is a thin silicone flap, sprung or hinged at the top, but that only moved within a cage.
    As such, it forms a very tight corner when open for exhalation, meaning that any sneezed particles are not able to turn the corner and are trapped on the internal surface of the mask. Any particle light enough to make it round this corner would make it out of most face coverings.
    Also, on many, the valve is not central anyhow, meaning that the air from a sneeze have to turn massively to get to valve in the first place.
    There really is no need to get the pitchforks out because someone wears a valved mask, they are being more responsible than anyone without a mask, and just as responsible as many people with ill-fitting or home made ones.
    Dave

  49. #49
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    National Rail have announced that wearing a face mask will be mandatory for travel from 15th June.

    Quote Originally Posted by Maysie View Post
    All of the discussion about the varying degrees of protection offered by the different grade of masks is all well and good, but there will be people on public transport who will just use whatever they have, some will have them on the mask on top of their heads, others will be taking them on and off to make phone calls, this is just how it is when you mix with the general public.

    You only have to look at the recent images of Bournmouth beach (or similar) to see the stupidity and selfishness of the people you will likely be standing next to on the tube. As always, it comes down to the lowest denominator.

    Just do whatever you can reasonably do to be safe yourselves and protect the potential spread of the virus to others, and that is about as good as it is going to get in reality.
    When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........

  50. #50
    Craftsman Integrale's Avatar
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    Current NHS guidelines are that a simple surgical mask is all that is required, even when dealing with Covid +ve patients. Only reason to up to FFP3 is in an aerosol generating environment (ITU, high flow oxygen, operating theatre).

    So, for Joe public the simple cheap cotton mask, or at best surgical face masks that prevent droplet spray in both directions, is all that is necessary.

    The world is full of misinformation.

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