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Thread: Rugby world cup 2019

  1. #201
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    Quote Originally Posted by RustyBin5 View Post
    Well we wonít know who the better team is unless they get it on come Sunday. This isnít sour grapes from Scotland cos letís face it they donít harbor hopes of winning the tournament but as it stands the tournament is a laughing stock and that is doing nobody any favors. And yes the rules are very clear - but equally we know they would be broken in a heartbeat if the holders or hosts could be ďeliminatedĒ in such a stupid way.
    Ignore his baiting, he's so partisan he can't think straight. Whilst I would chuckle heartily if Scotland lost to Japan I would not like to see them go out this way and I'm sure if it was England in this situation he would be singing from a different hymn sheet.

  2. #202
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    Quote Originally Posted by theoriginaldigger View Post
    Ignore his baiting, he's so partisan he can't think straight. Whilst I would chuckle heartily if Scotland lost to Japan I would not like to see them go out this way and I'm sure if it was England in this situation he would be singing from a different hymn sheet.
    I donít mind partisan 🇯🇿- Iíd be as annoyed with this situation regardless of the teams involved however

  3. #203
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    My problem with the cancellation of only some of the fourth round of pool matches is that it is inherently unfair & doesn't treat each team equally.

    Either all fourth round pool matches should have been postponed & each team awarded two points* or all matches should have been played.

    You can't run four mini-leagues of five teams & have them playing different numbers of games to qualify for a knock-out tournament. Each team is entitled to play the same number of games to attempt to qualify. Each team had planned to play four games, yet some will only play three. Unfair & against the ethos of sport.

    *Before someone points out that I'm a Scotland supporter, I believe that if all matches had been postponed & teams awarded two points each, Scotland would have failed to qualify.
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  4. #204
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    Quote Originally Posted by RustyBin5 View Post
    Well we wonít know who the better team is unless they get it on come Sunday. This isnít sour grapes from Scotland cos letís face it they donít harbor hopes of winning the tournament but as it stands the tournament is a laughing stock and that is doing nobody any favors. And yes the rules are very clear - but equally we know they would be broken in a heartbeat if the holders or hosts could be ďeliminatedĒ in such a stupid way.
    i don't think anyone is laughing because the risks were well known before the tournament, hence the rules made very clear to everyone. If Japan had lost to Ireland and Scotland automatically qualified as a result of the typhoon do you think the SRFU would be suggesting a legal challenge? Unlikely. Always what would you think if Japan was insisting the match be played at another venue or delayed until after the storm in order to give them a chance to qualify in breach of the rules.

    The simply fact is Scotland should have won all their games and maintained control of their own destiny.

    Alas it looks like they will be victims of a divine wind - also known as a kamikaze

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  5. #205
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    i don't think anyone is laughing because the risks were well known before the tournament, hence the rules made very clear to everyone. If Japan had lost to Ireland and Scotland automatically qualified as a result of the typhoon do you think the SRFU would be suggesting a legal challenge? Unlikely. Always what would you think if Japan was insisting the match be played at another venue or delayed until after the storm in order to give them a chance to qualify in breach of the rules.

    The simply fact is Scotland should have won all their games and maintained control of their own destiny.

    Alas it looks like they will be victims of a divine wind - also known as a kamikaze
    Youíre missing the point entirely - whether deliberately or not I canít tell. The post before yours makes the point perfectly. Cancel all 4th round fixtures or none - much fairer - and if Scotland go out that way itís fair enough. But if you think the system is fair then you have a strange view of things.

  6. #206
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    The Cricket World Cup saw many games wiped out due to the weather and it is fair to say that England's opponents in the final (New Zealand) would in all likelihood have not qualified for the knock out stages had the weather not robbed Pakistan of some games.

    That being said what we see in the rugby world cup is some absolutely shite teams getting whacked by stronger teams and I'd be pretty annoyed if I had to beat, say Canada, to qualify and was prevented so by the weather. I think the fact that the teams in the Rugby World Cup are not as evenly matched as in the Cricket World cup gives a genuine disadvantage to a team playing a 'gimme' team (and having that match wiped out) so I can see why there would be aggrievement.

    FWIW Japan arent a 'gimme' team by any stretch of the imagination (just ask Ireland) but I actually fancy the Scots to beat them as they have found some form, were never as bad as the aberration against Ireland made them out to be (last 2 games against England anyone?) and I think they would be quietly confident of progressing. So I can understand the issue however what we are dealing with here isn't rain, it's a bloody great typhoon. Sensible decision would have been to move the game and play it elsewhere. But the powers that be will want Japan to progress and it 'miraculously' happens to be Scotland, the team whose rugby executive decided to veto plans for the lucrative nations league (thereby majorly pissing off the IRC) that are having to bend over and get some. Who'd have thunk it?

