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Thread: Electric underfloor heating advice please

  1. #1

    Electric underfloor heating advice please

    We are having an extension built onto our property and want to explore having underfloor heating fitted, specifically electric.

    If anyone can offer some recommendations as to which manufacture they've had, tips or advice I'd be grateful.

    The ground build spec is 16 m≤, block and beam construction then 100mm insulation topped off with 18mm chipboard.

    Ta.

    R
    Ignorance breeds Fear. Fear breeds Hatred. Hatred breeds Ignorance. Break the chain.

  2. #2
    Master
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    We have Warmafloor in kitchen and study
    https://warmafloor.co.uk/

    About 10 years old and never had any issue.

  3. #3
    Craftsman
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    Many people sell electric ufh mats. I think they are all much of a muchness. Even Screwfix sell it. The killer is the operating cost. Electricity costs roughly four times as much as gas per kwhr. Electric ufh does not tend to have the thermal inertia that wet (gas CH based) systems have, ie pipes through a slab. Therefore you don't get any benefit from running it on Economy 7 rates during the night (when leccie is on a par with gas per KWhr).

    When I moved into my house, the previous owners had recently installed it and I was hit with c £800 month heating bills in the winter. I turned it all off, added larger radiators and better insulation to the rooms where they'd fitted it and my consumption quartered.

    You could use it in a small room (eg ensuite or downstairs loo) just to take the chill off the floor for a couple of hours a day. Or wear slippers.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by craig1912 View Post
    We have Warmafloor in kitchen and study
    https://warmafloor.co.uk/

    About 10 years old and never had any issue.
    I'm glad you like their product but they don't do electric.

    R
    Ignorance breeds Fear. Fear breeds Hatred. Hatred breeds Ignorance. Break the chain.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by broxie View Post
    Many people sell electric ufh mats. I think they are all much of a muchness. Even Screwfix sell it. The killer is the operating cost. Electricity costs roughly four times as much as gas per kwhr. Electric ufh does not tend to have the thermal inertia that wet (gas CH based) systems have, ie pipes through a slab. Therefore you don't get any benefit from running it on Economy 7 rates during the night (when leccie is on a par with gas per KWhr).

    When I moved into my house, the previous owners had recently installed it and I was hit with c £800 month heating bills in the winter. I turned it all off, added larger radiators and better insulation to the rooms where they'd fitted it and my consumption quartered.

    You could use it in a small room (eg ensuite or downstairs loo) just to take the chill off the floor for a couple of hours a day. Or wear slippers.
    I'm looking to have electric underfloor heating as the sole heat supplier for the room. It's being built to a high standard of insulation so I think it's do-able to heat it only from the floor and I don't want radiators on the walls. From my own research it seems the electric matting is the most popular choice but there's a number of manufacturers

    If anyone's got such a system in place I'm keen to hear from them.

    R
    Ignorance breeds Fear. Fear breeds Hatred. Hatred breeds Ignorance. Break the chain.

  6. #6
    Craftsman
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    Electric UFH is stupid and expensive for anything but the smallest of spaces.

    Get a wet system and do it properly.

  7. #7
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by ralphy View Post
    I'm glad you like their product but they don't do electric.

    R
    oops should have said The Warm Floor Company but not sure they exist anymore

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Benji053 View Post
    Electric UFH is stupid and expensive for anything but the smallest of spaces.

    Get a wet system and do it properly.
    What is your purpose on this site.....if it's to be the resident prick and troll you're doing a great job👍

  9. #9
    Craftsman
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    Quote Originally Posted by Franky Four Fingers View Post
    What is your purpose on this site.....if it's to be the resident prick and troll you're doing a great job
    The OP asked opinions. I work in the M&E industry and see countless electric systems being taken out and replaced with wet systems. If you think passing that on is being a prick then so be it.
    Last edited by Benji053; 7th October 2019 at 23:33.

  10. #10
    Master wileeeeeey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Franky Four Fingers View Post
    What is your purpose on this site.....if it's to be the resident prick and troll you're doing a great job
    Disproportionate response.

