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Thread: Recommend me a subwoofer?

  1. #1

    Recommend me a subwoofer?

    I know there are some on here who are in to their home cinema so thought Iíd ask the question.

    Just bought a Sennheiser Ambeo soundbar and like my bass so would like to add a subwoofer for a bit more oomph!

    Iíve only really had a one box solution before so have no experience in this field, what is a decent one to go for? Donít want to spend a fortune, just looking for one that packs a punch but also is aesthetically pleasing as it will be on show.

    Cheers!

  2. #2
    Master Kirk280's Avatar
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    Subwoofer


  3. #3
    Just bought an ex demo Accoustic energy 8" sub with it's own remote. Mine is coupled with a pair of bookshelf Q accoustic speakers for extra depth with stereo music.
    You may or may not need bigger than this for extra "room rumble" but I am very pleased with it.
    Bought from their ebay outlet for less than £150 saving at least £200 on new cost

    Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

  4. #4
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    Hi

    I have an AV set up in a home cinema room. Got a guy in the know to spec all my speakers telling him I wanted good stuff but didnít want to spend a ridiculous amount. He recommended SVS as the best in sub-woofers. I have the previous model of the SVS PB1000 and happy with it. Was about £550.

  5. #5
    Master
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    I have an expensive SVS but if youíre looking for something on a budget BK Electronics really canít be beaten. Made in the UK and sold direct so a bit of a bargain.

  6. #6
    Master Rod's Avatar
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    REL the best out there period.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by gilford View Post
    Just bought a Sennheiser Ambeo soundbar and like my bass so would like to add a subwoofer for a bit more oomph!
    Very nice! I have a Yamaha YAS-101 that impresses me. I think I would wet my sock listening to yours.

  8. #8
    Master subseastu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cynar View Post
    I have an expensive SVS but if you’re looking for something on a budget BK Electronics really can’t be beaten. Made in the UK and sold direct so a bit of a bargain.
    Have you compared the two side by side? I ask as I'm looking to replaced a goosed MA RSW silver 12 sub woofer and I've been drawn towards SVS and BK but wonder if the SVS really is worth the premium over the BK's. I'm having trouble with the SVS website as the uk dealer website listed doesn't work now. I understand BK use the same speakers and components as REL
    Last edited by subseastu; 6th December 2019 at 23:42.

  9. #9
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by subseastu View Post
    Have you compared the two side by side? I ask as I'm looking to replaced a goosed MA RSW silver 12 sub woofer and I've been drawn towards SVS and BK but wonder if the SVS really is worth the premium over the BK's. I'm having trouble with the SVS website as the uk dealer website listed doesn't work now. I understand BK use the same speakers and components as REL
    I’m not sure BK use the same components as REL, but they have manufactured subs for several other brands including REL. I had a BK XXLS400 and now have an SVS SB13 Ultra. I didn’t compare them side by side and it would be unfair to do so as they’re not in the same bracket. The SVS is definitely better, but it should be as it’s a 13” driver with a 1000 watt amp compared to a 12” with 400 watts.
    Whether the difference is worth nearly four times the price is another matter. At their price point I don’t believe anything comes close to BK. One of the rare bargain finds in HiFi.
    Last edited by Cynar; 7th December 2019 at 10:28.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Rod View Post
    REL the best out there period.
    I was hoping youíd contribute Rod!

    What model would you recommend to partner with the Ambeo? I donít want to spend a fortune.

    What are your thoughts on the Ambeo?

  11. #11
    Master Rod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gilford View Post
    I was hoping youíd contribute Rod!

    What model would you recommend to partner with the Ambeo? I donít want to spend a fortune.

    What are your thoughts on the Ambeo?
    The REL T Zero should be fine with that. You can snag one from E Bay for around £170.
    Beautifully made, class D 100watt.

  12. #12
    Master Rod's Avatar
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    ^^^ just a point, I'm not sure of the connectivity on the soundbar, better check.

  13. #13
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    https://en-uk.sennheiser.com/ambeo-soundbar

    Inputs
    3x HDMI In (v.2.0a), 1x HDMI Out (v.2.1 eARC)
    1x Optical In
    1x AUX In (Stereo RCA)
    1x USB (for Service/Update)
    1x Ethernet
    1x Subwoofer Pre-Out (Mono-RCA, max. 2V)
    1x Mic Input (2.5mm jack)
    Bluetooth
    Google Chromecast
    Media (UPnP)

  14. #14
    Thanks Rod, I think that may be a bit small?

    Iím a bit confused as the Ambeo has a sub out but most subs have two inputs? As you can see Iím a total noob at this!

    My lounge is a modest size, Iíd like something that packs a decent punch for movies so you can really feel it on the sofa!

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by gilford View Post
    Thanks Rod, I think that may be a bit small?

    Iím a bit confused as the Ambeo has a sub out but most subs have two inputs? As you can see Iím a total noob at this!

    My lounge is a modest size, Iíd like something that packs a decent punch for movies so you can really feel it on the sofa!
    Most subs have two inputs for stereo use but in your case youíll just use one of them.

