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Thread: Formula 1 2019

  1. #701
    Grand Master thieuster's Avatar
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    [QUOTE]Max V all had a much easier ride,[/QUOTE]

    Max and his dad are -what you'll call in English- Travellers. Grandpa Francois (Frans) used to run a bar and an ice cream parlour.

    Menno

  2. #702
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post

    Where as

    Damon Hill, Rosberg and Max V all had a much easier ride, but all have talent.

    Lance Stroll less so.
    Despite his father being a former champion, Damon Hill most certainly did not have an easy ride. By the time he reached adolescence the money had long gone. He was working as a motorcycle courier to fund his motorcycle racing at the start of his career.

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  3. #703
    Quote Originally Posted by jwillans View Post
    I sincerely believe the issue is not about having the same winner, its about lack of on track action across the board. Having watched live races through that era, and many replays on Sky, there was plenty of action to keep interest even though Schumacher won many of the races.
    Sky show only "classic" races from the past so they're bound to be the selected best from that era. There's also been some great (selected) races in the past few seasons too despite Mecedes dominance.

    I stopped watching F1 in the early 2000s because the racing was so poor. Ferrari's dominance was much worse than Mercedes because they did everything to ensure only Schumacher could win.

    There is a tendency to look back on past f1 eras with rose tinted glasses. That said F1 is definitely in crisis this season and even I'm losing interest.

    They have to sort out the problem of overtaking. It's been moaned about in F1 as long as I can remember but I don't recall it ever being this bad. So many races either become a train of cars 2 seconds apart or a DRS fest.

    A complete overhaul is needed of regulations and structure for distribution of prize money.

  4. #704
    Also I think prize money should be distributed based only on the finishing championship position of the lowest points scoring driver in each team.

    That way it encourages teams to employ 2 competitive drivers who will hopefully race each other. It should also discourage the use of uncompetitive pay drivers like Stroll.

  5. #705
    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    Also that Bridgestone designed the tires for Ferrari and did most of their testing with Ferrari. A massive advantage.

    Another reason why Ferrari's and Schumacher's record is tarnished (in my opinion).
    Well, that and the cheating. And the deliberate barging off of competitors. And the indignance if anyone even tried to do anything similar to him.

  6. #706
    Master WarrenVrs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by watchcollector1 View Post
    Also I think prize money should be distributed based only on the finishing championship position of the lowest points scoring driver in each team.

    That way it encourages teams to employ 2 competitive drivers who will hopefully race each other. It should also discourage the use of uncompetitive pay drivers like Stroll.
    I can not fathom why Stroll is used as an example so frequently. He's done more than enough to show he deserves to be in f1, certainly Kubica and Grosjean have had worse seasons so far.

    If he can sort his qualifying out, he'll be competitive with Perez, and no one would question that Perez is good enough.

  7. #707
    Master WarrenVrs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HenPecked View Post
    Well, that and the cheating. And the deliberate barging off of competitors. And the indignance if anyone even tried to do anything similar to him.
    Reading Brawn's comments on Schumacher is interesting. He had a very strange perspective of his own behaviour in the car.

    After the Villeneuve incident, he came into the pits shouting and swearing about Villeneuve driving into him, it was only when the Ferrari crew showed him the replay that he calmed and could see he'd been at fault.

  8. #708
    Grand Master Andyg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RS404 View Post
    Despite his father being a former champion, Damon Hill most certainly did not have an easy ride. By the time he reached adolescence the money had long gone. He was working as a motorcycle courier to fund his motorcycle racing at the start of his career.

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    He did indeed, however he still afforded to race and also in 1986 managed to borrow £100,000 to continue racing. Which was the same year my wife and I managed to borrow £42K (duel income no kids) to buy our first house. Not bad for a bloke riding a motor bike!!!

    Just because he worked as a motor bike courier, does not mean he was on his uppers. Plus he was still living in Hampstead at the time. Being the son of Graham Hill also helped.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  9. #709
    Grand Master Andyg's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=thieuster;5134610]
    Max V all had a much easier ride,[/QUOTE]

    Max and his dad are -what you'll call in English- Travellers. Grandpa Francois (Frans) used to run a bar and an ice cream parlour.

    Menno
    Max's dad "Jos the Boss", may indeed come from humble stock, but Jos was ex-F1 driver, ex-LMP driver, ex-Dutch Champ, etc, with many wins under his belt and I imagine he earned quite a few quid along the way, either via race wins or via sponsorship deals. He did drive for both Porsche and Aston Martin.

