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Thread: London & Lockdown

  1. #201
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    Take your car Tony, why take unnecessary risks, hospitals the last place you need to be right now given what you've said about your health concerns.

  2. #202
    Grand Master learningtofly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anton863 View Post
    You are talking about common sense and then riding a motorbike to the shops? Surely any slip/clip/spill on the bike is a trip to the hospital no matter how careful you are? (You are always at the mercy of other, less careful road users). If you are in a vulnerable group then the surest way to catch it would be in the hospital where you are getting the broken wrist or whatever seen to.
    Yes, I heard that point of view when the subject came up yesterday. However, given that the roads here are all but empty and I'm capable of being careful, it doesn't present a tangible risk. I'm well aware that other people have a different view, but please do bear in mind that - every day - tens of thousands of people are still using their bikes for commuting purposes.

  3. #203
    Grand Master learningtofly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Passenger View Post
    Take your car Tony, why take unnecessary risks, hospitals the last place you need to be right now given what you've said about your health concerns.
    I hear you, but 25 mph on dry and empty roads isn't really a risk.

    That said (and notwithstanding my other response above) the views being expressed will be carefully and seriously considered.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    Personally I feel safer in larger Tesco stores as easier to keep distance from fellow shoppers.
    This one is pretty quiet at the moment, fortunately.

  4. #204
    I'm hearing a heck of a lot more aggressive driving and honking going on around where I live. This was happening this weekend and last weekend, so it's not because I'm usually at work or the like meaning it's always been going on.

    I'm guessing people are driving more carelessly as the roads are more clear, so don't pay as much attention as usual?

  5. #205
    Grand Master learningtofly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by learningtofly View Post
    Of course, you're absolutely correct. Common sense should prevail whilst abiding to the intent of the regulations; however, what nobody wants is a diluted message coming from the government.

    Once again, I need to pop out to pick up some essentials, as it's still very difficult to get online deliveries when we need them. I'm avoiding large supermarkets completely as I'm in a vulnerable group; however, we have a Tesco Express about three or four miles away, and the best route to avoid other traffic involves a couple of miles of winding scenic road. I could go in the car, but I'll probably take the opportunity to get on the motorbike, taking extra care for obvious reasons. I'll feel a lot better for it.
    Changed my mind, and will use the car when necessary until such time as we're all out and about again. Thanks for the views expressed.

  6. #206
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    Quote Originally Posted by hughtrimble View Post
    I'm hearing a heck of a lot more aggressive driving and honking going on around where I live. This was happening this weekend and last weekend, so it's not because I'm usually at work or the like meaning it's always been going on.

    I'm guessing people are driving more carelessly as the roads are more clear, so don't pay as much attention as usual?
    When on my daily exercise Iím noticing the cars all on the road no longer appear to obey 30mph speed limits, seems utter stupidity.

  7. #207
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mj2k View Post
    When on my daily exercise Iím noticing the cars all on the road no longer appear to obey 30mph speed limits, seems utter stupidity.
    Iíve noticed this as well. I emailed my local police borough commander last week asking if speed limits had been suspended during lockdown.

    To be fair, he replied and said that I wasnít the only one making similar comments and that he would be instructing his officers to perform speed enforcement at check points going forward. Does seem that lock down has done some strange things to some peopleís behaviours.

  8. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tooks View Post
    Iíve noticed this as well. I emailed my local police borough commander last week asking if speed limits had been suspended during lockdown.

    To be fair, he replied and said that I wasnít the only one making similar comments and that he would be instructing his officers to perform speed enforcement at check points going forward. Does seem that lock down has done some strange things to some peopleís behaviours.
    I'd say:

    A man has been fined after he was caught speeding at 110mph on the motorway and told police he had been to London to buy bread. The man was stopped by officers at about 22:40 BST on Sunday travelling to Nottingham northbound on the M1. They said he had been in the car with his two young children and claimed bread in London was £1 cheaper.

    Leicestershire Police said the man was handed two fixed penalty notices and reported to court for the speeding.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-englan...shire-52183888


  9. #209
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    Oh my, some of you lack any semblance of common sense.

