London & Lockdown

[MrSmith]

As for “show me figures” well cows have killed 75 people over the last 15 years (source HSE) I would imagine a fair proportion would be dog walkers on farmland where the cows surround the dog and the owner tries to rescue it.

https://www.countryfile.com/go-outdo...ws-to-walkers/

[Kingstepper]

Recently seen several cars with bikes in the back or on cycle racks. That tells me you're driving somewhere for exercise. Not allowed. The police should stop and fine anyone with a bike in/on the car.

No, they're probably delivering supplies to an elderly relative and will be stopping on the way back to take the opportunity to cycle their favourite route.

[Ruggertech]

No. It’s rubbish because your figures obviously refer to working in a farm environment not walking. As I said unless you can show me otherwise.

You dont know anyone who has hurt himself walking one farm, but Tooks does. So there is a 50% chance right there in that small sample. Of course you can slip and hurt yourself man, any of us can at any time, your exercise is no safer than anyone else's and your argument is very puzzling.

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[Ruggertech]

Why exactly is that one trip better than the alternative two? Doesn't make a lot of sense TBH.

Well if you agree that staying at home makes sense, then only going out once instead of twice also make sense. Simples.

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[Passenger]

Recently seen several cars with bikes in the back or on cycle racks. That tells me you're driving somewhere for exercise. Not allowed. The police should stop and fine anyone with a bike in/on the car.

tbh my extended family are just as bad with their going out. Got a phone call yesterday from a niece telling us about a garden centre giving it's stock away by the side of the road. We wouldn't go out for this BUT it then twigged that said garden centre was a 30 minute drive from where the niece lives! When questioned about this we got the reply.... 'well I just had to get out but we didn't stop anywhere and if we did we kept out distance' - unbelievable. Isn't there a name for two statements that seem to re-enforce each other but actually don't e.g. 'didn't stop but if we did we kept our distance'. Another example, going to three different shops looking for chicken kievs! Honestly!

There's something grimly funny, sharply ironic about ignoring public health advice during a pandemic perhaps started by 'food' choices, to go out to search for something as unhealthy to eat as a mass produced chicken kiev

https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-...kiev-1.3465622

[Kingstepper]

Well if you agree that staying at home makes sense, then only going out once instead of twice also make sense. Simples.

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Not at all, out of the house for same amount of time. Simples, yes.

[Tooks]

The ‘my action is not harming anybody’ attitude
even though it goes against all the advice

Again, I am complying with all advice, be in no doubt.

I’m also able to see slight variances to that advice, and within the law, which genuinely also will not harm anybody.

Flapping about berating people on a watch forum for things they’ve not even done whilst being condescending about people who might be doing things slightly differently to you is what’s getting my goat.

[solwisesteve]

No, they're probably delivering supplies to an elderly relative and will be stopping on the way back to take the opportunity to cycle their favourite route.

Well you could try that excuse with the rozzers ;-)

[Ruggertech]

As for “show me figures” well cows have killed 75 people over the last 15 years (source HSE) I would imagine a fair proportion would be dog walkers on farmland where the cows surround the dog and the owner tries to rescue it.

https://www.countryfile.com/go-outdo...ws-to-walkers/

I remember a news story from a few years back when two lady ramblers were trampled to death by cows, they were walking up a slope, the cows got curious as they do and started following them and simply walked faster than the ladies could. Of course, this couldn't happen where old oak walks.

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[Tooks]

Well you could try that excuse with the rozzers ;-)

They’ve all bit disappeared around here to be honest.

I’ve done my 80 mile round trip work commute a few times the last 2 weeks. I was expecting to see a checkpoint by now, at least once, but I’ve seen nothing.

[Ruggertech]

Not at all, out of the house for same amount of time. Simples, yes.

At any time, for any purpose, lockdown or not, it makes sense to accomplish two or more tasks in the same trip.

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[TBKBABAB]

Again, I am complying with all advice, be in no doubt.

I’m also able to see slight variances to that advice, and within the law, which genuinely also will not harm anybody.