    He does however sound a rather unpleasent chap. Seems he likes to beat up women. What a prince!

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
    Friedrich Nietzsche


  10. #710
    [QUOTE=WarrenVrs;5134827]Reading Brawn's comments on Schumacher is interesting. He had a very strange perspective of his own behaviour in the car

    Do you have a link, would like to read that

  11. #711
    Master WarrenVrs's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=mav112;5135224]
    Quote Originally Posted by WarrenVrs View Post
    Reading Brawn's comments on Schumacher is interesting. He had a very strange perspective of his own behaviour in the car

    Do you have a link, would like to read that
    Can't remember, but Brawn talks about it here, 48mins in
    https://youtu.be/t15tKnsUJrk

  12. #712
    [QUOTE=WarrenVrs;5135239]
    Quote Originally Posted by mav112 View Post
    Can't remember, but Brawn talks about it here, 48mins in
    https://youtu.be/t15tKnsUJrk
    Ok cheers


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  13. #713
    Austria's Red Bull Ring, set amongst the valleys of Styria, is 700m above sea level and is 2nd in altitude behind Mexico at 2285m. It's also predicted to be a bit of a scorcher on race day. So what? Well, given the combination of the two, this could prove to be a test for each team yet to be experienced so far this season.

    The higher the altitude, the thinner the air. The thinner the air, the more critical the cooling. The higher the ambient temperatures... Well, you get the picture. Expect each team to come up with their own solutions to manage the airflow over, under, around and through their cars in order to keep brakes and power units in their respective ideal operating windows.

    There's another component that needs managing as well, one that is extremely sensitive to temperature - the tyres. For this season Pirelli amended their range of tyres, going from 7 different slick compounds to 5, each with a slightly thinner "tread" depth of those of last year. The reason for this thinner gauge rubber was to help to prevent blistering and potential tyre failures as a result, unfortunately the side effect is that it can be trickier to get the tyres up to, and then maintain, operating temperature. The FIA will be holding a meeting with the teams tomorrow morning to discuss a potential switch back to the 2018 spec gauge after the Summer break, most teams are for the idea with 2 against; Mercedes and McLaren. Let's not forget that those 4 rings of rubber are the most important components of each car, they are the final arbiter of performance. The team that extracts the most from them will have the fastest car with aspects such as suspension design, centre of gravity, wheelbase and so on all playing their part as well as, quite simply, how each driver controls their car. Almost forgot... we're not talking millimetres of difference here in depth, there's only 0.4mm between '18 and '19 spec tyres.

    Podium finishers? Ferrari could be strong here, it's a tight and short circuit that may suit their chassis and superior PU. Would you bet against those Silver Arrows, though? No, neither would I. It'll be as good as a home GP for Max, his teammate will need to bounce back from a very lacklustre French GP, and I'm keeping my fingers crossed that we'll see orange and blue up there again as well. A team that really needs a boost is Haas, Kevin Magnussen's gut is telling him that they'll do well, apparently.
    Last edited by CardShark; 27th June 2019 at 23:35.

  14. #714
    Well done Ferrari, but I’m betting an own goal with the soft tyres, they will be putting while the rest of the field goes through, LH penalty is a bit of a joke on that track, especially as in the last two minutes of qualy most of the field were impeding each other and nothing was done.

  15. #715
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    Formula 1 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    LH penalty is a bit of a joke on that track, especially as in the last two minutes of qualy most of the field were impeding each other and nothing was done.
    From what I could see they were all on out laps not flying laps. Lewis absolutely impeded Kimi on his flying lap. It was unfortunate for Lewis but the penalty was justified.

  16. #716
    Quote Originally Posted by jaytip View Post
    From what I could see they were all on out laps not flying laps. Lewis absolutely impeded Kimi on his flying lap. It was unfortunate for Lewis but the penalty was justified.
    Rules are rules, but the pundits saw it my way, Hamilton was in the wrong place at the wrong time

  17. #717
    Grand Master Saint-Just's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    Rules are rules, but the pundits saw it my way, Hamilton was in the wrong place at the wrong time
    Or the pundits are biased...

    In a separate post, he (LH) conceded that he "totally deserved the penalty today and have no problem accepting it"
    'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.

  18. #718
    Go Leclerc!

    With Lewis' grid penalty demoting him to 5th tomorrow could be a cracker. I'd usually be watching live however I'm at Brands Hatch tomorrow, I'll be doing my best to avoid all media.

