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Thread: What will Tudor surprise us with at BASEL 2019

  1. #101
    Craftsman WhopperSenior's Avatar
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    I'd like a BB58 Chrono. Not likely though

  2. #102
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    BB58 in another colour, a smaller pelagos would be awesome

  3. #103
    Craftsman Saxon007's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omegamanic View Post
    No reason why Tudor couldn't do a true limited edition though.
    They could but they shoudn't. Why take a great design and limit the number that can be sold?

    That does nothing but limit sales of the design and piss off potential customers who can't get one. Omega could still be making money on the Speedy Tuesday design two years later if it wasn't an LE. And I would own one rather than being pissed that Omega released and sold out the watch in the middle of the night (at least where I live). Rant off...lol

    A blue no date Sub would be great. But I would settle for a blue Black Bay 58.


  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by jameswrx View Post
    Instagram post from Tudor this morning (see what they wrote below pic), I’m still hopeful...

    Note the #snowflake50


    So it could be looking promising

    Ernie in Plymouth

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saxon007 View Post
    They could but they shoudn't. Why take a great design and limit the number that can be sold?

    That does nothing but limit sales of the design and piss off potential customers who can't get one. Omega could still be making money on the Speedy Tuesday design two years later if it wasn't an LE. And I would own one rather than being pissed that Omega released and sold out the watch in the middle of the night (at least where I live). Rant off...lol

    A blue no date Sub would be great. But I would settle for a blue Black Bay 58.

    I would consider swapping in my Pelagos for one of these. Pelagos is a superior watch in every way but the of my 58 is just so good. It’s so comfy.

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omegamanic View Post
    No reason why Tudor couldn't do a true limited edition though.
    But they haven't done an LE at all since their re-launch (apart from the unique one for the "one watch" event that went for so much).

    And my reason still stands wrt an LE, I do not see them blurring the lines between the BB and Pelagos ranges by producing a mix between them. It detracts from both ranges to do so.
    D

  7. #107
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    More 58 variants will be introduced


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  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweets View Post
    But they haven't done an LE at all since their re-launch (apart from the unique one for the "one watch" event that went for so much).

    And my reason still stands wrt an LE, I do not see them blurring the lines between the BB and Pelagos ranges by producing a mix between them. It detracts from both ranges to do so.
    D
    Completely agree. The BB is tudors sub of the modern time. It will be more colours on the 58 and hopefully , eventually a gmt.

  9. #109
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    I love the 'tool' design features of the Pelagos - I must have had 5 or 6 as despite the short-falls for me, I kept coming back to try again!

    Size - fine
    No shiny bits - great
    Easy to read
    Good lume
    Lovely bezel action
    etc

    But!...

    I couldn't get a comfortable fit, so bracelet needs better adjustment - I've noted other comments on this too.
    Also on the bracelet; the edges are too sharp, mind you, so are the edges on the rest of the watch!
    And...a bit heavy for a titanium watch, so has a tendency to flop a bit - fit and weight?
    Oh, and make the minute hand longer to hit the markers.

    Anyway, if those issues could be sorted please I'd buy another!
    Last edited by wadsy; 14th January 2019 at 23:34.

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by hchj View Post
    More 58 variants will be introduced


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    This.

    Anyone who thinks Rolex would be cool with them remaking a classic sub case is off their head.

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  11. #111
    Craftsman smalleyboy1's Avatar
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    What will Tudor surprise us with at BASEL 2019

    Anyone who thinks Rolex would be cool with them remaking a classic sub case is off their head.


    Possibly, but Tudor and Rolex submariners co-existed in the past. Due to the lack of availability for SS Rolex models, Rolex are likely to be losing sales to others. Better they lose those sales to Tudor. A Tudor submariner costing £2,500 probably wouldn’t steal many sales from Rolex. Those who want a Rolex sub will likely still buy one, although they may have a Tudor while the spend many years waiting for their name to get to the top of the Rolex AD list.

  12. #112
    Tudor Subs didn't steal too many sales from Rolex when they shared exactly the same cases, crowns, and hand/dial manufacturers though, so I'm not seeing how it would affect Rolex sales at all.

    For some buyers it may as well say Steinhart on the dial- if it doesn't say Rolex it's not a Rolex, simple as that. That's not always a bad thing of course.
    It's just a matter of time...

  13. #113
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    A new snowflake sub like the Instagram post would be very cool.

  14. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omegamanic View Post
    Tudor Subs didn't steal too many sales from Rolex when they shared exactly the same cases, crowns, and hand/dial manufacturers though, so I'm not seeing how it would affect Rolex sales at all.