  11. #11
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    We had an extension built in 2006/7, it met the building regs at the time re levels of insulation. We specified electric underfloor heating, I believe it is a Devireg system and has wall mounted thermostatic controllers for the kitchen and bathroom. There have been no issues with it at all and the running costs are not as horrendous as expected, whilst we have an old small terraced house with mains gas, the other heating is night storage heaters which I plan to replace with more modern ones in the not too distant. Anyway the monthly cost for both gas and electric is £180 and we probably don't use the floors in their most economic mode, tending to leave then on and just adjusting temps occasionally. The extension acts as a "blanket" for the rear of the House too, but probably most importantly it's just so bloody nice to have a warm floor! Cheers, John B4

  12. #12
    My issues with the systems is how they are sold (I work for a wood flooring company) so many customers buy them to replace radiators and in a large room you have no chance of maintaining heat without massive bills and also damaging your wooden floor. They were designed as a comfort feature to run alongside traditional heating but in recent years they are sold as a replacement to normal heating which they just are not. If this will be your only heating source I would be careful on what temperature you expect the room to be.

  13. #13
    We use Klima underfloor heating (available from Screwfix) and so far it's been really good. It makes a massive difference to a tiled floor.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by NikGixer750 View Post
    My issues with the systems is how they are sold (I work for a wood flooring company) so many customers buy them to replace radiators and in a large room you have no chance of maintaining heat without massive bills and also damaging your wooden floor. They were designed as a comfort feature to run alongside traditional heating but in recent years they are sold as a replacement to normal heating which they just are not. If this will be your only heating source I would be careful on what temperature you expect the room to be.
    Sorry to hijack, but in your experience is there a meaningful difference between wet and electric ufh from a wooden floor perspective?

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnB4 View Post
    We had an extension built in 2006/7, it met the building regs at the time re levels of insulation. We specified electric underfloor heating, I believe it is a Devireg system and has wall mounted thermostatic controllers for the kitchen and bathroom. There have been no issues with it at all and the running costs are not as horrendous as expected, whilst we have an old small terraced house with mains gas, the other heating is night storage heaters which I plan to replace with more modern ones in the not too distant. Anyway the monthly cost for both gas and electric is £180 and we probably don't use the floors in their most economic mode, tending to leave then on and just adjusting temps occasionally. The extension acts as a "blanket" for the rear of the House too, but probably most importantly it's just so bloody nice to have a warm floor! Cheers, John B4

    off topic but on your topic of storage heaters. i have the Quantum ones with the computer inside, i would upgrade to them as soon as you can if you do not get a gas boiler. so much more control over the old type and they hardly leak any heat when you donít want them to and soon learn how much to top up overnight. the fan is quiet (no more obtrusive than a whump of a boiler firing and the pump) i saved on my bills too.
    i get billed £535a year for power in my flat and iím all electric on economy 7.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Morgan View Post
    Sorry to hijack, but in your experience is there a meaningful difference between wet and electric ufh from a wooden floor perspective?
    Not really, our clients tend too have wet systems over electric matting (our floors are fairly expensive so the builds tend to be expensive and they normally go for a full wet system). From a wooden floor point of view the heat source is not important the key is not going over 27 degrees below the board and keeping relative humidity between 40-60%, other things that can damage the floor are constant and rapid heat changes, ie off in summer than a cold weekend and ramp it up to max then turn it back off a few days after.

  17. #17

    Electric underfloor heating advice please

    Iíve put warmup UFH in my bathrooms and itís very good. I would recommend it.


    https://www.warmup.co.uk

  18. #18
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Benji053 View Post
    Electric UFH is stupid and expensive for anything but the smallest of spaces.

    Get a wet system and do it properly.
    That depends on many factors. You can install electric for a few hundred quid whereas retro fit of a wet system is going to be many thousands. I suspect the payback would be quite a few years and lets not forget that renewables are all electricity so I suspect that at some point in the next twenty years electricity will become the cheaper fuel.

