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Thread: NEW DEFNEDER OFFICIAL VIDEO ETC

  1. #1

    NEW DEFNEDER OFFICIAL VIDEO ETC

    https://youtu.be/2xI5FoWjcl4

    thought it would save going through the other thread if you just want to have a look
    Last edited by Sweepinghand; 10th September 2019 at 09:32.

  2. #2
    Master
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    Thanks............Good one.

    B

  3. #3
    Master
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    I like the look of that but its so expensive!

  4. #4
    Master vagabond's Avatar
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    Prices to start from £45k! - let's be honest, that's not a utility vehicle, is it?

    I think that the Pickup market can breathe a sigh of relief......though they probably always knew they were never the intended target.

    P.S. Too much tech for my liking too....

  5. #5
    Craftsman
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    I think they look great and have convinced my self we need one in our household

  6. #6
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    Utility vehicle ..............85 ECUís , it will wade in 900mm of water, then drag the brakes to dry out the disks. Rear view mirror doubles as a rear view camera, wow now thats some tech for a farmer or United Utilities engineer.

  7. #7
    Master sweets's Avatar
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    They've gone and built another vehicle with more than enough toys, bells, whistles and comfort to be a Range Rover, or a new model Discovery.
    This doesn't occupy the niche that Defender had carved out for them.
    They've left that totally open and gone off to crowd the niches that all their other vehicle occupy.
    Doesn't make any sense to me
    D

  8. #8
    Master paneristi372's Avatar
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    Love it. I think it looks amazing. Can't wait to see one on the road. Much prefer the 90 over the 110 for proportions.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by sweets View Post
    They've gone and built another vehicle with more than enough toys, bells, whistles and comfort to be a Range Rover, or a new model Discovery.
    This doesn't occupy the niche that Defender had carved out for them.
    They've left that totally open and gone off to crowd the niches that all their other vehicle occupy.
    Doesn't make any sense to me
    D
    the original niche meant they were selling less than 5,000 units a year - long been filled by other types of vehicle. walk around most farms and you see pickups and quad bikes.

  10. #10
    Craftsman Tifa's Avatar
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    It's nice, but undeniably a Chealsea Tractor.
    I don't think many farmers or utilities companies will be buying them.
    Reverse assist on a utility vehicle?? LMFAO.

  11. #11
    Master sweets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dandanthewatchman View Post
    the original niche meant they were selling less than 5,000 units a year - long been filled by other types of vehicle. walk around most farms and you see pickups and quad bikes.
    That may be true but what sets this apart from their other offers? Very little indeed, they are all expensive large, luxury 4x4s. They are cannibalising their own market share rather than occupying a different niche.
    It may be great, but it is most likely to kill the Discovery rather than anything else.
    That makes no sense

  12. #12
    Master Chinnock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweets View Post
    That may be true but what sets this apart from their other offers? Very little indeed, they are all expensive large, luxury 4x4s. They are cannibalising their own market share rather than occupying a different niche.
    It may be great, but it is most likely to kill the Discovery rather than anything else.
    That makes no sense
    Indeed, they should have called this the new Discovery, not the "Pretender".......oops sorry, "Defender"

  13. #13
    Grand Master oldoakknives's Avatar
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    I think they look great. Totally different look to the old Defender and rightly so. Bet they will be popular with farmers.
    Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything.

  14. #14
    Craftsman Tifa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldoakknives View Post
    Bet they will be popular with farmers.
    Did you forget the sarcasm font?

    No way will farmers be buying into those.
    It's pretty rare to see a battered sh1t covered stock trailer being towed by a Disco, let alone something like that new Defender.

  15. #15
    Master reggie747's Avatar
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    There's something missing out of that video.... Oh yeah, the hard shoulder ?
    Last edited by reggie747; 10th September 2019 at 15:37.

  16. #16
    Master Chinnock's Avatar
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    NEW DEFNEDER OFFICIAL VIDEO ETC

    They’ve told us about all the new technological features etc but they still haven’t answered the most important question.

    Will it be Labrador proof?




    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Last edited by Chinnock; 10th September 2019 at 17:08.

  17. #17
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    All a bit disappointing, but exactly what I had expected. It isn't a replacement for the Defender, it's what the D5 should have been. If they drive well then I might think about having one to replace our Disco Sport, but it certainly won't be replacing my Defender! Spent a few minutes pricing one up, a reasonable spec came in at £64k..hmm. A shame and a bit of a missed opportunity you can't help but feel - I am sure they'll sell to the school mum crowd by the bucket load though, and that's all JLR care about it seems.

  18. #18
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    It's just another expensive, luxury SUV. Sorry does nothing for me.

  19. #19
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tifa View Post
    Did you forget the sarcasm font?