    For some buyers it may as well say Steinhart on the dial- if it doesn't say Rolex it's not a Rolex, simple as that. That's not always a bad thing of course.
    Exactly my thoughts,

    Also, IF they did steal Rolex sales why is that? Is it due to people not being able to get a sub? Or is it people wanting a cheaper alternative?

    So if someone can’t get a sub or wants a cheaper alternative then they’d not be buying a sub but a sub alternative from another brand. Wouldn’t Rolex rather someone buy a Tudor sub than a Breitling or Tag?


    A Tudor sub (in theory) would be like an old school Rolex sub. If anything the only thing it would affect would be the used market for old 5 digit subs. Someone loving the old sub case who wants one (and would never buy the new maxi case like me) may well decide a brand new Tudor variant would be better to have than an old Rolex with a poor bracelet. Again, wouldn’t that be a good thing for Rolex?

  15. #115
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    I'm chanting under my breath to will it into being.

    No date sub... no date sub... no date sub...

  16. #116
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    I think I will be hovering outside my local AD in order that I can be ahead of the crowd should anything interesting be announced...

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  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhopperSenior View Post
    I'd like a BB58 Chrono. Not likely though
    That would be awesome

  18. #118
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    In the Tudor video teaser towards the end I’m sure I got a glimpse of the Heritage Chrono.

    That updated with an in-house movement would be very interesting...

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by timor54 View Post
    In the Tudor video teaser towards the end I’m sure I got a glimpse of the Heritage Chrono.

    That updated with an in-house movement would be very interesting...
    If they release an update in a smaller case (in a nod to the original) I would be very interested.




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  20. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by JPE View Post
    Check this video out (at 14 seconds).

    https://www.tudorwatch.com/2019-wish...KlWZ8VFciTbnYE



    Does this mean the Submariner classic case will make a return, huh?
    Was there a similar ref from the 80’s like this, not submariner on the dial and red bezel? That said, if they released this I would get myself as close to the front of the queue possible.


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  21. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by jameswrx View Post
    Exactly my thoughts,

    Also, IF they did steal Rolex sales why is that? Is it due to people not being able to get a sub? Or is it people wanting a cheaper alternative?

    So if someone can’t get a sub or wants a cheaper alternative then they’d not be buying a sub but a sub alternative from another brand. Wouldn’t Rolex rather someone buy a Tudor sub than a Breitling or Tag?


    A Tudor sub (in theory) would be like an old school Rolex sub. If anything the only thing it would affect would be the used market for old 5 digit subs. Someone loving the old sub case who wants one (and would never buy the new maxi case like me) may well decide a brand new Tudor variant would be better to have than an old Rolex with a poor bracelet. Again, wouldn’t that be a good thing for Rolex?
    You are all missing the detail in the call here. A CLASSIC CASED sub. People aren't hoping for a Tudor version of that big square lugged monstrosity Rolex make nowadays. They are calling for the classic perfectly proportioned 5513 etc case.

    With the thirst for all things vintage these days Rolex just aren't going to sign that one off. It won't steal from their current sales but I just can't see them selling the family silverware like that. Besides, they would probably argue that's what the black bay already is, and in my view the 58 is as close as they'll ever be getting to the original subs.

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  22. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by mowflow View Post
    You are all missing the detail in the call here. A CLASSIC CASED sub. People aren't hoping for a Tudor version of that big square lugged monstrosity Rolex make nowadays. They are calling for the classic perfectly proportioned 5513 etc case.

    With the thirst for all things vintage these days Rolex just aren't going to sign that one off. It won't steal from their current sales but I just can't see them selling the family silverware like that. Besides, they would probably argue that's what the black bay already is, and in my view the 58 is as close as they'll ever be getting to the original subs.

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    You do know that Tudor already produced a sub case don’t you? Just like they already produced a case like the BB many decades ago (alongside the Rolex). The silverware has been shared for decades and Tudor have been bringing it back out the cupboard for the last what 8? Years.

    I don’t know how people can talk with such conviction anyway “they’d NEVER do that, NEVER do this”. None of us know, some of us dream and post on forums about what we want and clearly they listen. Some poo poo everything and I’m sore they’d have said a few years ago “Rolex would NEVER let Tudor recreate a 50’s Sub look” (and out rolls a black bay with that style) and years later a smaller BB58 with a similar size too.

    The two best things Tudor could do in my eyes would be to produce a snowflake sub with 40mm case and a Chronograph with a paul newman’esque vibe. Some of us can dream, some of us can just be poo poo’ers.
    Last edited by jameswrx; 17th January 2019 at 09:02.