  16. #16
    Craftsman
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    How big is the room?
    How far from the subwoofer do you intend to sit?
    Can you install a SPL meter app on your phone, and verify the reading when you are listening to your existing system at its loudest?

  17. #17
    Master Rod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gilford View Post
    Thanks Rod, I think that may be a bit small?

    Iím a bit confused as the Ambeo has a sub out but most subs have two inputs? As you can see Iím a total noob at this!

    My lounge is a modest size, Iíd like something that packs a decent punch for movies so you can really feel it on the sofa!
    I'm using one with my KEFLS50 speakers in a lounge 26' x 12' and there is more than enough bass. It's also a very tuneful bass that stops and starts fast. I'm quite critical of sound and am more than happy with it.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Rod View Post
    I'm using one with my KEFLS50 speakers in a lounge 26' x 12' and there is more than enough bass. It's also a very tuneful bass that stops and starts fast. I'm quite critical of sound and am more than happy with it.
    thanks Rod.

    So with one sub out on the Ambeo what do I plug it into on the T Zero as it has two inputs?

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by gilford View Post
    I think that may be a bit small?
    Totally agree with you. To augment the bass on a pair of small speakers it would be fine, but itís not going to give you the low frequencies and impact you want for watching movies.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by jcm3 View Post
    How big is the room?
    How far from the subwoofer do you intend to sit?
    Can you install a SPL meter app on your phone, and verify the reading when you are listening to your existing system at its loudest?
    I sit square on to the TV and soundbar about 2m away.

    Just downloaded an app and at full chat my current Yamaha YSP5600 is 108db.

    Ive got a sub now you see, I donít want to end up with better sound but no thump!

  21. #21
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    If you want bass you can feel for movies there’s no substitute for size and power. It’s simply not possible to move enough air with a small driver. The T Zero has a 6.5” driver and is -6dB at 38Hz which is poor and barely subwoofer territory. Look at the BK P1200-300 SB PR. A 12” driver and a 12” passive radiator and will reach 20Hz at -3dB. That’s the sort of prrformance you need for a half decent cinema experience.

  22. #22
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    Chucking in a massive subwoofer is easy (provided budget and space) - integrating it with your speakers / soundbar is harder.

    In general, I've preferred slightly smaller, sealed subs - they are easier to integrate and sound more agile. Bigger and ported subs (in general) will go much lower in frequency response but can sometimes sound lumpy.

    If you're only looking to add the oomph to movie watching and want to 'feel' action movies hit you in the chest, go big. For music and a better overall sound, go smaller!

  23. #23
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    But you donít actually need to compromise. Itís not necessarily big and lumpy or small and agile. There are big subs that are tight and agile too.

  24. #24
    Master Kirk280's Avatar
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    I canít believe my Ďamusingí contribution was ignored in favour of actual useful advice! Whatís this forum coming to?

    (Sorry OP....I was on my 5th pint!)

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by gilford View Post
    thanks Rod.

    So with one sub out on the Ambeo what do I plug it into on the T Zero as it has two inputs?
    https://rel.net/wp-content/uploads/2...anual_2-12.pdf

    Pages 6,8

    Will depend on what the sound bar outputs. If the output has gone through a low pass filter then it’s the lfe input, if it has no filtering then low level input.

    If the latter you’ll want to experiment with crossover point, in either case you need to experiment with gain and phase.
    Last edited by Captain Morgan; 8th December 2019 at 10:42.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cynar View Post
    Totally agree with you. To augment the bass on a pair of small speakers it would be fine, but itís not going to give you the low frequencies and impact you want for watching movies.
    To all you guys who is saying it's too small are incorrect. This compact sub can shake my lounge with too much bass. The secret is to match it to the speaker system your using it with by careful adjustment.
    In fact you shouldn't even hear it until those low frequency notes are playing.
    My LS50's are no slouches at low frequencies but now sounds so much better at low frequency detail and a side effect is to lift the detail in the midband frequencies too.
    I had a good teacher by the name of Richard Eric Lord (REL)
    Gilford is matching this to a soundbar and is more than enough.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rod View Post
    To all you guys who is saying it's too small are incorrect. This compact sub can shake my lounge with too much bass. The secret is to match it to the speaker system your using it with by careful adjustment.
    In fact you shouldn't even hear it until those low frequency notes are playing.
    My LS50's are no slouches at low frequencies but now sounds so much better at low frequency detail and a side effect is to lift the detail in the midband frequencies too.
    I had a good teacher by the name of Richard Eric Lord (REL)
    Gilford is matching this to a soundbar and is more than enough.
    Each to their own I guess. I wouldnít be happy with a sub that was missing the whole bottom octave.

  28. #28
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    What about a B&W pv1d?


    https://youtu.be/1uZYdqxTm4Q

  29. #29
    Master subseastu's Avatar
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    Don't know if throws a spanner in the works but I think personally I'm leaning towards one of these:

    http://www.epichomecinema.co.uk/Epic.../Sub12.17.html

    XTZ 12.17. Seem to get good reviews and bang for the buck. I'll be pairing with monitor audio radius 270 5.1 and yamaha amp.