    No way will farmers be buying into those.
    It's pretty rare to see a battered sh1t covered stock trailer being towed by a Disco, let alone something like that new Defender.
    Far too much money for a farmer. A farmer can get a ford (or similar) crew-cab pickup for less than 30K which is more suitable for their needs than a posh luxury SUV! Farmers often get stonking discount deals on pick-ups... ISTR ford were giving 25% for a while and I read in farmers weakly the other week of another manufacturer doing the same - sorry can't remember who it was. No this new 'defender' is obviously aimed at the pretend Chelsea country folk and will never see a muddy lane. The sort that think getting a 'defender' instead of, for example, a disco has more street cred in the waitrose car park.

  20. #20
    Grand Master oldoakknives's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by solwisesteve View Post
    Far too much money for a farmer. A farmer can get a ford (or similar) crew-cab pickup for less than 30K which is more suitable for their needs than a posh luxury SUV! Farmers often get stonking discount deals on pick-ups... ISTR ford were giving 25% for a while and I read in farmers weakly the other week of another manufacturer doing the same - sorry can't remember who it was. No this new 'defender' is obviously aimed at the pretend Chelsea country folk and will never see a muddy lane. The sort that think getting a 'defender' instead of, for example, a disco has more street cred in the waitrose car park.
    Not all farmers want a crew cab pickup, and there are plenty of farmers out there who can afford a new Defender and will want one imo. Of course if all you want is the rufty tufty image of the old defender then by all means have one. Having driven them in the past I'd rather have something just as capable and a bit more comfortable if I had to spend a lot of time in it. Different if you just pose around down the pub and popping into town which is all I see most defenders doing.
    Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything.

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by reggie747 View Post
    There's something missing out of that video.... Oh yeah, the hard shoulder ?
    LOL.

    Yet another dud from JLR. How are they still in business? Who buys this cack?

  22. #22
    Master reggie747's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Holsterman View Post
    LOL.

    Yet another dud from JLR. How are they still in business? Who buys this cack?
    Not as many people as they'd like, I hear the owners are haemorrhaging...

  23. #23
    Master Chinnock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldoakknives View Post
    Not all farmers want a crew cab pickup, and there are plenty of farmers out there who can afford a new Defender and will want one imo. Of course if all you want is the rufty tufty image of the old defender then by all means have one. Having driven them in the past I'd rather have something just as capable and a bit more comfortable if I had to spend a lot of time in it. Different if you just pose around down the pub and popping into town which is all I see most defenders doing.
    You donít see any farmers here in rural Essex flashing their wealth in new Land Rovers tbh. Most commonly seen in old Defenders and other 4x4ís, pickups and the like.

    According to my farmer mates, an old Defender is the perfect vehicle. Rough and ready, easy to fix and repair, not too precious, carries a multitude of goods, parts etc, tows, doesnít get stuck and thanks to no longer being built doesnít lose any value.

  24. #24
    Yes Lenny of orders already in.... including utility customers, you need to properly understand what it can do - oh... farmers? Yep I know two who ate on the lists..... they will buy the base model - but you can spec up to a luxury look ok

    I love it

  25. #25
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    The Rolex of SUVs! No wonder we have so many comments on here. Overengineered and underused like the typical Submariner.

    At least you don't have no waiting list malarky with these 5 wheelers.

  26. #26
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    Yes the starting cost looks a bit rich but to be fair itís loaded with most of the toys required as standard.

    This is a big, highly capable and versatile 4x4 that has a Land Rover badge. For a lot of people in the market for this type of vehicle thatís enough.

    Given the choice between one of these and the hideous Disco 5 I know which one Iíd pick. I think it looks good, particularly with the black alloys.

    I just hope theyíve improved the reliability.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  27. #27
    Master Skyman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrMater View Post
    Yes the starting cost looks a bit rich but to be fair itís loaded with most of the toys required as standard.

    This is a big, highly capable and versatile 4x4 that has a Land Rover badge. For a lot of people in the market for this type of vehicle thatís enough.

    Given the choice between one of these and the hideous Disco 5 I know which one Iíd pick. I think it looks good, particularly with the black alloys.

    I just hope theyíve improved the reliability.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Agree all of the above, and the final sentence in particular. I cannot see myself being one of the first owners, aka JLRís front line consumer shake down. Too risky. I might wait for a basic 90 with steel wheels, for the wife. But at the opulent end of the scale, this is just way too expensive for what you are getting.

  28. #28
    Grand Master markrlondon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweets View Post
    That may be true but what sets this apart from their other offers? Very little indeed, they are all expensive large, luxury 4x4s. They are cannibalising their own market share rather than occupying a different niche.
    It may be great, but it is most likely to kill the Discovery rather than anything else.
    That makes no sense
    This. It really does seem to be attacking the Discovery.

