Reply With QuoteYeah let's take on OPEC, they might be getting a little bit carried awayOriginally Posted by ryanb741
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Hopefully they'll pump RDSB 😊
Yeah let's take on OPEC, they might be getting a little bit carried away
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Gamestop up 35% since market close 35 minutes ago.
Donation to the FR made. Thank you Raffe. The best tip I've ever had. Maybe apart from the one I got before the 2:30 at Newmarket, when my jockey got stuck in the gates.....
Good man. Glad you got out on top, I was a bit concerned for you.
Bloomberg reporting that Robinhood is in financial trouble.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ource=url_link
Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.
From all the madness I've read over the last couple of days, finally at least someone who knows what's going on: https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreak...pening_on_the/
Push back against the establishment. The times they are a changing!
Also AMC up 25% and BTC pumping.
Tomorrow we feast in Valhalla Bois!
But their 'gains' mirror others' losses. In the GameStop situation, it's a zero-sum game: when the bottom drops out (soon), winnings=losings. If the losers are mostly hedge and mutual funds, that translates into losses for everyday people and their retirement savings in many cases.
That rule seems so simple...but in practice it's very difficult (as I'm sure you know). The risks are far greater getting in at the beginning when no one really knows if the strategy will be mass-adopted and succeed, or if it's ignored and you lose your money. You're right, though, if you have the experience, judgement, and knowledge necessary to properly evaluate the "opportunity," you could be a winner!
The finance people I've spoken to have universally said they won't shed a tear for Melvin Capital (and their owners Citadel) who are notorious for unethical practices with how they drive down stock valuations on shares they have shorted and who got hammered by the WSB action to drive up GME stock. Worth noting as well that Citadel also owns......Robin Hood......Hmmmmm
If truth be told, the establishment have their tentacles everywhere, hedging their bets, friend and foe.
Enjoy seeing them squirm though, once in a while, especially when I’ve assisted
I don't want to be a d!ck about it PC but if that is how you feel, take all your money out of your stocks. Because someone is losing on the other end.
Yes, you're being a dick.The difference is I'm not conspiring with others to artificially jack up a stock's price just so I can sell and leave the other guy to suffer the inevitable price drop.
When you buy or sell you are acting on information. I don't see how it's suddenly got a bit unfair. If you don't think stocks have been manipulated before 2021 you are kidding yourself.
I will add that I don't revel in the losses of anyone as a result of WSB or 2008 or any other market mover.
Some you win.
As opposed to some Hedge Funds who short stocks and drive down their prices artificially by spurious 'research' publications and so on.Yes, you're being a dick.
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For every GameStop theres a Wirecard
There will be a slew of private investors who got burned trying to ride these waves, irrespective of RH banning purchases, as has been said in here, if you werent in before the momentum built, youre just straight out gambling and trying to time the market.
However you look at it, the last couple of weeks dont exactly conclude that the market is operating efficiently, whether for private investors or hedge funds
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Did you read that on your favourite Reddit board again?
Fun fact: Citadel neither owns Melvin nor Robinhood.
If anyone is interested why RH really limited access to trading, read this. Not that I think will be interested when there is a simple explanation that much easier ties with your bias of everybody else conspiring against you....
https://twitter.com/KralcTrebor/stat...52686165225478
Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.
Ok calm down on the aggression please. Go to your happy place or whatever please.
Re Melvin, ok correction they did bail out Melvin with nearly $3bn in return for a revenue share. So they are technically part owners.
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...301214477.html
Citadel also pay large sums of money to Robin Hood for customer data so your statement is true that they don't own them.
Regarding everyone conspiring against me - I did not say that I said it is what it is and was philosophical about it other than the fact it appears clear parts of the Financial Services industry have their dark elements and shenanigans go on below the surface. And I'd wager yesterday's episode would have enabled people like Citadel to conveniently extricate themselves from their situation. More may be found out as time goes on. It is what it is.
