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Thread: Formula 1 2019

  1. #1001
    Quote Originally Posted by PickleB View Post
    Let's see what semantic gymnastics the stewards can come up with re SV at the Ascari chicane and all that followed.
    In fairness he wouldn’t have been able to look that way

  2. #1002
    FIA at it again CLC no penalty, Albon does exactly the same thing and gets a penalty
    Last edited by adrianw; 8th September 2019 at 16:43.

  3. #1003
    Grand Master Andyg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    FIA at it again CLC no penalty, Alvin does exactly the same thing and gets a penalty

    Investigated 3 times and still no action taken. An interesting decision, but it's Ferrari's home race and they most likely wanted to get out alive. Personally I thought it was worth a 5 second penalty.

    On the whole thought CL defended very well under huge pressure from Hamilton (less so from Bottas), but running a driver off a track, especially one which claimed the life of another WDC was a bit uncool to be honest.

    As for Vettel - more disappointment. If I was in Ferrari I would be looking at alternatives.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  4. #1004
    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    Investigated 3 times and still no action taken. An interesting decision, but it's Ferrari's home race and they most likely wanted to get out alive. Personally I thought it was worth a 5 second penalty.

    On the whole thought CL defended very well under huge pressure from Hamilton (less so from Bottas), but running a driver off a track, especially one which claimed the life of another WDC was a bit uncool to be honest.

    As for Vettel - more disappointment. If I was in Ferrari I would be looking at alternatives.
    FIA was strong here, they even sent in someone to justify their decisions, basically saying they have changed the way they apply the rules, it just happens that they chose this race to do it, and forgot to tell the other drivers and teams and must have been after the penalised Albon for exactly the same thing.

  5. #1005
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    FIA was strong here, they even sent in someone to justify their decisions, basically saying they have changed the way they apply the rules, it just happens that they chose this race to do it, and forgot to tell the other drivers and teams and must have been after the penalised Albon for exactly the same thing.

    Lol .

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  6. #1006
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    A great race marred only by the strange decisions of the stewards.

    First in qualifying when they ruled that Vettel had not exceeded track limits and let his time stand and, secondly, in Leclerc’s case when they effectively gave him a yellow card for running Hamilton off track and then took no further action when he cut the chicane.

    After all the previous controversies re penalties there was no consistency.

    I doubt this would have happened under Charlie Whitings era as Race Director.

    It will be interesting to see how both the drivers react to this in forthcoming races and whether these inconsistencies continue.

  7. #1007
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    I get the feeling Vettel’s trying too hard to maintain (in his mind) the top driver position at Ferrari.

    It just seems to me that LeClerc is hungrier for success. His driving style reminds me of Verstappen a couple of years ago.

  8. #1008
    Decent GP ruined by ridiculously inconsistent stewards rulings. I think a 5 sec penalty post-race for CLC would have been fair. I think the black/white flag use was a total cop out - there's no way you can enforce that consistently over a season. IF there's not a car's width and you force someone off, it's a penalty...ad if K Mag or Perez had done that I think the result would have been different.

    Vettel...claims he couldn't see. Fine, ask the team if it's safe to rejoin then. He's done I think....Hamilton destroyed him at Monza last year and now he has a team mate who is doing the same. He's lost his race craft, he's pushing beyond the limit to try and keep up.

  9. #1009
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    Not seen anything of the race; been otherwise entertained but it sure is a sour grapes fest Brit side.
    The rest of the world is more neutral; also appreciating the stewards letting the blokes ráce.

    From the results I say; congrats to LC and Ferrari; good for Renault and Albon!!
    When the going gets tough, the DAF gets going.

  10. #1010
    Grand Master Dave+63's Avatar
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    Formula 1 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Huertecilla View Post
    Not seen anything of the race; been otherwise entertained but it sure is a sour grapes fest Brit side.
    The rest of the world is more neutral; also appreciating the stewards letting the blokes ráce.

    From the results I say; congrats to LC and Ferrari; good for Renault and Albon!!
    Perhaps you should watch the race before spouting more of your anti British rhetoric.

