Beautiful, simply beautiful!
Near perfection (No hooked seven?). Black dial for me, please, sir. The strap and deployant look great. I won't be wearing mine on a NATO so happy with the lug hole location (assuming of course that I'm lucky enough to secure one of the limited edition first run).
These sound as though they'll all be gone in the blink of an eye. Do you have an alternative movement lined up for the second run, Eddie?
Last edited by lughugger; 24th May 2020 at 07:50.
The lugs are much longer than on the Everest so I am not seeing an issue.Originally Posted by Oroccoco
In regards to the no hooked 7 I would say that this is an homage to the original IWC MK11 and not an exact copy is why there should be some subtle differences. As far as an alternative movement I know Eddie posted earlier that a new batch of Selitta movements would take around a year and that the ETA's were a no go because of the lack of availability who we can blame Swatch Group for. All that being said it will be a run at getting an order right in once available at the store.
I think we can take a que from how fast the black dialed Everest sold out in April, 20 minutes and all were sold.
Distance between spring bar and case looks similar to me.
Admittedly it's quite a thick strap. Anyway, idle speculation, doubtless TF Inc know what they're doing.
Last edited by Oroccoco; 24th May 2020 at 10:28.
That's perfect Eddie.
Congratulations you have produced some fine watches over the years with some outstanding pieces recently.
I will certainly want to add one to my collection.
Are you happy with the centre second hand Eddie? It perhaps could be a little finer, sleeker.
They look amazing. Can't decide which version I like more. I will probably end up buying both.
Black dial is epic. Great work, nothing close to the SMiths range at this price point IMHO
Looks can be deceiving. Changing springbars from 1.8mm on both my Damasko DA 37 and 40mm Everest to 1.6mm and 1.5mm respectively meant that straps that were a very tight fit pull through the gap nicely now. It doesn't take much.
F.T.F.A.
Great point. Thanks for the info.
This is the original.
This is the Navigator.
On the original the solid bars are right at the edge. But don't get too excited.
This is Eddie's example.
You very rarely see a Mk11 on a two-piece leather strap probably due to the solid bars but if you look at Eddie's example you will see quite a large gap between the case and the strap. Probably too much gap.
Much smaller gap in the Navigator.
What I propose is not so much to pull the holes back.. but only half a millimetre down... that will increase clearance plus keep (or even improve) the optics.
Last edited by abraxas; 24th May 2020 at 17:32.
"The whole purpose of mechanical watches is to be impertinent." ~ Lionel a Marca, CEO of Breguet
I'm probably in a minority of one, but it to me it needs a longer tail on the seconds hand. Otherwise, crack on!
I think you might be right...
It could be, but I don’t find it offensively thick.
What I am surprised nobody has called out is that the 5 minute hash marks are the same thickness/ weight as the minute ones. Whereas on Eddie’s vintage example, there are two weights (three If you count the 12-3-6-9)
Can we register interest or is it strictly first come first served?
(Maybe the first 50 could be allocated to regular forum users?)
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Sadly I've already asked about pre-orders and Eddie doesn't do them.
He could put some back for forum guys but I would imagine it's a first come first serve.
I think one way he could do it would be if you were to register for one, you then get a number. Eddie would then pick 300 from random and you get a link for payment.
Overall there are going to be a lot of disappointed people and I think I'll be one of them especially when it'll take another 12 months to restock.
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I think Eddie’’s way of selling watches is completely fair, first come first served. No preferences for anyone means a level playing field. Certainly refreshing compared to the nonsense that has been going on with certain well known brands requiring deposits, special waiting lists and only being able to buy if you’ve bought from them before etc. What a load of nonsense!!
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There is also the issue of the server which hosts Eddie's website crashing when the watch is released.
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My Mk11 next to a Smiths Military Prs-29b (now long gone). I got the Mk11 in the early '80s for 25 sobs, wore it for a couple of days, and it has been sitting in a safe ever since. I prefer to wear homages so I don't have to worry. I had more pics but I cannot find them on photobucket.
"The whole purpose of mechanical watches is to be impertinent." ~ Lionel a Marca, CEO of Breguet
Put far better than I could have...
"Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. The third time it's enemy action."
'Populism, the last refuge of a Tory scoundrel'.