Flapping about berating people on a watch forum for things they’ve not even done whilst being condescending about people who might be doing things slightly differently to you is what’s getting my goat.

If you read your own post that wasn’t a reference to you just your attitude that other people are doing this and what is wrong with that.

And you are the one that decides that it will not harm anybody? I notice you ignored my reference to the NHS.

[Ruggertech]

Not at all, out of the house for same amount of time. Simples, yes.

Accidental double post.

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[Kingstepper]

At any time, for any purpose, lockdown or not, if you can accomplish two or more tasks in the same trip it makes sense on many levels.

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What levels?

Simples no.

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Seems so.

[Tooks]

If you read your own post that wasn’t a reference to you just your attitude that other people are doing this and what is wrong with that.

And you are the one that decides that it will not harm anybody? I notice you ignored my reference to the NHS.

Yes, because it had no relevance. Or are you trying to shame me now somehow as somebody who doesn’t support the NHS?

I think most people can see the difference between crass stupidity/selfishness, and things that are not illegal and will do no harm.

Clearly some can’t.

[oldoakknives]

I would never try and argue with a bloke who seems to spend all day and night on here doing exactly that, so no.

Paddle boarding is exercise, a paddle board is an accessory to that exercise, like a bike I guess. If they’re complying with ‘the advice’ what’s your problem with it?

I like being on the forum. So do many others. No need to get personal just because I disagree with you.

So if paddle boarding is ok what about canoeing and water skiing? Where do you draw the line?

[Tooks]

I like being on the forum. So do many others. No need to get personal just because I disagree with you.

So if paddle boarding is ok what about canoeing and water skiing? Where do you draw the line?

I guess you draw the line when you can no longer do your exercise safely or within the law.

Some horse riders went past my living room window yesterday, wasn’t sure about that as exercise.

Oh, and I totally agree with the personal bit, but you realise you do that yourself I presume?

[oldoakknives]

I remember a news story from a few years back when two lady ramblers were trampled to death by cows, they were walking up a slope, the cows got curious as they do and started following them and simply walked faster than the ladies could. Of course, this couldn't happen where old oak walks.

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I don’t walk in fields with cows with a dog especially if they have calves. Or fields with young bulls being raised for beef. I wouldn’t condone anyone else doing so either.

[TBKBABAB]

Yes, because it had no relevance. Or are you trying to shame me now somehow as somebody who doesn’t support the NHS?

I think most people can see the difference between crass stupidity/selfishness, and things that are not illegal and will do no harm.

Clearly some can’t.

well above pretty much sums up your attitude, again, it’s not against the law and I don’t think it will do any harm.

And my reference to the NHS was at least take on board what every single NHS worker is saying.


1. When am I allowed to leave the house?

You should only leave the house for very limited purposes:

• shopping for basic necessities, for example food and medicine, which must be as infrequent as possible
• one form of exercise a day, for example a run, walk, or cycle - alone or with members of your household
• any medical need, including to donate blood, avoid or escape risk of injury or harm, or to provide care or to help a vulnerable person
• travelling for work purposes, but only where you cannot work from home

[Tooks]

I don’t walk in fields with cows with a dog especially if they have calves. Or fields with young bulls being raised for beef. I wouldn’t condone anyone else doing so either.

Which is excellent behaviour and clearly you are possessed with common sense. You’re exercising good judgement.

You could perhaps credit more of your fellow humans with that too, whilst accepting there will be cretins in all walks of life and at all times.There are many many more though who exercise judgement just like you whilst doing something that perhaps you have no appetite for.

[oldoakknives]

You dont know anyone who has hurt himself walking one farm, but Tooks does. So there is a 50% chance right there in that small sample. Of course you can slip and hurt yourself man, any of us can at any time, your exercise is no safer than anyone else's and your argument is very puzzling.

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Only puzzling to some it would seem. I never said you couldn’t slip and hurt yourself. I said the figures referred to working in a farm environment not walking.

[oldoakknives]

Which is excellent behaviour and clearly you are possessed with common sense. You’re exercising good judgement.