  19. #719
    Craftsman RS404's Avatar
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    Well it's set up nicely for the race tomorrow, could be a really good one. Won't be watching it until the evening though as I refuse to pay for Sky. So it'll be MotoGP from Assen for me tomorrow lunchtime and trying to avoid hearing the result in the afternoon. I'm intrigued to find out how Ferrari will blow it for Le Clerc this time!

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  20. #720
    Grand Master Andyg's Avatar
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    The cynical amongst us might think that the LH penalty was engineered to give us a cracking race. Hopefully LH will do Bottas off the line (Perhaps by design), then a tussle before overtaking MV on an undercut, before going after Lecerc. Vettel should get up to 5th.

    Lewis accepted the penalty in good spirit (not the whiny Vettel way) and deep down I think he is looking forward to actually doing some racing.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  21. #721
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    Lewis was late to be told, or realise, that KR was upon him and it was a clumsy 'block' that could have easily been avoided. The penalty is justified imo. Lewis can't get through any season without causing a bit of drama now and then! Hopefully, the slightly shaken up grid will provide for an exciting race, especially with the contra tyre choices.

  22. #722
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    Impeding is a good example of a rule that needs to be changed. If the driver you impeded gets through to the next quality session anyway, then no harm done.

  23. #723
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    Quote Originally Posted by CardShark View Post
    Go Leclerc!

    With Lewis' grid penalty demoting him to 5th tomorrow could be a cracker. I'd usually be watching live however I'm at Brands Hatch tomorrow, I'll be doing my best to avoid all media.
    4th, not 5th. He drops into the space created by the magnussen penalty.

  24. #724
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    Quote Originally Posted by WarrenVrs View Post
    4th, not 5th. He drops into the space created by the magnussen penalty.
    No. Norris is 4th, Lewis gets the three place drop to 5th.

  25. #725
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaytip View Post
    No. Norris is 4th, Lewis gets the three place drop to 5th.
    For the avoidance of doubt here is a link to the Provisional Starting Grid (Amended), ie after the grid penalties have been applied.



    The 'Official Starting Grid' has yet to be published.

  26. #726
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaytip View Post
    No. Norris is 4th, Lewis gets the three place drop to 5th.
    Nope. See the grid. It's the way penalties are applied. They are done in order they're received (magnussen first Hamilton next). The field isn't bunched up to fill the gaps, until all penalties applied.

    The mistake you're making, is thinking that Norris is moved forward once the space in front (the magnussen 5th) as soon as magnussen goes back. He isn't. Magnussen is moved back, vacating 5th. Hamilton is then moved into 5th, with Norris still 6th. The entire top ten (bar leclerc) is moved forward one position to fill the now vacant 2nd. Thus Hamilton goes from 5th to 4th, Norris 6th to 5th.

    Complicated, but that's how it's done.

  27. #727
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    Quote Originally Posted by ViperStripes View Post
    Impeding is a good example of a rule that needs to be changed. If the driver you impeded gets through to the next quality session anyway, then no harm done.
    I don’t disagree in principle but it’s probable that, due to aborting the lap, Kimi had to use an extra set of tyres thus leaving him worse off for the race.

  28. #728
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave+63 View Post
    I don’t disagree in principle but it’s probable that, due to aborting the lap, Kimi had to use an extra set of tyres thus leaving him worse off for the race.
    Fair point that - but now penalties having to make up for all the other restrictions they have put on racing

  29. #729
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    Quote Originally Posted by WarrenVrs View Post
    Nope. See the grid. It's the way penalties are applied. They are done in order they're received (magnussen first Hamilton next). The field isn't bunched up to fill the gaps, until all penalties applied.

    The mistake you're making, is thinking that Norris is moved forward once the space in front (the magnussen 5th) as soon as magnussen goes back. He isn't. Magnussen is moved back, vacating 5th. Hamilton is then moved into 5th, with Norris still 6th. The entire top ten (bar leclerc) is moved forward one position to fill the now vacant 2nd. Thus Hamilton goes from 5th to 4th, Norris 6th to 5th.

    Complicated, but that's how it's done.
    I thought Lando was 4th due to reading this.(last paragraph)

  30. #730
    Yeah, it seems I got it wrong, however in my defense virtually every F1 related website couldn't agree if Lewis was to start 4th ot 5th either.

  31. #731
    I wonder if now the FIA have tried to make it interesting, if we have s real race, or if Ferrari have already screwed there drivers

  32. #732
    Grand Master thieuster's Avatar
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    56 laps now and things are looking good for Verstappen.