    If you’d bothered to do that, you’d see that it was clearly a case of letting Ferrari get away with (almost) anything whilst punishing everyone else.
    Last edited by Dave+63; 9th September 2019 at 11:37. Reason: I’d forgotten about Vettel’s penalty which he’d have probably hit away with if he hadn’t actually hit the Racing Point!

  11. #1011
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huertecilla View Post
    Not seen anything of the race; been otherwise entertained but it sure is a sour grapes fest Brit side.
    The rest of the world is more neutral; also appreciating the stewards letting the blokes ráce.

    From the results I say; congrats to LC and Ferrari; good for Renault and Albon!!
    Personally I think it was great to see Charles Leclerc at the front defending well at the limit not easy with mirrors filled with silver knowing who’s piloting it ....a driver with similar characteristics for errr ‘racing’.

    Unnecessary penalties ruin races imho....he made errors under pressure but I saw nothing too naughty or deliberate Lewis seemed to enjoy it to be fair.

    Leclerc and Verstappen a breath of fresh air

    Cilla you seem quite intellectual so please drop the anti Brit thing it’s tiresome.

  12. #1012
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huertecilla View Post
    Not seen anything of the race; been otherwise entertained but it sure is a sour grapes fest Brit side.
    The rest of the world is more neutral; also appreciating the stewards letting the blokes ráce.

    From the results I say; congrats to LC and Ferrari; good for Renault and Albon!!
    God you are boring. Why do you bother posting on this thread.

  13. #1013
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaytip View Post
    God you are boring. Why do you bother posting on this thread.
    He's only on this forum to troll a couple of threads. Beats me why people bother to respond to him.

  14. #1014
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    FIA was strong here, they even sent in someone to justify their decisions, basically saying they have changed the way they apply the rules, it just happens that they chose this race to do it, and forgot to tell the other drivers and teams and must have been after the penalised Albon for exactly the same thing.
    In case anyone missed it, apparently the FIA's position was negotiated with, and at the request of, teams and drivers, first being applied at Spa...Italian GP 'yellow card' explained by F1 race director (link with video clip):

    ...Masi said: "The rules remain with regards to a car's width of room.

    "It's quite obvious here that Charles has squeezed Lewis and, consistent with what happened last weekend in Spa with Pierre Gasly, as a result it was the bad sportsmanship flag, or the black-and-white flag, that was displayed to Car 16 for the move and the squeeze in the braking area."

    While the black-and-flag has long been in use and available across motorsport, Masi says it will now be issued more often as means of a one-chance warning to drivers.

    "For small infringements that are, let's call it, a 'professional foul' but don't go beyond the line, we'll be absolutely using the black-and-white flag more and more," he said.

    "It's a sign to everyone that the driver's on notice because you only get one for the race. If you do it again, the drivers have all been advised that any other infraction will be referred to the stewards."

    Why the change in approach?
    Amid long-standing calls to allow drivers to race more freely in wheel-to-wheel situations, without penalties always being applied, Masi says teams and drivers have helped shaped the revised approach and plans for increased use of the 'yellow card'...

  15. #1015
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    Very pleased for Ferrari and LC for the win, I was surprised about the slight chicane cutting LC did towards the end didn’t get more comment.
    I think the ‘new’ warning flag policy is a good move, for the reasons given above.
    Cheers..
    Jase

  16. #1016
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    I think the yellow card is an excellent idea, however I have a couple of questions.

    Firstly what happens after a driver gets a second yellow card. Is it an automatic Black flag, stop go penalty, points deduction, a fine on the team or what??

    Secondly which offensives will be given a yellow card. Clearly it's not joining the track in an unsafe manner, an unsafe release, etc, but dangerous driving resulting in running another driver off the track is acceptable.

    Personally my view is if it doesn't create a safety hazard, for example exceeding track limits, then fine. But if it does impact safety (of others), then it seem totally inappropriate.

    Perhaps what the FIA need to do is actually list offences and the associated penalty.

