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Thread: Let's talk about Panerai!

  1. #1
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    Let's talk about Panerai!

    So I have always completely discounted Panerai as being too big and frankly being a bit ridiculous, as well as overpriced (but aren't all watches over £500 really??).

    But recently the fantastic thread started by Nono - https://forum.tz-uk.com/showthread.p...nerai-content) had been thinking that actually there may be something there.

    Recent trip to London and the missus was doing some clothes shopping and I had free reign of the WIS's wet dream that is Old Bond Street and Harrods. I was mainly researching IWC mark watches as I was thinking one of those could be my next big purchase. Then I came across the Panerai section in Harrods and thought, what the hell.

    I am not totally sure but I think this is the one that I tried on:

    The PAM00510


    It is 44mm, stainless steel, it had a solid case back. It was totally amazing. I thought that 42mm was a stretch for my wrist but somehow it just didn't look or feel out of place at all on my just under 7" wrist. What magic is this!? The crown guard thing is a gimmick but had a lovely feel and added to the character and I was just totally sold on the overall design. Oh dear...

    So what are the pitfalls with this brand? Customer service (Richemont...)? Service price? Quality control?

    I can see from chrono24 that buying at full RRP is probably not best advised. However, that leads me to my next query if buying second hand, fakes. Having been on enough European holidays I obviously know that Panerai is a much replicated brand. Any giveaways if I was buying second hand? One thought I had was that I think Panerai movements are quite slow beating, so listening might be a give away.

    Lastly, how do people feel in-house vs ETA. I am not someone that thinks in-house is inherently better at all; plus I think the serviceability of outsourced movements is much undervalued. What ETA movement is it that Panerai tend to use in their past or current 44mm watches? Do people have good experience of their in house ones?

    Obviously lots of questions - clearly not asking for anyone to just answer all of them. Please do not tell me to use the search function blah blah (I hate that, if this forum isn't for chatting watches what is it for?!), I will obviously do my own research as well!

    Oh and most importantly, please post pictures!!

  2. #2
    Master
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    You're clearly a very discerning and open minded gent. I don't have time to ramble just now, but I have fallen for Panerai big time in the past couple of years and have just ordered my most expensive watch ever... A Panerai - 670.

    Have sold off eveything else, including an extensive crop if Rolex sports.

    Get yourself over the Paneristi where most the Panerai fans form here also hang out. You'll find loads of info.

    BTW the heritage of Panerai is every bit as extensive and interesting as any other brand and not without controversy on top.

    A brand you can really get passionate about. The Paneristi are a special bunch (a bit like TZers): diverse individuals united by a passion.

    Also, search some of my posts.

    Here's today's wear...

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  3. #3
    I am a big fan and have several.
    Shortly someone will come along to complain about Italian Nazi connections, Brooklyn bridge fiasco, snap back cases on some recent models, betraying the heritage, the ‘ugly’ crown protector, the size, Richmont service,the Panerai fad being over blah blah. I have never had a problem with any of them ( touch wood ) and wear them with joy. No brand is perfect and they are all out to make money. Some grievances are genuine and you have to like it enough to be able to overlook
    them. Not for everyone and better to buy preowned from a reliable source, IMO.

    Since we all like pics here, a recent pic of my 389

    Last edited by RAJEN; 10th August 2019 at 13:31.

  4. #4
    Master
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    176, one of the classiest watches ever IMHO.

  5. #5
    I’ve never had a problem with in house movements,I think all current models are now in house ,maybe wrong.
    I’ve also had older models with eta movements,and not had any problems ,one of the advantages of these is obviously you don’t need to send them to panerai,which with there reputation is a bonus.
    Check out the panerai thread for more pics.


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  6. #6
    Master Skyman's Avatar
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    I am not really a Panerai person, but that 389 above would make a great daily. WTB duly posted!