  23. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by mowflow View Post
    People aren't hoping for a Tudor version of that big square lugged monstrosity Rolex make nowadays IMO.
    Fixed that for you

  24. #124
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    I can see both sides of the argument re. Tudor subs, but I think the reality is that when Tudor were making them alongside Rolex it was a different time. They were cheap(er), the Rolex in particular, they were all available on the shelf, Daytonas were discounted yadda yadda yadda. The market has a different landscape today and Rolex will understand the value of what they have and look at it in a different and far more protective way.

    I'd be happy with new BB58 colours but, ooofff, a smaller Pelagos would be the real dream.

  25. #125
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    I'm hoping for more Tudor / Breitling swapsies... specifically a colt, superocean (normal or heritage) or avenger GMT using the movement from the BB GMT.

  26. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by jameswrx View Post
    You do know that Tudor already produced a sub case don’t you? Just like they already produced a case like the BB many decades ago (alongside the Rolex). The silverware has been shared for decades and Tudor have been bringing it back out the cupboard for the last what 8? Years.

    I don’t know how people can talk with such conviction anyway “they’d NEVER do that, NEVER do this”. None of us know, some of us dream and post on forums about what we want and clearly they listen. Some poo poo everything and I’m sore they’d have said a few years ago “Rolex would NEVER let Tudor recreate a 50’s Sub look” (and out rolls a black bay with that style) and years later a smaller BB58 with a similar size too.

    The two best things Tudor could do in my eyes would be to produce a snowflake sub with 40mm case and a Chronograph with a paul newman’esque vibe. Some of us can dream, some of us can just be poo poo’ers.
    Yes, I did know. I wasn't aware they actually produced them though. I thought they just stole them off the Rolex shelf as my 1965 oyster prince has a Rolex caseback and a Rolex branded bracelet. Pretty odd why Tudor would PRODUCE them with the wrong logo.

    Manufacturing and attitudes towards branding and brand protection from 50 years ago can't be applied to today.

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  27. #127
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    One thing I always loved about the older ones like my snowflake, lollipops (2) and jumbos (5 in total) is that they were Rolex cases and stamped/engraved around the caseback as such. If you bought the Rolex equivalent, you got no such branding at all. I always thought it funny that Rolex never put anything on any caseback except the sea-dweller.

  28. #128
    They are still effectively the same company.
    It's just a matter of time...

  29. #129
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    Probably been said already but hoping for a GMT in the BB58 case


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  30. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweets View Post
    One thing I always loved about the older ones like my snowflake, lollipops (2) and jumbos (5 in total) is that they were Rolex cases and stamped/engraved around the caseback as such. If you bought the Rolex equivalent, you got no such branding at all. I always thought it funny that Rolex never put anything on any caseback except the sea-dweller.
    & Milgauss, no?

  31. #131
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    Another nod towards the Tudor Sub maybe?


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  32. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by JamieTheBarber View Post
    Another nod towards the Tudor Sub maybe?
    I threw this together quick so excuse some of the crappy resolutions. The top photo is Tudors teaser rotated to be the 12 marker that it obviously is. The lower are:

    Top row L-R: Black Bay ETA, Black Bay GMT, Black Bay 58
    Bottom Row L-R: Pelagos, 1977 Tudor Sub, ~1990 Tudor Sub Prototype (the one that gave them the burgundy colour for the black bay and featured in the video the other week).

    The new shot is closest to (but still different from) the early Submariner, so the optimism continues....


  33. #133
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    What will Tudor surprise us with at BASEL 2019

    It does look very sub like doesn’t it. A new take on the Ranger or a Tudor version of the 1655 would be nice though.


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  34. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hammond View Post
    I threw this together quick so excuse some of the crappy resolutions. The top photo is Tudors teaser rotated to be the 12 marker that it obviously is. The lower are:

    Top row L-R: Black Bay ETA, Black Bay GMT, Black Bay 58
    Bottom Row L-R: Pelagos, 1977 Tudor Sub, ~1990 Tudor Sub Prototype (the one that gave them the burgundy colour for the black bay and featured in the video the other week).

    The new shot is closest to (but still different from) the early Submariner, so the optimism continues....

    Good work! More excited for news of Tudor at Basel than Rolex these days .. fingers crossed it’s something more than just a “faux” painted dial on a Black bay 58


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  35. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hammond View Post
    I threw this together quick so excuse some of the crappy resolutions. The top photo is Tudors teaser rotated to be the 12 marker that it obviously is...
    Not necessarily a 12 marker. Some vintage Tudors - the 94010 lollipop and 79090 come to mind - had triangles at 3 (for the 94010),6,9 and 12.