You could perhaps credit more of your fellow humans with that too, whilst accepting there will be cretins in all walks of life and at all times.There are many many more though who exercise judgement just like you whilst doing something that perhaps you have no appetite for.

I’m not reading anything here to convince me that I should give people more credit to be honest.

[guinea]

I cleaned the car yesterday. A little while later it sent me a text telling me my starter battery was critically low.

It's been sat on the drive for a month. Am I allowed to drive it to top it up?

I went for a wander yesterday in Epping Forrest. The only problem there with respect to social distancing is the amount of dogs coming too close and requiring their owners to come over. If we are to continue to be allowed out then I'll be armed with a stick to beat them back. They need to be on leads and I'd rather scare a dog off than risk my family. As an aside, it's almost impossible to walk 20 metres in there without seeing a bag of dog poo. With deforestation on the Amazon for pet food, and plastic bags of poo everywhere, dogs really are an environmental disaster.

[Tooks]

well above pretty much sums up your attitude, again, it’s not against the law and I don’t think it will do any harm.

And my reference to the NHS was at least take on board what every single NHS worker is saying.


1. When am I allowed to leave the house?

You should only leave the house for very limited purposes:

• shopping for basic necessities, for example food and medicine, which must be as infrequent as possible
• one form of exercise a day, for example a run, walk, or cycle - alone or with members of your household
• any medical need, including to donate blood, avoid or escape risk of injury or harm, or to provide care or to help a vulnerable person
• travelling for work purposes, but only where you cannot work from home

Which one of those is my neighbour breaking?

She’s exercising (and walking her dog) and maybe even helping her mental health.

She’s driving the 1 mile to a private woodland where she has asked permission to be, and she’s driving home again.

It feels far more risky, to me, than her going shopping where she will again have to drive and 100% certain she will be with other people.

I’m afraid that none of this is simple black and white.

[Andyg]

Oh FFS! It looks as if the human race is doomed because people cannot apply common sense anymore or follow basic instructions.

Let me try to help.

1) Don’t drive. Unless it’s necessary to buy food or get medical support. Your car is a privilege - so treat it as such.

2) Don't leave your property unless you REALLY have to (food/medical). Fitness (outside your property) is a privilege - treat it as such, but see Rule 3.

3) Never forget that INFECTED zombies are walking the streets/shops/hospitals/parks/car parks, etc and if they get within 2 meters of you they can kill you.

4) If you have a dog and no garden, (it begs the question why?), and you need to take it out for a walk see rules 2 and 3. Plus don't forget if you die/get hospitalised who will look after your pets.

5) Breach the rules and face the prospect of becoming a zombie, which could result in a horrible death for you and loved ones.

This is NOT an exercise. It’s a Global Pandemic which has the capability to kill millions and create billions of zombies capable of inflecting YOU.


Finally remember that without a cure, the only way to get rid of this virus is to allow it to die out on its own. If the virus’s lifespan” is about 15 days and we can go without new inflections for this period, then the virus will lose its host (Zombies) and hopefully will die out on its own (unlikely I know), but by reducing the number of zombies it would make it much more manageable.

It’s really not rocket science. Unless you have superpowers (you don’t), you are just a zombie waiting to happen. Don’t become a Zombie!

[Onelasttime]

Yes, safest thing you can do is drive around all day.

Or just drive for 15 minutes there and back, observing the 20 mph speed limit. You’d have to be pretty unlucky to have any kind of accident that required hospital treatment at that speed.

[Tooks]

Well, Andy’s arrival signals the death of the thread, so that’s me out.

I’m off to work now, have a good day all.

[Alansmithee]

Or just driving for 15 minutes there and back, observing the 20 mph speed limit. You’d have to be pretty unlucky to have any kind of accident that required hospital treatment at that speed.

There is a formula that works this out - Nilson's formula or something like that - I do remember that as you increase speed from 20 mph - the chances you kill anyone you hit ramp pretty dramatically.

[TBKBABAB]

Which one of those is my neighbour breaking?

She’s exercising (and walking her dog) and maybe even helping her mental health.