  30. #30
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    I've just lost a long winded reply to this message (long enough that my login timed out and the message was lost in the sign in process). So here is the short version. You have a very capable soundbar. Given its output and your room placement, a single large subwoofer will work well. I would suggest the Paradigm Defiance X12 or the Martin Logan Dynamo 1600x, but any of the subs highlighted in orange on this chart should work fine, see page 4.

    https://www.audioholics.com/subwoofe...-07-21-19.xlsx

    There is a lot of talk here about small subwoofers. You know that flabby, tubby, unpleasant bassy sound you hear so often, that's distortion. What people describe as "tight bass", that's what a properly working subwoofer sounds like.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by subseastu View Post
    Don't know if throws a spanner in the works but I think personally I'm leaning towards one of these:

    http://www.epichomecinema.co.uk/Epic.../Sub12.17.html

    XTZ 12.17. Seem to get good reviews and bang for the buck. I'll be pairing with monitor audio radius 270 5.1 and yamaha amp.
    Jag has a really impressive home cinema/demo room that he built if you get to see it. I'd say these would be the last of the XTZ stuff he's got.

  32. #32
    Master subseastu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by esulp View Post
    Jag has a really impressive home cinema/demo room that he built if you get to see it. I'd say these would be the last of the XTZ stuff he's got.
    I've seen some of his posts on the AVforum. Seems a very helpful bloke. I'll be contacting him soon I think. I sent a mail to XTZ direct and the 12.17 is now discontinued replaced by the 12.17 edge but its a bit pricier.

  33. #33
    Well, after much deliberation and research on various furrows I've gone for a BK P12-300SB-DF sub today.

    Great reviews and they haver an eBay store with Grade B but still a 2 year warranty and also 14 day no quibble return so it's a no brainer.

    Thanks for everyone help!

  34. #34
    Master subseastu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gilford View Post
    Well, after much deliberation and research on various furrows I've gone for a BK P12-300SB-DF sub today.

    Great reviews and they haver an eBay store with Grade B but still a 2 year warranty and also 14 day no quibble return so it's a no brainer.

    Thanks for everyone help!
    I'm torn between this and the XTZ 12.17 edge. I'm wondering if the 12.17 is worth the extra cost?

  35. #35
    Iíll report back once mine is installed.

  36. #36
    Well, the BK has arrived and what a monster it is!

    Iíve got a concrete floor and it rumbles the foundation! By far the most powerful sub Iíve owned.

    Could do with some pointers on how to set up properly though?

  37. #37
    Master subseastu's Avatar
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    Take a look on Av forum. Alot of good information on there

    Sent from my H8314 using Tapatalk

  38. #38
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    I would speak to your local Audio T or similar and see if you can borrow one to try in your room when it's calibrated correctly.

    Setup is all important, a well set up £200 REL can outperform a badly set £3000 JL Audio with ease.

    I ran a Wilson Benesch Torus for a few weeks alongside my Discoveries and they hardly did anything in terms of outright workload, but the difference they made was enormous because the helped take the strain off the speakers.

    Had to buy a kitchen though... :(

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by gilford View Post
    Well, the BK has arrived and what a monster it is!

    Iíve got a concrete floor and it rumbles the foundation! By far the most powerful sub Iíve owned.

    Could do with some pointers on how to set up properly though?

  40. #40
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    Because of the long wavelength of low frequency sounds you can have areas in the room where the volume will be much lower than others. Ideally you don’t want to put the sub where it will create one of these nulls where you sit. Assuming you have options on where to place the sub, a good way to find the best position is to temporarily place it where you sit and play something with plenty of bass. Then walk around the room to the places you could put it and choose the one where the bass sounds loudest.

  41. #41
    Craftsman PJdB's Avatar
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    Ported subs give a lower note, - sealed subs have more musicality. I have been through a number of subs and have now finally found one that I'm happy with. It's an 18" FI sub in a sealed box (diy) with an external 3000w amp

    That fact that it's sealed makes it controlled and musical, - the 18" cone gives that beautiful depth

  42. #42
    Master
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    Iíd love something with an 18Ē driver, my wife might object to the size!

    Interesting read on here & certainly know where I will go once my MA RSW-12 gives up the ghost (already lost EQ2 and to fix is a £300+ amp....)

    Still works great though, so canít justify a new one yet.

    Set up wise, I did the Ďsub where you sití technique, unfortunately the best location ended up near the entrance to the lounge, part blocking the door; guess what the wife said!

    Luckily second best was the other side of the sofa, a little too much in the corner though but these are the sacrifices you have to make. I did have it wonky so it wasnít firing straight to a wall, but looked awful, so a large leather chair sits directly opposite now. Works great, but know it could get better.


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  43. #43
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    I'll personally recommend the BK XLS200 which is supposed to be brilliant for the money.

  44. #44
    Well, I've had "Man Flu" all weekend and have had plenty of time to play with this, it's superb, just like being in the cinema!

    Hat's off to BK, a cracking sub for the money, I cannot see how spending more would produce anything better (in my set up at least).

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