Afternoon all, apologies for the ominous title but I’m in a slight bit of a pickle,
So I sold a watch on eBay last week, a c65 trident diver by c ward to be specific, and the buyer is taking a rather odd approach to his new ownership of said watch.
So I know Ebay has policies to protect people in light of an item being faulty of not as described, but I’m essentially being held hostage by this guy who is telling me it’s ‘out of spec’ as far as timekeeping goes. He’s had it for 4 or 5 days and is claiming it’s keeping -17 secs a day in his watch box. I had the watch for about 2 weeks and wore it the entire time, it was keeping escellent time at -2 secs a day with it being wound (it’s a hand wind selitta movement) once per day. He’s now told me he is going to keep an eye on it for a few days and actually wear it and will ‘keep me updated’
I took issue with this as for starters he hasn’t even been wearing the watch and given its running slow he might not have wound it up fully? He’s at the stage now where he’s telling me What I’ve sold him is faulty or was misold. The way he’s going about it is oddly aggressive given if this goes to a dispute Ebay will have all his messages that he’s sent to me surely?
It’s also worth noting the watch isn’t even a year old and is still inside thier 5 year warranty.
Sorry this is it a bit garbled but who is in the wrong here? He essentially is clamming it’s not accurate enough for him but how am I supposed to know he hasn’t dropped it or is even operating the watch correctly?
If it comes down to it I could quite easily sell it but I’d rather not have the hassle, I posted it out to him extremely quickly and in the full complete c ward packaging.
I’ve sold maybe 8-10 watches in the past year and this has never been a problem before, I guess I’ve been selling to people who actually understand mechanical watches
Any advice appreciated or relevant experience thanks!
Why torment yourself? Get the watch back, refund the money and get the buyer out of your bubble. CW watches aren't that expensive (unless you are really desperate for the money). As long as it's returned in the condition you sent it out it then you can move on. Unless he/she is hoping for a discount?
I don’t get why you just don’t phone Ebay?
I suspect Ebay will see it black and white and despite it being a fully working and as described watch they will side with himOriginally Posted by bwest76
They might, but you will never know until you try.
I would just tell him to send it back personally,
If it’s not a chronometer spec movement then the timekeeping should be +/- 20spd so by his own admission it’s running within specifications. (I’d double check the CW website first though.
If you have all the details and talk to eBay, they’ll not necessarily side with him.
I had an issue with a buyer last year (not watch related) and, after talking to them and going through the messages, they sided with me.
Just offer a refund and ask for it to be returned.
I'm sure the buyer is just angling for a discount.
Cheers,
Neil.
Given how consistent the watch ran pre-sale it does sound like the buyer is trying it on for a discount.
Last time I had such an issue I simply asked watch to be returned.
Buyer then strangely felt the problem wasn't such a crisis after all.
Either way if the watch is indeed running poorly, you're honouring the ebay guarantee and C. Ward will sort it out for you in the long run.
I would offer a full refund and take the watch back, then let that be the end of it
Not worth the hassle dealing with some of these people
Tell Him to return the watch to You and only then refund His money
Just spoke to C Ward on the phone and they were very helpful,
On this watch in particular they guarantee it to +15/-15 a day and if it falls outside of those parameters in your use they will regulate it under warranty free of charge.
They also said the warranty is totally transferable and there will be no issues sorting it. They advised me to ask the buyer to get in touch with them if you have any questions,
I’ll wait to see if he wants to dispute but I’m not the kind or person just to let people get away with trying to manipulate me,
Given I have all the facts and have been nothing but helpful to him I think I stand a chance
Appreciate the feedback and glad to hear I’m not the only one
Let us know the outcome.
How do you know the buyers not just pissed off th at the time keeping isn’t what they expected (and if true on their timing outside spec)
Im not sure what you feel you stand a chance with. If the goods are within spec, notwithstanding that it’s covered by guarantee, I wouldn’t be too surprised if eBay agreed with the buyer.
