Reply With QuoteI'm amazed at the difference this season between CLC and SV. Seb seems to be continually 2-3 tenths slower than CL. Loss of form / mojo or is he being shown up by a more talented team mate?
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Safety car is going to ruin every race here this weekend
I'm amazed at the difference this season between CLC and SV. Seb seems to be continually 2-3 tenths slower than CL. Loss of form / mojo or is he being shown up by a more talented team mate?
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Despite what he says, I think Seb can’t wait to get out of that car.Originally Posted by subseastu
Vettel is past his sell by date.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
Based upon yesterday’s times actually he was in qualifying. Will he be the 5th best over the entire season - unlikely. Will be finish 5th in today’s race - possibly (given he has already had a podium)
But you are missing the point. The car is as important as the driver (if not more so), but it still takes both components in order to get a result. Put LH in a Williams/Haas, Alfa and he wouldn’t win. Put him in a Racing Point, RedBull and he would have a chance. It’s the quality of the package that’s important.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
safety cars every race here so far this weekend , the Spanish Marshall’s don’t exactly hurry, if they can’t recover cars with uninjured drivers quickly the suitability of this track has to be questioned
Accept the F2 sprint race
Last edited by adrianw; 16th August 2020 at 11:56.
Just a thought
if they extended the race distance by the safety car laps, wouldn’t that make things more interesting
Would cause issues with tyres (which they can deal with through additional changes), and fuel (which they wouldn’t be able to)
And
And? So let’s say they have a safety cars for a total period of 15 laps throughout a race. That’s 15 laps more than the cars were fuelled for. Granted they will use less fuel behind a safety car but they will still be going at full chat when the race restarts but they will have 15 laps less fuel.
It would be a pretty exciting race to see them all parked on the track because they had run out of fuel wouldn’t it.
And it’s a stupid idea
You mean the teams would not be able to run marginal fuel loads just in case there was a safety car hmmmn
It really isn’t, it would bring another element to it, with the marginal tyres, also teams from the back might get the opportunity to win or score points
I think it would result in all teams running significantly slower than they are capable of because of further fuel saving. They already do this to conserve tyres and engines parts. Add a long safety car in and they will need to run even slower because they are then likely to factor in some sort of risk on fuel for a safety car, but not enough if there are 10 or more laps under the SC.
All teams will adopt the same strategy regardless of where they are on the grid - it could possibly reduce the gap if teams at the back do fuel to go longer, but then the converse would be they will be heavier in races where there isn’t a SC and could be further back.
Rumour (Dutch F1 TV) has it that SV will leave Ferrari after Spa and that he has signed up with Aston Martin (2021 version)
BTCC series do this, to a maximum of an extra 3 laps, less fuel under the safety car and a known maximum number of laps at racing speed mean fuel load is predicable(ish), can’t remember when someone last ran out of fuel.
Dominate drive by LH. Right strategy and I enjoyed him telling the team what tyres he wanted for the final stint. Easy day at the office.
Good drive by MV, but once again Bottas proved he is a quick driver, but a poor racer. As soon as he goes behind a good racer he can match them for pace, but cannot challenge them or overtake. Oddly he can drive faster, because every so often in can pop in a super lap, but simply cannot maintain it lap over lap.
LS and SP both did an excellent job as did CS, however the stand out performance for me, was SV (but certainly not Ferrari).
Last edited by Andyg; 16th August 2020 at 17:25. Reason: Corrected to satisfy Backward Point.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
Congrats to Mercedes, we are seeing the most dominate car in F1 history, but it doesn't make it interesting. To be fair, Barca is normally a dull race anyway.
Lets hope that we can have a race at Spa, normally a power circuit so it'll favour the Mercedes but we can still hope.
Although no trees were harmed during the creation of this post, a large number of electrons were greatly inconvenienced.
:-) :-)
Agree with that, masterclass by Hamilton today who did just as much as he needed to.