Yes, I know it's being picky with what is going to be a great watch, but I agree with all of the above. I think the 5 min hash markers are a bit thicker than the 1 min ones on the prototype but the differential isn't as pronounced as the original. It's difficult to say exactly what it is with the centre seconds hand but it just doesn't look as refined/balanced as the original, that is a thing of great beauty!I think you might be right...
It could be, but I don’t find it offensively thick.
What I am surprised nobody has called out is that the 5 minute hash marks are the same thickness/ weight as the minute ones. Whereas on Eddie’s vintage example, there are two weights (three If you count the 12-3-6-9)
Given the overwhelmingly positive reaction to these prototypes, I wonder if some of the concerns expressed on the other thread regarding the boobies/non boobies logo have fallen away. Mine have.
I have a Mark XV which I wear a lot, so am primarily interested in the white/cream version. I was hoping it would be a brighter white, like the white version of the Mark XV which looked very sharp, but I suppose a cream dial is more in keeping with the Timefactors Smiths 'house white'.
Agreed on the 5-minute hash marks (could be more pronounced), minute hand (could be a bit shorter), second hand (could be a bit thinner) and brushing on the caseback (looks a bit rough compared to PRS-29).
It's funny how much discussion there was around the boobies logo vs. a more simple one but it looks like the prototype put it all to bed.
Looking forward to the final product later this year.
I would prefer a simpler, straight (but smaller) classic SMITHS but only in light of what could possibly/maybe/hopefully come further down the line with the GS De Luxe which would then need to have a very similar dial layout. I am aware that I am in a massive minority and think the dial looks great with the exception of the redundant circled L that I could do without.
As it happens I totally agree with you. Very sharp and as rare as hen's teeth.
PS And just look at that seconds hand!
Last edited by abraxas; 25th May 2020 at 12:29.
"The whole purpose of mechanical watches is to be impertinent." ~ Lionel a Marca, CEO of Breguet
I totally I agree with you. The seconds of the Navigator would need to be a tad thinner, and the shaft of the counter-balance a tad longer.
Compare the two sec-hands above... the taper of the JLC vs the needle of the IWC... both masterful in their own way.
"The whole purpose of mechanical watches is to be impertinent." ~ Lionel a Marca, CEO of Breguet
I'm one of those. Yes, the boobies could be gone, the 5-min markers could be thicker, the seconds hand could be thinner, and the sun could shine brighter on some days. After seeing the prototype I shut my trap. None of this is needed. Its a thing of beauty.
Last edited by TomasC; 25th May 2020 at 12:21.
Thank you for the great image Abraxas, how amazing are they both, simply stunning. Can I also point out that neither has anything between the centre pinion and 6 and don't look unbalanced at all (cough)
"The whole purpose of mechanical watches is to be impertinent." ~ Lionel a Marca, CEO of Breguet
IMG_7916.JPGIMG_7919.JPG
First of all, I must say how impressed I am with the prototype. Definitely going to try and buy one when they are available. Just thought I’d second what a fellow mention earlier in the thread re the minute hand. The minute hand does look different to the original but I think it’s nothing to do with the actual length (which as Eddie states is the same), more to do with how it tapers at the end. This from certain angles can I would think give the impression that it is in fact shorter. Pointless conjecture maybe, but it’s often the finest detail that can make or break it for some.
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Strange to say but think that cream dial is going to save me some money. Been looking at some more expensive pieces but now I've seen this I know where my money is headed now.
Both are beautiful watches. Lovely work Eddie!
Lovely as it is, I don't like pure white dials.
As it happens I totally agree with you. Very sharp and as rare as hen's teeth.
PS And just look at that seconds hand!
Eddie
Whole chunks of my life come under the heading "it seemed like a good idea at the time".
I was thinking about saying the same thing, but don't want to be overly nitpicky when it's really hard to tell from the photos. Plus I'm probably going to buy one anyway (if I can get one!). But with some of the other photos posted more recently, it looks like the original tapers into more of a needlepoint (a bit like on a Sinn, but more curvy), whereas the Smiths seems to be more of a normal sword-tip taper. Plus it also looks like the minute hand may be slightly fatter than the IWC, but that could just be because of the lighting & angle of the photo.