  7. #7
    I've been a big fan over the years - in total I think I've had 5 of them. Currently left with two - a 111 and 190. The 111 was my first Panerai 10 years ago - all ETA with the sprinkle of outsourced movements (the 190 is an example which has the superb JLC 8 day movement). In-house was just trickling in. Panerai went that route due to ETA supply fears and wanting to become independent. Frankly I prefer the ETAs on Panerai - you can at least service them easily. The early in-house watches such as the 233 were also excellent watches - different, yet retained the essence of Panerai.

    After 2011 or so Panerai slowly started to lose their way IMO. Numerous models and special editions. For a newbie, I personally think start simple and look for a second hand ETA based watch - be it a 44mm Luminor or 45mm Radiomir.

    The only in-house I'd look at are the Submersible models and smaller (42mm) Panerai. Possibly the 372 as it is quintessential 'basic' Panerai, but I really don't like the 'faux lume' colour and it is massive at 47mm.

    Anyway have fun trying things on, styling wise they are fantastic!

  8. #8
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    Great interesting thread I’m with the OP but I need to try one on

  9. #9
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    Let's talk about Panerai!

    Definitely seems like they are a bit of a marmite brand, all depends if you like the styling I guess. But if you do then no one seems to really do a cushion case and sandwich dial quite like Panerai!

    All pics above look great! This could get expensive...


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  10. #10
    Master
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    Just some random pics on the phone...

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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by ASW1 View Post
    Just some random pics on the phone...

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    Wow! Those look amazing. Have you done a SOTC post at all?


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  12. #12
    my current 3


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  13. #13
    Craftsman endo's Avatar
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    I think i’m a “in the closet” Paneristi, despite my best efforts at disliking these oversized, overpriced fashion watches I seem to have owned quite a few!

    It all started a few years back when I came across a 122 for sale, 40mm and El Primero powered it wore lovely on the wrist after years of being under “the Crown’s” spell.
    Turned out to be a Unicorn, as very few 122s made it to market after Zenith ceased supplying Panerai with movemts just as they launched.

    PAM00122


    Next came the Zero as a by product of putting the 122 on a strap, I found the 40/22 case/strap ratio overpowered the head on the 122, and after trying a 44mm, I finally realised the size made sense proportionally.

    PAM00000
    https://www.instagram.com/p/BmDs3KxHTGj


    Third came the 511, yup thats a solid gold Luminor... so its a big pointless, “more money than sense” watch, but I honestly I loved it.(it was sold to fund a Moser), and i’d have another in a heartbeat.
    Sandwich tobacco dial, Rose Gold case made it a lovely combo.

    PAM00511
    https://www.instagram.com/p/BkVh8mNn9c0


    Having sold the 511, i suffered from withdrawal so I went hunting for a mint 510 Sandwich Dial....
    But it never could quite replace the feel I got from the gold, so it went to a forum member :)

    PAM00510
    https://www.instagram.com/p/Bp9QJBkHjyZ


    Now on to the two that remain in my collection...

    Titanium, Pig-Dial and 8 day PR, pretty much my perfect pam (perfect would be DLC maybe)
    After at the end of last year it took the place as the only 44mm Luminor I needed.

    PAM00913
    https://www.instagram.com/p/BsDPhA_nns5


    Finally... the most recent addition the 422
    For years I said 47mm was dumb, and even told verv there was no way I’d wear her 605 even though I secretly loved it. What I fool I was
    The 1950s case feels great, it has every bit of Panerai DNA, SandwichH, gold hands, domed sapphire and a handy PR indicator on the back just in case you forget if you’ve wound it.

    I definately been wearing the hell out of this one lately!

    PAM00422
    https://www.instagram.com/p/BzDHOjzHBc6

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by endo View Post
    I think i’m a “in the closet” Paneristi, despite my best efforts at disliking these oversized, overpriced fashion watches I seem to have owned quite a few!

    It all started a few years back when I came across a 122 for sale, 40mm and El Primero powered it wore lovely on the wrist after years of being under “the Crown’s” spell.
    Turned out to be a Unicorn, as very few 122s made it to market after Zenith ceased supplying Panerai with movemts just as they launched.