Disappointed in Bottas, as you said, a better driver than he is a racer atm. I had hoped he would have had a go at Verstappen but this didn’t materialise.
Roll on Spa, one of my favourite circuits.
Last edited by JeremyO; 16th August 2020 at 17:24.
Another non-event.
Worse still if looked in MotoGP perpsective. Foúr different factory teams plus two satelite teams in with a chance of a win. Could have been any of tén riders!
25 secs. to second, lapping all up to 3rd place is óverdoing it.
If by F1 standards it is not, then that alone says enough about the state of affairs.
In 1969 Jackie Stewart won the Spanish GP by over 2 laps in his Matra, the same year he also won the British Grand Prix by just under 3 minutes. A year which saw him win 6 of 11 race season, including 5 of the first 6 races.
More recently, in 1995 Damon Hill, won the Australian Grand by 2 laps in his Williams. A year which saw Schumacher win 9 of the 17 races that year. It would have been more for Schumacher if he had managed to stop crashing into other drivers, and not having 4 DNFs (Including being twice punted in to gravel trap by Damon Hill) * citation needed. .
Are these not dominance?
But just in case you are still struggling. Here are the top 4 most successful F1 cars.
- McLaren-Honda MP 4/4 in 1988 (15 races out of 16: 93.75 %)
- Mercedes F1 W07 Hybrid in 2016 (19 races out of 21: 90.48 %) ...
- Ferrari F2001/F2002 in 2002 (15 races out of 17: 88.24 %) ...
- Ferrari 500 in 1952 (7 races out of 8: 87.50 %) ...
- Alfa Romeo 158/159 Alfetta in 1950 (6 races out of 7: 85.71 %) CC BY-SA 2.0 de, Link. ...
As I said, there has always been teams which have dominated in F1 during seasons. The problem is that Mercedes has dominated since 2014 and have one of the best drivers on the planet driving for them. Much like Ferrari had with Lauda during the 1970’s and Schumacher between 1996-2006.
Last edited by Andyg; 16th August 2020 at 18:37. Reason: Corrected to satisfy the resident pendent, trying to score points but not offering anything of value.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
I really do not understand the angst that some have towards the current F1 situation. Mercedes should be lauded for the W11 as a lesson in technological esoterica. It's nothing new to have a dominant team/car/driver.
No likey, no watchy.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
This - and it is unlikely to change much in the not too distant.
Personally, I still enjoy F1 - it has come so far over the years. Hamilton has honed his skills and suits the Mercedes to a T.
Red Bull will close the gap, Ferrari are still struggling - they have been there before and will come back.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
Not sure why you compare MotoGP with F1 given that in the last 12 years MotoGP been won by either Honda or Yamaha. Or that in the last 8 years it has been won by one of 2 riders.
By comparison, in last 8 years F1 has provided 3 different WDCs. And in the last 12 years we have had 5 WCC and 3 engine manufactures. Surely this is better than MotoGP.
But most likely not.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
Two of Schumacher's 1995 DNF's were the result of Damon Hill punting him into gravel traps. Once again, your blinkers obscure your view.
What does "has been dominate" mean? And who is Jackie Steward?
The problem with the current Formula 1 is that Mercedes managed to hit the sweet spot at the beginning of the turbo-hybrid era, and have been able to make incremental improvements since then, keeping them ahead of the rest. It's a truly admirable achievement. Maintaining a performance advantage in what is undoubtedly the most technical of all sports is incredibly difficult, but right now they have a car which is almost a second per lap clear of everybody else, which does not make for competitive or interesting racing. For this, and the last six seasons, it has been harder for Mercedes to lose a race than win.
And, while nobody can dispute the fact that Lewis Hamilton, when he's in a dominant Formula One car, is carving his name into history, he lets himself down when he's out of the car.
Although no trees were harmed during the creation of this post, a large number of electrons were greatly inconvenienced.