She’s driving the 1 mile to a private woodland where she has asked permission to be, and she’s driving home again.

It feels far more risky, to me, than her going shopping where she will again have to drive and 100% certain she will be with other people.

I’m afraid that none of this is simple black and white.

Come on, unless you have been in hibernation you will know that anyone over 70 has been advised as below

We are advising those who are at increased risk of severe illness from coronavirus (COVID-19) to be particularly stringent in following social distancing measures.

This group includes those who are:

• aged 70 or older (regardless of medical conditions)

[jaytip]

Oh FFS! It looks as if the human race is doomed because people cannot apply common sense anymore or follow basic instructions.

Let me try to help.

1) Don’t drive. Unless it’s necessary to buy food or get medical support. Your car is a privilege - so treat it as such.

2) Don't leave your property unless you REALLY have to (food/medical). Fitness (outside your property) is a privilege - treat it as such, but see Rule 3.

3) Never forget that INFECTED zombies are walking the streets/shops/hospitals/parks/car parks, etc and if they get within 2 meters of you they can kill you.

4) If you have a dog and no garden, (it begs the question why?), and you need to take it out for a walk see rules 2 and 3. Plus don't forget if you die/get hospitalised who will look after your pets.

5) Breach the rules and face the prospect of becoming a zombie, which could result in a horrible death for you and loved ones.

This is NOT an exercise. It’s a Global Pandemic which has the capability to kill millions and create billions of zombies capable of inflecting YOU.


Finally remember that without a cure, the only way to get rid of this virus is to allow it to die out on its own. If the virus’s lifespan� is about 15 days and we can go without new inflections for this period, then the virus will lose its host (Zombies) and hopefully will die out on its own (unlikely I know), but by reducing the number of zombies it would make it much more manageable.

It’s really not rocket science. Unless you have superpowers (you don’t), you are just a zombie waiting to happen. Don’t become a Zombie!

I’m sorry Andy but it’s like fingers on a chalkboard to me every time I read it. It’s infection NOT inflection.

[RAFF]

Oh FFS! It looks as if the human race is doomed because people cannot apply common sense anymore or follow basic instructions.

Let me try to help.

1) Don’t drive. Unless it’s necessary to buy food or get medical support. Your car is a privilege - so treat it as such.

2) Don't leave your property unless you REALLY have to (food/medical). Fitness (outside your property) is a privilege - treat it as such, but see Rule 3.

3) Never forget that INFECTED zombies are walking the streets/shops/hospitals/parks/car parks, etc and if they get within 2 meters of you they can kill you.

4) If you have a dog and no garden, (it begs the question why?), and you need to take it out for a walk see rules 2 and 3. Plus don't forget if you die/get hospitalised who will look after your pets.

5) Breach the rules and face the prospect of becoming a zombie, which could result in a horrible death for you and loved ones.

This is NOT an exercise. It’s a Global Pandemic which has the capability to kill millions and create billions of zombies capable of inflecting YOU.


Finally remember that without a cure, the only way to get rid of this virus is to allow it to die out on its own. If the virus’s lifespan” is about 15 days and we can go without new inflections for this period, then the virus will lose its host (Zombies) and hopefully will die out on its own (unlikely I know), but by reducing the number of zombies it would make it much more manageable.

It’s really not rocket science. Unless you have superpowers (you don’t), you are just a zombie waiting to happen. Don’t become a Zombie!

Awesome post!

[catch21]

Oh FFS!...
Finally remember that without a cure, the only way to get rid of this virus is to allow it to die out on its own. If the virus’s lifespan” is about 15 days and we can go without new inflections for this period, then the virus will lose its host (Zombies) and hopefully will die out on its own (unlikely I know), but by reducing the number of zombies it would make it much more manageable.

It’s really not rocket science....

Eliminate the virus, does that work as a strategy? I can't say I share your optimism.

These are the ingredients I think we need:

Substantial herd immunity
A functioning, equipped, funded, manned, health care system
Infection testing
Antibody testing
A vaccine
A healthy workforce, jobs for them to do and a fully functioning economy

Fire away...

