Reply With QuoteI imagine it's to stop people "renting" the watches, I'm fairly sure that if there was a legitimate reason for return (a fault) then it would be fine.
Chaps, interesting thing Watchfinder are now doing...
They are now attaching a sticker to the watch that says the item is non returnable if removed or damaged. To me, this is unreasonable and seems to conflict with consumer rights legislation, both the Consumer Rights Act and the distance selling/cancellation regulations. I am sure Watchfinder would honour those rights, but the sticker may put people off trying to exercise them if they happened to have removed or damaged it. In particular, defects may become apparent a few days or months later, when the sticker will no doubt have been removed in order to be worn... a return for a refund under the CRA may still be the legal remedy but the sticker suggests otherwise. Interesting how this is supposed to link in with their warranty too...
Irked me, anyway! What do you think?
I imagine it's to stop people "renting" the watches, I'm fairly sure that if there was a legitimate reason for return (a fault) then it would be fine.
Legally you can return if faulty, sticker or not.
In my experience, they can be rather slippery and offer only the absolute minimum required by law....if that. Once bitten, twice shy.
Distance selling returns are only viable if the goods are returned in an unused and as supplied condition are they not? That's a return where you are not claiming a fault, but just "changed your mind" when seeing the goods in person.
That's does not affect immediately apparent or latent fault returns I don't think.
Sent from my SM-G950F using TZ-UK mobile app
I'd like to return this watch because the plastic on the bracelet is making me sweat
I think there is provision for a reduction in the refund to reflect “unnecessary handling” etc.Originally Posted by Bluehase284
I think it is an attempt to put people off exercising their legal rights, which is a very “interesting” practice...
Dont see any issue.
My missus ordered clothes from Selfridges recently and the garments had a large thick tag that clearly said if removed could not be returned. Judgingby the size of these tags, it's clearly to stop people ordering a expensive dress for a party/wedding and then returning it afterwards. Its clearly an issue for luxury retailers that people buy an item for an event and return it afterwards so by placing large tags/stickers that clearly say if removed cant be returned helps solve the problem.
I'd be interested to see the sticker. Is it see through? Where do they apply it? If not transparent, then it could be masking a defect.
Would really need to see an example before I could form any sort of opinion.
I'm sure as others have said, its only for change of mind circumstances. However, from personal experience they do not like to willingly refund even with an obvious fault and goods returned to store the next day.
Surely this is just until you have decided if you like the watch or not? So maybe a week or so
I would imagine at a later date if you have a problem with the watch then lack of sticker shouldn't be a problem if watch is within any warranty provided.
They have been doing this for ages now, it's nothing new. The 'sticker' is an opaque, robust, nylon? band that is looped and sealed around a section of the bracelet. Like a tab on a loaf of bread! It's maybe 2cm wide. It's loose enough that you can slide it about to try the watch on and check the bracelet for defects.
I do question their assertion that if it's removed you loose any consumer rights.
Totally get that, it’s a fair concern to protect, but consumer rights remain regardless. I think they are asking for trouble from a consumer rights perspective in the way it is presented and worded.
Big red sticker/band now I think. Like a sticky tag.
They will, in my experience, offer the least back-up they can get away with.
Not good, I've heard things to that effect about them.
My brother bought two watches from them. His Rolex came minus the spare links and I think he had trouble getting them sent out.
They sell links on eBay interestingly.
Could be worse. I can't recall the brand of the watch straps, but they came from watchgecko, and the straps were in sealed plastic bags with an if seal broken then it can't be returned sticker. So you can't even test of its the right length, suits your watch etc.
If you buy a Rolex they ask for your wrist size then send the watch with the required amount of links and hold back any surplus. At least that what they told me.
I suddenly had very large wrists
They sell lots of links on Ebay...Sent from my SM-G950F using TZ-UK mobile app
I really object to those restrictive practices. When you've paid for something, it's yours.
That says, people do take the piss with generous return policies.
Could consider it’s really only yours when you decide to keep it.
Can see their POV- if the sticker still enables the watch to be assessed but prevents it being worn in earnest fair enough.
Last edited by Kingstepper; 24th July 2019 at 21:59.
This is probably a good summary of rights under "distance selling" regs, etc..
https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/sh...buyingfromhome
Terrible business practice, especially given their top end pricing.
Is this a double negative?
Blimey! That really is taking the p***. Are these watches described as “complete package”. I could do without a guarantee card but links??!
Sounds fair enough to me. Guess I’d never seen the sticker as I always go to one of the shops.
What do you expect when you go grey though.... imagine the quality of their "servicing" then....
From Martin lewis site...
if you're sending a toy back because it was the wrong colour, it would be reasonable for you to open the parcel and take it out of the bubble wrap, but it would not be reasonable for you to remove the toy from a sealed clear plastic bag as you would have been able to see it was the wrong colour without taking it out.
^ is that the bit they are playing on?
Of course if its not a stuck on tag just pop the bracelet off then remove tag without cutting it
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Has anybody who is concerned about WF's practice actually asked them why they do it? That is what I would do - but then I won't buy anything from them following a bad experience many years ago.
I bought my first decent watch from them but it was in 2008 & they were a very different retailer then than they are now.
My feeling is that they are fine to sell to.......buying is a different matter.
