Reply With QuoteThats good info, I was only whinging to my wife the other day that often mobility users around here seem to fly along the footpaths. 8mph seems about right. Its a matter of time before they hurt someone. Fools.Originally Posted by ptcoll
There’s not much difference in principle between a scooter and a bike. One has a seat and pedal, the other doesn’t (though the first ‘bikes’ didn’t have pedals either).
Thats good info, I was only whinging to my wife the other day that often mobility users around here seem to fly along the footpaths. 8mph seems about right. Its a matter of time before they hurt someone. Fools.
Halfords now doing the Xiaomi M365Pro for £400 and the M365 for £270 using a code, ohhhh which one haha...
I have no problems with these scooters, more of this type of thing means less cars and thats a step in the right direction. Im a keen road cyclist, have been for years and Ive never come across one that I couldn't overtake.
I wonder how these scooters can be illegal yet electric bikes are not.
I'm fine with electric bikes aswell mind but a lad shot past me the other day at over 40mph.
Looks like there is specific legislation for bicycles but I suspect the key word is "assisted" (so, as opposed to 'powered', etc.):
https://www.cyclinguk.org/cyclists-l...pc-regulations
Whether all electric bicycles conform and are used according to the law is another question.
Last edited by David_D; 26th December 2019 at 13:54.
Presumably you can't be complying with the Highway Code if you are using it on the public highway when it's illegal to do so!
It's like me saying I'm very careful when I drive through red lights!
My one does about 23mph I use to used it for getting to work as the carpark was always full
My scooter I could fold up and leave it in my locker but now I just use it to pop down to the Tescos
As its only just over a mile away
The police are cracking down on the scooters due to a young woman recently being killed while riding one in London and another young man getting life changing injuries a couple of days later.
Happens to cyclists everyday. Police aren’t really cracking down. There have been a couple of specific exercises but most of the time the police don’t care and will even chat to you at lights as you’re riding.
It might happen to cyclists everyday, but using a cycle isn't illegal.
Using an electric scooter on public roads is.
Break the law if you want (i don't have a problem with people using them), but don't whinge if you're caught.
Last edited by steptoe; 26th December 2019 at 18:20.
I wouldn’t whinge. Given police resources the chance of getting stopped is almost nil, unless you ride across London Bridge of course. It’s the hypocrisy I find amusing. People get riled up about scooters for some strange reason but cyclists happily break the same highway laws every day and don’t seem to care.
The law will have to catch up eventually.
There are number of app-based hire schemes for electric scooters in Berlin (although I'm waiting for the first snow to kill them off) and they are legal over here. I threw a tenner's worth of credit into the Lime one as their scooters seem to be more frequently strewn across the pavement near the office and the conclusion is that I am not a fan. The most irritating restriction is that they are absolutely useless on cobblestones - one of the first opportunities to use the thing had to be abandoned as the shortcut I had in mind ended up in me ditching the first scooter, walking to the nearest main road to get another and then effectively shadowing the bus route I was originally planning to avoid.
I also don't feel particularly safe on them as you will always have one less point of contact than any kind of bicycle (i.e. your @rse) - I imagine more familiarity would improve this but I'm not planning any more work in this area. They don't really work with luggage either unless you're prepared to switch to a rucksack and that is not going to happen.
In the Sotadic Zone, apparently.
I was driving through Leeds yesterday and some prize t!t on an electric scooter was driving through Sheepscar interchange - this very large, busy and complex junction:
https://www.sabre-roads.org.uk/wiki/...ar_Interchange
It is not the police I would be bothered about - it is the personal injury liability (which you cannot even bankrupt yourself out of being liable for).
Best not hit anyone then! Bit like cycling on the pavement!
I cycle on pavement wherever I can as I prefer living and being in one piece or both if possible. If I see people on a footway I slow down or nip onto the road. Then back on footway. My bike is de-restricted and can do about 35mph reasonably easily. A road (racing) bike will achieve 40+ mph with a fit rider but they weigh about a quarter of my Ebike. It's about common sense rather than blind conformance.
When we were in Malta last year there were hundreds of Ebikes and scooters on paths and roads, I'm sure it's the same in many countries worldwide.
Not in good old nanny-state Britain though. We love our rules don't we?
Rejoice scooter owners....
https://road.cc/content/news/270713-...-lane-legal-uk
From the people who brought you “smart” motorways ....
Had to happen eventually.
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Scooters have much smaller wheels, which means the rotational inertia of the wheels (mass x radius squared) is far lower for a scooter than a bike. This is why scooters are inherently unstable and unsafe.
More importantly for stability, the centre of gravity is much higher above the wheel axles than on a bike. Add to that the slightest imperfection on the road is the equivalent of a pothole for a bike. They are fun, they are fast and they are convenient in a city but they are dangerous (for themselves) on the road and dangerous (for others) on the pavement.
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
Exactly, if you push a supermarket trolley across a supermarket carpark, you get some idea of how tiny wheels and even small surface irregularities “work” together.
Saw this which was dreadful:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-53823514
Although it says "scooter being "unsuitably driven, too fast" and the lack of air in the tyre had caused the crash.", I can't see how small wheeled scooters on your average (poor) road surfaces could ever be safe.
Last edited by David_D; 6th September 2020 at 16:30.
No experience of one and honestly never likely to but whilst i can see their advantages on the commute or just going from A to B given the state of our roads well they just look dangerous and quite frankly if they are used on a public highway they should be by law required to carry proper insurance same goes for the “ lycra” mob.