  19. #19
    In my experience, it echos what has been said, electric UFH as a primary source of heat will be expensive. We have electric UFH in our main bathroom with a tiled floor, we have it on low to take the edge of the cold flooring and for that job it works perfectly, we do have a radiator in the room to as its just so much cheaper for the winter to properly heat the room. We are looking at putting wet UFH in our extension when that gets built which will be a primary source of heat.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by o u t a t i m e View Post
    Iíve put warmup UFH in my bathrooms and itís very good. I would recommend it.


    https://www.warmup.co.uk
    Hi, are you using the 4ie smart thermostats with your UFH, if you donít mind me asking?

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by alfat33 View Post
    Hi, are you using the 4ie smart thermostats with your UFH, if you donít mind me asking?
    Yes I think thatís the one I use. It connects to Wi-fi and I can set it etc from the warmup app on my phone.

  22. #22
    Have a look at infrared under floor heating Mattís,it doesnít just warm the surface it warms the whole area and you can do with out radiators .


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by mk1974 View Post
    Have a look at infrared under floor heating Mattís,it doesnít just warm the surface it warms the whole area and you can do with out radiators .
    I'd not heard of this, off to have a search now. Thanks.

    R
    Ignorance breeds Fear. Fear breeds Hatred. Hatred breeds Ignorance. Break the chain.

  24. #24
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    Electric underfloor heating advice please

    Quote Originally Posted by o u t a t i m e View Post
    Yes I think thatís the one I use. It connects to Wi-fi and I can set it etc from the warmup app on my phone.
    I have that thermostat and app as well.

    My son designed and engineered it :). Naturally I find it works brilliantly.
    Last edited by alfat33; 8th October 2019 at 20:36.

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by hansblix2001 View Post
    We use Klima underfloor heating (available from Screwfix) and so far it's been really good. It makes a massive difference to a tiled floor.
    We have the same in our kitchen and it works well, but we use it to warm the floor a tiled, not heat the whole room as we have a radiator in there too, my Mrs refuses to wear slippers!!!

  26. #26
    Master
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    I installed a loose cable kit in 3 of our rooms in my old house (biggest area being a large kitchen diner) under a stone floor and tiled floors. Bought from the underfloor heating company, ran it for 10 years with no problems(controls were great). Energy bills didn't seem excessive at £113 per month (gas and electric) for a large 4 bed house which was quite old and not very well insulated (used in the 2 bathrooms often but the kitchen/diner only used in winter as it got to warm otherwise). Just make sure you lay down insulation boards first and plan the cable run.

  27. #27
    Craftsman hyl1987's Avatar
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    I have recently in the last few months installed electric UFH (150w version from eBay) in my loft, loft bathroom and some hallway. Approx 45 m2.

    I do however also have gas central heating radiators in all these spaces, as itís cheaper to heat the air volume with radiators from the gas fired radiator than to use electric UFH. I only installed the electric UFH for SWMBO and my 2 daughters as they always complain of cold feet!

    Whilst testing it, Iíve found that I could keep the rooms warm enough (floor and air volume) with just the UFH on <4 hours per day (bearing in mind we are not in winter yet so that cost might go up if I were to be electric only. However my new loft is very well insulated with 100 to 150 mm of rigid insulation boards in all walls and roof spaces.

    Separately I think the OP should consider what sort of roof/ insulation is used in your extension. The more insulated it is, there is a better chance that electric UFH can be your primary heating source. Also, I think the OP should consider if the extension contained within another room to the house, that is if there are no walls/ doors from existing house to new extension, your current heating from the house would also heat the extension.

    P.s. you also need a insulated tile backer boards over your wooden floorboards prior laying the UFH. This is to help ďreflectĒ the heat upwards, into the room and not down into the floor.

    Hope this helps!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  28. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by hyl1987 View Post
    Hope this helps!
    It certainly has and thank you for the detailed comments.

    The roof is of a very high level of insulation along with the new walls and d/g windows. There is an existing door accessing the extension (one that is double-glazed in fact) but the plan is to have that open as much as possible during daily use.