I would have to agree with the Master. I am not really a cream or white dial kind of guy, much prefer a nice black dial. I do have one watch that is a champagne color made by Pontiac that I like.
I guess it's a matter of balancing the negative space at the bottom part of the dial. There should be either an L or a pheon.
The Smiths looks to have slightly thicker minute and second hands, with a shorter tail on the seconds hand?
Last edited by Onelasttime; 25th May 2020 at 13:52.
I refer you to Abraxas's image in post number 76, I don't think either of the original dials shown there look unbalanced at all.
Both versions are looking lovely. I will definitely be getting the black dial, but that cream dial also looks gorgeous.
I disagree. I think the lug hole position is perfect where it is. I've seen many high end watches with a higher hole, and it allows the strap to follow the top of the lugs which looks very classy, kinda like a solid fit strap.[img]
What I propose is not so much to pull the holes back.. but only half a millimetre down... that will increase clearance plus keep (or even improve) the optics.
The only thing I don't like is the bezel. I thought this would have a more Mark bezel or at least one similar to the PRS-29. A Flat-top bezel gives it a very masculine edge to it that I love. I find the plainer no flat bezel like the Explorer out of character for a military watch. It's fine for an Explorer type watch, but not fine on a miltary watch IMO.
Last edited by grizzlymambo; 25th May 2020 at 18:11.
I am trying to understand what you are saying... and I think that I agree with you.
The original bezel has 3 sides. Horizontal top, the side at an angle, and the vertical base.
The Navigator appears to have only 2 sides. The vertical base, and the angular side going all the way up to the crystal.
Is this what you are referring to?
"The whole purpose of mechanical watches is to be impertinent." ~ Lionel a Marca, CEO of Breguet
+1 with you (both I think?) on this one. I commented on this in the other thread. I really like the chunky look that the 3-side bezel gives it. It makes it look stronger, less delicate. Didn't notice this was missing from the prototype until you pointed out that side view. The front-on view looks like it has the flat front, but that might just be reflections in the crystal.
Probably too late to change it now though. I'd rather than the bezel as-is than have something go wrong in manufacturing by trying to change this at the last minute. But if it's an easy change I'd vote in favour of doing it.
I did not notice its absence either until grizzly pointed it out. I assumed it was there (as it was copied from an original) but now I see that what I was looking at was "the milkiness" of the sapphire. Now let's see what the boss will say about all this.
"The whole purpose of mechanical watches is to be impertinent." ~ Lionel a Marca, CEO of Breguet
The flat top would have been possible with acrylic but the mounting method is different for sapphire. I personally don't think it's a big deal. The pictures don't show it clearly but there is abou 0.5mm of a flat top before the chamfer starts. There's a gasket at the edge of the sapphire which isn't present on acrylic.
Eddie
Whole chunks of my life come under the heading "it seemed like a good idea at the time".
Am I the only one who finds the crown thin? But everyone seems ok with it? I mean the original iwc seems thin too, but was hoping the smith to be thicker for easier winding like a khaki field.
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I am having trouble unseeing that now....bugger!
Don't know how much more than 0.5mm the flat top on this isThe pictures don't show it clearly but there is about 0.5mm of a flat top before the chamfer starts.
Yes, exactly.I am trying to understand what you are saying... and I think that I agree with you.
The original bezel has 3 sides. Horizontal top, the side at an angle, and the vertical base.
The Navigator appears to have only 2 sides. The vertical base, and the angular side going all the way up to the crystal.
Is this what you are referring to?
Check out the Longines Avigation BigEye for some ideas of how to do a kick-ass skinny "flat top" bezel. I have this watch and having the bezel be smaller than the case size, and having the bezel be 3 sided gives the watch very masculine looking edges that looks amazing in the flesh.
The IWC Doppelchronograph 3713 also has a multi-dimensional bezel that just looks fantastic. It might not work for the Smiths watch, but just wanted to spark some ideas.
Last edited by grizzlymambo; 26th May 2020 at 18:17.
The Mark XV has a thin top of less than 1mm. I think this makes the watch look a bit dressier and slightly less tooly/military.
That is a JLC. It has completely different parameters, though it looks quite similar.Don't know how much more than 0.5mm the flat top on this is
"The whole purpose of mechanical watches is to be impertinent." ~ Lionel a Marca, CEO of Breguet
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