    PAM00122


    Next came the Zero as a by product of putting the 122 on a strap, I found the 40/22 case/strap ratio overpowered the head on the 122, and after trying a 44mm, I finally realised the size made sense proportionally.

    PAM00000
    https://www.instagram.com/p/BmDs3KxHTGj


    Third came the 511, yup thats a solid gold Luminor... so its a big pointless, “more money than sense” watch, but I honestly I loved it.(it was sold to fund a Moser), and i’d have another in a heartbeat.
    Sandwich tobacco dial, Rose Gold case made it a lovely combo.

    PAM00511
    https://www.instagram.com/p/BkVh8mNn9c0


    Having sold the 511, i suffered from withdrawal so I went hunting for a mint 510 Sandwich Dial....
    But it never could quite replace the feel I got from the gold, so it went to a forum member :)

    PAM00510
    https://www.instagram.com/p/Bp9QJBkHjyZ


    Now on to the two that remain in my collection...

    Titanium, Pig-Dial and 8 day PR, pretty much my perfect pam (perfect would be DLC maybe)
    After at the end of last year it took the place as the only 44mm Luminor I needed.

    PAM00913
    https://www.instagram.com/p/BsDPhA_nns5


    Finally... the most recent addition the 422
    For years I said 47mm was dumb, and even told verv there was no way I’d wear her 605 even though I secretly loved it. What I fool I was
    The 1950s case feels great, it has every bit of Panerai DNA, SandwichH, gold hands, domed sapphire and a handy PR indicator on the back just in case you forget if you’ve wound it.

    I definately been wearing the hell out of this one lately!

    PAM00422
    https://www.instagram.com/p/BzDHOjzHBc6
    Awesome, and I can understand the appeal of the gold, colours look fantastic. That 510 though... lovely. Out of interest what makes you call Panerai a “fashion watch”? It ain’t no Fossil!


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  15. #15
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    I loved the simplicity when I bought my zero in 2008. I got lost after that as they brought out a zillion models every year.
    Still have it but attempting to sell- send me a message if interested.
    Lovely watches- simple base models are my favourites.IMG_5971.jpg

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  16. #16
    Master Skyman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wigdog View Post
    I loved the simplicity when I bought my zero in 2008. I got lost after that as they brought out a zillion models every year.
    Still have it but attempting to sell- send me a message if interested.
    Lovely watches- simple base models are my favourites.IMG_5971.jpg

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    Nice pitch.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skyman View Post
    Nice pitch.


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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by wigdog View Post
    I loved the simplicity when I bought my zero in 2008. I got lost after that as they brought out a zillion models every year.
    Still have it but attempting to sell- send me a message if interested.
    Lovely watches- simple base models are my favourites.IMG_5971.jpg

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    Haha thanks. Currently I am thinking that if I did buy one it would have a sandwich dial and probably a display case back.


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  19. #19
    Craftsman endo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by watchstudent View Post
    Out of interest what makes you call Panerai a “fashion watch”? It ain’t Fossil
    Fossil, to you or I, might look disposable, but there are people out there that can drop £500k+ on a Mille or Jacob & Co. without batting an eyelid since it’s this seasons must have accessory, without any interest in a pieces technical merits.

    There was a time when Panerai rode the waves of success with the trend for oversized watches, when devout followers would talk in references and fight to be seen with the latest hot release, if that isn’t fashion i don’t know what is? (Sounds almost like another brand today. Ha ha)

    Ultimately, with Panerai now being lukewarm at best, it gives people an interest in watches a chance to explore the brand and their offerings with a less lot less pressure of “did i get the right one”

  20. #20
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    Panerai is my favorite brand,I started back in 2006ish with 24 and 111 then I stopped until the dam burst in late 2011/early 2012 with 6 incoming in a year,after that I started to curate what I want and getting what I really want into my collection (or PAMily)

    My SOTC from 2015/2016ish,still have all the watches here



    Other watches I haven’t got back then (forgot to take off my 345 when I took the SOTC photo)