Agreed, ref RedBull/Honda closing the gap, but I also see McLaren challenging Mercedes before Ferrari. does. Hopefully Renault will also rediscover their 2010-2013 mojo.
Plus I am sure 2022 Rule changes will also help the lesser teams.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
..etc.
The thing is that F1 now competes with a lot more entertainment.
Even among those who ´follow´it, the minority pays to see it live.
For the reading impaired: NÓT critisizing either Merc or Saint Lewis for shining and the tech is jaw droppingly interesting. Does not change the way too predictable and largely uneventful ´racing´.
Say want you want about Bernie, but he knew it was a show and needed to be entertaining to sell.
In the past the FIA have stepped in before it got this bad, they changed the rules after 2004 so Ferrari were stopped, and then again during the Red Bull dominance. I think either of those periods could of continued for alot longer if they were allowed too, and I wonder if the same people on this thread claiming how amazing it is, would be so vocal if it wasn't their favorite drive who benefits.
I was in bed with c-company ´watching´ The Secretary. Read up on the race result later.
I used to be awed by the racing spectable of F1 and I think it a shame that the pinnacle of racing tech has been allowed to become a wet fart.
Last edited by Huertecilla; 16th August 2020 at 18:46.
That's just being provocative for the sake of it TBH.
The FIA interventions in the past had some safety related issues included, hence the interventions.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
It's not provocative for the sake of it, I think it's a fair point. How did you react during Vettel being the best driver on the grid by a mile? Or how about when Schumacher had the best car and walked over everyone?
The FIA changed the rules to stop the team dominating, and that's not my opinion, that's the opinion of Ross Brawn when the FIA changed the rules to stop his Ferrari team in their tracks.
Perhaps, Vettel has been amazing over the years - he has lost his mojo currently and Ferrari are not helping. Today was a solid drive by him and he deserved to win the popular vote. Brawn has a chequered history across a few teams - shame he did not realise that Ferrari had the right to veto FIA changes and had this right since the 80's. Nonetheless, he is likely to have that opinion, as would anybody else affected by rule changes.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
I used to like watching F1, grew utterly bored during the Schumacher/Ferrari/FIA love-in and lost interest when Rosberg retired. I used to watch Spa and Brazil when they were still on free-to-air TV but now it's all on Sky (having taken the excellent Martin Brundle) I can't be bothered. I suspect I'm not alone and I also suspect F1 has a big problem on its hands if it wants to continue to exist. Once Formula E gets its act together and becomes not just even more relevant to manufacturers but genuinely interesting (particularly on genuinely interesting tracks!) too I wonder how long F1 will keep hold of Ferrari and Mercedes. Schumacher and Ferrari, dull. Vettel and Red Bull, dull. Mercedes and Hamilton, dull. I've much better ways of spending my time on Saturday and Sunday afternoons. And yet I'd happily watch F1 again if it wasn't so boring.
"A man of little significance"
And why do you think he is “carving his name into history“. Could it be because he is consistently beating his teammate and the rest of the field, is going for his 7th WDC (one with McLaren), has the highest number of pole position, podiums, and soon will top the highest number of wins. Clearly it’s not just the car otherwise Alonso/Rosberg/Bottas would have done better and his teams would have achieved more one-twos.
So perhaps you need to add “in my opinion” (which fortunately only actually matters if anyone values it - which I doubt) Plus why not explain how his behaviour outside the car has anything to do with his abilities inside the car? I am sure it would be fascinating. Not relevant to the topic, but fascinating all the same.
Sadly you remind me of folk “back in the day“ who hated Mohamed Ali. They hated his persona, they hated his politics, his showmanship, his dress sense, his private life, his colour, his money, his “arrogance”, the way he spoke, and strangely even how he boxed, yet oddly many of these haters now laud the fact that he was indeed the greatest or certainly one of the greatest. Ditto Tiger Woods, LeBron James, Floyd Mayweather, George Best, Cristiano Ronaldo, Tom Brady, Ian Botham etc.
