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Thread: Smart Meters.... a warning...

  1. #1
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    Smart Meters.... a warning...

    I switched onto a new tarrif with Scottish Power about a month ago and didn't realised I had agreed to a smart meter in the T&Cs.

    They just called me to book an 'appointment'.

    I don't want one to be installed, so it appears they will revert me onto a SVR tarrif after three months.

    So just a warning that this is now becoming the standard way to 'lever' customers ino smart meter installation so watch out.

  2. #2
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    Can I ask why you wouldnít want a smart meter?

    Not intended to sound confrontational- Iíve just moved into a new house with a dual fuel tariff and smart meters werenít available in my previous property. Weíre on the wait list for an appointment with E-On and thought that a smart meter would be a beneficial thing?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  3. #3
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    What is the down side of having a smart meter installed?
    I had one installed a month ago and find it very useful.

    edit - doebag beat me to it

  4. #4
    Master blackal's Avatar
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    Not as if it affects your bill - like a water meter?

  5. #5
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    I've had 3 smart meters, no problems. Means I dont have to send meter readings and the bill us just adjusted to what I use. No over paying or under paying. The "monitor" part is just a gimmick to me after 1hr. Everyone knows the items in the house that burn money if switched on, dont really need a monitor to tell you.

  6. #6
    afaik you can ask for the smart meter to be fitted in 'dumb' mode - it just acts as a normal meter showing readings.

    smart meters give no savings whatsoever to the end user , the person that leaves the lights on will still leave the lights on regardless.
    Last edited by pugster; 21st October 2019 at 14:47.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by T1ckT0ck View Post
    I switched onto a new tarrif with Scottish Power about a month ago and didn't realised I had agreed to a smart meter in the T&Cs.

    They just called me to book an 'appointment'.

    I don't want one to be installed, so it appears they will revert me onto a SVR tarrif after three months.

    So just a warning that this is now becoming the standard way to 'lever' customers ino smart meter installation so watch out.
    You might want to double check. I just signed up with EON and got an email about fitting a smart meter. I phoned their "Helpline" and was told it was mandatory (that was the word used) for the particular tariff. Went onto the Martin Lewis site and EON rep on there advised it's not mandatory; I have just signed up to be pestered about it, apparently!
    Last edited by David_D; 21st October 2019 at 14:47.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by pugster View Post
    the person that leaves the lights on will still leave the lights on regardless.
    You've clearly met my wife.

  9. #9
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    When I looked into a while back smart meters didnít transfer between companies to say npower fit one and you switch to British Gas a year later the smart meter is effectively useless you need a different one fitting or back to just reading the meter. Iím not sure if theyíve standardised it now or not but that was my main gripe when I almost had one fitted a couple of years back.

  10. #10
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    Had a smart meter fitted a couple of months ago as there was a (very) minor ussue with the old dumb one and because ultimately it was inevitable and it saves me sending readings each month via the Bulb website (we only have electricity, no gas) - hardly a chore I know. It has to be one of the most ill-conceived government initiatives that forces expenditure by the electricity companies and, therefore, ultimately the consumers. This cost is currently estimated at £11Bn which means it will probably be over £15Bn by the time it's complete. The smart display is a complete waste of time and now sits unused in a draw. How much has it saved us or changed behaviours? Zero to both.
    Last edited by Skier; 21st October 2019 at 15:12.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by T1ckT0ck View Post
    I switched onto a new tarrif with Scottish Power about a month ago and didn't realised I had agreed to a smart meter in the T&Cs.

    They just called me to book an 'appointment'.

    I don't want one to be installed, so it appears they will revert me onto a SVR tarrif after three months.

    So just a warning that this is now becoming the standard way to 'lever' customers ino smart meter installation so watch out.
    Why don't you just move to another supplier like Bulb or Octopus? They handle everything & Bulb will pay any exit fees (& give you £50 if you use a referal code):
    https://bulb.co.uk/
    https://octopus.energy/

    With Bulb you don't have to have a smart meter (I'm not sure about Octopus).

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by bootneck View Post
    When I looked into a while back smart meters didnít transfer between companies to say npower fit one and you switch to British Gas a year later the smart meter is effectively useless you need a different one fitting or back to just reading the meter. Iím not sure if theyíve standardised it now or not but that was my main gripe when I almost had one fitted a couple of years back.
    Gen 1 Smart Meters were as you descibed. Gen 2 became available earlier this year and are now transferrable.