    Oh well, Land Rover know what they are doing. Or not, perhaps. Land Rover to go the way of Rover Group, I suspect (although not solely because of this model).

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by markrlondon View Post
    This. It really does seem to be attacking the Discovery.

    Oh well, Land Rover know what they are doing. Or not, perhaps. Land Rover to go the way of Rover Group, I suspect (although not solely because of this model).
    I think if Land Rover can ditch Jaguar they will do just fine.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaytip View Post
    I think if Land Rover can ditch Jaguar they will do just fine.
    Well put.

  31. #31
    Master helidoc's Avatar
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    NEW DEFNEDER OFFICIAL VIDEO ETC

    Ugly as sin, and with traditional LR ďreliabilityĒ, Iím sure it will sell. Our Puma engined 110 had appalling reliability, but at least it did look cool.

    Iím sure serious users such as farmers would choose a Japanese or Ford pickup every time.

    D


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  32. #32
    Well I really like it which is a surprise for me. We've been seeing various pics of this for the past 8+ years and when it was called the DC100. A little disappointed it doesn't look more like that.

    I caught an angle of it going through the forest on the video and you can see some design features of the old Defender


  33. #33
    What niche or gap does it fill in the range? Whatís its competition?

    1. Amarok, HiLux?
    2. Vehicles that variants of the Discovery and Range Rover already compete against?
    3. Will it increase JLR sales or take sales from variants of the Discovery or Range Rover?

    Iím not being awkward, I just donít know what itís meant to do?


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  34. #34
    Master murkeywaters's Avatar
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    I seen a rather morose farmer last year effing, jeffing and worse at a load of sheep that he was chasing round the field in an old 90, it was very very funny and seeing the 90 bounce over that field was brilliant, just cant see the same situation in this new model.

  35. #35
    Craftsman Tifa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaytip View Post
    I think if Land Rover can ditch Jaguar they will do just fine.
    They need to address their horrendous reliability issues first.
    That's Landrover AND Jaguar.
    When a budget marque like Dacia starts consistently beating them both on the reliablity front*, something is seriously wrong.
    *Souce - Which Magazine

  36. #36
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    I would love one, steel wheel 90 with a roof tent.

  37. #37
    Grand Master Chris_in_the_UK's Avatar
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    It is long overdue - whilst I have no real issues with the looks etc. the fact that it is a new JLR platform and systems would keep me well away for the foreseeable.
    When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........

  38. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by BillyCasper View Post
    What niche or gap does it fill in the range? Whatís its competition?

    1. Amarok, HiLux?
    2. Vehicles that variants of the Discovery and Range Rover already compete against?
    3. Will it increase JLR sales or take sales from variants of the Discovery or Range Rover?

    Iím not being awkward, I just donít know what itís meant to do?
    Not aimed at the pick-up market. Business' choose those because pick-up and vans are more tax efficient than cars. Yorkshire famers seem to prefer the Isuzu D-Max and this car isn't going to take their market share.

    It's aimed at other cars of it's size and price point, the soft roaders from BMW, Audi, VW and the like. When those 4x4's were first launched they captured the outdoor/rugged feel with car spec. Now X3's and Q5's have lost that outdoor feel and become ordinary. This Defender looks at home in the forest, even though the nearest it'll get to a forest is Center Parcs.

    I like it and think it's a good move for JLR.

  39. #39
    Journeyman
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    What a pig of a thing.

    One born every minute, though.

  40. #40
    Master sweets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrisparker View Post
    Not aimed at the pick-up market. Business' choose those because pick-up and vans are more tax efficient than cars. Yorkshire famers seem to prefer the Isuzu D-Max and this car isn't going to take their market share.

    It's aimed at other cars of it's size and price point, the soft roaders from BMW, Audi, VW and the like. When those 4x4's were first launched they captured the outdoor/rugged feel with car spec. Now X3's and Q5's have lost that outdoor feel and become ordinary. This Defender looks at home in the forest, even though the nearest it'll get to a forest is Center Parcs.

    I like it and think it's a good move for JLR.
    I understand all that, totally, but why isn't that market share already covered by JLR? Oh wait, it already is, several times over. I think this looks fine, and it may be great, but it seems to take the fight to its own models as much as to the competition.
    If this is as good as they stare, why would anyone buy a Discovery?
    Surely, with the Defender there is a case for a simpler, more utilitarian vehicle, even a pick up or crew cab as there was before. There is competition in that sector, for sure, but JLR has no dog in that fight at present.

    Dave

  41. #41
    I really like it but I think it's just too close to the Disco.

    I'm going to be after a vehicle for my mobile bike repair business that I can get a couple of bikes inside, ideally just removing the front wheel, but also something nice enough / sufficient wife-friendly to use as a second family vehicle.
    With the old 110 you could flip the back seats to the side but it doesn't look like that's an option here so back to the drawing board.