    The 'don't drive to exercise' rule is to stop people invading areas that may be less prepared for huge outbreaks of Covid, like a couple of weeks ago when there were huge crowds in the Lake District - how well do you reckon their tiny regional hospitals are prepared if there's an extra ten thousand potentially infected people in the area?

    And ook, I really hope that you don't do anything as reckless as taking a shower, since, you know, you might slip and break your hand getting out of it - you wouldn't wanna be a drain on the NHS now, would you?

    I haven't been out of the house for three weeks, so tonight I'm gonna go for a run as I'm getting way too chunky.

  10. #210
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    I see a new scurge emerging. Facebook Marketplace. It is currently full of people selling things Ďcollection onlyí trampolines requiring disassembly, lamps, rugs, second hand furniture. How travelling to pick up some second hand crockery can be seen as essential by some is beyond me, chances are they donít care, although the majority seem to be proudly displaying some sort of profile picture proclaiming Ďstay at home, save lives, protect the NHSí.
    Sorry, slightly OT as I live in Malvern not London but I imagine this is not unique to my area.

  11. #211
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    Quote Originally Posted by catch21 View Post
    Eliminate the virus, does that work as a strategy? I can't say I share your optimism.

    These are the ingredients I think we need:

    Substantial herd immunity
    A functioning, equipped, funded, manned, health care system
    Infection testing
    Antibody testing
    A vaccine
    A healthy workforce, jobs for them to do and a fully functioning economy

    Fire away...
    The herd immunity only works on those who survive! Plus it does not guarantee you will not catch it again.

    The Infection test tell you whether or not you have it. If positive, you have it and could die, plus you might get it again. If you donít have it, it doesnít mean you still canít. A Nil sum gain unless you think you have it, but actually donít.

    Antibody testing only tells you whether you had it, so until its proven you cannot get it again, it is a bit of a so what.

    A vaccine will take about a year (at least) to perfect, also it will require everyone on the planet to be vaccinated to irradiate the virus. It also will require everyone to be actually inflected with a live strain of the virus to tell your body to make the antibodies. Could be risky for some.

    Full agree with the last one, but itís dependant upon the above.

    Privately I believe that ultimately the herd immunity will be effective, just like it was with Spanish Flu. However donít forget that Spanish Flu infected 25% of the worlds population, of which up to 100m died. In todayís money that would 2B inflections and about 400 million deaths.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
    Friedrich Nietzsche


  12. #212
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    Quote Originally Posted by thestore View Post
    A friend saw the police dispersing everyone on Wimbledon Common. There doesn’t seem to continuity across the U.K. or even London as to how they are dealing with this.
    My garden backs onto Wimbledon Common. There's usually a handful of people on the common out the back, yesterday it was rammed. They'd all driven in, the Crescent where i live was packed with cars.

    I had to go out into central London (essential), for work and getting my 89 year old mum food.
    Went on my motorbike, central London was completely and utterly empty, so had a very long walk around all the empty streets inbetween popping into work and shopping for mum. Another benefit is not much social housing in the centre of town so the usuallly packed at weekends supermarkets were empty with no queues and full shelves.

  13. #213
    Quote Originally Posted by Tooks View Post
    But, my elderly neighbour is driving 2 miles to walk her dog somewhere remote and non public (with the permission of the landowner) as she doesnít want to be out in the village. I can respect that.
    Too many people want to have absolutely everything spelt out to them in black & white instead of using their own judgement of what is sensible or not. In the case of your neighbour I cannot see a problem with what she is doing, the overiding criteria from the government is for people to act sensibly and she no doubt believes she's doing just that.

    R
    Ignorance breeds Fear. Fear breeds Hatred. Hatred breeds Ignorance. Break the chain.

  14. #214
    Quote Originally Posted by ralphy View Post
    Too many people want to have absolutely everything spelt out to them in black & white instead of using their own judgement of what is sensible or not. In the case of your neighbour I cannot see a problem with what she is doing, the overiding criteria from the government is for people to act sensibly and she no doubt believes she's doing just that.