  13. #13
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    Seems like theyíre over that hurdle

    https://flipper.community/posts/smar...u-need-to-know

    However using your data to sell you things and selling that data on to others doesnít sit right Iím not sure why it bothers me but it just doesnít sit right

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Skier View Post
    Gen 1 Smart Meters were as you descibed. Gen 2 became available earlier this year and are now transferrable.
    Beat me to it lol cheers

  14. #14
    My parents have had a Smart meter installed when they moved house around a year ago. Theyíre very happy with it. No more estimated readings. No more meter readers coming round.

    They get accurate bills and they can check anytime what they have spent on their energy.

    Not sure what there is to be unhappy about.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by demonloop View Post
    You've clearly met my wife.
    And my kids

    Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

  16. #16
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    We have had one for 12 months now I donít have a problem with it, itís not as it costs any more .

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by David_D View Post
    You might want to double check. I just signed up with EON and got an email about fitting a smart meter. I phoned their "Helpline" and was told it was mandatory (that was the word used) for the particular tariff. Went onto the Martin Lewis site and EON rep on there advised it's not mandatory; I have just signed up to be pestered about it, apparently!
    I wish I had known that yesterday when I switched to EON on the Martin Lewis site, I know you get 2 weeks to change your mind, still as hassle.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by kungfupanda View Post
    My parents have had a Smart meter installed when they moved house around a year ago. Theyíre very happy with it. No more estimated readings. No more meter readers coming round.

    They get accurate bills and they can check anytime what they have spent on their energy.

    Not sure what there is to be unhappy about.
    Dynamic billing. With more and more people switching to electric cars the government is losing money due to electric cars not being subject to RFL and not requiring petrol or diesel.
    With smart meters installed itís monitored what the energy is being used on and I guess it would be fairly straight forward to come up with a system where energy for vehicle charging can be taxed at a higher rate as petrol and diesel is now.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaytip View Post
    Dynamic billing. With more and more people switching to electric cars the government is losing money due to electric cars not being subject to RFL and not requiring petrol or diesel.
    With smart meters installed itís monitored what the energy is being used on and I guess it would be fairly straight forward to come up with a system where energy for vehicle charging can be taxed at a higher rate as petrol and diesel is now.
    I think you have completely missed the point.

    Currently, usage is just that - ours is high due to an AGA and a hot tub, no differentiation on what used what - we just pay a lot per month. Electric vehicles and RFL is nothing to do with smart meters.
    When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by jaytip View Post
    Dynamic billing. With more and more people switching to electric cars the government is losing money due to electric cars not being subject to RFL and not requiring petrol or diesel.
    With smart meters installed itís monitored what the energy is being used on and I guess it would be fairly straight forward to come up with a system where energy for vehicle charging can be taxed at a higher rate as petrol and diesel is now.
    Iím sure a Smart meter isnít smart enough to differentiate what the power is used on.

  21. #21
    Master reggie747's Avatar
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    What exactly is "The Warning" here ?

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by kungfupanda View Post
    Iím sure a Smart meter isnít smart enough to differentiate what the power is used on.
    My understanding is that it just means you can see how much power an appliance uses by checking the meter when the appliance is switched on.

    It can't do an appliance breakdown, unless every appliance has it's own wi-fi connection?

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris_in_the_UK View Post
    I think you have completely missed the point.

    Currently, usage is just that - ours is high due to an AGA and a hot tub, no differentiation on what used what - we just pay a lot per month. Electric vehicles and RFL is nothing to do with smart meters.
    My bad. I donít have a smart meter and I was under the impression that they were all singing, all dancing intelligent things that (somehow, donít ask me how, I never gave that any thought) knew what appliances were being used based on the power consumption of the time.

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by reggie747 View Post
    What exactly is "The Warning" here ?
    No idea if it's the warning here but lot of people don't like them because of 1) reports of them misreading, leading to excessive bills and 2) a concern that suppliers will eventually vary rates during the day (to their advantage obviously) depending on consumers's pattern of usage.

  25. #25
    Anyone got some silver foil?

  26. #26
    Grand Master Saint-Just's Avatar
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    Itís of no benefit to me. It costs them money. Therefore it can only benefit them.
    Until theyíre made compulsory they can keep them.
    Don't take my silence for agreement. I've just realised you're too stupid to argue with.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saint-Just View Post
    Itís of no benefit to me. It costs them money. Therefore it can only benefit them.
    Until theyíre made compulsory they can keep them.
    It's not cost them anything. We've paid for it as the cost has been added to our bills.

  28. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Pointy View Post
    It's not cost them anything. We've paid for it as the cost has been added to our bills.
    And it may be a government requirement so they have to push them.