    So for examples

    an unsafe release - 10 sec
    unsafely rejoining the track - 10 sec
    causing an accident - 10 sec
    exceeding track limits after a "yellow card" - 5 sec
    missing a turn - 5 sec
    failure to slow under safety car - 10 seconds
    failure to slow under yellow/red flag - 10 seconds
    swearing over the radio after a yellow card - 5 seconds.
    Last edited by Andyg; 9th September 2019 at 15:19.

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  17. #1017
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    Quote Originally Posted by TKH View Post
    Personally I think it was great to see Charles Leclerc at the front defending well at the limit not easy with mirrors filled with silver knowing who’s piloting it ....a driver with similar characteristics for errr ‘racing’.

    Unnecessary penalties ruin races imho....he made errors under pressure but I saw nothing too naughty or deliberate Lewis seemed to enjoy it to be fair.

    Leclerc and Verstappen a breath of fresh air
    Yup.
    Fínally the overly correct safety argument a bit better balanced by the fact that it ís racing.


    Cilla you seem quite intellectual so please drop the anti Brit thing it’s tiresome.
    Action = - reaction. Mine being the latter. The Saint Lewis stuff is beyond nauseating.
    When the going gets tough, the DAF gets going.

  18. #1018
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    Quote Originally Posted by TKH View Post
    Personally I think it was great to see Charles Leclerc at the front defending well at the limit not easy with mirrors filled with silver knowing who’s piloting it ....a driver with similar characteristics for errr ‘racing’.

    Unnecessary penalties ruin races imho....he made errors under pressure but I saw nothing too naughty or deliberate Lewis seemed to enjoy it to be fair.

    Leclerc and Verstappen a breath of fresh air

    Cilla you seem quite intellectual so please drop the anti Brit thing it’s tiresome.
    I believe that any other driver would have been penalised for the moves that Leclerc made yesterday.

    The stewards decisions were cop outs, I would be interested to see if any other driver pulls these type of moves and whether penalties are invoked.

    I doubt they would even attempt such manoeuvres such is the inconsistency of the stewards at the moment.

  19. #1019
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    I'm a fan of F1 over many decades, and love to see hard racing, but yesterday's I was pretty disgusted at - actually switched off on the last lap once it was clear the result.

    Did those guys not see Spa? Or the F3 race on Saturday? I've no issue with things like Verstappen and Leclerc in Austria - there's run-off, and you're not playing games with another man's life. But when you push someone off the track, on an old school circuit like Monza....you put someone at risk.

    The rules are really clear;
    1. No moving in the braking zone - you commit to a line and stick to it.
    2. You must leave minimum a car's width for your competitor
    Leclerc broke both of those, putting Hamilton at risk. Set aside who's involved, it's just the actions - exactly the same if it was Russell and Giovinazzi.

    So for me a great race spoiled by putting others at risk to block the advantage his opponent had created. If Hamilton held his line - as he was entitled - one of them could have easily ended up over the fence as wheels run over each other and potentially launch a car.

    'Warning flags' in my opinion do next to nothing. I raced in a series years ago that used such a system, and it was basically considered a free pass. If under pressure you knew you could deliberately block - saving an overtake - and there would be no repercussion, just a flag. It got so you HAD to do that, as everyone else would do it to you - if you didn't use that 'get out of jail free' card you were just at a disadvantage.

    I hope F1 cleans that up. With potentially closer racing under the new regulations, these kind of risks could become much more common.

  20. #1020
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    All the pap written here there and everywhere would suggest F1 should be tickling sticks contest with cotton wool.
    For heavens sake, it's mean to be the pinnacle of open wheel racing yet we don't see too much of it.
    I guess the opinion is that it's better to have one guy streak off ahead into the distance and that'll be it. Race result in say..... 2 laps ?
    This was the battle for the lead and 1st place yet there was no contact between the protagonists, such a fuss to "fill columns".


    https://youtu.be/TnzFRV1LwIo

  21. #1021
    Grand Master PickleB's Avatar
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    Let's not forget F1 Driver Penalty points. Sebatien Vettel is on 9 and that leaves him with a margin of 3 before a further penalty ensues. He has 3 GP to go before any of the 9 points are dropped.