    R
    It's not about people believing they're acting sensibly, it's about acting sensibly.

  15. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tooks View Post
    Iíve noticed this as well. I emailed my local police borough commander last week asking if speed limits had been suspended during lockdown.

    To be fair, he replied and said that I wasnít the only one making similar comments and that he would be instructing his officers to perform speed enforcement at check points going forward. Does seem that lock down has done some strange things to some peopleís behaviours.
    I suspect the police were glad of your email as they are very quiet at the present time.

  16. #216
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    Quote Originally Posted by asteclaru View Post
    ...........
    And ook, I really hope that you don't do anything as reckless as taking a shower, since, you know, you might slip and break your hand getting out of it - you wouldn't wanna be a drain on the NHS now, would you?.......
    What I'm not going to do is take unnecessary risks at a time when the NHS is going to need all it's resources for more important things.

    If you think thats something to take the p out of crack on chap.
    Cuidich 'n Righ

  17. #217
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    Quote Originally Posted by steptoe View Post
    I suspect the police were glad of your email as they are very quiet at the present time.
    Well, they didnít complain, so not sure why you are?

    Or are we asking them to uphold only some laws now?

    If people canít go out and engage in Ďriskyí behaviour whilst exercising to avoid a hospital visit, why doesnít that extend to avoiding deaths or injuries via policing idiots on the roads?

    People need to make their minds up...

  18. #218
    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    It's not about people believing they're acting sensibly, it's about acting sensibly.
    As I said, I cannot see a problem with what she is doing, so in your opinion what is she doing that is insensible?

    R
    Ignorance breeds Fear. Fear breeds Hatred. Hatred breeds Ignorance. Break the chain.

  19. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    1) Donít drive. Unless itís necessary to buy food or get medical support. Your car is a privilege - so treat it as such.
    Oh if only our driveways were as long as yours, so we could run our cars up and down through the gears a few times...
    You can live in your car but you can't drive your house.

  20. #220
    Quote Originally Posted by oldoakknives View Post
    What I'm not going to do is take unnecessary risks at a time when the NHS is going to need all it's resources for more important things.
    Be careful out there: https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucele.../#679d849b9c48

    For the sake of balance, I've no idea which is the more riskier: dog-walking or taking a shower/bath, I guess the decision depends on what one thinks is the more important...


    R
    Ignorance breeds Fear. Fear breeds Hatred. Hatred breeds Ignorance. Break the chain.

  21. #221
    Grand Master oldoakknives's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ralphy View Post
    Be careful out there: https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucele.../#679d849b9c48

    For the sake of balance, I've no idea which is the more riskier: dog-walking or taking a shower/bath, I guess the decision depends on what one thinks is the more important...


    R
    Well done chap. Actually I thought it was important to follow the guidelines, but obviously you would know better since you see fit to ridicule that.
    Last edited by oldoakknives; 6th April 2020 at 18:27.
    Cuidich 'n Righ

  22. #222
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    Quote Originally Posted by Foxy100 View Post
    Oh if only our driveways were as long as yours, so we could run our cars up and down through the gears a few times...
    https://i.imgflip.com/1mxnum.jpg

  23. #223
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    I was talking to my sister in law in London earlier she was walking the dog there where children and others around all keeping distance.
    A cyclist wearing all the gear hurtled down at dangerous speed, she asked him to slow down he just abused her,I could hear it she has a kind and gentle manner.
    These are the people I hate.

  24. #224
    Quote Originally Posted by asteclaru View Post
    Oh my, some of you lack any semblance of common sense.

    The 'don't drive to exercise' rule is to stop people invading areas that may be less prepared for huge outbreaks of Covid, like a couple of weeks ago when there were huge crowds in the Lake District - how well do you reckon their tiny regional hospitals are prepared if there's an extra ten thousand potentially infected people in the area?

    .
    I donít think that is correct most of the people who did that didnít go to exercise they just wanted a nice day out.

  25. #225
    I think this thread needs one of these

    [

  26. #226
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    Quote Originally Posted by bwest76 View Post
    India has its own methods theirs lots of videos like this.