  29. #29
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    We moved from EON to British Gas a few months ago. We then got an email telling us that, as part of the new contract, we would be obliged to install 2 new smart meters, each for gas and electricity. Their website stated theyíre would be SMETS2 devices and as such would be compatible with any other supplier, should we decide to move again.
    Based on that, the app owns made but when the engineer turned up, he failed to mention that he was about to install SMETS1 meters, as ďthere were issuesĒ with one of SMETS2 meters. It transpired that you canít have a mix of SMES1 & 2, so he would be installing 1s. He didnít offer this information upfront but readily told me when asked.
    On that basis, I told him to pack up his gear and leave, which he duly did. Havenít heard a word from BG since.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    No idea if it's the warning here but lot of people don't like them because of 1) reports of them misreading, leading to excessive bills and 2) a concern that suppliers will eventually vary rates during the day (to their advantage obviously) depending on consumers's pattern of usage.
    ???

    We have our dual fuel contract with stated rates etc. Account is available online, no misreading (we still have the physical meters in the house so this is easily checkable). Variable rates (Economy 7 as an example) have been around for years - I do wonder how folks worry about stuff that are pretty straightforward?.
    When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........

  31. #31
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    I donít need a smart meter to tell me that if I switch things off Iíll use less power. Version 2 may not go dumb if switching suppliers but thereís no guarantee on that and different utility companies use different versions. Basically if itís a govnt. initiative itís the kiss of death as they screw up most things - eg they left it to the utilities to decide on the type of meter to be installed rather than insisting on a common meter for all as other countries have done . What a Surprise!

  32. #32
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    They are not being pushed to help you.

    They are being pushed in order to introduce variable tariffs. Once people have accepted them in sufficient numbers, peak usage periods such as breakfast time, dinner time, overnight EV charging etc. will incur additional costs.

    Coupled with the proposed removal of the UK domestic gas supplies/grid, electricity will rocket in price.

    To be avoided, imho.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by 33JS View Post
    They are not being pushed to help you.

    They are being pushed in order to introduce variable tariffs. Once people have accepted them in sufficient numbers, peak usage periods such as breakfast time, dinner time, overnight EV charging etc. will incur additional costs.

    Coupled with the proposed removal of the UK domestic gas supplies/grid, electricity will rocket in price.

    To be avoided, imho.
    Can you link to any reputable evidence for your statements?
    Last edited by Skier; 21st October 2019 at 20:07.

  34. #34
    Grand Master Chris_in_the_UK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 33JS View Post
    They are not being pushed to help you.

    They are being pushed in order to introduce variable tariffs. Once people have accepted them in sufficient numbers, peak usage periods such as breakfast time, dinner time, overnight EV charging etc. will incur additional costs.

    Coupled with the proposed removal of the UK domestic gas supplies/grid, electricity will rocket in price.

    To be avoided, imho.
    Our contract ( just signed) is for 2 years - none of your bollocks is included in our paperwork.
    When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........

  35. #35
    Grand Master Saint-Just's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris_in_the_UK View Post
    Our contract ( just signed) is for 2 years - none of your bollocks is included in our paperwork.
    But his point is valid. Itís all about getting to critical mass. The key is having enough homes equipped.
    Think of it asGoogle: they can use the information they gather to make money. It can be obvious ( heavier tariffs at peak, but they can and already do this). It can (and will) also be sneakier.
    Don't take my silence for agreement. I've just realised you're too stupid to argue with.

  36. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris_in_the_UK View Post
    ???

    We have our dual fuel contract with stated rates etc. Account is available online, no misreading (we still have the physical meters in the house so this is easily checkable). Variable rates (Economy 7 as an example) have been around for years - I do wonder how folks worry about stuff that are pretty straightforward?.
    Pretty sure thereís been thread(s) on here in the past where people have been very against them for such reasons.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...h-study-finds/

    Personally, donít think the potential hassle is worth the benefit, happy to read myself and enter on an app once a month or so and ignore the frequent reminders to get one fitted.

  37. #37
    Grand Master Chris_in_the_UK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saint-Just View Post
    But his point is valid. Itís all about getting to critical mass. The key is having enough homes equipped.
    Think of it asGoogle: they can use the information they gather to make money. It can be obvious ( heavier tariffs at peak, but they can and already do this). It can (and will) also be sneakier.
    So I just unplug it. Our contract is not conditional, no more is the Ďblack boxí for car insurance.

    Smart meters aside, they know who we are, where we live and our energy consumption - what extra are they gaining via the smart meter except not physically visiting the address?.
    When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........