  22. #1022
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    It's not a fuss to fill columns, it's vital. It's defining the extent to which you are prepared / allowed to put someone else at risk.

    Leclerc squeezed Hamilton as Hamilton had created an advantage, and (I presume) Leclerc judged that Hamilton would back out, thinking of the championship. Hamilton took avoiding action onto the grass, therefore no accident happened. It's absolutely clear from every camera angle that it Hamilton stays on his line they make contact.

    The FIA has said 'do that again and we wave a flag at you', i.e. nothing. So the next time when the championship is not at stake Hamilton MUST hold his line, otherwise he allows himself to be bossed by the more aggressive driver. So the FIA are nigh on ensuring there will be an accident next time. Hamilton has already made that clear - if the FIA will not stop that, he has to.

    For me that's totally unacceptable. Remember Melbourne - Villeneuve and Schumacher pushing each other too hard, the car is launched and resulted a marshall was killed. There's 'hard racing' which is fine, but you have to have an eye for risks, and squeezing someone off the track, particularly with no run off, is unacceptable.

    Going just off track caused this at Monza - look at the innocuous little kerb and the enormous effect. What if that happens to Hamilton - he's in the grandstand.


  23. #1023
    Master reggie747's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Senninha View Post
    It's not a fuss to fill columns, it's vital. It's defining the extent to which you are prepared / allowed to put someone else at risk.

    Leclerc squeezed Hamilton as Hamilton had created an advantage, and (I presume) Leclerc judged that Hamilton would back out, thinking of the championship. Hamilton took avoiding action onto the grass, therefore no accident happened. It's absolutely clear from every camera angle that it Hamilton stays on his line they make contact.

    The FIA has said 'do that again and we wave a flag at you', i.e. nothing. So the next time when the championship is not at stake Hamilton MUST hold his line, otherwise he allows himself to be bossed by the more aggressive driver. So the FIA are nigh on ensuring there will be an accident next time. Hamilton has already made that clear - if the FIA will not stop that, he has to.

    For me that's totally unacceptable. Remember Melbourne - Villeneuve and Schumacher pushing each other too hard, the car is launched and resulted a marshall was killed. There's 'hard racing' which is fine, but you have to have an eye for risks, and squeezing someone off the track, particularly with no run off, is unacceptable.

    Going just off track caused this at Monza - look at the innocuous little kerb and the enormous effect. What if that happens to Hamilton - he's in the grandstand.
    But Hamilton wasn't ahead at any point so he had to make the decision back out.
    The driver ahead has the advantage,

  24. #1024
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    Quote Originally Posted by reggie747 View Post
    But Hamilton wasn't ahead at any point so he had to make the decision back out.
    The driver ahead has the advantage,

    Whoosh! The driver doesn't have to be in front, just along side. Which he was. Otherwise CLC wouldn't have had to run him off the track.

    But remember The Cockwomble was racing for a championship, rather than the win. Once the title is secure, and if he starts gambling with the lives of other drivers, then perhaps you might see how stupid your remarks are.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  25. #1025
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    Quote Originally Posted by reggie747 View Post
    But Hamilton wasn't ahead at any point so he had to make the decision back out.
    The driver ahead has the advantage,
    Leclerc only got a black and white as Hamilton swerved onto the grass. If he had held his line and the cars had touched (and potentially crashed), the stewards admitted as such that they would have struggled NOT to penalise Leclerc. You don't have to be level in those situations to have a right to a cars width and LeClerc crossed the line but was lucky he was driving a Ferrari at Monza rather than being a back marker in Williams.

  26. #1026
    Master reggie747's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    then perhaps you might see how stupid your remarks are.
    In the words of Kmag, "Suck my Balls", Andyg.

  27. #1027
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    then perhaps you might see how stupid your remarks are.
    You, of all people, are in no position to suggest that anybody has made a stupid remark, ever.
    When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........