Haters gonna hate, but hopefully they will one day recognise how special some people actually were and the contribution they made to their sports, and who knows, society as a whole.
Last edited by Andyg; 16th August 2020 at 20:40.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
That's what i have done...cacelled my F1 on Sky because it's a bore fest...i wonder how many other's have done that for the same reason.
You can't help yourself, can you? Why do you take any criticism of Hamilton so personally?
Although no trees were harmed during the creation of this post, a large number of electrons were greatly inconvenienced.
I have been watching F1 since about 1964 and have continued to watch through the many many years when one team was more dominate than others, but because I am from the the UK I have had the luxury of always having a British Driver to follow and support. From Clark, Stewart, Hill(s), Hunt, Mansell, etc, plus even during the Schumacher era, i still had James Hunt and Murray Walker to keep me entertained. The RedBull seasons of 2011 and 12 were a bit dull, however it still managed to serve up some classic entertainment and I really enjoyed the MB/SV and LH/JB battles and Alonso whingeing
But I agree, sometimes it has been amazing, others less so, but then that’s the nature of all live sports. Some times good, sometimes less good, but the one constant that remains is that it’s live, unscripted, anything can happen plus there is always the possibility that the next race/game might be a classic.
As for the FIA stepping in (which mostly has previously been done for safety, environmental and cost cutting reasons) what do you think they are doing in 2022? The FIA want close racing, the public want close racing, but everyone wants the best drivers/constructors to be rewarded.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
Well it might be because it’s completely unnecessary, unsubstantiated and adds nothing to this thread. You don’t like LH (or his Fanboys) for your own reasons. Good for you, but it’s something you have told us repeatedly on numerous occasions. If you have a problem with LH driving, his race management, his ability to setup the car, overtaking, etc then fair enough, because it’s actually relevant. Stuff that happens outside the track which you disapprove of isn’t.
But whilst you claim I “cannot help myself“, I think you are missing the point that it always in response to sh*t posts by you. So is it me or actually you, who can’t help themselves?
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
[/QUOTE] And, while nobody can dispute the fact that Lewis Hamilton, when he's in a dominant Formula One car, is carving his name into history, he lets himself down when he's out of the car.[/QUOTE]
I’m sure he must of had teammates in equally as good cars? Or don’t he? And he must of beaten them
It's you.
You have "issues" and need help.
Your incoherent, misspelt drivel and your need to defend your idol point to somebody who clearly needs emotional crutches in order to compensate for their shortcomings.
Incidentally, when you watch Hamilton being interviewed, do you not feel embarrassed for him? Most of the drivers are multi-lingual, and some, like Sebastian Vettel, portray themselves as intelligent and amusing in languages other than their own. Nico Rosberg is fluent in six languages, which is six more than Hamilton. His talents lie within the cockpit, and he is in a dominant (that's the word that you keep aiming for, and missing - I'm trying to help you here) team, and is able to make the most of his opportunity.
But it doesn't make for good racing, and FOM must be praying for Red Bull, Ferrari or anybody to find a way to relieve the tedium of the Mercedes domination which threatens to drive even more viewers (subscribers) away.
Although no trees were harmed during the creation of this post, a large number of electrons were greatly inconvenienced.
Just ignore him, he's not interested in anything apart from constant praise for LH. You meet this type of person on every F1 forum/thread, thankfully most get better but some are just lost.
The Hamiltonanists. Have you noticed that they all seem to share an inability to spell, or construct a coherent sentence?
I know. It's like kicking a puppy. You know it's wrong, but sometimes a puppy needs a kicking.
Last edited by Backward point; 16th August 2020 at 21:24.
Although no trees were harmed during the creation of this post, a large number of electrons were greatly inconvenienced.
He may be a good driver, maybe one if the greats, he is hardly engaging, everything is down to racism at the moment, which is becoming a bore, especially from such a wealthy individual, he has lucked into the best cars by a mile, if you did a survey of a decent size sample of both interested and never watched the result would be it is the car and not the driver, so many people say it.