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    Last edited by ryanb741; 11th October 2019 at 18:17.

  7. #207
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    I think you will find that it is. Perhaps in the Japan match the scum half was taking the p*ss or that the Samoan side of the scum was pushing just before the put in after being warned by the ref.

    A free kick is a correct penalty for either.
    Sorry, I donít agree. The ref made it clear the infringement was a squint feed, not an early engagement.

  8. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by RustyBin5 View Post
    Youíre missing the point entirely - whether deliberately or not I canít tell. The post before yours makes the point perfectly. Cancel all 4th round fixtures or none - much fairer - and if Scotland go out that way itís fair enough. But if you think the system is fair then you have a strange view of things.

    Doh! Just in case you had forgotten each group contains 5 teams, hence it would penalise Russia who have already played all their games. Not withstanding the rules didn't say they would cancel all matches. Just those effected.

    The alternative would be for each team to exclude its worse result, but then Scotland would still go out.

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  9. #209
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    Quote Originally Posted by alanm_3 View Post
    Sorry, I donít agree. The ref made it clear the infringement was a squint feed, not an early engagement.

    No need to apologise. This might help.



    The scrum-half must put the ball in straight to the scrum, but they are allowed to align their shoulder to the middle line of the scrum.
    This means they are putting the ball in a shoulderís width towards their own teamís side of the scrum.
    So the ball has to be put in straight, but rather than being put in down the middle of the tunnel it is put in slightly towards the scrum-halfís own team.

    Read more at https://www.rugbyworld.com/news/scru...dM6MfMIi3S3.99

    So if it's not straight or more than "slightly" towards the scrum half's own team, then it gets pinged.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
    Friedrich Nietzsche


  10. #210
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    Rugby world cup 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    Doh! Just in case you had forgotten each group contains 5 teams, hence it would penalise Russia who have already played all their games. Not withstanding the rules didn't say they would cancel all matches. Just those effected.

    The alternative would be for each team to exclude its worse result, but then Scotland would still go out.
    Even you are now coming up with variations that are fairer. There is no ďdohĒ. The point is that the rules as they stand are not equitable. Whether Scotland are eliminated or not isnít relevant to whether the rules of the competition are stupid.

    To be clear Iím not trying to come up with a scenario which sees Scotland through, I just want a non retarded World Cup organizer. You seem to think it makes sense though so thatís ok .

    Even poor old Italy never got their shot at the all blacks due to this so they go home with no opportunity to qualify.

    Pointless tournament.
    Last edited by RustyBin5; 11th October 2019 at 20:05.

  11. #211
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    No need to apologise. This might help.



    The scrum-half must put the ball in straight to the scrum, but they are allowed to align their shoulder to the middle line of the scrum.
    This means they are putting the ball in a shoulderís width towards their own teamís side of the scrum.
    So the ball has to be put in straight, but rather than being put in down the middle of the tunnel it is put in slightly towards the scrum-halfís own team.

    Read more at https://www.rugbyworld.com/news/scru...dM6MfMIi3S3.99

    So if it's not straight or more than "slightly" towards the scrum half's own team, then it gets pinged.

    Thanks for the rule of law, however, in reality, Iíve rarely seen this rule being applied.
    Iíve witness what are clearly blatant feeds which never go unpunished, which is my contention. We all know that scrums are messy but some consistency would be welcome.

  12. #212
    Grand Master Andyg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RustyBin5 View Post
    Even you are now coming up with variations that are fairer. There is no ďdohĒ. The point is that the rules as they stand are not equitable. Whether Scotland are eliminated or not isnít relevant to whether the rules of the competition are stupid.

    To be clear Iím not trying to come up with a scenario which sees Scotland through, I just want a non retarded World Cup organizer. You seem to think it makes sense though so thatís ok .

    Even poor old Italy never got their shot at the all blacks due to this so they go home with no opportunity to qualify.

    Pointless tournament.
    i personally would change the entire format of the tournament to have a Cup and Plate competitions. I see little point in Tier 2's Team's being given a thrashing by a Tier 1 Team by 50+ points and would much prefer to see the top 8 teams all playing each other with the top 2 in a cup final. A bit like the Aviva Prem and the Tier 2 teams playing in a similar format for the Plate. The only question is whether Scotland would actually qualify for the top 8. Unlikely to be honest.

    Alas as I am not an organiser, but it would mean we get a much fairer contest.

