Noticed this on the Rolex forum and makes interesting listening if true.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xlrcEEIhyis
Anyone with any interest in Rolex already knew this was going on for years.Nothing new apart from the apparent release of warranty cards.Why rolex took so long to sort their poor image which turns people off through having to jump through hoops with their local AD is beyond me.Are we going to be able to buy stainless professional models more easily - I doubt it very much.
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Impressive waffling :- >10 minutes for something that should take 30 seconds. He must work in management.
I wonder if this will cause other AD chains to release warranty cards.
Rolex have done the right thing here whereas WoS have abused their dominate retailer position and this has put me right off them as a trusted organisation. Time for the CEO to fall on his sword.
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All sounds a bit far fetched, but what do I know?
Surely all ADs are giving their best customers preferential access to sought after watches? Why wouldn't they? By the way, do WoS really have a long list of customers spending more than £100k - annually?!
Surely Rolex know that the card retention has done diddly to prevent reselling of new watches so why would they be bothered. I understood that, if anything, Rolex were encouraging it at one time.
I would have said Watchfinder have played a far greater role in pushing up prices and reducing supply.
EDIT: WF financials - Turnover year to 31 March 2015 £38.7m, profit £1.78m. Year to 31 March 2018 (latest figures) £109.3m, £7.3m.
Last edited by David_D; 8th December 2019 at 12:59. Reason: Added
Doesn’t explain the global shortage though, don’t see these Daytonas being abundant in US or Asia
Unfortunately AD's have simply been using Sports Rolex as a sweetener for high spending customers. A high percentage of whom probably flip for a profit fairly quickly. Not much ordinary customers can do about it.
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
Rolex, for at least 40 have been limiting supply of some models - it's called supply and demand. Limiting the supply generates increased demand, not just for the Unicorn models, but across the range Other companies achieve the same via its use of special limited editions. Brietling, Heuer and Omega have been doing it for years. It's a marketing trick, also used by most makers of luxury products to manipulate the market, create demand and generate conversations like this.
The funny thing is that people cannot be complaining about the lack of availability of certain products - because the grey market is full of them. What they are complaining about is the ability to buy them at RRP, thus preventing them from getting a perceived bargain (if a £10k watch can every be a bargain) and/or flipping it themselves for a profit. The really funny thing is that some people seem happy to go on lists, and wait for watches (it used to be 7 years for a Daytona and that was back in the 80's) and forget that during that time Rolex would put the price up 7 times during that period and exclude any currency variations.
If people really want something they should simply pony up and buy it. The difference between a SS Daytona at RRP and via a grey is about £4K. Compare this with say a Porsche GT2 RS where the difference is about £80k. It's not fair, but that's life.
Personally i would simply buy at the best available price, safe in the knowledge that a) I can enjoy the watch NOW, b) that I will not be impacted by future price rises/currency issues and c) that if I do flip it down the road the most I will lose is a couple of grand at worse, and maybe break even or make a profit at best.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
Originally Posted by jukeboxs
If you make your youtube videos over 10 minutes you can earn more from advertisement, dependent on views of course.
its actually over £10k, you will be very lucky to find a ss Daytona from a grey at less than £20k
Cheers,
Ben
..... for I have become the Jedi of flippers
" an extravagance is anything you buy that is of no earthly use to your wife "
Well I'm simply complaining about the inability to buy them at RRP. I want to keep them not flip them. Not everyone is in it to make money, some people just like watches.
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
List for a 116500 is £9,550. Cheapest on WF just now is £21,600. Cheapest on C24 is £18,521.
Last one I could see on SC was in May and the asking seemed to be £15,500 based on a grey dealer offer of £16,000.
I wouldn't personally buy one for list + £4,000 but I bet you would sell a few at that price.
Last edited by David_D; 8th December 2019 at 17:16. Reason: typo
I got offered £12k earlier this year for my Daytona which I bought for £3670 rrp in 2003 , no doubt that has increased a tad since then .
It’s on my wrist today, no real interest in selling it to be honest.
Not everyone is a flipper .
Heres a UK secondhand SS Daytona for under £13k. https://www.chrono24.co.uk/rolex/day...id12616299.htm
others are available at £13.5k.
They dont have a ceramic bezel admittedly, however folks can get an aftermarket ceramic bezel for £35 from Amazon if they are that bothered.
Zero wait time and a 6.5k saving - they can thank me later. And if they do decide to flip it all they need to do is pop on the original bezel.
Last edited by Andyg; 8th December 2019 at 17:54.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
You can buy them at RRP if you are very lucky or prepared to camp outside an AD for next x years.
However if you want to avoid the hassle associated and you really really want one, then just justify the addition cost (call it a preminum) and pay it or simply pretend that Rolex have just put the RRP upto 21k and you are actually getting a bargain.