Ultimately is easily solvable, but I’m not sure what you are hoping to gain - for potentially a lot of hassle. Personally, I couldn’t be bothered - I’d have got the watch back, got someone to time it for me properly over 24/48hrs or so, if required send it back to CW, and then sell it.
Good luck with a happy outcome though.
It's just a matter of time...
When you speak to them first it’s much better for you.
Refund it fully, then cancel the deal to get your eBay fees back. DO NOT offer him any discounts, that is exactly what he wants
Ebay were helpful to me when a buyer tried to extract a discount from me after an auction ended. Luckily I still had the item so I just cancelled the sale. They even removed the negative feedback he left me :)
So one step at a time here as he's going to wear it and update you, so maybe all will be ok .... or has been suggested, he's unhappy with the deal and angling for return/refund or a discount. So of course you are now waiting to hear from him again and can decide from there.
The watch has CW warranty and they have offered to deal with him or maybe you will decide the best route is to offer refund (on return) and move on. Even tho you say you don't really want the "hassle" of selling, it might be best to just conclude this saga quickly and move on. I would worry that offering a discount might not end the story !
Good luck.
my one and only problem sale on e bay was a watch, it was a Gucci! GMT, sold it sent it and almost immediately got contacted by the buyer and told it was not running correctly/ timekeeping , never a issue when I had it and it was almost new , anyway I said "send it back" and as long it was in the condition I sent it & I had lots of images on the ad to show what condition it was in i would refund, e bay froze the funds , well this went on for about 5-6 weeks he would send a mail he had it to his watchmaker etc it was faulty, all I ever replied was, "send it back" never got into a conversation with him of course he threatened to go to dispute, again I replied "go to dispute or send it back " . I seem to remember there is time limit ? the buyer has to lodge a dispute or return the item?, anyway he never did I appealed to e bay the looked at the correspondence and noted he never sent it back and sided with me and freed the funds . never heard from him again.
Last edited by mitch1956; 25th January 2019 at 17:34.
Sadly, it appears you've been selected by one of the many ebay d!ckheads out there.
Ebay will side with him, no matter what. I've had it happen to me and never again will I sell anything on that platform.
Give him a refund and move on.
I understand your frustration but move along, it's really not worth it.
What the others said: refund and have the watch returned. Fair chance that he will start moaning about "Who's going to pay for shipment when I return it...?" Or, if he plans to keep the watch and have it regulated by CW Ward: "I reckon that you'll pay for shipment"(...).
Menno
He sounds odd. Manual wind but puts it on a winder?
The word 'winder' appears exactly once in this thread: in your post.
Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.
Thats me odd then. I see it was watch box.
This.
Put yourself in the buyer’s shoes, he’s bought a watch that’s apparently not keeping good time and has advised the seller accordingly.
Rather than asking for a refund or discount, he’s said he’s going to wear it for a few days to see how it settles.
Let’s wait and see what happens next before jumping to conclusions.
The OP’s “taking issue with it” may have also come across as aggressive prompting a curt response from the buyer.
I don’t really see that the buyer is trying it on yet.
I see what you're saying but I guess you guys dont have the full picture here of how he is talking to me,
I'm not willing to share the messages but he's being incredibly condescending, aggressive and rude.
I guess I'm just stubborn..
as others have suggested , tell him to send it back and offer a refund.
.. tbh fleabay isnt worth bothering with as a seller these days as you are effectively forced to give a 6 month warantee on used items.
Random person buys watch, watch arrives, buyers remorse kicks in, random person fabricates random issue in order to qualify for a freebie return. Just save yourself the hassle and take it back and refund the guy, you'll find it runs exactly how you remember it when you get it back. The more he wears it the more chance it'll come back in lesser condition than you sent it (ie scratched).
Just tell him to either send it back or stop moaning, the watch is under warranty so he could get any issues sorted out if necessary.