    We need more of this in the U.K.

  27. #227
    Anonymous location data from google/android phones.

  28. #228
    Master ryanb741's Avatar
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    2 week old prediction from someone at Imperial who said deaths would top out at 250 a day.

  29. #229
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    Boris in intensive care. His weight is his biggest enemy now. Hope he recovers

  30. #230
    Grand Master oldoakknives's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ralphy View Post
    Be careful out there: https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucele.../#679d849b9c48

    For the sake of balance, I've no idea which is the more riskier: dog-walking or taking a shower/bath, I guess the decision depends on what one thinks is the more important...


    R
    Iíll just leave this here for you. Since you seem to feel Iím taking it too seriously.

    Quote Originally Posted by stiglet View Post
    Not for the sqeamish

    From my pal's facebook page on Saturday.



    "Before I go any further I have NOT been tested for Covid 19 therefore I cannot say I have it. OMG I have symptoms of shortness of breath and a cough. Letís start with shortness of breath. Scary really scary as you canít do anything and I mean anything, walking to toilet is a struggle and by the time you get back to bed you just want to lie down!! Thats when the real problem occurs as that cough wonít allow it!! Lie down and you start coughing so badly you near pass out!! Sitting up eases it a wee bit but because youíve coughed a zillion times your body now aches and I mean aches like nothing Iíve ever felt before. You get a comfy position and 30secs later aches again so new comfy position and 30 secs later blah blah and so it goes on!!! I donít officially have it but whatever I do have I would not wish this on my worst enemy. Oh and the flem you produce is horrible and doesnít stop coming. So folks please stay at home and letís try and stop this virus ASAP as itís sh1tty trust me I know! Stay Safe and Indoors😊 Iím at day 5"



    He died last night. (50, ex-Scottish under 21 footballer , no underlying etc.)

    Wash your hands folks


    Cuidich 'n Righ

  31. #231
    Quote Originally Posted by ryanb741 View Post
    2 week old prediction from someone at Imperial who said deaths would top out at 250 a day.
    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.t...ospital-london

  32. #232
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    The herd immunity only works on those who survive! Plus it does not guarantee you will not catch it again.

    The Infection test tell you whether or not you have it. If positive, you have it and could die, plus you might get it again. If you donít have it, it doesnít mean you still canít. A Nil sum gain unless you think you have it, but actually donít.

    Antibody testing only tells you whether you had it, so until its proven you cannot get it again, it is a bit of a so what.

    A vaccine will take about a year (at least) to perfect, also it will require everyone on the planet to be vaccinated to irradiate the virus. It also will require everyone to be actually inflected with a live strain of the virus to tell your body to make the antibodies. Could be risky for some.

    Full agree with the last one, but itís dependant upon the above.

    Privately I believe that ultimately the herd immunity will be effective, just like it was with Spanish Flu. However donít forget that Spanish Flu infected 25% of the worlds population, of which up to 100m died. In todayís money that would 2B inflections and about 400 million deaths.

    I think you may be overstating your "so what" point there - I'm sorry I can't attribute the following to the virologist or physician who made this point on 5 Live a couple of days ago because I can't remember who it was. But he said that it was a fair assumption that recovering from the virus would leave you with immunity although it wasn't certain, and that the doubt around this was most likely caused by false positive test results.

    Also I suspect that not everyone on the planet would need to be vaccinated. If sufficient people are immune that the transmission rate falls below 1 (ie if say every 10 infected people pass it on to on average 7 or 8 between them) then the virus will die out - or so I would have thought, but would welcome a more knowledgeable opinion.

    This isn't a publication I would normally cite or trust frankly, but I don't think they're making stuff up here:

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...n-get-it-twice

    On Monday, both Sir Patrick Vallance, the governmentís chief scientific adviser, and Prof Chris Whitty, Boris Johnsonís chief medical adviser, sought to reassure the public. Those who have had the virus once will develop some immunity, they said Ė and it is rare to get an infectious disease again.

