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Thread: Creation watches location?

  1. #1
    Master johnbaz's Avatar
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    Question Creation watches location?

    Hi all

    I've been fancying a nice Orient dive watch, On fleabay second hand ones seem to be listed for (Or selling at) the same price as new ones at Creation watches, If I buy one from this company, Is it in the UK or another country that will attract import duty and handling fees?, Anyone know or better, Bought from them?


    Failing that, Anyone thinking of selling one?

    EDIT- Doh!!, Just found their location on the website- Singapore!!


    Cheers, John
    Last edited by johnbaz; 29th January 2020 at 01:58.

  2. #2
    Grand Master markrlondon's Avatar
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    First of all, there will be no Customs Duty applied to any watch imports in practice, except for shipments of a large number of watches. Usually it will just be VAT and the courier's handling fee.

    Historically Creation shipped most watches direct from Singapore. This usually attracted no import VAT at the UK end because, in common with many people and businesses in countries like Hong Kong, Singapore, China, Malaysia, and so on, they simply didn't tell the truth on the customs declaration.

    At the same time, they sometimes shipped watches from a partner in Japan. This was usually high value Seikos. In these cases, the customs declarations were always filled in accurately and thus did attract VAT at the UK end.

    Slightly more recently, however, things changed: Creation did still ship direct from Singapore but it would seem that the courier they used had become something of a stickler for accurate customs declarations and so it was then more likely (but still not certain) that imports by this route would be caught for import VAT at the UK end.

    Because of this, Creation started doing what an increasing number of far eastern firms have begun to do: They set up a UK-based warehousing/logistics operation, imported the watches into that, and then shipped from there to UK customers[1]. This allowed them to quote end user prices where they had already accounted for VAT.

    You could choose between direct from Singapore vs. local UK postage on the Creation website.

    More recently still, the option to choose shipping method seems to have disappeared from Creation's site, from what I can see. I haven't used them in a while so I don't know if they have gone back to shipping direct from Singapore (or from Japan for certain model sold through partners) for all watches or have moved to a UK-based warehouse for all UK orders.

    In brief, if they have gone back to shipping direct from Singapore then UK customers should be prepared to pay the 20% VAT and courier's handling fee but be pleased if it does not actually get charged. :-)




    Footnote:-
    1: Just before Creation started doing this, this method of more efficient shipping to UK customers came under attack by HMRC as a large number of Chinese and far eastern companies doing this were not registering for UK VAT when they should have done. They were (knowingly in many cases) evading UK VAT to bring better prices to their customers, as they would have done previously when they were shipping direct from their home countries with incorrect customs declarations. I do not know if Creation ran this illegal scheme or correctly registered for VAT in the UK.
    Last edited by markrlondon; 29th January 2020 at 09:27.

  3. #3
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by markrlondon View Post
    First of all, there will be no Customs Duty applied to any watch imports in practice, except for shipments of a large number of watches. Usually it will just be VAT and the courier's handling fee.

    Historically Creation shipped most watches direct from Singapore. This usually attracted no import VAT at the UK end because, in common with many people and businesses in countries like Hong Kong, Singapore, China, Malaysia, and so on, they simply didn't tell the truth on the customs declaration.

    At the same time, they sometimes shipped watches from a partner in Japan. This was usually high value Seikos. In these cases, the customs declarations were always filled in accurately and thus did attract VAT at the UK end.

    Slightly more recently, however, things changed: Creation did still ship direct from Singapore but it would seem that the courier they used had become something of a stickler for accurate customs declarations and so it was then more likely (but still not certain) that imports by this route would be caught for import VAT at the UK end.

    Because of this, Creation started doing what an increasing number of far eastern firms have begun to do: They set up a UK-based warehousing/logistics operation, imported the watches into that, and then shipped from there to UK customers[1]. This allowed them to quote end user prices where they had already accounted for VAT.

    You could choose between direct from Singapore vs. local UK postage on the Creation website.

    More recently still, the option to choose shipping method seems to have disappeared from Creation's site, from what I can see. I haven't used them in a while so I don't know if they have gone back to shipping direct from Singapore (or from Japan for certain model sold through partners) for all watches or have moved to a UK-based warehouse for all UK orders.

    In brief, if they have gone back to shipping direct from Singapore, UK customers should be prepared to pay the 20% VAT and courier's handling fee, but be pleased if it does not actually get charged. :-)




    Footnote:-
    1: Just before Creation started doing this, this method of more efficient shipping to UK customers came under attack by HMRC as a large number of Chinese and far eastern companies doing this were not registering for UK VAT when they should have done. They were (knowingly in many cases) evading UK VAT to bring better prices to their customers, as they would have done previously when they were shipping direct from their home countries with incorrect customs declarations. I do not know if Creation ran this illegal scheme or correctly registered for VAT in the UK.
    They run citywatches.co.uk website. They seem to have slapped the fees on top of all the prices there so you know what you are getting.

    Still cheaper than the highstreet but not nearly the deals they used to be.

    I remember getting Seiko monster gen 2`s for about £110 delivered.

    Now profiteering people sell used ones for triple that lol because discontinued,

    they were barely worth 110 I thought at the time, scratched easily and I remember thinking it was low quality steel Seiko use

  4. #4
    Master
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    Thatís right they ship out of City Watches based in Salford, Manchester if you choose Royal Mail and you wonít be stung with VAT and DHL handling fees. You can of course buy direct from City Watches but they slightly higher priced. Creation Watches are based in Singapore. I bought from there recently and received a faulty watch which was returned to their Salford address. It took a while to receive the refund during which time Iíd wished Iíd bought from a UK retailer. The good old days of super cheap Creation watches are over, donít think Iíll be using them again.

  5. #5
    Craftsman
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    Also look on Serious Watches in the Netherlands,

    Next day postage and no VAT to pay, they also stock most Orient models

  6. #6
    Master johnbaz's Avatar
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    Many many thanks chaps, WOW!! What an education!!


    Kind regards, John

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