Anyway let's hope that the next time a Hedge Fund tries to profit too much from shorting and destroying a business that they too get de-platformed from Bloomberg in the name of 'market orderliness' and 'consumer protection'!
Last edited by ryanb741; 29th January 2021 at 08:00.
Robinhood - 'Let the People Trade!'
People - *Trade*
Robinhood - 'No, not like that'
;)
Last edited by ryanb741; 29th January 2021 at 08:07.
I knew you wouldn't understand it. Thanks for providing my point.
Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.
You are posting two falsehoods in one sentence, and when I correct you, I am aggressive?
Maybe you would care to explain how shorting a stock is destroying a business? I'd say Gamestop's management didn't need any outside help with destroying the business, and the share price reflected that pretty accurately until the bois started to have their go. And how Melvin shorted the stock of Gamestop 'aggressively'? To the best of my knowledge the GME position was about 1% of their portfolio as of 31/12/2020.
But I know you are not interested in facts, you are just typing what you read on your favourite reddit channel - just like you do on the Covid thread.
And I am not even going to ask what 'de-platformed from Bloomberg' is supposed to mean because I know that you have no idea what Bloomberg is and what utility it serves to financial markets.
Ryan, you are nothing but a clown.
And Raffe what you are also begins with a C so at least we have that in common;)
I made a resolution in 2021 not to get involved in petty spats with frustrated keyboard bullies so I'll leave you in peace. Have a good day.
OK fine, we have now established you are out of arguments.
Maybe we can also agree that you will stop posting your simple truths? That would be a real win-win.
100% agree.If truth be told, the establishment have their tentacles everywhere, hedging their bets, friend and foe.
Enjoy seeing them squirm though, once in a while, especially when Ive assisted
You're paying fees to have someone do it for you.
There's no one in this game squeaky clean, when all's laid bare.
One approach is just more accepted than the other.
Thanks footsie, kids are crying , going back up chimneys later
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I normally watch this channel for car reviews but he simplifies the situation ( I cant comment if he does so accurately, maybe someone here can ) for someone with an interest but no real knowledge such as myself.
https://youtu.be/NropOy5PE68
In the real world away from sub reddits the politics around vaccine supply , vaccine efficacy and dire economic outlook continue to plague the markets . And now a forth vaccine which is seemingly now whatevs
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Two very different things.
One is to anticipate future stock moves and betting money on it. In this regard there is absolutely no difference in buying a company's shares or shorting it.
The other one is a conspiracy to move share prices beyond any sensible price target in order to gain a personal benefit by exploring mechanisms to hurt other investors. Short squeezes as such are not new and have happened before, some of them through happenstance and some of them planned and targeted. There was definitely involvement from some hedge funds in such elaborate short-squeezing schemes in the past and that was just as unethical and immoral as the actions by WSB traders.
To say that these are the same is not understanding financial markets. Melvin was nothing but a diversified long/short hedge fund and was never involved in planned short squeezes or anything similar. They clearly underestimated the risks of sitting in a number of crowded trades, but they didn't hurt anyone with their investments.
This still applies:
$GME up 100% and $AMC up 51% pre market. And BTC pumping.
Both of them up about 20% versus yesterday's after-hours trading - but that doesn't sound as sensational.
Just go on.
Up 100% and 51% vs yesterday's close. Not sensational, just factual based on the stated market close position. Or would it be better to say up 20% vs the pre market position it was 5 hours ago? No. Just like on Bloomberg they will state the DJIA finished up 1.84% on the day not up 0.26% vs the level it was at at 2.27pm.....
What pre-market from 5 hours ago? Pre-market trading opened half an hour ago, and the sensible way to compare prices is against the close of the after-hours. Regular session to regular session, and pre-market to after-hours.
Always impressed by the knowledge on this thread. I am by no means a stocks and shares professional but I always like to have a read of this thread to better equip me, particularly the knowledge of Ryan who clearly knows a thing or two!