[Rodder]

Eliminate the virus, does that work as a strategy? I can't say I share your optimism.

These are they ingredients I think we need:

Substantial herd immunity
A functioning, equipped, funded, manned, health care system
Infection testing
Antibody testing
A vaccine
A healthy workforce, jobs for them to do and a fully functioning economy

Fire away...

It’s a balance, agree with some of the above but what we can’t have is more demand for intensive care beds than capacity. Presumably as we acquire more we’ll be in a better position to reduce restrictions.


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[Christian]

I like the sentiment but exercise isn’t a privilege. I‘m not in prison, nor have I been captured by ISIS or chained to a radiator Terry Whaite-style. In fact, I’m pretty sure that exercise isn’t seen as a privilege in North Korea even.

[dougair]

It’s a balance, agree with some of the above but what we can’t have is more demand for intensive care beds than capacity. Presumably as we acquire more we’ll be in a better position to reduce restrictions.


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https://www.newscientist.com/article...pert-predicts/

[Ruggertech]

I don’t walk in fields with cows with a dog especially if they have calves. Or fields with young bulls being raised for beef. I wouldn’t condone anyone else doing so either.

Aah, I somehow I knew it wouldn't apply where you walk.

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[Rodder]

https://www.newscientist.com/article...pert-predicts/

And I assume that’s because lockdown has worked. If it hadn’t and transmission increased we wouldn’t. If we increase beds, presumably we can reduce lockdown measures as we’ll be better in a better place to cope.

[oldoakknives]

I remember a news story from a few years back when two lady ramblers were trampled to death by cows, they were walking up a slope, the cows got curious as they do and started following them and simply walked faster than the ladies could. Of course, this couldn't happen where old oak walks.

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I don’t walk in fields with cows with a dog especially if they have calves. Or fields with young bulls being raised for beef. I wouldn’t condone anyone else doing so either.

Aah, I somehow I knew it wouldn't apply where you walk.

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I never said it didn't apply where I walk did I?

I said I wouldn't put myself in a situation where it could happen. It's common sense not to do so. I also said I wouldn't condone others doing so. It's tragic that people and dogs get harmed every year by cattle, because of peoples stupidity and lack of knowledge.

If you simply want to attack everything I say, you need at least to address what I say, not what you wish I'd said.

[monogroover]

The trouble with the 'lockdown' regulations really is that they don't necessarily, in the real world, have the same relevance and importance to everyone. For example if you live in a very remote area and you're genuinely unlikely to see someone when you step outside your front door, you'll probably feel you can go walking five times a day without doing any harm. If you live in Camden or New Cross, you definitely don't want to be doing that.

I do support the rules, and clearly it's desirable that the same rules apply to everyone, at least ostensibly. I also see a need for them to be fairly simple. But common sense has to play a part as well. The important thing is to do nothing likely to risk spreading the virus, or to risk spending the time and resources of the NHS.

[Enoch]

I guess you draw the line when you can no longer do your exercise safely or within the law.

Some horse riders went past my living room window yesterday, wasn’t sure about that as exercise.

Oh, and I totally agree with the personal bit, but you realise you do that yourself I presume?

As a prolific horse rider with 3 horses, my wife hasn’t ridden since the lockdown.. she’s of the opinion that if she falls off and needs hospital treatment she’s taking up unnecessary NHS resources..

So Charlie is chilling out on long term loan in Cumbria



Pixie is chilling out in a local schooling livery.. so she’s getting ridden by the instructor


And Rosie is chilling out in our field. She’s an unridden field ornament due to a back injury. But still gets exercised by hand on a lead rope.

[Tooks]

As a prolific horse rider with 3 horses, my wife hasn’t ridden since the lockdown.. she’s of the opinion that if she falls off and needs hospital treatment she’s taking up unnecessary NHS resources..

So Charlie is chilling out on long term loan in Cumbria



Pixie is chilling out in a local schooling livery.. so she’s getting ridden by the instructor


And Rosie is chilling out in our field. She’s an unridden field ornament due to a back injury. But still gets exercised by hand on a lead rope.