    Personally I prefer the older ETA for ease of service,however the 8 days movement are practical as well,typically I got 240+ hours on P2002 and 237/238 hours on P2004 movt

    Some risti might notice that most of my watches are from the era before Panerai got lost..nothing beyond pam441 in my PAMily

  21. #21
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    I like Panerais, I have the PAM177 in titanium and the new PAM796 ‘destro’ leftie model in stainless steel. Here they are holding hands, surrounded by some dressier Germans:



    I’ve also got a PAM739 incoming, it has the prettiest movement I’ve ever seen in a Panerai, so I couldn’t resist:


  22. #22
    Craftsman Hasan's Avatar
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    I’ve had quite a few Panerai watches in my time including a 120, 111, 312, 307 and 368.

    To me, a Panerai should be sandwich dial, crown guard and manual wind.
    Would love a 127 or 217 one day as a weekend casual watch....

  23. #23
    Love Panerai and kind of glad they are out of favour.Had a 24 and a 111 both now gone ,replaced later with a 372 which is still here,soon to be followed hopefully with a rad 753

  24. #24
    Grand Master Chris_in_the_UK's Avatar
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    Always have a Panerai in the fold - maybe another sometime soon.

    When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........

  25. #25
    Master Top Cat's Avatar
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    Similar to the OP, I had a spare 30 minutes in selfridges and decided to look at the Panerai section as I was always put off by the 44mm and frankly scary 47mm case sizes but love the submersible design.
    I have 6.75" wrists so thought I could not wear such beasts until I tried them on..

    Visually I didn't think the 47mm looked any bigger than 44mm. I have convinced myself a can pull off a 47mm and have been lusting after the 389 sub ever since!!

  26. #26
    aaah all the 'faux lume' or whatever we're calling the colour now ruining so many nice watches . So much prefer the cooler tones of the normal green or blue.

  27. #27
    Craftsman Andyp1973's Avatar
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    I currently own these two,

    590, which gets the most wear. It’s been back to Panerai twice under warranty. First time because I magnetised it somehow and the second time was a timing issue after it had been fully wound.




    It tends to live on the strap in the pictures above the most. Which is leather from a vintage baseball glove.

    The second one I currently have is a 425. Traded my last sports Rolex for it on here. It doesn’t get as much wear as my other one and I have been thinking about putting it up for trade on here for the last couple of weeks. I couldn’t really tell you why either because it’s a great model and the hands and domed glass are to die for.




    I did something similar to AWS in that I sold of my Rolex’s and I now only own this brand.

    The brand literally has something for everyone if you choose to buy one. I just wouldn’t buy new from an AD.

    Paneristi is a good place for research and asking questions. The strap subculture is a big plus because you can completely change the look of your watch. Dress them up or down just by changing a strap.

    What’s not to like.


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  28. #28
    Master Nono's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyp1973 View Post
    First time because I magnetised it somehow and the second time was a timing issue after it had been fully wound.
    Same thing happened to my 560. I'm fairly careful with my watches near magnets, but one day It just gained 20 minutes in few hours. Demagnetization fixed the issue, but from time to time i see it jumps few minutes every few days, it depends how wound the movement is I guess.
    BTW, thanx OP for the shutout.
    I like the brand for ages, but what I didn't like the fact everyone had them because it was the thing back in the day. The same thing happened to Rolex and you get that funny look from people when you go diving with it. It's a tool watch FFS!
    I had the chance to go for In-house model, but if could make that choice again, I would go for Base Logo (aka 'Zero') with Unitas. It's like a AK47 strapped to your wrist.
    Oh and that thing with straps can become an obsession. I had gone that route with Speedmaster, I hope i won't go there with Panerai.

    OP said a picture, so here is one


  29. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by crazyp View Post
    aaah all the 'faux lume' or whatever we're calling the colour now ruining so many nice watches . So much prefer the cooler tones of the normal green or blue.
    ?? Faux lume? Where?