Who's to say he's tested it against a reliable source? You could always offer to have a phone conversation to try and iron out any misunderstandings, possibly he's timing it against something unreliable and he doesn`t realise this.
I asked how he was timing it and he said with his iPhone, I suggested http://time.is but that pissed him off and he launched into another verbal volley at me!
I'll keep you guys updated,
Thanks a lot
Dependant on how much you sell via eBay you have access to the concierge service. I've always found them extremely helpful and sort out 'eBay w4nk3rs' relatively quickly.
As above, if he continues to complain tell him to send it back. Do not refund until you have it back in hand.
Hope it all pans out.
What a pain for you
Sent from my iPhone using TZ-UK mobile app
Kill him off with kindness.
Don’t lose your rag, offer him answers and help such as who to contact about transferring warranty etc and eventually he will give up. Don’t leave feedback until he has though.
Basically he has decided he doesn’t really want the watch any more and is looking for an excuse for a refund or a discount.
Good luck.
I hate eBay these days, it’s just become a place for a-holes to try and blackmail you. Watches seem to attract the dregs of society on there too for some reason. I’ve had it all, buyers refusing to pay as “it went for too much” when they placed bids to win in the dying seconds! Buyers keeping watches for almost 30 days & starting a return because “it was broken when it turned up” Latest one was someone unhappy as the (perfect original watch) didn’t have a feature he thought it did & asking for money off because of it! You even have to pay for the privilege of return postage for their remorse!
Sounds odd I had a buyer who was a chancer wanted a cheaper price, send it back and I will refund you The cost of the watch. Probably best way to go but save emails and send them to eBay if he starts being a wanker over it. Sorry for bad language.
Sent from my HTC U11 life using Tapatalk
Ebay seems to be rife with buyers seeking a discount once they get the goods.
I think that is the safest assumption to make here - and I would, in your situation..... ask for it to be sent back to me and issue a refund.
I once sold a new motorbike pillion cowl to someone on a bike forum, and got a text to say he was disappointed that there was a chip on the paint edge. I simply asked if it looked like it was from my packaging, to please take a photo of the damage - and to send it back with me paying all costs for a refund.
It quickly became ‘no problem’.................. and no photo was forthcoming either, even though the whole exchange was polite.
This.
Haggling for a partial refund.
World is full of cheap a.....s and eBay is crowded with it.
Ask him directly how much does he want or ask for return. You do not refund him unless ebay has proof that parcel is delivered to you.
Stall for a few days or weeks when you get the parcel back.
Small detour, but relevant I think: Does eBay have a system where the money and parcel are 'handed over' simultaneously?
Here on TZ-UK we're used to sending money before the parcel is in the mail. It functions wonderfully well as far as I can tell. However... I don't think that eBay is a safe spot like TZ-UK.
A Dutch website called 'Marktplaats' (Market Place) is owned by eBay but it is pretty independent of the owner. Marktplaats has this wonderful mechanism (buyer and seller have to join first, for free). You send the money using your bank and Marktplaats, where the money you send to buy is 'stalled' by Marktplaats until the parcel is in your possession. The money is 'released' at the moment that the courier has your signature on his display. Works perfectly.
Since Marktplaats is owned by eBay...
