Reply With QuoteGood one !
Thanks
B
Good one !
Thanks
B
Is this the one with all the covid tracking stuff in it?
If so its a swerve from me.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Thanks OP.
Just checked the Privacy folder and noted this:
B
Well, looks like I'll be sticking at 13.4
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Good luck with that.Originally Posted by berin
Surely that only works if you enable it, and if you install an App that uses it ?
I understood the Covid tracking from Apple and Google to be usable frameworks, rather than something like the NHS App.
Pete
No, iOS 13.5 introduced the ability for apps to implement COVID-19 tracking. However, if you don't download the apps etc. then it makes no difference.
The COVID tracking is only available to a single app per country which is issued by the government. No other apps have the ability to access this data.
They should make that very clear in the description above.
I think this is a huge reason that the track and trace measures won’t work. So many of us will refuse to be “tracked” in any way, even if it is apparently for the greater good. Shame.
These are the full terms of who can access the tracking API:
https://developer.apple.com/contact/...n_Addendum.pdf
Last edited by Phil Lee; 3rd June 2020 at 09:51.
That rather depends on your definition of "greater good".
Why do so many people get wound up over tracking apps?
I don’t understand it...
First of all iOS tracks your location anyway, as do pretty much all smartphones.
Secondly network operators can track mobile phone locations if they want, regardless of any user accessible apps or settings.
And in the case of Covid apps the primary use is a huge benefit to the individual using it, to keep you (And others), healthy and safe.
How many people are that important or are doing things where their location would even be interesting to anyone else?
The only real question I can see is why anyone would be selfish enough to not use one.
Only my simple views of course, I don’t mean to offend anyone, and if I have done I apologise in advance. 😎
I agree. And I don’t understand why people who happily use Facebook, Instagram etc complain when Zuckerberg sells your soul for $$$$
Sent from my iPhone using TZ-UK mobile app
I am always surprised when people apologise for expressing a view. Your view is as invalid / valid as anyone's, we have free speech in this country, and opinions can be so easily ignored.
Although the free speech part is highly debatable, I agree with the general idea
As to the opinion, it is one thing to (generally carelessly) voluntarily give away information on social media; it is another of letting entities that are regularly on the front page for data breach, access information that you would not want to share otherwise.
That information should be deleted after a rolling 15 days anyway. Where are the guarantees that it is?
Last edited by Saint-Just; 3rd June 2020 at 11:51.
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
NHS + IT = disaster
Too many outfits that are way better at this stuff have proved to be incontinent with customer data. The NHS? LOL.
Not so. The app our gov has released requires you to agree to a set of terms including that the app may be sold, and also that the data may be sold. TIt doesn't comply with GDPR, and doesn't have an option to delete all your data, and it overrides your NHS data opt out.
However, it also doesn't use the Apple toolkit (probably why it doesn't work), but the next one may so more than one app already, and the data has already been sold
https://privacyinternational.org/lon...we-know-so-far
https://www.google.com/amp/s/techcru...committee/amp/
https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/ope...vid-data-deal/
I'm unconvinced the tool kit couldn't be turned on silently.
My post specifically referred to tracing using the Apple/Google API which the privacy message refers to. Governments can chose not to use this API. The UK government has said they are using their own system which does not use the more privacy focussed Apple/Google API.
True. I'm in the weird situation of trusting an American tech giant with data more than our own government, who leak or sell data as they choose. At least someone would have to take Apple to court to get data they didn't want to share.
I just update my phone.
13.5.1 is now released. Now, I have my phone set to update manually so I can choose when and if I want an update. All the other updates bar 13.5 I’ve installed when the notification came through.
Today I get a pop up saying 13.5.1 will be installed *automatically*
I’ve now gone into settings and switched off (again) auto updates but this is an interesting move by Apple, to force upgrades.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
In 13.6 they are introducing setting which splits updates up into download and install. That way you can have your device download an update when it is available then install it at a time of your choosing.
Totally agree. We are going through a pandemic that will inevitably lead to another financial crisis and yet some are more concerned over the theoretical risk of a data breach than trying to help the government manage the situation. Those same people will probably sit on the sidelines and be vocal that the government are doing a crap job too. Amazed they even get a phone to start with, as you rightly say they are already walking around with a tracking device.
It's a sad state of affair when people trust Apple more than they trust their own government. But it is pretty factual. Furthermore, it's demonstrably legitimate.