  28. #1028
    Grand Master Andyg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris_in_the_UK View Post
    You, of all people, are in no position to suggest that anybody has made a stupid remark, ever.

    Oh to err is human, but to suggest that a driver has to be n front before the other driver can run him off the road is incredibly stupid - don't you think.

    But on the topic of stupid, you recently incorrectly accused me of following you around the forum in order to troll you. I said incorrectly because it was actually proven it was you who was following me. And as if to reprove my point, you have doubled down and done it again. What a prize chump you are.

    Any who, enough of this, can we get back to the topic in hand, because some other find your petty little vendetta boring. I know I do.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  29. #1029
    Grand Master PickleB's Avatar
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    Has Hamilton ever squeezed another car? If so, what penalty was he given?

    Just asking...

  30. #1030
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    No he hasn’t, when he does it it’s brilliant decisive talented driving obviously.
    Cheers..
    Jase

  31. #1031
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    Formula 1 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by PickleB View Post
    Has Hamilton ever squeezed another car? If so, what penalty was he given?

    Just asking...
    Just found this on the web.


    But.......Leclerc did two infringements in one. He moved while under braking and forced another car off the track.

  32. #1032
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    The point that needs to be made here is that the pressure from CLC was made under braking for the chicane.
    This means that both cars are decelerating as fast as they can as close to the chicane as possible. Hamilton has the right to try and outbrake his rival, so has a right to be where he was. But, Hamilton could not back out of that situation, because he was under maximum braking effort at the time. The only things he can do is either hold his line and allow the contact (which definitely gets CLC the penalty but risks damage, and therefore points) or move sideways off the track to avoid contact, and so lose track position and time, but keep the position he aready has. "Backing out" is not possible. Hamilton took the more pragmatic decision.
    The stewards choice not to sanction CLC makes it much more likely that next time the outside driver (Hamilton or anyone else) will hold his line, and contact will be made, with all those inherent risks.
    That is what makes the stewards decision so odd.

  33. #1033
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    Cool

    Oh my, and then Í am boring because I think the Saint Lewis stuff nauseating...

    May LC and MV bother the zelots a lót; what the heck; Albon too!!
    When the going gets tough, the DAF gets going.

  34. #1034
    Grand Master PickleB's Avatar
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    Lewis does seem to have a better record than some of the other drivers...link to Total and current penalty points per driver.

  35. #1035
    Quote Originally Posted by sweets View Post
    The point that needs to be made here is that the pressure from CLC was made under braking for the chicane.
    This means that both cars are decelerating as fast as they can as close to the chicane as possible. Hamilton has the right to try and outbrake his rival, so has a right to be where he was. But, Hamilton could not back out of that situation, because he was under maximum braking effort at the time. The only things he can do is either hold his line and allow the contact (which definitely gets CLC the penalty but risks damage, and therefore points) or move sideways off the track to avoid contact, and so lose track position and time, but keep the position he aready has. "Backing out" is not possible. Hamilton took the more pragmatic decision.
    The stewards choice not to sanction CLC makes it much more likely that next time the outside driver (Hamilton or anyone else) will hold his line, and contact will be made, with all those inherent risks.
    That is what makes the stewards decision so odd.
    I now hope the gloves are off and all of the other drivers do exactly the same as CLC, back to proper racing, without interference.

    What will actually happen, is they will dish out penalties as they have been doing and claim that it is deferent stewards at different circuits, but there was no bias at Imola

  36. #1036
    Quote Originally Posted by Huertecilla View Post
    Oh my, and then Í am boring because I think the Saint Lewis stuff nauseating...

    May LC and MV bother the zelots a lót; what the heck; Albon too!!

    I don't like him (but I don't know him) Hamilton is that good, it may make the races boring but it is a fact, look what he does to his team mates and not with contracts like MSC did. Rosberg only got a championship because LH broke a few times.