    What someone said: things look very different when the party-mode during qualifying isn't working for Ferrari and Mercedes. Then, RB/Honda is fast enough for overtaking during the race itself.


    Menno
    Last edited by thieuster; 30th June 2019 at 15:34.

  33. #733
    Sorry still another push to pass win, I’m becoming very disengaged with F1

    And the rules say a Cars width

    I have to wonder how many laps of the track his team owns he has done in other cars, a bit like Ferrari
    Last edited by adrianw; 30th June 2019 at 15:37.

  34. #734
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    Sorry still another push to pass win, I’m becoming very disengaged with F1

    I have to wonder how many laps of the track his team owns he has done in other cars, a bit like Ferrari

    Followed by the stewards reading the rule book?

  35. #735
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    Gutted for Leclerc, but what a drive by Max.

  36. #736
    Grand Master thieuster's Avatar
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    The tears of the Honda engineer are really something. What was the last victory of a Honda-engined F1 car?

    Edit: found it! Jenson Button 2006!

    Menno
    Last edited by thieuster; 30th June 2019 at 16:36.

  37. #737
    Master WarrenVrs's Avatar
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    That was a cracker. Can see max getting penalised unfortunately.

  38. #738
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    Quote Originally Posted by WarrenVrs View Post
    That was a cracker. Can see max getting penalised unfortunately.

    Yes, it´s F1; can´t have them rácing.


    McLaren will have something to think about; the Honda seems to make impressive progress; literally.

  39. #739
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    A bit gutted for Leclerc but a great drive from Max and a much better advert for F1. On another note, how much of a disappointment is Gasly proving to be? There's no way he'll be in that seat next season and I'm doubting if he'll even be in it for the last few races of this season.

  40. #740
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huertecilla View Post
    Yes, it´s F1; can´t have them rácing.


    McLaren will have something to think about; the Honda seems to make impressive progress; literally.
    Not really. Red Bull have the best chassis on the grid. They have done for years. Their week point has always (in the hybrid era) been the power unit.
    McLaren are a solid 4th in the constructors with more than double the points of the other Honda engine team, Torro Rosso.

  41. #741
    As I said, that’ll be a penalty then, 5 seconds

  42. #742
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    As I said, that’ll be a penalty then, 5 seconds

    As Verstapen says; why bother at all if you cannot overtake.
    Even Ferrari themselves lament that the current rules just about only allow for clean DRS overtakes but that rules are rules.

    Green table the winner of the second GP in a row is like shooting a dead horse.

  43. #743
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huertecilla View Post
    As Verstapen says; why bother at all if you cannot overtake.
    Even Ferrari themselves lament that the current rules just about only allow for clean DRS overtakes but that rules are rules.

    Green table the winner of the second GP in a row is like shooting a dead horse.
    It's a rule. Everyone knows the rule. If a driver chooses to ignore the rule, who's to blame?

    The driver. 100%. It might not be an outcome that we're happy with, but beyond stupidity to pull a move clearly in breach of a very well known regulation.

  44. #744
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    The penalty tweeted by journos is apparently fake. But Ferrari are apparently celebrating in their garage. So who knows.

  45. #745
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    Quote Originally Posted by WarrenVrs View Post
    It's a rule. Everyone knows the rule. If a driver chooses to ignore the rule, who's to blame?

    The driver. 100%. It might not be an outcome that we're happy with, but beyond stupidity to pull a move clearly in breach of a very well known regulation.
    Why bark up my tree?
    I don´t care whó wins!

    I simply like good racing and this green table winner stuff points to F1 being beyond terminally ill now.

  46. #746
    Grand Master thieuster's Avatar
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    Without further comment...

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=L42H4vkbHYc

  47. #747
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    Outcome (BBC link):

    No further action on Verstappen/Leclerc. The stewards "did not consider that either driver was wholly or predominantly to blame for the incident. We consider that this is a racing incident".

  48. #748
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    MV keeps the win.

    Wrong decision imo, but there ya go.

    * You just pipped me Pickle lol

  49. #749
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    Common sense prevailed. Best race of the season so far

  50. #750
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    About to watch highlights on C4 as I don’t have Sky but having watched the clip on the Sky website I think that was the wrong decision.

    It appeared that Verstappen forced Leclerc completely off circuit on the overtake which would normally invoke a penalty

    It took an inordinately long time to make a decision which never augurs well. Will be interested to see if Ferrari appeal this decision.

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