    As for it being a pointless tournament. If you say so.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  13. #213
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    Quote Originally Posted by alanm_3 View Post
    Thanks for the rule of law, however, in reality, Iíve rarely seen this rule being applied.
    Iíve witness what are clearly blatant feeds which never go unpunished, which is my contention. We all know that scrums are messy but some consistency would be welcome.

    Not surprising you have seen it rarely given the rules only changed in 2017/18. But the one thing that never changes is that the refs decision is final. I know having watches England lose Grand Slams because of decisions that I didn't agree with. Makes bugger all difference at the end of the day. What is perhaps quite surprising is that you are complaining about a decision made in a match in which Scotland wasn't even playing in.

    But wait until the next WRC in 2023 because there is going to be a whole host of new rule changes especially regarding tackles. I read that all tackles above the waist line will be outlawed.

    As I said I really hope the game takes place, just to shut the whingers up.

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  14. #214
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    Rugby world cup 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    What is perhaps quite surprising is that you are complaining about a decision made in a match in which Scotland wasn't even playing in
    Does a discussion about rugby rules or tournament rules have to be about Scotland to allow comment ? What a bizarre comment. Not your first though
    Last edited by RustyBin5; 12th October 2019 at 10:39.

  15. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by RustyBin5 View Post
    Does a discussion about rugby rules or tournament rules have to be about Scotland to allow comment ? What a bizarre comment. Not your first though

    It's not that bizarre. You have selectively chosen to debate a single refereeing decision (not even a rule) in one game, which just happened to lead to a bonus try, which MIGHT just have an impact upon Scotland progress to the next round.

    If you want to discuss rules,referees and their decisions, then perhaps you need to keep it more general rather than fixate on one incident. Or perhaps we should start talking about Mark Cuetos try in the 2007 World Cup final.

    Its history. What happened has happened and it's time to move on.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  16. #216
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    Aaaanywaaayyy.....thereís a match on.

    Ireland the best first 20 minute team in the world. Now if they could sort out the last 60...

  17. #217
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    Red card to Bundi, fair call I think, after a yellow earlier this was to be expected for the next offence?

  18. #218
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    Quote Originally Posted by crazyp View Post
    I'm puzzled by the weather outrage, as a major cricket fan, it's just something you have to deal with. Look at this summer, we had so much rain and more matches called off than any other WC.

    You can't just say don't hold a WC in England for cricket and the same applies to Japan - try to do your best in terms of timing and if the mother nature wants to havoc, so be it.
    I agree with you here, sort of, bad weather when it supposed to be summer is a unavoidable hazard, a competition held in Typhoon season is not really a good idea, there were alternatives promised to be in place to avoid cancellation but they seem to have vanished.
    Weather has hit Japan in a big way, looks very bad for some, hope there are no more fatalities.

  19. #219
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    Have to say this refereeís been excellent.

  20. #220
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  21. #221
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    Samoa are a disgrace. Third world rugby.

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  22. #222
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhilT View Post
    Have to say this refereeís been excellent.
    ref was very good overall to be fair to him . it was a red card by the rules of the game. it didnt look malicious but it is still a red. however the ref should have given penalty tries .

    Samoa were filthy on the try line , numerous penalties again and again . there is a limit to what is acceptable and thats the only criticism of the ref i have . it wouldnt have changed the game result but fair is fair.

  23. #223
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    It's not that bizarre. You have selectively chosen to debate a single refereeing decision (not even a rule) in one game, which just happened to lead to a bonus try, which MIGHT just have an impact upon Scotland progress to the next round.

    If you want to discuss rules,referees and their decisions, then perhaps you need to keep it more general rather than fixate on one incident. Or perhaps we should start talking about Mark Cuetos try in the 2007 World Cup final.

    Its history. What happened has happened and it's time to move on.
    I havenít discussed any decision - only the match cancellations

  24. #224
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    Hagibis directly hitting Yokohama so Scotland game will be off. Have been sent some vids from people we know living in Japan and the areas it has already hit look like they've been through a tumble dryer.

    I've softened my stance on Scotland being eliminated this way as apparently Gregor Townsend was adamant Ireland had to pmay Samoa today and not postpone when that was under threat earlier this week so it is a case of sowing and reaping

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  25. #225
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    Samoa were poor and very disappointing. Ireland looked sharp, but I cannot work out whether it was because they were good or that Samoa were just bad.

    We will get a better view when they play SA in the next round. Should be a corker.

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  26. #226
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    USA fans certainly bring some colour to proceedings ...

  27. #227
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    Scotland game going ahead. Wales B team look appalling.

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  28. #228
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryanb741 View Post
    Scotland game going ahead. Wales B team look appalling.

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    Itís a difficult game for Wales. Uruguay have zero to lose, and plenty of people in the Welsh B team whoíve had next to no game time.