Come on Stroll came fourth.
I, too, am getting bored with the constant sniping at Hamilton.
He is at the top of his game because he is totally focussed on what he does. It matters not a whit that he is not multilingual, etc. He has come from a fairly humble background and has not enjoyed many of the advantages that others have.
The one thing he cannot be criticised for is his skill and application.
I don't think anyone really cares what Hamilton is like out of the car, it just sounds like desperation from those that don't like him. He's driving in a dominant car, for a dominant team, someone has to, Bottas is also and look how he faired today. Baring a miracle we all know the outcome of this and next season so why don't those that are so bored on F1 take a hiatus and come back in 2022 when things may (or may not) be different. Failing that I look forward to reading all the same old bitching and moaning in 2 weeks time.
Wow, you are like a Duracell bunny. Fair play :)
Now it’s LH linguistic skills you disapprove of. Thats so funny. But not as funny as his tattoos, earrings and hair style. They were absolute belters.
As for Rosberg being able to speak 6 languages more than LH, your point is what exactly? Come the end of season LH will hopefully have 6 more WDC’s than Nico. Which is what actually matters in F1? Plus perhaps you should ask Nico (in any language) what would he rather have, 6 languages more than LH and a job as an F1 pundit/Vlogger, or 6+ WDC’s, a seat in a Mercedes F1 car for 2021 and a £30m contract? Answers on a postcard.
Regarding Vettel and MV, neither sounded intelligent or amusing today when they were communicating with their teams (in English). English perhaps because so many teams reside in England and F1 teams are staffed by lots of UK folks. The only time I have heard Vettel speak Italian was when he won a GP for Ferrari (so not that often). Perhaps because English is the language of choice within F1, (like air traffic control), and which might actually explain another advantage LH has - an ability to communicate clearly and coherently with the team and it’s engineers in English.
However on the topic of linguistics, (a bit bizarre, but you introduced it), what about Sterling Moss, Jackie Stewart, Jim Clark, Graham Hill, James Hunt, Nigel Mansell, Damon Hill, etc are they non-worthy because of poor linguistic skills. Ditto Jack Brabham, Alan Jones or Bruce McLaren, just ignorant half wits? As for Norris and Russell they must be complete no hopers and unworthy of a seat in F1. Or are you only reserving for “insightful comments“ (bigotry) just for LH - because you can’t help yourself and a hater’s gotta hate?
As for LH interviews, he has certainly matured with age and comes across as a professional athlete. He is focused and serious, articulate, modest and thoughtful, especially in his interview on Sky regarding BLM. Plus he has retained a sense of humour especially after last week when he stole MV trophy after the race (live on TV). All this despite much of the abuse he gets from F1 “fans”. IMHO of course.
Finally one can be dominant, they can dominate, or demonstrate dominance. Pick one, because they all apply to Mercedes and LH at the moment. Words that certainly cannot be applied to any other teams or drivers, and that’s seems to be the problem in the eyes of some, but not me. I love it.
Mercedes and LH have raised the bar and are making history, much like Schumacher and Ferrari did, (but without ramming cars or having custom fuels or tyres) and it’s something I want to witness and enjoy. The fact that LH has come from nothing (unlike most most of the monied F1 drivers) and worked his way up to the top of tree, just makes this even better.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
Regarding racism, do you remember the abuse he got in Spain and Italy in 2007? He was actually booed because he won, so yes perhaps he is a bit sensitive to it, but unless you have experienced it first hand who are you to judge.
As for lucking out. Hardly, he took a punt in 2013 by joining Mercedes, who didn’t have a great record at that time, but who did have ambition, then came the hybrid era which could have also gone horrible wrong.
One thing that LH typified is the old saying “form is temporary, but class is permanent” and LH has demonstrated his class over and over again.
Last edited by Andyg; 17th August 2020 at 08:55.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
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