    When Vallance was asked on Monday if the Japanese case meant herd immunity was no longer achievable, he replied that some people do catch infectious diseases a second time, but that it is a rare occurrence. There was no evidence to suggest that it would occur with the coronavirus, he added.

    Prof Whitty explained that with diseases, even if there is no long-term immunity, there is normally some short-term immunity.

    Prof Jon Cohen, emeritus professor of infectious diseases at Brighton and Sussex Medical School, said: ďThe answer is that we simply donít know [about reinfection] yet because we donít have an antibody test for the infection, although we will have soon.

    ďHowever, it is very likely, based on other viral infections, that yes, once a person has had the infection they will generally be immune and wonít get it again. There will always be the odd exception, but that is certainly a reasonable expectation.Ē

  33. #233
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    London & Lockdown

    Patrol completed. No paddle boards visible tonight, just a few foxes that look completely outfoxed with whatís going on, where the scraps have gone and why itís so quiet.

    Thought Iííd mix it up a little and feature a watch I got from the forum.


  34. #234
    Grand Master Andyg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by monogroover View Post
    I think you may be overstating your "so what" point there - I'm sorry I can't attribute the following to the virologist or physician who made this point on 5 Live a couple of days ago because I can't remember who it was. But he said that it was a fair assumption that recovering from the virus would leave you with immunity although it wasn't certain, and that the doubt around this was most likely caused by false positive test results.

    Also I suspect that not everyone on the planet would need to be vaccinated. If sufficient people are immune that the transmission rate falls below 1 (ie if say every 10 infected people pass it on to on average 7 or 8 between them) then the virus will die out - or so I would have thought, but would welcome a more knowledgeable opinion.

    This isn't a publication I would normally cite or trust frankly, but I don't think they're making stuff up here:

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...n-get-it-twice

    On Monday, both Sir Patrick Vallance, the governmentís chief scientific adviser, and Prof Chris Whitty, Boris Johnsonís chief medical adviser, sought to reassure the public. Those who have had the virus once will develop some immunity, they said Ė and it is rare to get an infectious disease again.

    When Vallance was asked on Monday if the Japanese case meant herd immunity was no longer achievable, he replied that some people do catch infectious diseases a second time, but that it is a rare occurrence. There was no evidence to suggest that it would occur with the coronavirus, he added.

    Prof Whitty explained that with diseases, even if there is no long-term immunity, there is normally some short-term immunity.

    Prof Jon Cohen, emeritus professor of infectious diseases at Brighton and Sussex Medical School, said: ďThe answer is that we simply donít know [about reinfection] yet because we donít have an antibody test for the infection, although we will have soon.

    ďHowever, it is very likely, based on other viral infections, that yes, once a person has had the infection they will generally be immune and wonít get it again. There will always be the odd exception, but that is certainly a reasonable expectation.Ē
    Itís sort of comforting to know that once you have it, you cannot get it again, but the problem with viruses is that they can remain in the body and can reactivate later. For example Chickenpox can become shingles, which is contagious. Hence making sure everyone is vaccinated is the only sure fire way to eliminating it once and for all. Although I agree, the more people who are immune the less likely it can be transmitted.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
    Friedrich Nietzsche


  35. #235
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    Itís sort of comforting to know that once you have it, you cannot get it again, but the problem with viruses is that they can remain in the body and can reactivate later. For example Chickenpox can become shingles, which is contagious. Hence making sure everyone is vaccinated is the only sure fire way to eliminating it once and for all. Although I agree, the more people who are immune the less likely it can be transmitted.
    Are you sure you canít get it again? Have you seen the news from Singapore and South Korea. Recovered patients are testing positive - ie they have it again, not that they had it.

  36. #236

  37. #237
    Grand Master Andyg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by joe narvey View Post
    Are you sure you canít get it again? Have you seen the news from Singapore and South Korea. Recovered patients are testing positive - ie they have it again, not that they had it.
    I have no idea, however Monogrooverís post suggested that once you have it you are unlikely to get it again. It could be that the folks in Singapore/Korea simply were not fully recovered before being released from hospital.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
    Friedrich Nietzsche


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