  38. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris_in_the_UK View Post
    So I just unplug it. Our contract is not conditional, no more is the Ďblack boxí for car insurance.

    Smart meters aside, they know who we are, where we live and our energy consumption - what extra are they gaining via the smart meter except not physically visiting the address?.
    Iím with you on the Smart meters not being conditional however car insurance black boxes are. Thatís how younger policyholders get insurance with half reasonable premiums. The insurers can monitor their speeds and if they go over the speed limit regularly, the insurance is cancelled. Safer drivers are rewarded with further discounts on their policies.

    If you removed the black box, your policy would be terminated.

  39. #39
    Grand Master Chris_in_the_UK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kungfupanda View Post
    Iím with you on the Smart meters not being conditional however car insurance black boxes are. Thatís how younger policyholders get insurance with half reasonable premiums. The insurers can monitor their speeds and if they go over the speed limit regularly, the insurance is cancelled. Safer drivers are rewarded with further discounts on their policies.

    If you removed the black box, your policy would be terminated.
    I was not advocating unplugging insurance black boxes.
    When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skier View Post
    Can you link to any reputable evidence for your statements?
    Plans for the future of energy here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48186443

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris_in_the_UK View Post
    Our contract ( just signed) is for 2 years - none of your bollocks is included in our paperwork.
    Why do you think it's bollox? Its fecking obvious that's the way it's going! Only an idiot wouldn't see what's happening... Generation capacity and stability at risk, gas planned for phase-out, more renewables, more EV's...

    Do you think they are pushed in order that you can see your usage? lol

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by 33JS View Post
    Plans for the future of energy here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48186443
    Nothing there backs up any statements you made.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by 33JS View Post
    Why do you think it's bollox? Its fecking obvious that's the way it's going! Only an idiot wouldn't see what's happening... Generation capacity and stability at risk, gas planned for phase-out, more renewables, more EV's...

    Do you think they are pushed in order that you can see your usage? lol
    However they monitor my usage, be it smart monitor or analogue clock - they know what I use, itís how they bill me.

    FFS.
    When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........

  44. #44
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    Smart meters are a damn sight harder to tamper with than standard pre-payment electric (key) meters. In fact they trigger an alert to the supplier if they become faulty or someone tries to clock them. I see a lot of tampered with meters, some of the tampering is quite sophisticated but most instances are fairly blatant. The one I came across last week had a display debt of almost £420 but the electric was still on. No-one wants smart meters in the neighbourhood I work in.

    If you donít know what youíre doing then youíll likely end up with a partially melted meter and a scorched back panel. Itís rare for the utilities to prosecute anyone for this reckless behaviour.

  45. #45
    I hardly think anyone on here would be on a prepayment meter 😂😂

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by kungfupanda View Post
    I hardly think anyone on here would be on a prepayment meter 
    I wouldnít be too sure of that. The expression ďfur coat, nae knickersĒ comes to mind.

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by demonloop View Post
    You've clearly met my wife.
    What is it with women and leaving lights on EVERYWHERE even in rooms they arenít using. Seriously!!

  48. #48
    Grand Master oldoakknives's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 33JS View Post
    They are not being pushed to help you.

    They are being pushed in order to introduce variable tariffs. Once people have accepted them in sufficient numbers, peak usage periods such as breakfast time, dinner time, overnight EV charging etc. will incur additional costs.

    Coupled with the proposed removal of the UK domestic gas supplies/grid, electricity will rocket in price.

    To be avoided, imho.
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris_in_the_UK View Post
    Our contract ( just signed) is for 2 years - none of your bollocks is included in our paperwork.
    The clue is in... "Once people have accepted them in sufficient numbers,". When they reach that point they can set tariffs which are dependent on having said meters. 'Want a good tariff? Have our smart meter'
    Courage is being scared to death but saddling up anyway.

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldoakknives View Post
    The clue is in... "Once people have accepted them in sufficient numbers,". When they reach that point they can set tariffs which are dependent on having said meters. 'Want a good tariff? Have our smart meter'
    I'll repeat my question above. "Can you link to any reputable evidence for your statements?" Scaremongering and conspiracy theories without evidence are BS.

  50. #50
    Grand Master oldoakknives's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skier View Post
    I'll repeat my question above. "Can you link to any reputable evidence for your statements?" Scaremongering and conspiracy theories without evidence are BS.
    It's a prediction, nobody said it was in force at the moment, which was fairly obvious. However with the increasing concern about energy usage it's not unreasonable to think smart meters will be put forward as a tool to help reduce it. and become more commonplace if not mandatory.
    Courage is being scared to death but saddling up anyway.

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