Sorry I think it is entirely reasonable, it annoys me that people think its OK to borrow and item at the sellers expense - if you wear a watch for 14 days and send it it back it is considered "used" and cannot be resold as "new". The 14 days requires the buyer to 'look after the item' and not handle / use it more than they would when purchasing from a high street shop...
In watch-finders case I guess it has to be checked over and any marks, swirls, etc refinished... more time, money...
----------------------------------------------
We've moved from high street retail to online and while I entirely agree with distance selling laws, and the provision to return an item bought from a photograph, some consumers are taking liberties, have no honour, not thinking any further than there own front doors...
This kind of mentality fuelled the decline of the high street retail, and will also destroy small independent online sellers... If you want nice shops, real or online try to see the other side, especially the small traders and treat them with some respect - I believe amazon has started to log serial returners...
Sadly traders are fearful of standing up for their own rights as keyboard warriors are happy to post negative reviews. Its easier to give in and hope you get some return purchases later...
Sorry rant over :)
Last edited by 2kilo; 25th July 2019 at 16:22.
Totally get that.
I think the stronger issue here is the blanket nature of the statement that no returns are permitted if the sticker is removed. Yes a small minority of people might take the p and wear as a one off with the intention of returning, and that is a legitimate dealer concern, but that statement on the sticker cuts across consumer rights (not just distance selling but under the CRA too). A well advised dealer would make clear on the sticker this is without prejudice to consumer rights. A naughty dealer would hope enough buyers are put off trying to exercise their rights down the road if there’s a problem because of the blanket statement. Watchfinder are either poorly advised or a little naughty IMHO.
They refer to their faulty goods clause in their terms, but that is a little murky given their terms also state in one place that no returns are accepted if the sticker is removed. You have to look a long way into the terms to see a reference that nothing affects your statutory rights.
All a bit odd! Anyway, I’m very pleased with what I received so no need to try to return :)
Last edited by Berty234; 25th July 2019 at 17:48.
Bravo 2 kilo. Hard to disagree with anything you said except the part about the distance selling laws. I think they are unfair to the sellers.
I have a friend who sells high end audio. Because of the issues, he stopped all selling on-line. He only deals directly with customers. Strange as it may seem, his sales have gone up. Rightly, or wrongly, he believes he gets ‘better’ customers. And more repeat business.
It’s a huge question for the watch industry. Companies like Omega and JLC are already by-passing their jewellers.
That’s loyalty for you!
Last edited by paskinner; 26th July 2019 at 14:27.
^^^^^^
I think it's the personal touch from dealing with a real person when buying anything that is a luxury or indulgence. It's that warm fuzzy feeling, we all know it BS and the salesperson is after just that, a sale. In this world of digital comms, connected, but still in your own silo, human interaction is a sought after commodity.
Asos have also started checking up on serial returners, which make sense given the amount of people now just taking the p*ss. Very tough time to be any kind of retailer.
Distance selling does not give you an unlimited right of return if the item is not faulty.
Breaking seals, put there for a purpose, negates your right of return. Try returning a software package if you have broken the seal.
You are not given the right to use goods then return them. If you try an article of clothing on in a shop you cannot remove all the tags and seals before you do.
Same for a watch, distance selling or not, try it on yes, remove all seals, without the permission of the seller, then try it on, a different matter.
If the item is faulty then you have a definite right of return no matter what you have done with seals etc.
Mitch
I think the retailer is entitled to make a deduction for unnecessary handling, but the right to return under the cancellation/distance selling regs would still potentially remain even if a tag is removed. Perhaps this is over protective, can understand that.
It is what is reasonable.
If the seal is put there to prevent use of the goods, other than to test for fitting etc then that is a reasonable use of a seal. You can not return a software package, DVD etc having broken the seal. The seller can refuse a refund for obvious and legitimate reasons.
Same with clothing etc, you do not get to remove all the tags etc before you try it on in a shop. Tags put there to prevent the goods being worn, other than to try on for fitting and look, are a reasonable thing in my opinion and you would be unlikely to succeed in arguing otherwise if you made a legal claim.
I suppose you could say you removed the tags and wore it on just one occasion then changed your mind and decided to return and you would like a refund of the now current value of the goods and that you feel this would override a sellers statement that removing the tags and seals would negate a return. It is an argument but I am not sure it would succeed.
The legislation does say that breaking of seals etc can negate your right of return in certain circumstances, you would have to convince that it would be unreasonable to apply that to your goods.
Mitch
It’s an interesting one (for boring folk like me anyway) :)
All boils down to whether a tag on the watch fits squarely into one of the exceptions in the cancellation regs (such as sealed CDs, software, etc) where the right to cancel is lost where the seal is broken. I think the retailer would have to argue it fitted into the general category of exception relating to hygiene or health. Not overly convinced by that.
They can always try to argue for a reduction in the refund if counting as unnecessary handling (beyond what would be allowed in a shop) amounting to loss of value. Not sure removing a tag on a watch would reduce the value unless you also scratched it.
It’s a labyrinth, for sure, but I remain of the view Watchfinder’s red tags are a bit naughtily presented!
I can totally understand why some sellers will only do face to face/in store transactions.
Last edited by Berty234; 28th July 2019 at 19:56.
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