Menno
Return
Refund
Relax
Re sell
The above reflects why I have not sold anything on ebay for about 10 years. This is the kind of stuff I used to sell on eBay and I never had a problem with any buyer. Here is a small sample:-
Perfect watch,perfect delivery,perfect communication:perfect sender.Thank you T. More than a year ago IWC Mark XV withTHE bracelet PLUS IWC strap & Deployant (#140110221251) £1,411.00 Great service, highly recomended More than a year ago IWC cal 88 in 9ct gold. Recent full service, Fine watch (#140114570027) £985.00 Super Ebay seller. Excellent goods and service. Hope to deal again. THANKS More than a year ago Eterna-Matic. Pristine. Immaculate.Very Rare. Stunning! (#140109534617) £200.00 As good as it gets! 20 of 20 stars to an Ebay gentleman I sincerly recommend More than a year ago Jaeger LeCoultre Reverso Lady, Croc strap & deployant. (#140091689607) £970.00 completely trustworthy and honest seller; no hesitation in doing further busines More than a year ago Ulysse Nardin San Marco Chronometer. Blue Enamel Dial (#140095555783) £1,020.00 Fabulous. Great items, good comms and fast shipping. Excellent. Many thanks More than a year ago PATEK PHILIPPE. NEW WATCH BOX, WALLET AND OTHER ITEMS (#140081486443) £200.00 Super Seller -Grade A More than a year ago Meade ETX-90EC Astro Telescope in PRISTINE condition. (#140062545687) £295.00 The Best esaler !!! Always a great pleasure to deal with you Tom !!! Thx. More than a year ago Eterna-Matic 1948 Reveil in SS / 18ct SOLID GOLD BEZEL. (#140057300061) £450.00 Nice item, received safely with thanks. More than a year ago -- (#140041824989) -- Exceptional ebayer, pleasure to deal with. Fast and safe delivery. Many thanks. More than a year ago
It it is a different world on eBay now and my impressions for a long time is that it is infested with opportunistic Scroats! I know there are good guys still there but I will never sell on there again. I look at my ‘sold’ prices on there and wince painfully, if only I had the sense to keep those watches!
Last edited by KavKav; 26th January 2019 at 22:04.
They will
Partial refunds after the sale are against eBay rules.
If a buyer is trying to get you to partially refund some of the price, report them to eBay immediately.
I had a buyer try this on me for a few weeks, I kept refusing because his demands were basically unrealistic. Then I did some research and found that the "partial Refund Scam" is a common thing. eBay should be supportive of your position.
If you dont get a sympathetic response from eBay try suggesting that because you suspect the buyer is committing Mail Fraud, you're going to file a police report. The mention of "police" usually triggers eBay into action.
IF the buyer had claimed the item wasn't as described and asked to return the watch for a full refund, then eBay would probably side with him.
HOWEVER if the buyer claims the item isnt as described and doesnt ask for a return and refund but instead starts haggling for a "partial refund" then that is strictly against eBay rules because it is probably a scam. eBay will not take his side, I can almost guarantee it.
Let the buyer know that they are breaking eBay rules. Let him know you are reporting him to eBay. Report the buyer to eBay. Phone eBay and let them know that the buyer is possibly committing a fraud and you need to report the incident to the police to satisfy your insurance company req's. eBay will take this seriously.
What will likely happen is that your buyer will likely just not contact you again. Hopefully also get himself banned from eBay.
Very similar to my experience. He got angry and threatening at any suggestion that wasn't some kind of part refund.
Do a google search on "ebay partial refund scam"
Best of luck.
Had this last year with some joker who claimed that the item I sold him was damaged in the post and wanted a partial refund of about 60% of the sale price. He never produced any pictures or evidence, I just stuck to my guns and told him to return it for a full refund if he wasn't happy.
After several weeks of back - and - forth he kept the item and gave me negative feedback which claimed I had refused him a partial refund. eBay were, as usual, useless. They wouldn't remove the feedback even though I sent them all the messages where I had offered him a full refund on returning the item.
Against their rules?, seems to be woven into.
How is it I’ve had a few scummy twits going through the ‘not as described’ thing and eBay actually give you an option to make a partial refund on the resolution page.
Well damn, I stand corrected then.
The buyer who I was dealing with eventually was banned from eBay after our "incident", perhaps my complaining and making a noise to eBay precipitated them looking into his record some more? I dont know, but you can google "ebay partial refund scam" and its a known issue.
An interesting problem. Try to write to Ebey right away and complete the situation. Perhaps you will be a little protected. And if a guy starts taking out your brain, arrange his terrorism using mail through some kind of program for mass mailing
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