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
Your choice, if you want to hand Information over, as it should be a choice if you don’t. Obviously there’s a trade off, but there’s nothing wrong with wanting privacy.
I’d also note there’s a difference between needing to get a court order for the phone company to reveal your location history, as is required now, and freely handing that information over. If you want to, that’s fine. I don’t.
I wouldn't overly politicise this, it is convenient blaming this government but you'd still get the same old short sighted line trotted out with ANY government. Don't care if I am even in the minority, it stands to reason that tracking is important to trying to control this pandemic and I will do whatever I can by way of tracking, wearing a mask, observing social distancing, etc to try to help and regardless of whether I have an iPhone, a Galaxy or whoever the government is.
You do what you think is right. I shall do the same. You are the one who chose this thread about system update to politicise it.
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
Could have sworn you were the one that chose to use this government as the reason you weren't going to help...
Don't swear, we're in the G&D.
This thread is about updating our iPhones to the latest release of iOS. There a re other threads for the issue you chose to discuss.
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
So last time I checked, you are not the site moderator, I have not sworn in G&D, others were first to choose to raise the issue of the Covid functionality of the latest version and you were the one that chose to politicise this by having one of your 20 a day barbs at the government.
There is no moral high-ground for you to take here and I am equally happy to stay in this thread and encourage everyone to download this software update to help the government try to control the pandemic, regardless of the colour of anyone's politics and what they think about the handling so far. Tracking is proven to be a key tool from other countries, there is nothing political about that, I haven't even made a comment here on what sort of job I think they are making of things, this is about trying to save lives not petty politics.
Go in the appropriate threads to discuss track and trace, and you’ll learn why the app is not fit for purpose.
For your information other comparable countries have much more robust data protection measures incorporated within their app, like non-centralised data (aka Apple-Google platform) or strong encryption only decrypted on testing positive (to contact those who have been in contact) and limited lifespan of data (rolling 15 days because there is no instance of incubation that long).
Science is saying the app is not fit for purpose and probably illegal (Non-respect of GDPR).
Track and trace (and isolate) will hopefully be fully functional in September. Only then will downloading an app will make any sense.
By refusing to download it now you give the developers a nudge to address the concerns and thus massively increase adherence and downloads.
Alternatively it will not be downloaded by enough people to make it functional.
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
Yet more sweeping statements. This is not a binary problem and in the same way science cannot agree over safe distancing, the benefits of masks, the way the disease mutates, etc, science is NOT universally saying the app is not fit for purpose. Equally sweeping to imply that the developers won't continue to evolve a product if they get solid take up, to the contrary, all apps evolve, and the greater the usage the greater test data at a time when they don't have the luxury of time to go through a normal product development cycle. It is an imperfect set of circumstances, as JFK said it's time to ask what you can do for your country, not go looking for reasons not to help.
As I said, you do as you think you ought to and I ‘ll do the same.
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
Well, it all seems rather academic given that the much ballyhooed NHS app has followed the great tradition of every NHS IT project since forever.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-53069690
“Envy of the world”.
Why do people talk about 'location'?
The system:-
* Generates a new 16 bit random number every 15 minutes.
* Broadcasts this number via bluetooth low power (if anything receives it, it does not say it has received it, it's purely one way, the only other information sent is the power level of the bluetooth transmission which may be varied to help work out distance)
* Listens for anything else (other phones) broadcasting their random number.
* All numbers sent and heard are stored for 30 days.
* Every so often a server is contacted to receive a list of random numbers that are associated with COVID 19 positive users (no other data apart from the numbers is received)
* Your phone then scans the list of heard numbers and the list received from the cloud for any matches
* If a match is found, the received power level is used to work out a 'risk' factor (how close the phone was to the other phone).
* If risk is above a certain level, the user is notified they may have been exposed and should get tested.
* At any time the user can voluntarily indicate they have COVID-19, and if they do so, their list of sent random numbers (for the past 30 days) is sent to the cloud.
No location is used anywhere, its purely proximity between phones.
The app sends nothing (to the cloud servers) without the users permission, and the user self identifying as being infected. And then all that is sent is the random number. (I think very limited data may also be sent, but nothing that can be used to identify or locate the phone or user)
And in a not unexpected twist, the UK are switching to the Apple/Google system.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-53095336
Indeed, but according to Hancock it's all Apple's fault. What a w****r.
F.T.F.A.
A better result for all concerned.
Posting Permissions