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This is the reason why BTC jumped a short while ago:
Difficult enough with all the misinformation posted all over the internet, but this is the second time in a few days that elonm741 has posted stuff with the only intention to pour gasoline into the fire.
I am speechless.
Hes a loose cannon, the SEC will go after him at some point
Ironically a guy worth more than the richest hedge fund guys combined, but hes one of us
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Back in November the markets just decided life would be back to normal by March.
This sh1tshow is not ending any time soon. You can write off 2021. God help us if another more difficult mutant strain takes hold. The South African strain is already present in the US.
Do you mean write off 2021 from an Economic rebound perspective or from a 'return to (sort of) normal' perspective re coming out of lockdowns?
Economic activity you'd expect would leap forward when people can do house renovations and go for meals and holidays etc etc , things may not be normal because we can only mix with so many people or wear masks whatevs, but spending money is what matters
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Last edited by Daveya.; 29th January 2021 at 11:51.
That's my view currently, it's unlikely life is going to get back to normal this year. Hopefully next.
I still have hope for some form of normalisation in Q3/Q4, but am very aware that I may be too optimistic.
Raffe are you saying in your post above (too long to quote) that institutional investors have not ever manipulated markets in other to do exactly what the WSB crowd have done?
Apologies, Ive re-read your post. But I still
maintain that if the big hedge funds can do it, so can the little man.
And if going beyond a certain point should not be allowed, be it short selling or short squeezing, then regulations should address it and be applied to all. Not just the little guy
Last edited by demonloop; 29th January 2021 at 12:09.
Nothing wrong with a little optimism Raffe, I will acknowledge there is a chance for some kind of Q3/Q4 normalisation. Tbh I'm attempting to mentally prepare myself that this year may well be another mainly spent on 'pause' with limited opportunities for social interaction and travel, though that's OK we can still live/cope with the situation...it's not like we're actually at war, rationing and bombs falling around us... and then IF events do prove me wrong it's all good, I'll be pleasantly surprised.
I obviously said the exact opposite, there are examples of market manipulation by institutional investors or hedge funds, very recent example the squeezing of shorts in GSX TechEdu by Singaporean fund QQ. I'd say that this was even more unethical, as it was done in conspiracy with the Chairman and CEO of the underlying company, which is a fraud. It's all a long story and if intersted you can read about it here.
It's wrong when hedge funds do it, and it's wrong when private individuals do it. The above case has been referred to the SEC and an investigation is ongoing (obviously held under wraps during the Trump administration, but I still have hope that it will finally have some sort of outcome).
Last edited by Raffe; 29th January 2021 at 12:23.
Two wrongs don't make a right unfortunately, just an even more skewed, unhealthy market.
I think it will be the same as last year. Some normalisation in the summer then hunkering down again in winter. The world won't be going back to normal anytime soon imo.
Robinhood just confirmed that they raised 1 bln USD fresh capital from existing investors.
New variants beyond U.K. and RSA is always a risk.
U.K. struggling to give the proper 2 doses on schedule, resulting in lower immunity. Best forecast is end of summer for complete vaccinations. Novovax is still 3 months from implemtation
Europe at least 2 months behind U.K. in vaccinations, and speed-up seems unlikely at the moment. Europe will not be done this year.
ROW - who knows, 2023?
US - 300 million vaccinated in a few months my arse especially given the great handover from The Donald. Loads of anti-vaxxers.
Throw is a new sh1tty variant (this virus is mutating all the time) and add another 6 months to the schedule.
U.K. may get back to a bit of internal normality by the end of the summer. But what is normality? Border closed for all of 2021. Only opening to vaccinated countries in 2022. ROW could be 2023.
Normality with £400 billion of public sector debt - more if the furlough scheme carries on past March - likely.
Normality with everyone now working from home. Less car purchases, no train travel, no sandwich shops.
The effects of this pandemic have barely been felt. Once the furlough scheme is wound up and all the structural change of society happens, normality will be very different IMO.
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