    I'm inclined to think it is a 9 index.

    Here is a 94010, not my watch or photo. Notice the triangles.


  36. #136
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    Given the Pelagos and bb range contain the triangle it could be anything and while I want it to be a sub I still think it makes a lot more sense for it to be a 58 colour variant. From a business perspective it makes more sense to cash in on the movement and case than to release another new watch.

  37. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stuno1 View Post
    Given the Pelagos and bb range contain the triangle it could be anything and while I want it to be a sub I still think it makes a lot more sense for it to be a 58 colour variant. From a business perspective it makes more sense to cash in on the movement and case than to release another new watch.
    This is my feeling too. Doesn't seem to make sense to release the BB58 case, only to release a sub style case the following year.

  38. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saxon007 View Post
    Not necessarily a 12 marker. Some vintage Tudors - the 94010 lollipop and 79090 come to mind - had triangles at 3 (for the 94010),6,9 and 12.

    I'm inclined to think it is a 9 index.

    Here is a 94010, not my watch or photo. Notice the triangles.
    A very good point that I really should have noticed as even the photo of the prototype sub that I used has them at 6 and 9 too! Doh.

  39. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saxon007 View Post
    Not necessarily a 12 marker. Some vintage Tudors - the 94010 lollipop and 79090 come to mind - had triangles at 3 (for the 94010),6,9 and 12.

    I'm inclined to think it is a 9 index.

    Here is a 94010, not my watch or photo. Notice the triangles.
    Lollipops were all 76100s, not 94010 - the pucture is a 76100. I had 2, a blue and a black

    Here's the blue

    Last edited by sweets; 21st January 2019 at 10:20.

  40. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweets View Post
    Lollipops were all 76100s, not 94010 - the pucture is a 76100. I had 2, a blue and a black

    Here's the blue

    94010 lollipops were made from roughly 1982 until 1984 or so.

    I also had a 76100, it was my first Tudor sub. The 76100 has a date function and a lollipop although many of them now have mercedes service hands. The last 94010s were watches contemporary to the 76100 and were also lollipop watches (not-snowflake) without the date function.

    This is a 94010


  41. #141
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    Regardless of what they release it's nice to see the brand doing well with so many people interested in what they will release next.

  42. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by mowflow View Post
    Regardless of what they release it's nice to see the brand doing well with so many people interested in what they will release next.
    I have to say that when window shopping yesterday, their collection was the only one that jumped out at me as having various nice watches throughout the range, the Rolex display was just lots of datejusts....

  43. #143
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    Not that I'm an expert, but I think they'll probably expand the BB58 range in some form. They've got plenty of variants of the BB41 and it seems unlikely they'd not try to do the same with the BB58.

  44. #144
    I think their Marketing model is pretty fascinating. Let’s face it, Rolex could very likely switch production overnight from Datejusts to every flavour of Submariners and GMT’s, introduce half a dozen dial colours etc - but they don’t. Instead they make their Rolex Sports models artificially ‘rare’ and rejuvenate an alternate brand - Tudor - inject a bit more of the Rolex design motifs and then slowly start to ramp up their prices whilst justifying them by introducing in-house (or tweaked Breitling?) movements. Make them easier to buy than a Rolex of similar specs, and make them a ‘rugged everyman’ watch with people like David Beckham in the advertising. So Rolex becomes the ‘jewellery high end’ brand to be flashed on the wrists of Roger Federer, one Direction, Alan Sugar (and nearly everyone travelling into Liverpool Street on the Central Line! ) - and suddenly £3000 for a 3 handed Tudor looks incredibly cheap, sure it will be an investment etc etc. Clever but like most Marketing, a load of old nonsense. Possibly like this rambling post I guess?!


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  45. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by Itizme View Post
    the Rolex display was just lots of datejusts....
    Datejust and the Oyster 36 are the only Rolex models I`d consider owning! It's a mistake to think everyone fawns over the sports models, Rolex sell lots of non-sports watches for a good reason and that's because they're popular. By offering these models with a wide variety of dials Rolex appeal to a lot of buyers, I`m surprised other manufacturers don`t do the same.