    Main thing is to get through it with a win and no significant injuries.

    Looking forward to the Japan vs Scotland game.

  29. #229
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    After all the talk about the Japan vs Scotland game, what are the chances of a draw?!

  30. #230
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    Superb handling by Japan

  31. #231
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    That 2nd Japan try was amazing. Try of the tournament (the NZ team try against a garbage outfit doesn't count)

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  32. #232
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    Good to see Japanís game improving so much. Scotland doing fine and Defence overall very good but nowhere near enough possession and going through phases. When we get the ball we are kicking possession back to Japan. Entertaining contest though. Japan through now.

  33. #233
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    Japan easily the team of the tournament so far. I would have preferred to see them play NZ in the quarters - not sure Japan v SA and Ireland v NZ will be as entertaining...

  34. #234
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    Very glad we're not playing Japan today!

  35. #235
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    Scotland could pull off another come back just like they did at Twickenham
    Going to be a great last 30 mins

  36. #236
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    Scotland giving it a good go here in the 2H. Might be a classic!

  37. #237
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    As soon as Scotland stop kicking away possession they look 10x more competitive

  38. #238
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    Tell you what - it says a helluva lot about Scotland that Japan arent out of sight - best game of the World Cup by far

  39. #239
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    Japan showing the resilience of a nation. First half was monumental.

  40. #240
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    Well done Japan. What a great game of rugby though

  41. #241
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    Fantastic Japan

  42. #242
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    Superb match, best of the tournament so far, excellent defensive display by Japan in the 2nd half

    1st half Scotland conceded too much possession

    Japan worthy winners, great contest

  43. #243
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    Great game! Well done Japan and also lots of spirit shown by Scotland in the 2nd half. Surely Japan are a tier 1 side - they arent at the level of the top 4 yet but surely they are on par with Australia and better than Scotland, Argentina and France?

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  44. #244
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    Fantastic match, both side left nothing on the pitch.

    Japan play with heart, skill and flair and are a team to be reckoned with in the top echelons of the rugby world. I think theyíll give SA a good run for their money.

    Glad we got to see them play.

  45. #245
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    WHAT A GAME OF RUGBY !! japan were immense in the first half . Their handling is god like . serious grit and determination . They deserve to Top the Group

  46. #246
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    What a wonderful morning of Rugby.

    I enjoyed the Tonga/USA game. The Wales game was pretty good, even if Wales underperformed in my book against a very spirited Uruguay - who I thought were excellent value.

    As for Japan and Scotland, best game of the tournament so far. Japan's tries were brilliant. They had great discipline, skill, commitment and passion. As for Scotland, they showed they had a forwards game, for about 10% of the match. The backs including Hogg were at best average. Bu the biggest difference was the class with which Japan conducted themselves. An example to all of Rugby.

    Regarding Scotland, assuming they don't try to sue the organisers for something, should be to clear house. Appoint a decent coach, from the Southern Hemishere (like England did when we failed to get out of our Pool in 2015), and get rid of players who consistently under perform including Laidlaw. Especially Laidlow. But most of all Scotland seriously need to spend a bit of time to reflect and stop thinking about previous glories, because the game has changed and so must they.

    Well done Japan. You are a credit to the game.

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  47. #247
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    I agree about Scotland needing to have a good look at themselves Andy. Gregor Townsend never seems capable of creating a cohesive team, making so many changes from game to game. I think Laidlaw has played his last game at number 9. He might be a good game manager but with the new generation of scrum halfís, like Ali Price and George Horne, heís no longer the differentiator he once was. I think the game has moved on and he doesnít fit into it.

  48. #248
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    Rugby world cup 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by ryanb741 View Post
    Great game! Well done Japan and also lots of spirit shown by Scotland in the 2nd half. Surely Japan are a tier 1 side - they arent at the level of the top 4 yet but surely they are on par with Australia and better than Scotland, Argentina and France?

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    Out of curiosity, you say Japan are not quite at the level of the top four but are on a par with Australia.
    Who do you believe are the top four? I would have thought Australia would have been amongst them.

  49. #249
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    I thought Japan were sensational, they had 79% possession in the first half, almost unheard of in what was a competetive game.
    I love the way they play, every man in their team seems interchangeable, they can all make yards, secure the ball, recycle it quickly and move into the next phase with speed and precision. It is irresistable.
    They all do their job defensively and work as a whole.
    And they will be a handful for South Africa, no doubt.
    Their win leaves Ireland in the position they least wanted, a QF vs NZ

    Dave

  50. #250
    Great match from Japan. They remind me of my Jack Russells, small, fast, tenacious and relentless.


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