  37. #1037
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    I don't like him (but I don't know him) Hamilton is that good, it may make the races boring but it is a fact, look what he does to his team mates and not with contracts like MSC did. Rosberg only got a championship because LH broke a few times.
    I neither like nor dislike the bloke and objectively he is an áwesomely good driver.
    Team dominance and/or rider dominance has always been part of racing with rule makers trying to level the field.
    The rest is simply about humans racing, the circumstances of their epoque
    ... and about fanboys and appearantly nationalism. Facts of life, as are counter-reactions to that.
    When the going gets tough, the DAF gets going.

  38. #1038
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    Formula 1 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Huertecilla View Post
    ... and about fanboys and appearantly nationalism. Facts of life, as are counter-reactions to that.
    You claim to only be reacting to the”nauseating fanboyism” as you refer to it, yet you’re the one who’s constantly criticising the level of support for LH (a British world champion who is currently the best driver in the field) On a predominantly British forum.

    You come across as very anti British on almost all your posts; perhaps it would be wise to take a step back and look at your posts from an outsider’s perspective?

    There was a clear bias going on on Sunday (although you won’t have seen it because you were doing something “much more interesting!”) but it wasn’t anti LH or anti British, it was pro Ferrari. Look back at almost any point in the history of F1 and you’ll see that it has always been thus.
    Last edited by Dave+63; 10th September 2019 at 15:59.

  39. #1039
    Grand Master Andyg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huertecilla View Post
    I neither like nor dislike the bloke and objectively he is an áwesomely good driver.
    Team dominance and/or rider dominance has always been part of racing with rule makers trying to level the field.
    The rest is simply about humans racing, the circumstances of their epoque
    ... and about fanboys and appearantly nationalism. Facts of life, as are counter-reactions to that.

    Blimey Cilla are you really that dim or myopic, or just bigoted.

    Did you not see the reaction of the Tifosi to Ferrari's win in Monza or the MV Orange Fanboys who follow him from track to track (even if he was born in Belgium). So of course some element of nationalism comes in to it. Just as it always has, and just as it come in every major sport. Perhaps this is why they play the respective national anthems for the winners - doh!

    The problem you seem to struggle with, is that the Mercedes/LH package is by far the best on the grid. You might not like it, and you might wish to see MV or CLC win, but has it occurred to you that what you actually want is to see LH lose. Why? Because he is British and not Dutch/German/Spanish, etc. Which actually makes you a bit sad. True fans just want to see the best perform, like watching Messi, Ali, Micheal Jordon, Wayne Gretski, etc and don't actually give a monkeys what country they were born in.

    Try to see beyond the driver's nationality and just appricate the levels of skill, ability and commitment each contributes to the competition. LH's record speaks for itself and if you don't believe me just look at the stats.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  40. #1040
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    Whoosh! The driver doesn't have to be in front, just along side. Which he was. Otherwise CLC wouldn't have had to run him off the track.

    But remember The Cockwomble was racing for a championship, rather than the win. Once the title is secure, and if he starts gambling with the lives of other drivers, then perhaps you might see how stupid your remarks are.
    He was only slightly along side, Leclerc took the correct line for braking for the corner..............Lewis should know by now where not to put his nose.

  41. #1041
    Grand Master Andyg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    I now hope the gloves are off and all of the other drivers do exactly the same as CLC, back to proper racing, without interference.
    I doubt Lewis will play that game until the championship is secured. So around the time of the US Grand Prix assuming of course Bottas is not within 77 points.

    It really is his WDC to lose, and LH hopefully is to smart to get sucked into wheel banging with someone who is over 100 points behind him.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  42. #1042
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve27752 View Post
    He was only slightly along side, Leclerc took the correct line for braking for the corner..............Lewis should know by now where not to put his nose.
    Thats the point, he didn't take the correct line, he took all the lines. He covered off the inside (defensively), then realised Hamilton was 3/4 alongside him and he steered out to cover that line too, knowing that the outside on the start of the chicane is the inside on the exit. The normal racing line would have been the outside, not the line he chose (then deviated from)

  43. #1043
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    I was really surprised that LH went for that gap on the outside, it was always likely to close under braking or after turn in, he may have decided by that point he was not going to get many chances to get by and jumped in when he was close to give it a go. To get by a Ferrari at Monza a “maybe chance” is unlikely to ever work, the pressure or intent to win by the driver of the red car is always going to make a 50-50 chance disappear, desperate measures under desperate circumstances?