  30. #30
    Craftsman Andyp1973's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAJEN View Post
    ?? Faux lume? Where?
    The two models that I have are both dirty dials. Or aged lume from new. A take on an aged patina dial. Personally I like it because it softens the dial markers. You can also highlight it or blend it in depending on the colour of strap you pick.

    Some people will say it’s faking something. Personally I couldn’t careless. Don’t like it, don’t buy it.


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  31. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Andyp1973 View Post
    The two models that I have are both dirty dials. Or aged lume from new. A take on an aged patina dial. Personally I like it because it softens the dial markers. You can also highlight it or blend it in depending on the colour of strap you pick.

    Some people will say it’s faking something. Personally I couldn’t careless. Don’t like it, don’t buy it.


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    I see. Because I have a few Panerais with T dials and they all have real aged lume.

  32. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by RAJEN View Post
    I see. Because I have a few Panerais with T dials and they all have real aged lume.
    Yes obviously not actual matured T dial stuff but the newer watches that have this faux lume colour. I just don’t like it personally.

  33. #33
    Master
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    I have been a panerai fan for many years, bought my first in 2009, a 49, second in 2016, a 422. Then joined TZ in 2017 and the flood gates opened. Highlights for me are the 243, nice and chunky but not overpowering, 372, a classic luminor look, and the 720, my favourite radiomir. And included a group shot. Yes. I know. It is excessive.
    There is something for everyone in the range.

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  34. #34
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    Once they're under your skin you may as well give in and buy one. I bought the Pam00190. Classic Panerai looks but with a JLC 8-day movement. Perfect combo for me

    http://www.timetunnel-jp.com/image07...01908days2.jpg

  35. #35
    Craftsman Wyvern971's Avatar
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    I like the styling, but the case size sounds enormous.

    Then again I had the same with a Tuna, but after getting one it seems ok size wise.

    Bad news is I won't be in a position to pick one up for quite a while, so maybe better to not go and try one on.......

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  36. #36
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    Let's talk about Panerai!

    Anybody got a PAM959 yet? That new model has really piqued my interest again after all these years.

    I have had between 10 and 15 Panerai over the years and I’m left with only 1. It’s the first one I ever owned, owned by myself from new and was bought for me by my wife on our honeymoon back in 2006!

    A little different from how it left the factory nowadays but I like it



    Steve.

  37. #37
    Craftsman Wyvern971's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stefaulkner View Post
    Anybody got a PAM959 yet? That new model has really piqued my interest again after all these years.

    I have had between 10 and 15 Panerai over the years and I’m left with only 1. It’s the first one I ever owned, owned by myself from new and was bought for me by my wife on our honeymoon back in 2006!

    A little different from how it left the factory nowadays but I like it



    Steve.
    I would say that takes a fair amount of skill, but not to my taste, there was a Rolex with something similar a while ago and thought the same on that one.

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  38. #38
    Craftsman endo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bclark View Post
    Once they're under your skin you may as well give in and buy one. I bought the Pam00190. Classic Panerai looks but with a JLC 8-day movement. Perfect combo for me

    http://www.timetunnel-jp.com/image07...01908days2.jpg
    Love your Rad.
    (Didnt love it on the silicone soft touch dildo rubber strap though, glad you swapped back ha ha)

  39. #39
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    I think we should add this thread to this thread https://forum.tz-uk.com/showthread.p...ciation-thread

  40. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by stefaulkner View Post
    Anybody got a PAM959 yet? That new model has really piqued my interest again after all these years.

    I have had between 10 and 15 Panerai over the years and I’m left with only 1. It’s the first one I ever owned, owned by myself from new and was bought for me by my wife on our honeymoon back in 2006!