    I'm currently favouring electric matting combined with a 4ie smart thermostat. In case we find this insufficient to heat the room I've now specified additional electrical sockets to supply one or two Wšrme panels.

    R
    Ignorance breeds Fear. Fear breeds Hatred. Hatred breeds Ignorance. Break the chain.

  29. #29
    Master
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    We have electric matting from Screwfix in our en-suite takes the edge off the tiles but to heat the whole room Iíd imagine itíd be expensive, in our extension we had a wet system installed due to running cost fears of electric (50m2 so a big space) and couldnít be happier with it if there is anyway you can install a wet system Iíd explore it, as you want it as your sole source of heating. A smart thermostat is that room is a must whichever option imo as it takes a while to warm the room but once up to temp itís a much nicer heat than radiators if I could afford it the whole house would be underfloor heating itís that much nicer.

  30. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by mk1974 View Post
    Have a look at infrared under floor heating Mattís,it doesnít just warm the surface it warms the whole area and you can do with out radiators .


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Surely thatís how any underfloor heating works.

  31. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by alfat33 View Post
    I have that thermostat and app as well.

    My son designed and engineered it :). Naturally I find it works brilliantly.
    Fantastic! He sure did a good job.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by o u t a t i m e View Post
    Fantastic! He sure did a good job.
    Thanks, Iíll tell him :).

  33. #33
    Useful thread as I'm just about to install this in my kitchen, would prefer underfloor water heating but too much faff routing hot water so electric is easiest. Will be secondary heating, just nice to walk on warm stone instead of cold in Winter

  34. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    Surely thatís how any underfloor heating works.
    Under floor heating first heats the surface and then itíll start to heat the room .
    Infrared doesnít heat the surface has such ,the rays pass through it and warm the surrounding areas,a bit like a microwave.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  35. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by mk1974 View Post
    Under floor heating first heats the surface and then itíll start to heat the room .
    Infrared doesnít heat the surface has such ,the rays pass through it and warm the surrounding areas,a bit like a microwave.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Not many (if any) construction materials are transparent to ir radiation, Iíd take these claims with a pinch of salt.

  36. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    Not many (if any) construction materials are transparent to ir radiation, Iíd take these claims with a pinch of salt.
    Fitted loads of it and never had a complaint


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  37. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by mk1974 View Post
    Fitted loads of it and never had a complaint


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Does the surface get warm?

  38. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    Does the surface get warm?
    A little but not like normal electric Mattís


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  39. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by mk1974 View Post
    A little but not like normal electric Mattís


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Okay, thanks, I'm just bit dubious about the science behind it!

  40. #40
    Grand Master
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    I think itís a bit ambitious to rely on underfloor heating as the sole source of heat in a room, clearly it could turn out to be an expensive option.

    As for the Ďcomfortí factor, I donít really get that. Wear slippers, or fit carpets if itís a problem. The current obsession with hard floors seems odd to me, I much prefer carpets! My kitchen floorís laminate and it is a bit cold in winter, but not to an extent that bothers me. Wifey insisted on tiled flooring in the en suite bathroom, thatís a bit cold, but I donít hang around in there too long so it isnít a problem.

  41. #41
    Grand Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    Okay, thanks, I'm just bit dubious about the science behind it!
    That makes two of us!

  42. #42
    Master
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    We stayed in a holiday let in Northumberland in late Autumn. The two story barn conversion was only heated by underfloor (wet I assume). We never did get it to the right temperature. Whatever you set the stats to it was either too hot or too cold and then took a long time to change.

  43. #43
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    It might be worth considering a wet system combined with a dry screedboard floating floor (something like https://www.fermacell.co.uk/en/floor...eating-overlay ). I have used this commercially in the past (in schools) and it gives the cost-in-use advantages of a wet underfloor heating system without the need for a deep build-up or wet screeding on top of your floor structure. The lighter weight of the overall construction also improves reaction times and reduces temperature lag.

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