  44. #1044
    Grand Master Andyg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve27752 View Post
    He was only slightly along side, Leclerc took the correct line for braking for the corner..............Lewis should know by now where not to put his nose.

    "Only slightly along side" - Lolz As for taking the correct line - yes of course, but you cannot take a line occupied by another driver - do you!

    But rather than debate this with you, why not you just have a look at this

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yrRFvrmSGUA

    You will also note that although LH would have been on the outside of the first corner, he would have had the inside line to the second part of the complex. Also have a look at where the spectators are sitting. It's important because if LH car had "launched", where do you think he might have ended up?

    What CLC did was over the limit, yet the FIA chose, for their own reasons, just to give a black and white flag.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  45. #1045
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pitfitter View Post
    I was really surprised that LH went for that gap on the outside, it was always likely to close under braking or after turn in, he may have decided by that point he was not going to get many chances to get by and jumped in when he was close to give it a go. To get by a Ferrari at Monza a “maybe chance” is unlikely to ever work, the pressure or intent to win by the driver of the red car is always going to make a 50-50 chance disappear, desperate measures under desperate circumstances?
    Didn’t Lewis overtake Vettel on that exact same corner on the outside last year?

    Edit: thought he did.
    https://youtu.be/2WVc8GFTcg4
    Last edited by jaytip; 10th September 2019 at 16:51.

  46. #1046
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    Blimey Cilla are you really that dim or myopic, or just bigoted.
    You should apply for a refund from the charm school 'cos they failed you again...

  47. #1047

  48. #1048
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/49629863

    Normally I don’t agree with what he says but!
    His bottom line is that it was a cracking ráce for once.

    Secondly him stating the ´obvious´ about consistency of rulings is not. He illustrates this himself by giving an identical example that ends up being different. Also rules shoúld evolve and in the current state of F1 the evolution needs to seek more freedom for the riders to race and yes that is unavoidably less safe.

    The non-argument what could have happened/ could happen, fundamentally applies to all of it: If you race you take riscs. The optimum between racing and safety does not exist. Even ignoring the variables of time and society, circumstances are always different and shit wíll happen. Want to seek the maximum safety? Then put the ´drivers´ behind a console steering drone cars...

    Ah well AnyG, next time Saint Lewis drives a bit too hungry you will defend him again like you did against Rosberg in striking demonstrations of emotion thwarting ratio.
    I have raced for 23 years, mostly motorbikes, including fást ones on street circuits and I applaud the FIA.
    When the going gets tough, the DAF gets going.

  49. #1049
    Grand Master Andyg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huertecilla View Post

    Ah well AnyG, next time Saint Lewis drives a bit too hungry you will defend him again like you did against Rosberg in striking demonstrations of emotion thwarting ratio.
    I have raced for 23 years, mostly motorbikes, including fást ones on street circuits and I applaud the FIA.


    If I believe "Saint Lewis" is guilty of anything then I will call him out for it. However we are not talking about his guilt, we are talking about CLC guilt and the inconsistency shown on Sunday by the FIA. So no more whataboutisims please.

    As for applauding the FIA, did you applaud them when MV got a 5 second penalty at last years Monza GP for causing and collision and forcing VB off the track, which cost him a podium finish. I think not.

    As for your racing history - yeah right!

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  50. #1050
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrianw View Post
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/49629863

    Normally I don’t agree with what he says but!
    His video analysis was good. Made the point that Schumacher was the master of pushing the limit rules wise, and was in an identical situation with Lewis, at the same corner! He left a cars width. And still kept the position.

    That's great racing. What Leclerc did, isn't.

    And the stewards rationale baffles me. It's effectively saying that in that in Lewis situation there's an incentive to allow contact. Ditto the Vettel/Stroll and Stroll/Gasly situation. The penalty for the instigator was decided by the action of the other drivers involved.



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