  42. #42
    The comments under Richard Hammond's video are killing...



    I can't see how we at the workshop will ever be able to service one for a local farmer or a weekend pheasant-hunter. Prices of the old one will go up and up. If you happen to have an 'old' 90 or 110: start saving parts.

    Menno

  43. #43
    Grand Master number2's Avatar
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    The only conquest sales it makes will be from those who were already going to buy a Disco, epic fail off target.
    "Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. The third time it's enemy action."

  44. #44
    Grand Master GraniteQuarry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thieuster View Post
    The comments under Richard Hammond's video are killing...
    Indeed!

    Hammond never drove it in this video in fear the engine check light would come on

    Ha ha ha!

  45. #45
    Grand Master number2's Avatar
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    Dear Land rover, design idea for the new Defender.
    1) Take a Suzuki Jimny
    2) Make it bigger.
    3) Make a LWB version
    4) Make a pick up version
    5) Make a 'panel van' version
    The Suzuki starts at about £18.000 so a Defender should start around £25k+
    Oh and don't forget to change the badges.
    Last edited by number2; 11th September 2019 at 15:49.
    "Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. The third time it's enemy action."

  46. #46
    Apologies if this has been posted already but it serves as a useful reminder for the purists/traditionalists:

    https://www.evo.co.uk/opinion/22767/...r-needs-to?amp

  47. #47
    Grand Master oldoakknives's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bravo73 View Post
    Apologies if this has been posted already but it serves as a useful reminder for the purists/traditionalists:

    https://www.evo.co.uk/opinion/22767/...r-needs-to?amp
    "After all, theyíre the sort of people who have 45 grand to spend or, more likely, can run to the chunky monthlies on a PCP scheme. This is how Land Rover will survive in these tricky times, by making an expensive car that sells to well-heeled people for more than it costs to make, not by delivering on some deluded 1950s yeomanry fantasy for PC-bound pundits who arenít going to buy one anyway."

    Nearly fell off me chair.....!! But so true.
    Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything.

  48. #48
    It may not come as a surprise that the local LR dealer is also the Kia dealer... Simply because the Kia workshop needs to earn its income from tinkering with spanners. One of the mechanics (trained Kia AND Land Rover mechanic) told me that Kias never fail and that LR is the opposite: new RR engines after 35K kms...

    LR and RR are not widely spread here like they are in the UK, so all we see and hear are 'excessives' or 'extremities', nothing about numerous LR products that won't fail. But I would not put my money on a never-failing Defender (like Toyota manages to build every time again).

    I guess that Toyota dealers aren't too worried.

  49. #49
    Master Chinnock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bravo73 View Post
    Apologies if this has been posted already but it serves as a useful reminder for the purists/traditionalists:

    https://www.evo.co.uk/opinion/22767/...r-needs-to?amp

    They should have modernised the old Defender, not created an over complicated electronic nightmare (85 ECU's for christ's sake) and cannibalise their own Discovery market in the process.

    Stick to simplicity, modernise and provide variants to cover all previous markets. Base model from £25K upwards and they would have opened up a new and previously extinct market. Too much tech = too much to go wrong, as they have already proved.

    It's not a Defender except in name. As a Discovery 5 I would have said they had nailed it.
    Last edited by Chinnock; 11th September 2019 at 17:25.

  50. #50
    Grand Master oldoakknives's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thieuster View Post
    It may not come as a surprise that the local LR dealer is also the Kia dealer... Simply because the Kia workshop needs to earn its income from tinkering with spanners. One of the mechanics (trained Kia AND Land Rover mechanic) told me that Kias never fail and that LR is the opposite: new RR engines after 35K kms...

    LR and RR are not widely spread here like they are in the UK, so all we see and hear are 'excessives' or 'extremities', nothing about numerous LR products that won't fail. But I would not put my money on a never-failing Defender (like Toyota manages to build every time again).

    I guess that Toyota dealers aren't too worried.
    To be honest all the talk of JLR products seemingly falling apart all over the place wouldn't worry me.

    Had a Freelander and everyone said the engine would blow up and it never missed a beat, great motor for farm tracks, shoots and on the road.

    Then went to buy a Disco Sport and had a test drive in an Evoque and had to buy one, went round corners like a roller skate compared to the Disco Sport. Had it 2 years and tbh regret getting rid of it.

    On a Jag E-Pace now and it has had a couple of niggles but nothing of any importance (except for the JLR crappy 'lets go green laning' sat nav!) which isn't bad for what was a new model when we bought it. Handles and goes better than you might expect from a small to mid sized suv.

    If I was in the market for something a bit bigger and a bit more 'offroad' I'd have no worries about looking at the new Defender.
    Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything.

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