    A little different from how it left the factory nowadays but I like it



    Steve.
    Wow I love this where did you get the work done?
    Thanks
    Dan

  41. #41
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    Great thread. Panerai have always been on my “lust list”, ever since I saw someone wearing a Luminor in around 2006 in London. I probably could’ve had one by now by my flirting with a PRS20 meant I knew a Radiomir would be too big, the crown digging into my hand, and I’ve kinda gone off “big watches” since getting into vintage Supercompressors and getting my Zenith. That said, a black or blue dialled Due would definitely be on my Lotto wine shopping list!

  42. #42
    Never owned a Panerai.
    Always fancied an 8-day - as I’m a bit of a snob with the movement...
    I’m also totally in the the dark on what other models are the ETA vs bona fida in house Panerai.

    What sort of money do the 8-day (?510) go for these days ? Don’t see many come up on SC.

  43. #43
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    Niche

    Quote Originally Posted by peter2704 View Post
    Love Panerai and kind of glad they are out of favour.Had a 24 and a 111 both now gone ,replaced later with a 372 which is still here,soon to be followed hopefully with a rad 753
    They certainly lost that niche exclusive factor which surrounded the brand for a number of years in the early to mid 2000’s but they have developed into a fully fledged player in the mid luxury marketplace giving Omega and Lecoultre serious competition for a buyers money and they do give an impressive wrist presence for the price point , even if that price point is somewhat inflated but the whole watch market pricing is becoming a little out of touch.

  44. #44
    Grand Master
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    Ive had a dew Panerai over the years. 1950/40 case, manual wind and no seconds hand is the combination that I go for. Have had so many of the bloody things that I cant remember all the reference numbers!
    605, 372, 176, zero, the coffee coloured 1940s radiomir, 8 day brevatto, etc. Also had a 233 and a submersible

    Ive said before that I liken them to kebabs. You know they're not good for you but they're still the best on a drunk Saturday night, and you will have one again at some point.

  45. #45
    Grand Master 100thmonkey's Avatar
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    Panerai had a great setup and story until Richmont came along and catapulted them into a league they were not ready to play in. This resulted in some bad PR and a series of unfortunate releases coupled with the company truly finding itself. I feel its done this now and the in house movements, exciting designs, and a UK dedicated Boutique in London will start to increase brand awareness and sales.

    From the old bunch you would never fail with a 000, 213, 320, 233, 88, 372, 0090, the list goes on and also watch this space as the best could be yet to come
    "When You Go Home, Tell Them Of Us And Say,
    For Their Tomorrow, We Gave Our Today"

  46. #46
    Master mondie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    Llandudno (ex Oz)
    Posts
    1,742
    After 20 years of observing the brand from the earliest days of its popularity on Timezone, I finally bought an 088 a few months ago. It was always the Pam that I was most drawn too. It makes for a bit of variety in what is probably a quite narrow collection.

    3 by Simon Gee, on Flickr

  47. #47
    Journeyman
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Location
    Oundle UK
    Posts
    162
    Have used the boutique a few times now; unfailingly positive experiences.

    First for me was a 351 bought new from Berry's in Leeds... little did I know how much that watch was really going to cost me given the habit it instantly embedded.

    No, addiction!

    One of the more eclectic dealers in the Burlington Arcade has a Slytech white faced Luminor on display currently; would remortgage in a heartbeat...

  48. #48
    Master adesmith's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Cheshire
    Posts
    2,404
    Popped into the Florence store this week. Was made to feel very welcome and it was amazing to see some of the museum pieces on display. I can't believe that people actually wore those huge compasses on their wrists!


  49. #49
    Craftsman
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Southend
    Posts
    960
    I keep looking at them and am going to have to try. Is there a single resource showing pics, specs and model numbers etc. Cheers


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  50. #50
    Craftsman
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    East Yorkshire
    Posts
    934
    I started off with a 312 which had enough issues to put me off totally, but it didn’t. Then into a 000 which I moved on regrettably and went and tried a few other brands and now I’m back with a 352 and I want another Panerai either a 112 or a 176.

    I’ve had Rolex/Omega/IWC/LW/BR But nothing quite hits the spot like a Panerai, for me anyway.





    Last edited by neebsta; 13th August 2019 at 17:10.

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