What a lovely trio!

We are horseless at the moment, which is quite fortunate in the circumstances. My wife hasn’t had the heart to get another one since her much loved beast had to be put to sleep a while back.

[Ruggertech]

As a prolific horse rider with 3 horses, my wife hasn’t ridden since the lockdown.. she’s of the opinion that if she falls off and needs hospital treatment she’s taking up unnecessary NHS resources..

So Charlie is chilling out on long term loan in Cumbria



Pixie is chilling out in a local schooling livery.. so she’s getting ridden by the instructor


And Rosie is chilling out in our field. She’s an unridden field ornament due to a back injury. But still gets exercised by hand on a lead rope.

Lovely pictures, fantastic animals. Made me smile, thank you.

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[solwisesteve]

They’ve all bit disappeared around here to be honest.

I’ve done my 80 mile round trip work commute a few times the last 2 weeks. I was expecting to see a checkpoint by now, at least once, but I’ve seen nothing.

I think they're all billeted around places like Scarborough, Whitby, etc... :-)

[oldoakknives]

As a prolific horse rider with 3 horses, my wife hasn’t ridden since the lockdown.. she’s of the opinion that if she falls off and needs hospital treatment she’s taking up unnecessary NHS resources..

So Charlie is chilling out on long term loan in Cumbria



Pixie is chilling out in a local schooling livery.. so she’s getting ridden by the instructor


And Rosie is chilling out in our field. She’s an unridden field ornament due to a back injury. But still gets exercised by hand on a lead rope.

Nice to see them all looking good!

[Mr Curta]

So Charlie is chilling out on long term loan in Cumbria...

Somebody very happy to see those photos here!
Top attitude, all the best.

[Enoch]

Somebody very happy to see those photos here!
Top attitude, all the best.

Still my favourite photo Matthew..

[learningtofly]

The trouble with the 'lockdown' regulations really is that they don't necessarily, in the real world, have the same relevance and importance to everyone. For example if you live in a very remote area and you're genuinely unlikely to see someone when you step outside your front door, you'll probably feel you can go walking five times a day without doing any harm. If you live in Camden or New Cross, you definitely don't want to be doing that.

I do support the rules, and clearly it's desirable that the same rules apply to everyone, at least ostensibly. I also see a need for them to be fairly simple. But common sense has to play a part as well. The important thing is to do nothing likely to risk spreading the virus, or to risk spending the time and resources of the NHS.

Of course, you're absolutely correct. Common sense should prevail whilst abiding to the intent of the regulations; however, what nobody wants is a diluted message coming from the government.

Once again, I need to pop out to pick up some essentials, as it's still very difficult to get online deliveries when we need them. I'm avoiding large supermarkets completely as I'm in a vulnerable group; however, we have a Tesco Express about three or four miles away, and the best route to avoid other traffic involves a couple of miles of winding scenic road. I could go in the car, but I'll probably take the opportunity to get on the motorbike, taking extra care for obvious reasons. I'll feel a lot better for it.

[Mr Curta]

Still my favourite photo Matthew..

Ours too. Happy days.

[anton863]

Of course, you're absolutely correct. Common sense should prevail whilst abiding to the intent of the regulations; however, what nobody wants is a diluted message coming from the government.

Once again, I need to pop out to pick up some essentials, as it's still very difficult to get online deliveries when we need them. I'm avoiding large supermarkets completely as I'm in a vulnerable group; however, we have a Tesco Express about three or four miles away, and the best route to avoid other traffic involves a couple of miles of winding scenic road. I could go in the car, but I'll probably take the opportunity to get on the motorbike, taking extra care for obvious reasons. I'll feel a lot better for it.

You are talking about common sense and then riding a motorbike to the shops? Surely any slip/clip/spill on the bike is a trip to the hospital no matter how careful you are? (You are always at the mercy of other, less careful road users). If you are in a vulnerable group then the surest way to catch it would be in the hospital where you are getting the broken wrist or whatever seen to.

[Kingstepper]

Personally I feel safer in larger Tesco stores as easier to keep distance from fellow shoppers.