But I'm not saying that all buyers intend to sell them on for quick profit, but that's exactly the reason why they fly out of the shops as soon as they appear. But rather than pointing the finger at Rolex for limiting supply (they are afterall making more watches than ever these days) point it all the money grabbing speculaters attempting the make a fast buck at the expense of collectors.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
Thought you meant the ceramic. The one linked looks as if it's had a hard life and has no papers. It all depends what people want, I suppose. Not sure anyone buys a 116500 to wear these days; I think the majority are sitting in safes.
You can buy them at RRP if you are very lucky or prepared to camp outside an AD for next x years.
Well I've been waiting since they came out so not sure where the luck comes in. If they want to just use them as a bonus for big spenders then fine, but I'll probably stop spending money on jewellery and watches in their shop. (we've spent over £40k in there in the last 2/3 years).
However if you want to avoid the hassle associated and you really really want one, then just justify the addition cost (call it a preminum) and pay it or simply pretend that Rolex have just put the RRP upto 21k and you are actually getting a bargain.
Nah, don't think so, I'd just be helping the flippers. Rather buy an Omega or Panerai or other brand if it comes to that. And that's from a Rolex 'fan boy'.
But I'm not saying that all buyers intend to sell them on for quick profit, but that's exactly the reason why they fly out of the shops as soon as they appear. But rather than pointing the finger at Rolex for limiting supply (they are afterall making more watches than ever these days) point it all the money grabbing speculaters attempting the make a fast buck at the expense of collectors.
I do.
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
Sorry Andy, I presumed (wrongly) you were referring to a new Daytona, ie ceramic.
Cheers,
Ben
..... for I have become the Jedi of flippers
" an extravagance is anything you buy that is of no earthly use to your wife "
Personally I think what’s said in the video is rubbish. I was in California recently and they had nothing in terms of sports models - most ADs had more cases empty than they had stock in. Have WoS group affected supply in California, and every other area in the world?
Let’s start with the number of ADs. I don’t think there are 125 Rolex ADs in the UK, let alone 125 WoS group ADs.
Does anyone here like Haywood or Oracle know the real figure? Once we’ve got that we can start work on the other inaccuracies spouted in this video.
Anyone summarise the video without me having to watch it?
To give the Grey Dealers their credit, they price their stuff at the correct market value and they know just what the market will take. Rolex are definately under pricing their watches. They could cut production even more and slap another 50% on the price and the greys would still buy them up and sell them on because that is the reality of the market.
Rolex have played a blinder and they should be congratulated. The brand has much more intrinsic value than it did two years ago.
Also we all need to recognise that "enthusiasts" are no more entitled to buy a watch than anyone else, be they a keeper, a hoarder or a speculator.
No probs. To me a Daytona is a Daytona. I like the ceramic bezel, but 6k for that, is well a bit silly, even in the wonderful world of Rolex.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
Desperate wannabe-you-tuber posts ludicrous click-bait video with abysmal production quality, utterly devoid of any factual content whatsoever.
Very dubious video since the shortage of SS Rolex is world wide, and WOS are UK based.
UK is AFAIK the only country where the ADs unilaterally hold back warranty cards though
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I’m fairly sure the YouTube video makes reference to the ‘Batgirl’ watch
Hearsay or first hand experience ?
My experience is that the warranty card was handed over with the watch with the advice that as it’s a worldwide warranty try not to lose the card.
That’s when I switched off!
Exactly, and WoS may have a large market share but not 100%!
Not all ADs do it, and a situation like that is unlikely to be anything other than unilateral because I don't think many people would willingly agree to it.
I've had it done on a few watches, I was a bit annoyed at first but the 12 months flew by like you wouldn't believe, and now it's a none issue for me. There are ADs, however, that don't hold back the cards and just give them out anyway.
Isn’t holding back warranty card an attempt by WOS to stifle the flippers? That’s a good thing no? So they are trying to sell to loyal customers given the shortage and not chancers who just flip for a quick buck.
WoS are worldwide i thought. they have shops in the states
I think Ryan is right. I've read on other overseas forum's and FB groups that they find it quite unbelievable that it's happened here. That may not be everywhere, but I'm unaware of any other country doing this.
Video is as presumed, I’ll save myself from viewing it
That was obviously the intention but not sure it's worked. Plenty of new Rolex watches get listed on eBay with photocopy of the card and promise to forward it after 12 months. I'd assumed (probably wrongly) that the AD might ask for evidence that the original purchaser still has the watch before handing over the card! Pointless exercise.
They own Mayors on the east coast, mainly Florida, and some WoS stores in NY. Their operation in the US is pretty small.
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