I FEEL LIKE I'M DIAGONALLY PARKED IN A PARALLEL UNIVERSE
I do, when the law states i am in a vehicle that requires me to have insurance i have that insurance, no matter if i'm in that vehicle, or on a bicycle on the public highway.
I have an e-scooter to do the school run on. My kids (3 and 7) go on their bikes and with this I can keep up! It’s about 1km each way, and due to different finishing times it’s a trip we have to do 3 times a day so the scooter saves me a lot of time and energy.
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No idea how many of the reported deaths were (a) riders driving within the law and (b) not the rider’s fault but it’s awful when you see reports like this.
E-scooter rider dies after crash with car in Portsmouth https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-englan...shire-57679780
Probably wrong but I always think e-scooters look so much more vulnerable than pushbikes (electric or otherwise).
I'd say the answer to (a) is almost zero as all e-scooters except for the rental trials are illegal to be ridden in public.
Looking at 2018 RoSPA as the source, 4,106 seriously injured and 99 deaths over the whole year. I assume the news is less widespread because it doesn't capture public interest as much as e-scooters so using newspaper reports to gauge the situation is difficult. I would suspect on the whole you have more inexperienced, less road proficient riders on e-scooters though. The other problem with e-scooters is that very few/no riders seem to wear any head protection.
I've seen some horrendously dangerous stuff from e-scooter riders though. I recently watched a guy weave around traffic with a child also stood on the scooter, no helmets. Yesterday one idiot was going about 30 mph down a steep hill near Crystal Palace with walkers in the park dodging out the way.
Last edited by Christian; 1st July 2021 at 16:22.
I saw one driving across the Sheepscar interchange in Leeds which must be one of the busiest junctions in the area. Not sure he wasn’t also carrying shopping or similar.
The absolute number of deaths may be low (still tragic) but as a % of users it must be high given, as you say, the scooters aren’t even legal and widely used.
I was in Bristol last weekend which must be the eScooter capital of Britain. Thousands of the things, not one person wearing a helmet and probably every fourth scooter had two people riding it, often on busy roads.
I've got this guy on order - - more eBike than eScooter. Sondors Fold XS...
My son has got an e-scooter and uses it on the pavement as you get done for no insurance if you use it on the road. I’ve seen e-scooters flying along on the road and are an accident waiting to happen. Looking at the big picture they are great personal transport and make more sense than piloting 1.5 tons of metal on a 2 mile journey. We need cycle/scooter lanes everywhere and they need to be legalised somehow as they aren’t going away.
So why aren’t they an accident waiting to happen flying along the pavement?
If they are here to stary, they need regulation. License, insurance, minimum age and accountability for those that ride them.
Great invention. I came within a second of mowing down some retarded teenager tonight due to his complete lack of road sense and self preservation. If anyone thinks these are a good idea. Then tell that to your dead child. They are illegal and the rental ones should be too.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CQ1XiM1H...dium=copy_link
Last edited by yumma; 3rd July 2021 at 01:53.
If anyone has been to Lisbon.
You can see how this can work.
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It's not just the danger they pose on the road and the pavements but then they take there precious in to a shop and then semi abandon it as it couldn't possible be left outside.
My wife see's a fair few scooter accidents each year and the number of escooter ones has started to climb in a large way.
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Do you get done for no insurance?
How can this be justified of cyclists don't have/need insurance...
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Half the problem is that there are too many of them now and not enough police to control their use...
They are mostly ignored by the police as they are massively going to struggle to prevent its use. Most people aren't even aware that they are not legal to use on public roads.
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Most people don't care, rather then them not being aware I would say.
I say this as even though they are legal in the trial areas around the UK when using the apps, people still use pavements not the roads.
This all the way (for bicycles as well) - only way to stop the current free for all.
Probably road tax as well (why should there use the roads for free?) - once we aren't using cars the govt will need to get revenue from somewhere.
Exactly this. E-scooters need to be treated the same as bikes. There is no reason to treat them differently. For that reason though it will not happen. Imagine effectively discounting people to use bikes for exercise and recreation by making it cost prohibitive. Also, you can’t exactly do this for kids.
Yes you can get done - because you are using a motor vehicle. So it matters not if you use them on the street, or just on the pavement. Unless you are using one of the official scooters in one of the trials (which are insured and have to be used on the street), you can only use them on private property.
This is true at the moment but there is a big push to legalise them and I can see it happening. It is a waste of police time making them deal with e-scooters.
Last edited by Stuno1; 3rd July 2021 at 10:57.
What an idiot!
I saw two kids yesterday similarly riding scooters on and off the pavement with no apparent traffic awareness. You get some cyclists who are the same but I’m sure the electric scooters do have a larger proportion of stupid users - certainly where they aren’t even currently legal.
It’ll be like smart motorways. They’ll press ahead regardless of the dangers.
This is not unique to scooters, that kid would have probably done the same walking, running, cycling.
Maybe not. I think part of the problem is that they are currently - for young people anyway - more a gadget or toy, like a skateboard.
I just don’t see how the small wheels on scooters are compatible with the shocking potholed and irregular road surfaces we have.
They don’t seem able to deal with illegal driving so I can’t see them too fussed about scooters other than the odd headline grabbing activity.
No one pays 'road tax', most pay vehicle excise duty, with cost dependent on exhaust emissions, as electric vehicles have no emissions they pay nothing.
However I wouldn't be surprised if it was reintroduced to some degree with the increasing popularity of e-vehicles.
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