  46. #146
    Quote Originally Posted by RobDad View Post
    I think their Marketing model is pretty fascinating. Let’s face it, Rolex could very likely switch production overnight from Datejusts to every flavour of Submariners and GMT’s, introduce half a dozen dial colours etc - but they don’t. Instead they make their Rolex Sports models artificially ‘rare’ and rejuvenate an alternate brand - Tudor - inject a bit more of the Rolex design motifs and then slowly start to ramp up their prices whilst justifying them by introducing in-house (or tweaked Breitling?) movements. Make them easier to buy than a Rolex of similar specs, and make them a ‘rugged everyman’ watch with people like David Beckham in the advertising. So Rolex becomes the ‘jewellery high end’ brand to be flashed on the wrists of Roger Federer, one Direction, Alan Sugar (and nearly everyone travelling into Liverpool Street on the Central Line! ) - and suddenly £3000 for a 3 handed Tudor looks incredibly cheap, sure it will be an investment etc etc. Clever but like most Marketing, a load of old nonsense. Possibly like this rambling post I guess?!


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    I think majorly over estimate the worldwide demand for the professional range, especially in the overall scheme of sales.
    It's just a matter of time...

  47. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobDad View Post
    I think their Marketing model is pretty fascinating. Let’s face it, Rolex could very likely switch production overnight from Datejusts to every flavour of Submariners and GMT’s, introduce half a dozen dial colours etc - but they don’t. Instead they make their Rolex Sports models artificially ‘rare’ and rejuvenate an alternate brand - Tudor - inject a bit more of the Rolex design motifs and then slowly start to ramp up their prices whilst justifying them by introducing in-house (or tweaked Breitling?) movements. Make them easier to buy than a Rolex of similar specs, and make them a ‘rugged everyman’ watch with people like David Beckham in the advertising. So Rolex becomes the ‘jewellery high end’ brand to be flashed on the wrists of Roger Federer, one Direction, Alan Sugar (and nearly everyone travelling into Liverpool Street on the Central Line! ) - and suddenly £3000 for a 3 handed Tudor looks incredibly cheap, sure it will be an investment etc etc. Clever but like most Marketing, a load of old nonsense. Possibly like this rambling post I guess?!


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    I started a thread not too long ago on the future of Tudor and came to a similar conclusion. Ultimately as Tudor continues to grow in popularity prices will go up and it will soon be competing with or sit just under the likes of omega. Rolex will disappear up the ladder to who knows where.

  48. #148
    Quote Originally Posted by Omegamanic View Post
    I think majorly over estimate the worldwide demand for the professional range, especially in the overall scheme of sales.
    You’re probably right, however online discussions and websites seem to virtually ignore most Rolex models and fawn over the ‘professional range’ - Cellini anyone? - and with online as such a powerful force I can’t believe that isn’t at least partly reflected in real-life demand?
    I’ve watched professional series Rolex and their ‘equivalent’ Tudor models ebb and flow in popularity over the last 25 years and it’s clear to me how supply of the popular models is stifled accordingly, to create a buzz of exclusivity and the accompanying AD lack of solid information/smoke and mirrors game. Like I say, clever marketing - and one that at one point went spectacularly wrong with Tudor disappearing entirely a few years ago, before their timely resurgence as a ‘budget’ brand whilst the price of a ‘real’Rolex climbs skyward. I can buy my son a decent secondhand car for the price of a new ‘budget’ black bay, which 10 years ago would have been laughable - and he’d prefer a car and an Apple Watch to a black bay any day. So I guess they have to mine a narrowing vein of demand, and make good while the sun shines on mechanical watches. Sadly (for Rolex, Tudor, Omega and their ilk) I don’t think today’s 18 year old is as easily led as your average wis! - but only time will tell.......(sticks tongue in cheek!)



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  49. #149
    Apprentice
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    Quote Originally Posted by walkerwek1958 View Post
    Datejust and the Oyster 36 are the only Rolex models I`d consider owning! It's a mistake to think everyone fawns over the sports models, Rolex sell lots of non-sports watches for a good reason and that's because they're popular. By offering these models with a wide variety of dials Rolex appeal to a lot of buyers, I`m surprised other manufacturers don`t do the same.
    They do have their place and quite correctly it's not all about the sports models, but when you look at the repetitive watch display in the window it's not very inspiring for a prestige brand. It wasn't just Rolex either tag, breitling all sort of blurred into a meh!!

    Tudor had a great display full of variation and that still didn't include the bb58 or the GMT either.

  50. #150
    Craftsman JPE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omegamanic View Post
    I think majorly over estimate the worldwide demand for the professional range, especially in the overall scheme of sales.
    It has been widely speculated that the DateJust range was their best seller for decades. It was definitely their best seller in the eighties and probably nineties too.

    The WIS communities have always been crazy about the professional line but models like 41mm DJ might be more attractive to general, wealthy watch buying public.

    It'd be interesting to see the sales figures but I guess that will never happen.

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